PRE Pre-season Rankings...Message board edition...

Discussion of Minnesota Girls High School Hockey

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massalsa
Posts: 476
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:37 pm

PRE Pre-season Rankings...Message board edition...

Post by massalsa » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:18 pm

Time for some Girls HS Hockey talk. Too many posts on concussions from greybeard (valuable but a little depressing)...how about some forward looking prognosticating!?!

How about a preseason top 10 for AA and a top 5 for A. Lastly an overall prediction for final 4 of both AA & A. Here is a VERY quick shot...may need to do some more thinking but wanted to get this started:

AA:

Hornets
Crimson
Pioneers
Centennial
Eagles
Cretin
Elk River
FLAKE
Blaine
WBL

(no Skippers or Trojans?!?)

A:

Bears
SPA
Mustangs
Warroad
New Prague

6. Taylor Heise (honorable mention...maybe the best player in the state?)

MN_Bowhunter
Posts: 223
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:08 am

Post by MN_Bowhunter » Thu Sep 29, 2016 3:07 pm

Here's how they stand in LPH.

High School Girls AA - FINAL
1 EDEN PRAIRIE
2 Maple Grove
3 Hill-Murray
4 Edina
5 Minnetonka
6 Elk River/Zimmerman
7 Wayzata
8 Cretin-Derham Hall
9 Centennial
10 Eastview
11 Lakeville South
12 Chaska/Chanhassen
13 Forest Lake
14 Blaine
15 Dodge County
16 Eagan
17 Mounds View
18 Spring Lake Park/Coon Rapids
19 White Bear Lake
20 Sartell/Sauk Rapids

1 BLAKE
2 Breck
3 St. Paul United
4 Warroad
5 Thief River Falls
6 Proctor/Hermantown
7 New Prague
8 Alexandria
9 Mound Westonka
10 Northfield
11 Owatonna
12 Red Wing
13 Princeton
14 New Ulm
15 Orono
16 Hutchinson
17 East Grand Forks
18 South St. Paul
19 Hibbing/Chisholm
20 Mahtomedi

massalsa
Posts: 476
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:37 pm

Post by massalsa » Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:52 pm

/\ /\ /\ /\

Thats how it ended...how bout some predictions!

zambonidriver
Posts: 675
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:31 am

Post by zambonidriver » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:49 am

OK, I'll bite

Cretin
Hornets
Crimson
Pioneers
Centennial
Eagles
Elk River
FLAKE
Eagan
Eastview

A
Blake
SPA
Roseau
SSP
Hibbing

Mavs
Posts: 448
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2015 10:35 am

Post by Mavs » Fri Sep 30, 2016 8:08 am

zambonidriver wrote:OK, I'll bite

Cretin
Hornets
Crimson
Pioneers
Centennial
Eagles
Elk River
FLAKE
Eagan
Eastview

A
Blake
SPA
Roseau
SSP
Hibbing

AA

Hill Murray graduated like 6 D1 players. I'm sure they reload but I wouldn't have them in the top 5 to start the season.

Cretin will be loaded and are getting the kids HM is use to landing and could be a changing of the guard with east side recruiting

Edina is Edina

Centennial could have the best 1st line in the state

Eastview has a game changer

Eagan will be good for years to come

Farmingtion will have a big top line

Forest Lake lost their top scorer and goalie

EP is your returning champ

Maple Grove will be good

MN_Bowhunter
Posts: 223
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:08 am

Post by MN_Bowhunter » Fri Sep 30, 2016 11:24 am

massalsa wrote:/\ /\ /\ /\

Thats how it ended...how bout some predictions!
I don't have a dog in the fight anymore but Edina is going to dominate everybody this year. Then Maple Grove. After that 3 through 10 are probably interchangeable.

I don't see Forest Lake in the top ten, with a D1 senior goalie they got OH-two BBQ'd at state, and as mentioned have lost quite a bit of scoring to graduation. Between lost offense and goaltending that's gonna average -2 goals a game. 13-12 at best, sorry ZD. Feel free to rub it in my face if I'm wrong.

Eastview will hover around the 20 mark like they did last year, then make a run in the playoffs when the bench gets shorter.

I predict a single A public school will make it to the 3rd place game at state.

jg2112
Posts: 518
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:36 am

Post by jg2112 » Fri Sep 30, 2016 1:46 pm

MN_Bowhunter wrote:
massalsa wrote:/\ /\ /\ /\

Thats how it ended...how bout some predictions!
I don't have a dog in the fight anymore but Edina is going to dominate everybody this year. Then Maple Grove. After that 3 through 10 are probably interchangeable.

