Elite Players, League, Opportunities

[hockeydad]

I don't know all the specifics and ins and outs of the rules, but high school eligibility is the same for all sports, boys and girls. <br><br>Athletes can start playing varsity, JV or B-Squad games when they are in seventh grade, and can play up to seven years on the varsity. Doesn't happen very often in boys hockey. I've heard of lots of seventh and eighth graders playing varsity girls hockey. I can only think of a handful of boys in recent years. Jimmy Kilpatrick was on New Prague's varsity as an eighth grader. <p></p><i></i>

[bdabbt75]

A couple other key eligibility things<br><br>1) once you are in ninth grade you have a max of 4 years left of eligibility. Repeating ninth grade does not restart the clock.<br>2) Once you are 20 years old, your eligibility expires <p></p><i></i>

[inthecorners]

Thanks guys!<br><br>Have a fun year!<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :D --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /happy.gif ALT=":D"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> <p></p><i></i>

[East Hockey Puck]

I appreciate reading all the feedback concerning these issues and I think it is important that everyone with an educated view feel free to discuss. Many of you know more about the reality of options available from your personal experience than parents of younger players who have never gone through the entire process.<br>It feels that the map for development for players continues to change every year due to factors such as:<br>1) Elite league<br>2) Shattucks and other schools who have an emphasis on athletic achievement as well as scholastic achievement.<br>3) The length of time younger elite players are staying at schools specifically the A program independents. <br>4) The type of program where you reside.<br>5) The changing landscape of Junior hockey ie. USHL age classifications and requirements.<br>6) National development and Division I schools reaching to younger and younger players.<br>etc..<br>Positive and educated positions I hope will continued to be shared instead of individual agendas taking over <p></p><i></i>

[mnhshock29]

From what I've seen on this board, it seems that we have some reoccuring themes in one of the member's posts.<br>1. The Elite League is bad because a few kids have spent their junior year in the league and then left for junior hockey--specifically Harrington and Duncan, which is of the utmost importance because they're from southern MN and were two of the millions of outstanding players from this region who haven't been blackballed by a league that for some reason hates southern MN, the only region in the state that has worthwhile HS hockey.<br>2. The Elite League's directors are only involved in the league for unknown and TBD personal interests.<br>3. Harrington and Duncan left, and the league now says its goal is to develop kids for juniors--what a waste. <br>4. Project Prep included at least three players from the past four years of action, who were all south of Burnsville by the way (which is no coincedence since as previously mentioned, all good MN players come from this region), who are playing D-1 hockey.<br><br>I am aware that are a few individuals who harbor ill will against the Elite League. While I don't want to give too much time to anything they say, I also don't want to see this fact-less campaign continue.<br><br>Some kids have left for juniors while still HS. Again, the goal of the League is to give these kids a viable option to stay at their HS, but not all will do this. We probably won't ever bat 1.000, but are definitely moving in that direction. In the end, one of the goals is to produce an elite player. If that happens via Junior Hockey AND we made them better during HS, so be it. Let's all remember that our last Olympic team featured ONE player from MN and he was 38 years old. Look in the leading scorers of the NHL, how may are from MN? <br><br>Outside of pride, I cannot see what those involved in the Elite League have gained from involvement. The League is non-profit, so it's not money. In fact, more money has been lost than gained by the few individiuals personally involved in getting it off the ground. This kind of claim is the most absurd and is libelistic.<br><br>I'm glad that Lundin, Canzanello and Brunkhorst are playing D-1 hockey. That's great. To infer that we're not developing kids and exposing them to an even greater extent is ridiculous. The recently released NHL Central Scouting Prelim ranking is a perfect example. All of the US HS West A players played in the league (3 of the 4 have already committed to D-1 colleges, and will NOT play Junior Hockey next year). Also, all four are from small private schools, in a bad conference and therefore likely wouldn't have caught scouts' eyes (or at least confirmed their abilities) while playing their traditional schedule (scouts have said as much). 14 of the 16 "B" players, and all of the Minnesotans, played in the Elite League. More and more players are committing to play D-1 hockey every day. In addition, 20 of the 21 players to watch in 2003-04 the Strib played in the Elite League...none of them Rochester (it must be a conspiracy).<br><br>I love the exchange of opinions on this board, I just cringe when so much of what's typed by so few of the individuals is without fact and appears to discredit an organization for purely personal reasons.<br><br> <p></p><i></i>

[Sioux Fan]

