Get a Clue MSHSL

[Green and White Fan]

I think the harsher penalties are going to make for a much better game as time goes on. The skilled "hockey player" is now going to be able to play the game the way it was meant to be played. Is charging no longer a penalty in hockey. if I have seen anyplace the game has deteriorated, it is by no longer calling charging. Players will pass the puck and a player 10 feet away will continue on and complete a check. Back in the day, that was charging every time.

[silentbutdeadly3139]

In the 1a and 1aa semi finals and finals there were by my count 5 major penalties called, 4 of them resulted in multiple goal power plays and 3 turned competitive games into blow outs. One boarding call happend on a check where the boards weren't even hit, literally an open ice boarding penalty.

That's a problem, we have officials discretion determining games. I'm all for calling the rules as written but far to often the penalty doesn't fit the crime and far too often it determines the outcome of games. It's far too inconsistant.

A few years ago the MSHSL had a rule where you had to serve your entire penalty time, if the other team scored your team replaced you and we played 5 on 5. I think that is a far better solution than this fiasco taking place now.

Very good points. The refs are now determining the outcomes of games more than ever before. They need to let the kids play. It gives skilled teams a much better advantage with the 5 min powerplays and all the special teams time.

Oh no, the skilled teams have an advantage Isn't that the point of the game, the skilled team have and advantage I get what your saying and agree to some extent that the pendulum has swung too far. Hopefully it will be adjusted before next year but I think something needed to be done. It's not like the good old days, players are bigger, faster, better equipment so the consequences of an illegal check ( ie. chance for injury ) are worse and the tendency to use the "check" for intimidation and over come skill caused an unsafe game. If the coaches , players, parents wont clean up the illegal checks then someone had to. As someone said, the higher leagues realized it and adjusted their rules and points of emphasis as has the NFL. Now hopefully the refs will call what on the books.

[defense]

I think the harsher penalties are going to make for a much better game as time goes on. The skilled "hockey player" is now going to be able to play the game the way it was meant to be played. Is charging no longer a penalty in hockey. if I have seen anyplace the game has deteriorated, it is by no longer calling charging. Players will pass the puck and a player 10 feet away will continue on and complete a check. Back in the day, that was charging every time.

Charging is actually taking a run at a guy while skating all the way through him, whether the victim has the puck or not. What you refer to sounds like interference, no less of a penalty of course. And if the ref don't call it, it don't matter anyway.

[The Universe]

My two cents:

No matter where you go, what level, there will always be referees who are looking for attention. That's just their personality, they like the spotlight. This rule adjustment (for those who don't like the term change) is only giving these referees more power and more fuel to their ego-boosting fire we call attention. The calls that I have seen are not always malicious and rarely even have the potential for injury. However, I think it is easy to get carried away after such a tragic incident with Jabs. Every hit is being analyzed in ways it would not have been if the Jabs incident hadn't happen.

Another thing I'm throwing out is isn't this taking away from the value of size? I know when I was growing up I always wanted to be taller! Now when your taller and you place your shoulder onto a shorter player's shoulder, I see it being called all too often as a 5 minute head contact.

[HShockeywatcher]

The issue isn't so much with the penalties, it's with how they are being called now.

Can you elaborate on this? How are "they being called now?"

Just seems that clean, but hard checks are being penalized more often now. If the "chekee" puts himself into a bad position due to his head being down or just not taking the check, it seems that the checker gets penalized with the big emphasis on the new rules. I will agree that some calls are definitely needed and they are the correct call, but it also seems that clean hits that are hard are getting penalized when they shouldn't be.

Agreed 100%. It's unfortunate there was no emphasis put on "drawing a penalty," which I believe is interference?

The calls that I have seen are not always malicious and rarely even have the potential for injury.

Another thing I'm throwing out is isn't this taking away from the value of size? I know when I was growing up I always wanted to be taller! Now when your taller and you place your shoulder onto a shorter player's shoulder, I see it being called all too often as a 5 minute head contact.

-As I always have, I look at these more as rule breaking issue than a safety issue. If you tried to outlaw unsafe things in high school sports, we wouldn't have them. If the current rules of high school permitted checking from behind, then it would be allowed. Since it doesn't AND is a safety issue, the MSHSL wants to emphasize it.