I don't see Forest Lake in the top ten, with a D1 senior goalie they got OH-two BBQ'd at state, and as mentioned have lost quite a bit of scoring to graduation. Between lost offense and goaltending that's gonna average -2 goals a game. 13-12 at best, sorry ZD. Feel free to rub it in my face if I'm wrong.

Eastview will hover around the 20 mark like they did last year, then make a run in the playoffs when the bench gets shorter.

I predict a single A public school will make it to the 3rd place game at state.
I'll take up the flag on behalf of Zamboni and Forest Lake. The U12A team that won the state title is now all in 9th grade, except for one of the goalies, and the superstar now-8th grader who would not be out of place on the varsity this winter.

If my notes are correct, one of the new goalies is a 10th grader who made it to the St. Cloud camp this past summer, and one of the 9th grade goalies should be there in 2017.

Yes, they will lose a lot of scoring, but they've got plenty of talented players in the pipeline. I've also heard 1-2 girls have open enrolled in from nearby.

I don't think 13-12 is likely. Yes, games against Breck and Tonka seem rough, but looking at that schedule, their conference opponents and the returning skaters, 15-10 looks more reasonable as a baseline.

As an aside, if Forest Lake remains in Section 7AA (avoiding redistricting), how good will those Sectional Finals be against Andover in about 2-3 years' time? Whoa Nelly.

nu2hockey
Posts: 606
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2013 8:19 pm

Post by nu2hockey » Fri Sep 30, 2016 2:42 pm

1 Edina
2 MG
3 Blaine
4 Centennial
5 Eagan
6 HM
7 ER/Z
8 EP
9 CDH
10 Eastview

1. Blake
2 P/H
3 Breck
4 SPU
5 Warroad

As to Forest Lake, with that weak schedule, 4-5 losses puts them in bottom of top 10....10-12 losses will be a BAD year compared to their expectations


..Roseau is AA

zambonidriver
Posts: 675
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:31 am

Post by zambonidriver » Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:37 am

jg2112 wrote:
MN_Bowhunter wrote:
massalsa wrote:/\ /\ /\ /\

Thats how it ended...how bout some predictions!
I don't have a dog in the fight anymore but Edina is going to dominate everybody this year. Then Maple Grove. After that 3 through 10 are probably interchangeable.

I don't see Forest Lake in the top ten, with a D1 senior goalie they got OH-two BBQ'd at state, and as mentioned have lost quite a bit of scoring to graduation. Between lost offense and goaltending that's gonna average -2 goals a game. 13-12 at best, sorry ZD. Feel free to rub it in my face if I'm wrong.

Eastview will hover around the 20 mark like they did last year, then make a run in the playoffs when the bench gets shorter.

I predict a single A public school will make it to the 3rd place game at state.
I'll take up the flag on behalf of Zamboni and Forest Lake. The U12A team that won the state title is now all in 9th grade, except for one of the goalies, and the superstar now-8th grader who would not be out of place on the varsity this winter.

If my notes are correct, one of the new goalies is a 10th grader who made it to the St. Cloud camp this past summer, and one of the 9th grade goalies should be there in 2017.

Yes, they will lose a lot of scoring, but they've got plenty of talented players in the pipeline. I've also heard 1-2 girls have open enrolled in from nearby.

I don't think 13-12 is likely. Yes, games against Breck and Tonka seem rough, but looking at that schedule, their conference opponents and the returning skaters, 15-10 looks more reasonable as a baseline.

As an aside, if Forest Lake remains in Section 7AA (avoiding redistricting), how good will those Sectional Finals be against Andover in about 2-3 years' time? Whoa Nelly.
Fl update obviously I have a dog in the hunt. Goalies are all 9th graders great competition with an 8th grader in the wings. Lost #1 goal scorer but still have one of the best senior forwards in the state in Nolan. Will see how things go I don't know about a weak schedule with Breck,Tonka and Cretin and White Bear twice. Young and coming. Two stud 8th graders competing for one Varsity spot one JG knows about the other is a move in from St. Francis. Three Lines 6 D depth wins in the long run it is not how you start but how you finish.