I think that there is a bias vs SO MN PLAYERS in the MN Hockey organization. I am willing to take a team of our area and compete in a few of your tourney events and see if we can compete. I know we can.. I know we will and I know that 3 guys from our area is a disgrace. So whoever you are I have nothing to gain and all I want is the players down here get a fair shot. This year my first line wing from the year before Joe Bluhm did not make the Elite league while others were taken that were not near as productive as he was. I want to work with players and get them better. PERIOD>>>> The Elite Program does little about getting players better and making them aware of the things they need to do to be ready to compete and win jobs at the next level. <br><br>I know my team once won the Elite League and they had an all-star team go down to Cedar Rapids. Our team that was in the top two in the League got one representative. You can kiss me where the sun don't shine if that ain't bias. <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i></i>

[Sioux Fan]

Just set up some games and I will get our kids ready...!!!! <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i></i>

[inthecorners]

Hey Hockey Peanut, give up your self-serving coaching ego and go teach the mites, in your community, that also need YOUR motivational expertise and start over! <p></p><i></i>

[Sioux Fan]

Self-Serving.. I have gotten a lot of enjoyment working with and seeing guys from our area move on. But if our area has only developed 3 players that are worthy fo being in the scouted and best format to get discovered we are not doing the job down here. Problem is I know one of my top guys didn't get to play up there.<br>Our area in the past 10 years has produced a lot of D-1 players. Is the talent level that far down or are we being shoved out by an organization that doesn't have the feel for our area. I think it is the latter. I would be willing to put my ego and my area players futures on the line in a competitive scenario and not just hope that a miracle letter came to the right players. I don't think our kids should hold their breath waiting for the opportunity. I think we need to get access to the scouts by being able to have a team similar to North Dakota, Thunder Bay etc and get access to participating in two or three weekends and if we do well the end of the season tourney.<br> I guess it is about me! That is why I say these things. Problem is I think everyone else down here must accept the fact that MN Hockey and the Elite program is serving our best interest. This is very troubling. If the parents and the players don't think they are getting a bum deal. <br><br>Then maybe this area has lost it's ability to teach and share the game to our youngsters in a way that enables them to compete on equal footing with the "Elite".. I doubt it. <br><br>In defense of the players and parents in our area. I can see that it would be hard to overcome the acceptance of the prevailing noise or I mean common knowledge that we don't have very many good players down here. How did Section 1 do in the Great 8 tourneys with mostly guys from our Wells Fargo Teams? <br><br>I guess I should just let a good thing die.<br><br><br>If we really are not good enough to move on and compete. What is the threat to the Elite group. Let the kids have a team and have access similar to the North Dakota and Thunder Bay groups. <br><br>Let us play and then eliminate us the pressure will be squarely on our area, players and coaches. <br><br>Oh I don't need to be the coach but I would enjoy it. <br><br><br>Why don't I let this go!!<br><br>Problem is I can't! I am sort of dismayed that the area is quite happy with being on the bad end of the stick. <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... xfan>Sioux Fan</A> at: 11/26/03 9:09 am<br></i>

[Whatwillwork]

So, what about Section 1's performance in the State HS Tourney? <br><br>Why not get the money people in So Minnesota to bankroll a team to play in some tournaments, there must be other competitions out there.<br><br>I just don't believe the Elite League would intentionally not put a player on the roster because they were from Southern Minnesota, but yet, your posts read like that. <p></p><i></i>

[hocke101]

As far a So Minn. is concered, having watched some of the section 1 A/AA games, I really don't think your strength is depth. All I have seen is a couple players here and there that are good. As far as the elite league not developing players I would have to say you are definetly wrong. The players in the league have had such a great opportunity to learn how to play at the next level under great coaches, specifically Hartzell. Look especially at the players who have been able to move on that come from the smaller schools and otherwise would not have been seen by scouts. Visiblity is probably the best thing that the league brings. <p></p><i></i>

[Sioux Fan]

<br>they selected 3 players from our area that is it! That says it all! <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i></i>

[onedogtoomany]

What I think Hockey Nut saying is don't judge Southern MN hockey by how specific TEAMS play. Frankly, I don't think they have enough depth to advance very far as normal HS teams. What he is saying is there are some very good <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>individual</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--></em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> players players from that part of the state. Isn't that what the "Elite Player" discussion is all about? Section 1AA and 1A do ok as an all-star group at the Great 8. That's the definition of Elite Players. He's pissed that only three players from that area were thought of enough to play in the Elite league.<br><br>He's a good coach and has something to offer to help develop players and their skills. He's frustrated that more isn't being done to help those players in So MN advance to the next level. Between the players from Lourdes that have advanced their careers into the USHL or WCHA or the Red Wing Pohl brothers (past & future) playing at the "U", there is no doubt good players down South and everywhere else in the state for that matter. I say forget Thunder Bay and No Dakota as part of the Elite League and open it up to more MN kids! <br><br>Just how I see it. <p></p><i></i>

