Now is the time to force all Privates up to "AA"

Post by **karl(east)** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:39 pm

My only venture into this thread:

Today, at the press conference after the win, someone asked Greg Vannelli about possibly opting up. His response:

"I know we're where we belong. It's not easy to do this. After these past few weeks, we're emotionally drained." He also cited his team's lack of top-end players, particularly at forward, as another reason why his team doesn't opt up. "It's not like we have stars," he said.

Make of that what you will.

puckstopper33 · Post by **puckstopper33** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:43 pm

karl(east) wrote:My only venture into this thread:

Today, at the press conference after the win, someone asked Greg Vannelli about possibly opting up. His response:

"I know we're where we belong. It's not easy to do this. After these past few weeks, we're emotionally drained." He also cited his team's lack of top-end players, particularly at forward, as another reason why his team doesn't opt up. "It's not like we have stars," he said.

Make of that what you will.

That is sad...

puckstopper33 · Post by **puckstopper33** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:53 pm

The Universe wrote:Private schools playing class A are:
-Rochester Lourdes
-Breck
-Blake
-Providence Academy
-Minehaha Academy
-St. Thomas Academy
-Totino-Grace
-St. Paul Academy
-St. Cloud Cathedral
-Legacy Christian
-Duluth Marshall

Looking at this list, I think all of these teams could compete in a AA section with the exception of Legacy, Minehaha, and Providence.

I think the only schools that need to opt up are STA and Breck. The rest of the privates don't dominate against public schools, and make things more interesting come tourney time.

goldy313 · Post by **goldy313** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:00 pm

Lourdes has won 8 of the last 9 1A championships, they went to 3A for 4 years in the middle of that span. That's pretty dominant against public schools if you ask me.

puckstopper33 · Post by **puckstopper33** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:19 pm

goldy313 wrote:Lourdes has won 8 of the last 9 1A championships, they went to 3A for 4 years in the middle of that span. That's pretty dominant against public schools if you ask me.

True, but they have not been that successful at state.

celly93 · Post by **celly93** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:44 pm

The Universe wrote:Private schools playing class A are:
-Rochester Lourdes
-Breck
-Blake
-Providence Academy
-Minehaha Academy
-St. Thomas Academy
-Totino-Grace
-St. Paul Academy
-St. Cloud Cathedral
-Legacy Christian
-Duluth Marshall

Looking at this list, I think all of these teams could compete in a AA section with the exception of Legacy, Minehaha, and Providence.

Another thing that I find interesting is that both the teams in the AA championship game tonight are private schools who opt up to AA.. I didn't know that until today.

From what I can tell, TG was 3-3 vs AA teams. Those wins were against Holy Family, Cooper, and Tartan. They were outscored 19-5 in their games against BSM and Mounds View.

BobSaget · Post by **BobSaget** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:00 pm

karl(east) wrote:My only venture into this thread:

Today, at the press conference after the win, someone asked Greg Vannelli about possibly opting up. His response:

"I know we're where we belong. It's not easy to do this. After these past few weeks, we're emotionally drained." He also cited his team's lack of top-end players, particularly at forward, as another reason why his team doesn't opt up. "It's not like we have stars," he said.

Make of that what you will.

That's embarrassing...

zamboni14 · Post by **zamboni14** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:03 pm

puckstopper33 wrote:
The Universe wrote:Private schools playing class A are:
-Rochester Lourdes
-Breck
-Blake
-Providence Academy
-Minehaha Academy
-St. Thomas Academy
-Totino-Grace
-St. Paul Academy
-St. Cloud Cathedral
-Legacy Christian
-Duluth Marshall

Looking at this list, I think all of these teams could compete in a AA section with the exception of Legacy, Minehaha, and Providence.
I think the only schools that need to opt up are STA and Breck. The rest of the privates don't dominate against public schools, and make things more interesting come tourney time.

STA... no doubt needs to move up. 4 titles in 6 years, that's dominating a class. Personally I say if you win 3 in 5 years, you don't get to make the decision. Then... if you don't qualify for state in the next 5 years, it can be re-reviewed by class A coaches.

So next season, move STA up... and if Breck wins it all, they get moved up the following season.