InigoMontoya
Posts: 1719
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:36 pm

Post by InigoMontoya » Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:48 am

If my notes are correct, one of the new goalies is a 10th grader who made it to the St. Cloud camp this past summer, and one of the 9th grade goalies should be there in 2017.
It's a big step from state summer camp to backing a top 10 AA team.

titleist
Posts: 165
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 11:12 am

Post by titleist » Mon Oct 03, 2016 10:33 am

InigoMontoya wrote:
If my notes are correct, one of the new goalies is a 10th grader who made it to the St. Cloud camp this past summer, and one of the 9th grade goalies should be there in 2017.
It's a big step from state summer camp to backing a top 10 AA team.
I've seen this said goalie, and she is not ready to make FL a top 10 team...yet.
For the most part, the MN goalies struggled at National camp. Not all, but most.....and this was one that struggled.

zambonidriver
Posts: 675
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:31 am

Post by zambonidriver » Mon Oct 03, 2016 10:55 am

titleist wrote:
InigoMontoya wrote:
If my notes are correct, one of the new goalies is a 10th grader who made it to the St. Cloud camp this past summer, and one of the 9th grade goalies should be there in 2017.
It's a big step from state summer camp to backing a top 10 AA team.
I've seen this said goalie, and she is not ready to make FL a top 10 team...yet.
For the most part, the MN goalies struggled at National camp. Not all, but most.....and this was one that struggled.
Goaltending will be a strength at FLAKE

InigoMontoya
Posts: 1719
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:36 pm

Post by InigoMontoya » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:44 am

titleist wrote:
InigoMontoya wrote:
If my notes are correct, one of the new goalies is a 10th grader who made it to the St. Cloud camp this past summer, and one of the 9th grade goalies should be there in 2017.
It's a big step from state summer camp to backing a top 10 AA team.
I've seen this said goalie, and she is not ready to make FL a top 10 team...yet.
For the most part, the MN goalies struggled at National camp. Not all, but most.....and this was one that struggled.
She was at the state camp - I didn't think she was at the national camp.

MN_Bowhunter
Posts: 223
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:08 am

Post by MN_Bowhunter » Mon Oct 03, 2016 5:29 pm

zambonidriver wrote:Goaltending will be a strength at FLAKE
The good news is that whatever confidence your daughter may lack, you'll make up for it.

Here's your AA state tournament breakdown from last year. FLAKE, Lakeville South, Eastview - Seniors

Edina, Maple Grove - Juniors

Eden Prairie - Sophomore

*Hill Murray - Freshman and benched Senior

Not a lot of freshman representation there.

*The last 5 years Hill Murray could have put a traffic cone in the crease and it would have posted a .930 save percentage. Evidenced by the fact they felt a freshman gave them a better chance to win than a senior goalie finalist with a .957 save percentage, as well as the return of a former state champion senior goalie finalist who is going to find out if she can compete at the D3 level this year after a heavy dose of D1 reality last year- This is a rant for another thread but wouldn't it be nice if inclusion in the elite leagues, HP, all-state, senior goalie, etc were based solely on talent instead of talent plus inflated stats, reputation and certain schools getting preferential treatment?

Rant over, back to the topic.

I'm not knocking anybody's talent, but experience, strength and confidence are huge factors that may not show up drastically in save %, but they show up in W's and L's, especially the most important W's.

Freshman don't play pucks very well or very often. Going back and getting a ring-around for your D on your PK with lots of incoming pressure takes confidence and experience. It very well may mean the difference between killing that penalty or losing the game. Does your freshman play pucks in the face of pressure? All the ones I've seen don't, and getting your team out of the zone means less pucks in your net and more in the other.

Freshman worry about making saves and nothing else. Seniors know when their 3rd line is on the ice against the other team's 1st line, They know when their team is tired so they direct that puck into the netting so they can get a change. They play pucks to their D when they're on the PP rather than covering it and giving the other team a face-off in their own zone. Not scoring that PP goal won't effect her save % but it very well may make the difference between winning and losing.

Freshman are weak and timid compared to juniors and seniors. Fighting through screens and scrums, owning the top of your crease and having the strength to cover loose pucks or be mobile enough to make a recovery save are huge. Maybe only a few goals a year difference between a senior and a freshman, but that's the difference between watching the state tournament and playing in it. Just ask Eagan.