[mnhshock29]

I understand what is being said. The fact is, that the HS Elite program is designed to develop MN's best, the League expands that to include other state's programs, which gives a flavor to the competition. Again, for the last time, let me say that if So. MN housed the best players in the state, they'd all be included. There is no bias. In fact, we've consulted a college coach with roots in So. MN for additional tips on the best players in that region. Keep in mind that last year we had quite a few players involved (Hauptili, Harrington, Duncan, Tubbs, Thauwald, Hovick, etc.). Others were snowed into playing in a secondary league, but most certainly were invited. I think the real disservice was done here, where players (like the Lundins) who were qualified and able to compete against Minnesota's best, Shattuck, etc. were instead sold a bill of goods and convinced by those with self-serving intentions to play in an inferior league against the likes of Shattucks' second team, etc. in the name of provincialism. Players can be nominated for participation. The program wants the best of the best. The league is not about the geographic divides that the poster longs for. The program wants to develop the state, no matter where the player is. Southern MN is a proportionate part of that, no more or less. Next yr may feature 20 So. MN kids...or it may not. <p></p><i></i>

[hckyman111]

you should change your name from mnhshock29 to MNHSELITEpromotor - Dan Hatzung ... congratulations<br>You've been on this site for yesars blowing smoke up guys ass' It's truely interesting to see the crap you pass around. We all understand how great you think all your players are but honestly open your eyes. <p></p><i></i>

[hocke101]

I read on another post the league might go through the winter next year? If they did a little deal after the season I think it would be a very good improvement. I think that it will take a few years to get the league to the point we all want it to be at for the developement of the players. I still don't think it will ever be perfect. As far as hckyman111, I havent seen any great ideas flowing from you so why don't you just focus on adding something to the conversation from now on. <p></p><i></i>

[nurfacehky]

Over the past two weeks I <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START 8o --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... s/nerd.gif ALT="8o"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> watched 10 scrimmages, the teams were BSM, EP, CENT, CLOQ, AV, WARROAD, MHD, and I or other people who did not have a child in the <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START 8) --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... lasses.gif ALT="8)"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> Elite "Checkbook" league could not tell who played in the league or who where just returning Varsity<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :D --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /happy.gif ALT=":D"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> . You know, the other kids who may have played another sport or spent their time working on skills and getting stronger instead of paying big bucks to a group of promoters <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :hat --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... s/pimp.gif ALT=":hat"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> that promised <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START ;) --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... s/wink.gif ALT=";)"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> the participants there would be scouts <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :smokin --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... smokin.gif ALT=":smokin"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> at the games. The ELITE players should have stood out,<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START :eek --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... ns/eek.gif ALT=":eek"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> they did not<!--EZCODE EMOTICON START 0] --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /alien.gif ALT="0]"><!--EZCODE EMOTICON END--> . <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... facehky</A> at: 11/30/03 1:48 pm<br></i>

[joe lulic]

I have nothing against the elite league but mnhshock29 in his support of the league saya stuff that makes people wonder. The elite league is a "viable alternative". To what? Juniors? There is no comparison. They are completely different experiences. Maybe we should just say it is a welcome addition. It is something extra that may benefit players.<br>"One of the goals is to produce an elite player" "The elite program is designed to develop MNs best."<br><br>If it is an elite league, you already have elite players so are you producing them or are you developing them? Do you really want to take credit for developing MNs best? Maybe some of us who have spent a few thousand hours supporting youth and high school hockey had a little something to do with it. <br><br>The Elite league offers something that some of our top players may want to take advantage of. Maybe a player or 2 will get noticed that other wise wouldnt have. Fine. But the elite league hasnt all of a sudden become MNs developmental savior. <p></p><i></i>

[joe lulic]

nurfacehky, I dont know about that. I have only been to a couple of scrimmages so far but the guys who played in the elite league definitley stood out. They were definitley the best players. Maybe they would have been anyway but whatever , you cant say the the league doesnt attract some of the best players and guys that stand out. <p></p><i></i>

[puckdoctor]

Why such sour grapes towards the elite league? Actually the cost to play is very resonable and there were alot of scouts present. If you don't like the league, that is your opinion, but lets get your facts straight when you are bashing someone. By the way, would you feel the same if you or yor kid were playing in the elite league? <p></p><i></i>