It shouldn't be called that way.

[Oldtimehockeyguy23]

Your knee jerk reaction has ruined the game. Get down to the basics of teaching kids how to hit and take a hit. Get the Hockey Moms the hell out of the rink. YOU ARE RUINING THE GAME. The Canadians are laughing at you clowns.

The great Don Cherry:
and checking (I will add)
“Everyone knows everybody loves fights. They better start listening to the people who are at the game and pay the money than the twits upstairs who get in for free.”

This applies to the 90%!!!!

“people think common sense is common - but it's not.”

[KICKED-IN-THE-PRIVATES]

I think the harsher penalties are going to make for a much better game as time goes on. The skilled "hockey player" is now going to be able to play the game the way it was meant to be played. Is charging no longer a penalty in hockey. if I have seen anyplace the game has deteriorated, it is by no longer calling charging. Players will pass the puck and a player 10 feet away will continue on and complete a check. Back in the day, that was charging every time.

Agreed. The charging/head hunting that is especially happenning at the end of games is embarassing the sport. We see this all through the playoffs as teams are eliminated and coaches give the seniors a chance to go out and get a good lick in. Well how many times are they illegal hits? Clean hits, great more power to the kid. But these are the games that attrack folks who have not seen a game all season. When your trying to introduce the sport, and that crap is going on and not called, easy to see why some parents chose not to allow their kids to play.

Also, you folks upset that games were altered/affected by 5 min penalties need to quit pointing the finger at the refs, and start looking at your own program. If a player can't understand boarding or checking from behind, maybe he should not be in the game...

I was pulling for Brainerd to reach the state tournament for the first time, and am sad for their kids and fans. But for Coach Archibald (UND's all-time penalty minutes leader) to say "I wish the players on the ice could have decided the game" shows how clueless he is. Sorry coach, but the kids did it. Your skaters took two foolish penalties at the end of the game, both were correct calls....

[Mite-dad]

The issue isn't so much with the penalties, it's with how they are being called now.

Can you elaborate on this? How are "they being called now?"

Just seems that clean, but hard checks are being penalized more often now. If the "chekee" puts himself into a bad position due to his head being down or just not taking the check, it seems that the checker gets penalized with the big emphasis on the new rules. I will agree that some calls are definitely needed and they are the correct call, but it also seems that clean hits that are hard are getting penalized when they shouldn't be.

I always love the arguement that if a kid has his head down, he should get drilled to teach him a lesson. My question is, "is it humanly possible in the game of hockey to never be vulnerable to a hard check? Is is possible to always be aware of everything around you when you are skating the puck? The answer is no. And I don't care what level of hockey it is all the way to the NHL. I don't believe your health and future well being should be put in jeopardy because you weren't aware of someone coming at you for an instant. Sure, check the player, but to a level that doesn't crush him.

[HappyHockeyFan]

I think your all imagining this horrible change in the game you complain about. I have seen probably 20 games of high school hockey since they started the 5 min major for boarding, Checking from behind and head contact and I have literally only seen it called 4 times. All four were deserved, all four came in the first handful of games and none of them came in the playoffs. The games I have seen are just as good as they ever were and I have seen plenty of physical play. So quit making things up and enjoy the safer game. Nuff said....

[Mite-dad]

I think your all imagining this horrible change in the game you complain about. I have seen probably 20 games of high school hockey since they started the 5 min major for boarding, Checking from behind and head contact and I have literally only seen it called 4 times. All four were deserved, all four came in the first handful of games and none of them came in the playoffs. The games I have seen are just as good as they ever were and I have seen plenty of physical play. So quit making things up and enjoy the safer game. Nuff said....

Couldn't agree more and my experiences have been the same.

[Bronc]

I think your all imagining this horrible change in the game you complain about. I have seen probably 20 games of high school hockey since they started the 5 min major for boarding, Checking from behind and head contact and I have literally only seen it called 4 times. All four were deserved, all four came in the first handful of games and none of them came in the playoffs. The games I have seen are just as good as they ever were and I have seen plenty of physical play. So quit making things up and enjoy the safer game. Nuff said....