Rebound control. If you play for a powerhouse with all college bound defenseman in front of you, you can spit out rebounds like a Pez dispenser and it won't hurt you. For the other 120(?) teams out there it's an important skill that freshman aren't that good at. Especially when it comes down to actual game situations where the best place to put a rebound may actually be right in front of you because there's a girl wide open on the back door. Seeing the entire ice and knowing where everybody is located is a skill learned through experience. How often does your freshman take her eyes off the puck? Watch a good older goalie and her head is on a swivel when the puck's in her zone.

Bottom line is, no matter how talented your freshman goalie is, she's going to lose some games because she's young and inexperienced. While you may describe goaltending as a strength at FL this year, I highly doubt your coach would do the same off the record.

Sincerely,

Parent of a goalie who played 4.5 years of varsity hockey.

MN_Bowhunter
Posts: 223
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:08 am

Re: PRE Pre-season Rankings...Message board edition...

Post by MN_Bowhunter » Mon Oct 03, 2016 5:48 pm

massalsa wrote:
6. Taylor Heise (honorable mention...maybe the best player in the state?)
Hosted an old friend this weekend who wanted to see some hockey because she hasn't lived in MN since the early 90's. Caught a couple periods of Elite League on Saturday and I was very impressed by Heise.

Unimpressive was the defenseman who got beat on every loose puck battle and proceeded to ring the boards with a puck she could have easily passed to a wide open teammate. Then waved her stick at the opposing player with the now turned-over puck who proceeded to score.

But hey, she plays for ****, so she must be elite, right?

zambonidriver
Posts: 675
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:31 am

Post by zambonidriver » Tue Oct 04, 2016 5:46 am

MN_Bowhunter wrote:
zambonidriver wrote:Goaltending will be a strength at FLAKE
The good news is that whatever confidence your daughter may lack, you'll make up for it.

Here's your AA state tournament breakdown from last year. FLAKE, Lakeville South, Eastview - Seniors

Edina, Maple Grove - Juniors

Eden Prairie - Sophomore

*Hill Murray - Freshman and benched Senior

Not a lot of freshman representation there.

*The last 5 years Hill Murray could have put a traffic cone in the crease and it would have posted a .930 save percentage. Evidenced by the fact they felt a freshman gave them a better chance to win than a senior goalie finalist with a .957 save percentage, as well as the return of a former state champion senior goalie finalist who is going to find out if she can compete at the D3 level this year after a heavy dose of D1 reality last year- This is a rant for another thread but wouldn't it be nice if inclusion in the elite leagues, HP, all-state, senior goalie, etc were based solely on talent instead of talent plus inflated stats, reputation and certain schools getting preferential treatment?

Rant over, back to the topic.

I'm not knocking anybody's talent, but experience, strength and confidence are huge factors that may not show up drastically in save %, but they show up in W's and L's, especially the most important W's.

Freshman don't play pucks very well or very often. Going back and getting a ring-around for your D on your PK with lots of incoming pressure takes confidence and experience. It very well may mean the difference between killing that penalty or losing the game. Does your freshman play pucks in the face of pressure? All the ones I've seen don't, and getting your team out of the zone means less pucks in your net and more in the other.

Freshman worry about making saves and nothing else. Seniors know when their 3rd line is on the ice against the other team's 1st line, They know when their team is tired so they direct that puck into the netting so they can get a change. They play pucks to their D when they're on the PP rather than covering it and giving the other team a face-off in their own zone. Not scoring that PP goal won't effect her save % but it very well may make the difference between winning and losing.

Freshman are weak and timid compared to juniors and seniors. Fighting through screens and scrums, owning the top of your crease and having the strength to cover loose pucks or be mobile enough to make a recovery save are huge. Maybe only a few goals a year difference between a senior and a freshman, but that's the difference between watching the state tournament and playing in it. Just ask Eagan.

Rebound control. If you play for a powerhouse with all college bound defenseman in front of you, you can spit out rebounds like a Pez dispenser and it won't hurt you. For the other 120(?) teams out there it's an important skill that freshman aren't that good at. Especially when it comes down to actual game situations where the best place to put a rebound may actually be right in front of you because there's a girl wide open on the back door. Seeing the entire ice and knowing where everybody is located is a skill learned through experience. How often does your freshman take her eyes off the puck? Watch a good older goalie and her head is on a swivel when the puck's in her zone.

Bottom line is, no matter how talented your freshman goalie is, she's going to lose some games because she's young and inexperienced. While you may describe goaltending as a strength at FL this year, I highly doubt your coach would do the same off the record.