[shutout]

<br><br>Everyone complains that Minnesota does not do anything to keep it's kids here, and a guy like Russo who does not need any notoriaty spends countless hours and dollars to provide an ALTERNATIVE to playing juniors and it is critisized.<br><br>Russo has done more in the two years with this league then the MSHSL has done in 20 years to improve high school hockey in Minnesota. I watch games and the players in the Elite league definatly stand out on their high school teams. If you disagree just read the team by team listing in lets play hockey and see how many coaches list the Elite League players as their key players this year. <br><br>I have said before that they made nice improvements this year from last year and i have no doubt they will continue to improve the league in the future, but they do not compare themselves to juniors they consider themselves an ALTERNATIVE that will allow the players to play in a competitive atmosphere, get seen by scouts and stay in high school.<br><br>Nurfacehky: Please tell us what you have done to help H.S. Hockey! <p></p><i></i>

[mnhockeyguy]

Mnhshock29 - You say the Lundin's were sold a bill of goods to play on an inferior team the fall of 2002. Gee, it really hurt them didn't it - Mike goes to college and moves right into the lineup and Matt follows up the fall season with an excellent winter year. Was the competition they played equal to the elite league - no. Was the coaching and development work they received a wasted effort - no is the answer to that either. Without a doubt, playing for a team coached by Pat Westrum had to really be a poor experience (at least from your viewpoint) or does it simply have to do with the fact that Westrum and other's felt the Elite league did not stress development and wanted to work with players willing to put in some practice time not just play games. Did you ever consider that players may just like working with a coach like Westrum or Noterman and for that reason alone chose to play where they did? Yes you did suceed by making the effort they put in as difficult as possible which led to decisions not to have teams this past fall. Now who was the real winner in that - the players? No I don't think so. How can high school hockey improve if only the so called top 100 are allowed to play. Did you ever think some of the other players might improve even if they were not in the "Elite league" <p></p><i></i>

[Sioux Fan]

(This message was left blank) <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... xfan>Sioux Fan</A> at: 12/1/03 2:41 pm<br></i>

[Sioux Fan]

The point is that I don't know who is going to be on my roster until the last day of camp after a jamboree and 4 good solid days of two a day tryouts. And believe it or not I still make numerous mistakes. So why not let us play in a couple of tourneys. I believe it is fear that we may show this eliteism for what it is. <br><br>I think it is about very young very green players learning to compete harder than they ever have before. Is that clear. Our teams last year Pat's and mine could have been competitive with elite league teams. He had Bayers, Obermeyer the Lundins I had Hansen, Hughes, Wiechmann, Bluhm, Tichich, James and Joel Gaulrapp, Adam Hendel, John Brunkhorst, Nick Forlitti, Kyle Mairose, Nate Bauer, etc. year before Reid Cashman, Jake Bluhm T. Pohl, M. Pohl, J.Hansen, J. Tubbs both years, John Loquai . Other players who played in our program Jeff Jakaitis LSSU, Andy Canzanello CC. Colin Stuart CC. etc... When my guys had a chance to go up to the Elite league they were encouraged to do that because I told them that is where the scouts are. . lots of good good players who competed hard for me. I don't think we would embarass ourselves if we got a shot. Players should be able to choose good coaches. and most importantly practice and development time vs game time. My guys would like to have practice and games and exposure is that a lot to ask for?<br>I hope we can get this chance for just one year. I think it would be great to have area teams for both the underclassman minors and upper classman majors.. Area directors and we could adjust boundaries to make sure that the best players had access. If a player in minors was doing exceptionally well he could get called up too!<br> <p>Hockey Nut in So. MN</p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub33.ezboard.com/bmnhs.showUser ... xfan>Sioux Fan</A> at: 12/1/03 2:58 pm<br></i>

[hocke101]

I thought that the other league had some good players but was definetly weaker and did not do as much for development. I think that a good player with a good work ethic that is motivated will improve to matter where they are like you said Lundin did with his scholarship. I mean if Crosby decided to go to stay at shattuck one year and then play two at college he might not have as much competition or even growth but he would still be as highly recruited so a lot of it is personal effort I think. I feel the elite league is the best for visibility. Souix Fan, I think that the league is going to keep growing and changing and that you will see these players that you say are very good get into it next year and more after that. I have been really happy with the league but you have to remember you can't build something perfect in a day. You have to start with a solid foundation, start building up better and better, and eventually get to that top point. I hope you are more content next year and ALL MN best players get a good chance to improve and be seen. <p></p><i></i>