What>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I have been to games where it was called 4 times in a single game, so to say your statement is outlandish and either you have a poor or selective memory.

Has it settled down some, yes. However clean hard hits are still called for something (they make it up so naturally changes with each call).

The games have lost energy and players, coaches and refs have adapted some but very slow.

No where enough said.......

[Bandy]

I think your all imagining this horrible change in the game you complain about. I have seen probably 20 games of high school hockey since they started the 5 min major for boarding, Checking from behind and head contact and I have literally only seen it called 4 times. All four were deserved, all four came in the first handful of games and none of them came in the playoffs. The games I have seen are just as good as they ever were and I have seen plenty of physical play. So quit making things up and enjoy the safer game. Nuff said....

Agree. I think the game suffered too long by allowing too many cheap shots and too much cheating. Officiating will never be perfect. But I haven't seen the game degraded at all post-Jack. I've seen pretty clean games, with some really stupid violations being called appropriately. As they should.

[eagleman]

Your knee jerk reaction has ruined the game. Get down to the basics of teaching kids how to hit and take a hit. Get the Hockey Moms the hell out of the rink. YOU ARE RUINING THE GAME. The Canadians are laughing at you clowns.

The great Don Cherry:
and checking (I will add)
“Everyone knows everybody loves fights. They better start listening to the people who are at the game and pay the money than the twits upstairs who get in for free.”

This applies to the 90%!!!!

“people think common sense is common - but it's not.”

I don't know how they are "ruining" the game by trying to enforce rules that are already in place. If you want to quote Don Cherry then put it into context. He played until the mid-70s!!! go watch a hockey game in the mid-70s and tell me it is similar to todays game. THERES HARDLY ANY HITTING! It was a skill game then and its simply trying to be a skill game again. These kids are much too confident with all of their padding. They think they are invincible! Give them the same pads they had in the good old days and lets see if this is still as big of an issue.

[grindiangrad-80]

I'm for the stiffer penalties.
Hard hits are fun to watch, but I'd rather see open ice skill anyday.
Once in awhile someone will get a major for a clean play.
It's just not realistic to keep yourself from getting into a vulnerable position every now and then.

[goldy313]

I don't know how they are "ruining" the game by trying to enforce rules that are already in place. If you want to quote Don Cherry then put it into context. He played until the mid-70s!!! go watch a hockey game in the mid-70s and tell me it is similar to todays game. THERES HARDLY ANY HITTING! It was a skill game then and its simply trying to be a skill game again. These kids are much too confident with all of their padding. They think they are invincible! Give them the same pads they had in the good old days and lets see if this is still as big of an issue.

To be fair, prior to the late 1980's there was also blueline icing, no tag up on the offsides, a limit on stick length, and all sticks were wood. The fundemental rules of the game changed to allow more hitting and less passing, and to allow bigger and stronger people to play the game, this was probably NHL driven to get butts in the seats in American arenas.

Happyhockeyfan...I saw 1 game in maybe 15 where a 5 minute penalty was called after the rule went into effect, I saw it in 4 of 6 in the playoffs and in 3 of those 6 it went quite a ways into determining the outcome. In my opinion of the 5 calls 2 were good 2 were bad and 1 was a complete joke. If the penalty is going to be so severe everyone better agree, at the very least, it is a penalty. That wasn't the occasion on at least 3 of 5 minute calls I saw.

Kids need to adapt to the rules, however in other sports like football it's maybe one possesion, in basketball it's maybe 2 free throws and a foul, in hockey a 5 minute penalty is 9.3% of the game you will be shorthanded for 1 call, way to harsh for nearly every call that's made and considering tripping can be as dangerous as any of the calls they made into majors pretty ridiculous.

[Listen2me]

Your knee jerk reaction has ruined the game. Get down to the basics of teaching kids how to hit and take a hit. Get the Hockey Moms the hell out of the rink. YOU ARE RUINING THE GAME. The Canadians are laughing at you clowns.