The sad part is that there are teams that should WANT to move up rather than stay back and just be the big fish in the smaller pond. Look at BSM for a great example... moved up to AA, next year they are going to be "independent" and will probably schedule EP, Wayzata, Edina, 'Tonka, DE, HM and as many of the other top teams as they can get. WHY? Because playing against teams they know they can beat does nothing for you except pad your stats.

HawkeyPower · Post by **HawkeyPower** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:43 pm

BobSaget wrote:
karl(east) wrote:My only venture into this thread:

Today, at the press conference after the win, someone asked Greg Vannelli about possibly opting up. His response:

"I know we're where we belong. It's not easy to do this. After these past few weeks, we're emotionally drained." He also cited his team's lack of top-end players, particularly at forward, as another reason why his team doesn't opt up. "It's not like we have stars," he said.

Make of that what you will.
That's embarrassing...

Maybe STA could recruit D1 forwards if they played AA

WB6162 · Post by **WB6162** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:51 pm

This just in--The Minnesota Wild are maneuvering to get into the Class A tourney next season

Teak · Post by **Teak** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:32 pm

zamboni14 wrote:I think the only schools that need to opt up are STA and Breck. The rest of the privates don't dominate against public schools, and make things more interesting come tourney time.

STA... no doubt needs to move up. 4 titles in 6 years, that's dominating a class. Personally I say if you win 3 in 5 years, you don't get to make the decision. Then... if you don't qualify for state in the next 5 years, it can be re-reviewed by class A coaches.

So next season, move STA up... and if Breck wins it all, they get moved up the following season.

The sad part is that there are teams that should WANT to move up rather than stay back and just be the big fish in the smaller pond. Look at BSM for a great example... moved up to AA, next year they are going to be "independent" and will probably schedule EP, Wayzata, Edina, 'Tonka, DE, HM and as many of the other top teams as they can get. WHY? Because playing against teams they know they can beat does nothing for you except pad your stats.

This is my thinking also, it should be a MSHL decision, not the individual school's. They have proven themselves dominant in the small schools' division, now PROMOTE them as a reward!! Good job Vanelli! You won again!! We will now PROMOTE you.

vf-guy · Post by **vf-guy** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:10 pm

Two thoughts.

1. have a play up/down game like they do in Europe.

or

2. separate league for private schools. BSM loses to Shattuck 5-2 and Breck ties Shattuck 3-3? C'mon. Be serious.

mulefarm · Post by **mulefarm** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:15 pm

When are the communities for BSM and STA having a welcome home celebration?

mnhockey30 · Post by **mnhockey30** » Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:42 pm

For all those that cheer against the private schools, let me please remind you of "open enrollment." If you say it is not close to the same as recruiting, please see Hopkins Boys Basketball, and Apple Valley Wrestling just to name a few.

northwoods oldtimer · Sat Mar 10, 2012 11:19 pm

Totally disagree. Time for hockey purist to get the kids out of USA hockey rule and MSHSL draconian league.

Bragenrights · Post by **Bragenrights** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 12:46 am

The biggest problem I have with STA is that they are an all guys school, this meaning that there 730 students classifies them as a "small" school when really you should times that by 2 bc all public schools have women included in enrollment. That would hypothetically put them with the same amount of potential hockey players as a school with 1460 students they would easily be AA. It's time to use some common sense!

goldy313 · Post by **goldy313** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:05 am

Without a Doubt Apple Valley is the most corrupt high
school team in the state, any sport, any class. When half your team comes from out of state and nearly the rest of the 7 come from out of district and you have a gifted athlete bylaw in your middle school transfer policy....... Comparing any hockey team to Apple Valley wrestling is a joke.

When you have a coach who 1) has kids from out of state live with him, 2) have a kid throw a chair at a competitor) and 3) think all this is ok, you have a problem way worse than anything hockey has.... No offense but anytime you compare any hockey program to wresting you lose credibility. I can't remember a boys hockey team being punished for recruiting but it happens in wrestling every year, including Kasson twice in two years.

easton18 · Post by **easton18** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:20 am

Bragenrights wrote:The biggest problem I have with STA is that they are an all guys school, this meaning that there 730 students classifies them as a "small" school when really you should times that by 2 bc all public schools have women included in enrollment. That would hypothetically put them with the same amount of potential hockey players as a school with 1460 students they would easily be AA. It's time to use some common sense!