The great Don Cherry:
and checking (I will add)
“Everyone knows everybody loves fights. They better start listening to the people who are at the game and pay the money than the twits upstairs who get in for free.”

This applies to the 90%!!!!

“people think common sense is common - but it's not.”

You are a genius, any seats left at your next seminar?

[gardetto]

Your knee jerk reaction has ruined the game. Get down to the basics of teaching kids how to hit and take a hit. Get the Hockey Moms the hell out of the rink. YOU ARE RUINING THE GAME. The Canadians are laughing at you clowns.

The great Don Cherry:
and checking (I will add)
“Everyone knows everybody loves fights. They better start listening to the people who are at the game and pay the money than the twits upstairs who get in for free.”

This applies to the 90%!!!!

“people think common sense is common - but it's not.”

You are a genius, any seats left at your next seminar?

I want a seat too Front row!

[EREmpireStrikesBack]

I always love the arguement that if a kid has his head down, he should get drilled to teach him a lesson. My question is, "is it humanly possible in the game of hockey to never be vulnerable to a hard check? Is is possible to always be aware of everything around you when you are skating the puck? The answer is no. And I don't care what level of hockey it is all the way to the NHL. I don't believe your health and future well being should be put in jeopardy because you weren't aware of someone coming at you for an instant. Sure, check the player, but to a level that doesn't crush him.

Keeping your head up helps to prevent yourself from being put in a position that you could get hurt. I'm not saying that he should get drilled to teach a lesson. I don't believe a player should get punished for throwing a legal body check just because the other player isn't doing anything to prevent themselves from being in the position. I will say the first time I got laid out at center ice definitely opened my eyes to the realization that players aren't going to just tap me on the shoulder and tell me to lift my head up.

Don't forget that hockey is a physical sport. Even the "skilled" players need to use their body.

I do think an example of exactly what I was talking about with the penalties happened in the Blaine/MG game tonight multiple times.

[EREmpireStrikesBack]

Happyhockeyfan...I saw 1 game in maybe 15 where a 5 minute penalty was called after the rule went into effect, I saw it in 4 of 6 in the playoffs and in 3 of those 6 it went quite a ways into determining the outcome. In my opinion of the 5 calls 2 were good 2 were bad and 1 was a complete joke. If the penalty is going to be so severe everyone better agree, at the very least, it is a penalty. That wasn't the occasion on at least 3 of 5 minute calls I saw.

Kids need to adapt to the rules, however in other sports like football it's maybe one possesion, in basketball it's maybe 2 free throws and a foul, in hockey a 5 minute penalty is 9.3% of the game you will be shorthanded for 1 call, way to harsh for nearly every call that's made and considering tripping can be as dangerous as any of the calls they made into majors pretty ridiculous.

Amen.

[Bronc]

Happyhockeyfan...I saw 1 game in maybe 15 where a 5 minute penalty was called after the rule went into effect, I saw it in 4 of 6 in the playoffs and in 3 of those 6 it went quite a ways into determining the outcome. In my opinion of the 5 calls 2 were good 2 were bad and 1 was a complete joke. If the penalty is going to be so severe everyone better agree, at the very least, it is a penalty. That wasn't the occasion on at least 3 of 5 minute calls I saw.

Kids need to adapt to the rules, however in other sports like football it's maybe one possesion, in basketball it's maybe 2 free throws and a foul, in hockey a 5 minute penalty is 9.3% of the game you will be shorthanded for 1 call, way to harsh for nearly every call that's made and considering tripping can be as dangerous as any of the calls they made into majors pretty ridiculous.

Amen.

Hopefully the amount of games ruined in the state tournament will be kept to a low roar. Great points above!!!

[Mite-dad]

I always love the arguement that if a kid has his head down, he should get drilled to teach him a lesson. My question is, "is it humanly possible in the game of hockey to never be vulnerable to a hard check? Is is possible to always be aware of everything around you when you are skating the puck? The answer is no. And I don't care what level of hockey it is all the way to the NHL. I don't believe your health and future well being should be put in jeopardy because you weren't aware of someone coming at you for an instant. Sure, check the player, but to a level that doesn't crush him.

Keeping your head up helps to prevent yourself from being put in a position that you could get hurt. I'm not saying that he should get drilled to teach a lesson. I don't believe a player should get punished for throwing a legal body check just because the other player isn't doing anything to prevent themselves from being in the position. I will say the first time I got laid out at center ice definitely opened my eyes to the realization that players aren't going to just tap me on the shoulder and tell me to lift my head up.

Don't forget that hockey is a physical sport. Even the "skilled" players need to use their body.

I do think an example of exactly what I was talking about with the penalties happened in the Blaine/MG game tonight multiple times.

I agree. But I don't care if you are Sidney Cros.....oh yeah, he's out with multiple injuries. I don't care if you are Jonathon Toe.....oh yeah, he's out with a concussion. What I'm saying is, I don't care how good you are, it is impossible to always have your head turned in the right direction to avoid getting destroyed. As long as these big blind side "legal" hits are legal, players will learn to exploit it and drill kids with injurious hits. Do we really need that as part of the game when a perfectly legal, hard, yet less destructive hit will accomplish the same thing?

[RangeHockeyFan1817]

I always love the arguement that if a kid has his head down, he should get drilled to teach him a lesson. My question is, "is it humanly possible in the game of hockey to never be vulnerable to a hard check? Is is possible to always be aware of everything around you when you are skating the puck? The answer is no. And I don't care what level of hockey it is all the way to the NHL. I don't believe your health and future well being should be put in jeopardy because you weren't aware of someone coming at you for an instant. Sure, check the player, but to a level that doesn't crush him.

Keeping your head up helps to prevent yourself from being put in a position that you could get hurt. I'm not saying that he should get drilled to teach a lesson. I don't believe a player should get punished for throwing a legal body check just because the other player isn't doing anything to prevent themselves from being in the position. I will say the first time I got laid out at center ice definitely opened my eyes to the realization that players aren't going to just tap me on the shoulder and tell me to lift my head up.

Don't forget that hockey is a physical sport. Even the "skilled" players need to use their body.

I do think an example of exactly what I was talking about with the penalties happened in the Blaine/MG game tonight multiple times.

I agree. But I don't care if you are Sidney Cros.....oh yeah, he's out with multiple injuries. I don't care if you are Jonathon Toe.....oh yeah, he's out with a concussion. What I'm saying is, I don't care how good you are, it is impossible to always have your head turned in the right direction to avoid getting destroyed. As long as these big blind side "legal" hits are legal, players will learn to exploit it and drill kids with injurious hits. Do we really need that as part of the game when a perfectly legal, hard, yet less destructive hit will accomplish the same thing?

Well if you're skating through center ice, or anywhere really, with the puck on your stick, you should EXPECT you might get hit. When did it become the opposing players job to make sure little Johnny is ready? If it is not from behind, there is no reason not to be ready for it, whether you directly see it coming or not; like I said, if you are carrying the puck, don't you expect a check or at least an attempt? I'm not sure exactly where you're going with this but it sounds like you would want a pentalty for a hit you deem legal but "too hard"? Who is going to be the judge of that? A legal check is a legal check, if it's not charging, then leave it alone. If you can't hanlde it, don't play.

[Bronc]

. But I don't care if you are Sidney Cros.....oh yeah, he's out with multiple injuries.

Oh yeah..... his own teammate hit him. Wonder if he got a 5 and 10

[EREmpireStrikesBack]

I agree. But I don't care if you are Sidney Cros.....oh yeah, he's out with multiple injuries. I don't care if you are Jonathon Toe.....oh yeah, he's out with a concussion. What I'm saying is, I don't care how good you are, it is impossible to always have your head turned in the right direction to avoid getting destroyed. As long as these big blind side "legal" hits are legal, players will learn to exploit it and drill kids with injurious hits. Do we really need that as part of the game when a perfectly legal, hard, yet less destructive hit will accomplish the same thing?

Are you aware that hockey is a physical sport? If people don't want to worry about getting hit or possibly hurt, there are plenty of dance studios around the state.

[Reggie]

I guess we just live in a soft world now, in 20 years checking from behind and fighting will mean time in jail, so 5 minutes isn't so bad.