They have an enrollment of 533, per the MSHSL. Doubled makes them 1066 which is under the cutoff. According to the rules/system the MSHSL has developed they are in the right class based on their most recent enrollment figure. Leaving my opinion out, just stating facts.

MHGr8ness · Post by **MHGr8ness** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:32 am

mulefarm wrote:When are the communities for BSM and STA having a welcome home celebration?

MHGr8ness · Post by **MHGr8ness** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:35 am

This topic reminds me of the student sections of both STA and Htown going at it. Funny and clever chants from both sides... but when Htown chants "No one likes you" and almost all of the Xcel claps then I think that sends a strong statement of peoples' feelings towards the powerhouse privates.

MHGr8ness · Post by **MHGr8ness** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:42 am

My personal feeling on the topic can be summarized by a story from today.

My friends and I got to the Xcel at 9 and picked great spots in the middle. We watched the third place game and were a little upset to see that when the STA parents started coming in that we were where the majority of them were sitting (we planned on cheering for Htown and had a sign for them).
When one mother saw the sign she told us we would wreck the game for her and that we should leave. It's funny because that's EXACTLY how I feel about these powerhouse privates playing A. You're wrecking the game and should leave.

MHGr8ness · Post by **MHGr8ness** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:44 am

mnhockey30 wrote:For all those that cheer against the private schools, let me please remind you of "open enrollment." If you say it is not close to the same as recruiting, please see Hopkins Boys Basketball, and Apple Valley Wrestling just to name a few.

Already brought up. Read... it's quite different.

celly93 · Post by **celly93** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 4:39 am

mulefarm wrote:When are the communities for BSM and STA having a welcome home celebration?

I find it extremely funny when people say that private schools don't have communities. What they really mean is cities.

Just because you don't all live in the same city doesn't mean you're not a community.

For example, if you're a parent of a high school public school kid, who do you connect with most? Other parents and members of the high school. Obviously there are exceptions but it's pretty much the same at private schools.

I attend BSM, so maybe I don't know what a "real" community is like, but when I have random people high five me when I wear my BSM stuff in public, I feel like it's a community. When I talk to parents who attended BSM and now send their kids there, I feel like it's a community. When I talk to my teachers who went to BSM and came back right after they got their degrees, I feel like it's a community. When I see hundreds of people gathered in the chapel for before school prayer the week after Jack's injury, I feel like it's a community.

I know you'll probably pick this apart because well, that's what we do on this forum, but my main point is that just because you aren't named after a city doesn't mean you don't have a community.

And to answer your question, hundreds of people welcomed the team at the Rec Center (their home ice) after the game.

gorilla1 · Post by **gorilla1** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:37 am

For all those Complaining about it not being fair with private schools, especially up north, how about we move teams around in the sections so that teams like Wayzata, EP, Minnetonka and BSM all have a chance to go to state? Put Minnetonka in section 8, Ep in section 7, and BSM in section 3 and Burnsville in section 1. Is it fair that all of these teams cant get to state every year? No, especially when you watch teams that only get to state because of the sections they are in. Of the 5 teams I have listed, at least 2 or 3 should make state almost every year, sometimes more. It isn't fair and they just have to deal with it. I know some like what the Hermantown coach said, but I think it kind of is embarrassing and does nothing to instill confidence in your team. It sounds like he is a great coach though.

Hard water fan · Post by **Hard water fan** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 8:56 am

As someone whose kid goes to a private school, I would like the privates to band together and form a league, competing nationally. Tier 1 competition, form a true midwest prep league, west coast and east coast. They could start at the bantam level. This would eliminate all recruitment discussions, even the playing field, keep tne sanctity of the MSHSL State Championship and prevent the dilution of publc programs. If someone wants to play in the greatest show in hockey, play public. You want to compete with Culver, Shattuck or Hotchkiss for Nationals, play prep league Tier 1.