Sincerely,

Parent of a goalie who played 4.5 years of varsity hockey.
You make good points. I'll let my daughters play speak for itself while I stand by my earlier statement. With regards to your rant about Hill you are a hundred % accurate there. Know the goalie you are talking about couldn't agree more.

InigoMontoya
Posts: 1719
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2009 12:36 pm

Post by InigoMontoya » Tue Oct 04, 2016 10:34 am

Now I'm excited for the season to start.

itsfoilcoach
Posts: 153
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:02 pm

Post by itsfoilcoach » Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:14 am

MN_Bowhunter wrote:
zambonidriver wrote:Goaltending will be a strength at FLAKE
The good news is that whatever confidence your daughter may lack, you'll make up for it.

Here's your AA state tournament breakdown from last year. FLAKE, Lakeville South, Eastview - Seniors

Edina, Maple Grove - Juniors

Eden Prairie - Sophomore

*Hill Murray - Freshman and benched Senior

Not a lot of freshman representation there.

*The last 5 years Hill Murray could have put a traffic cone in the crease and it would have posted a .930 save percentage. Evidenced by the fact they felt a freshman gave them a better chance to win than a senior goalie finalist with a .957 save percentage, as well as the return of a former state champion senior goalie finalist who is going to find out if she can compete at the D3 level this year after a heavy dose of D1 reality last year- This is a rant for another thread but wouldn't it be nice if inclusion in the elite leagues, HP, all-state, senior goalie, etc were based solely on talent instead of talent plus inflated stats, reputation and certain schools getting preferential treatment?

Rant over, back to the topic.

I'm not knocking anybody's talent, but experience, strength and confidence are huge factors that may not show up drastically in save %, but they show up in W's and L's, especially the most important W's.

Freshman don't play pucks very well or very often. Going back and getting a ring-around for your D on your PK with lots of incoming pressure takes confidence and experience. It very well may mean the difference between killing that penalty or losing the game. Does your freshman play pucks in the face of pressure? All the ones I've seen don't, and getting your team out of the zone means less pucks in your net and more in the other.

Freshman worry about making saves and nothing else. Seniors know when their 3rd line is on the ice against the other team's 1st line, They know when their team is tired so they direct that puck into the netting so they can get a change. They play pucks to their D when they're on the PP rather than covering it and giving the other team a face-off in their own zone. Not scoring that PP goal won't effect her save % but it very well may make the difference between winning and losing.

Freshman are weak and timid compared to juniors and seniors. Fighting through screens and scrums, owning the top of your crease and having the strength to cover loose pucks or be mobile enough to make a recovery save are huge. Maybe only a few goals a year difference between a senior and a freshman, but that's the difference between watching the state tournament and playing in it. Just ask Eagan.

Rebound control. If you play for a powerhouse with all college bound defenseman in front of you, you can spit out rebounds like a Pez dispenser and it won't hurt you. For the other 120(?) teams out there it's an important skill that freshman aren't that good at. Especially when it comes down to actual game situations where the best place to put a rebound may actually be right in front of you because there's a girl wide open on the back door. Seeing the entire ice and knowing where everybody is located is a skill learned through experience. How often does your freshman take her eyes off the puck? Watch a good older goalie and her head is on a swivel when the puck's in her zone.

Bottom line is, no matter how talented your freshman goalie is, she's going to lose some games because she's young and inexperienced. While you may describe goaltending as a strength at FL this year, I highly doubt your coach would do the same off the record.

Sincerely,

Parent of a goalie who played 4.5 years of varsity hockey.[/quote

Ouch. No Mas No Mas says the zambonidriver. .... well said bowhunter.

nu2hockey
Posts: 606
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2013 8:19 pm

Post by nu2hockey » Thu Oct 06, 2016 4:38 pm

itsfoilcoach wrote:
MN_Bowhunter wrote:
zambonidriver wrote:Goaltending will be a strength at FLAKE
The good news is that whatever confidence your daughter may lack, you'll make up for it.

Here's your AA state tournament breakdown from last year. FLAKE, Lakeville South, Eastview - Seniors

Edina, Maple Grove - Juniors

Eden Prairie - Sophomore

*Hill Murray - Freshman and benched Senior

Didn't happen, they alternated every game except sec finals,freshman earned the right to play ...

Not a lot of freshman representation there.

*The last 5 years Hill Murray could have put a traffic cone in the crease and it would have posted a .930 save percentage. Evidenced by the fact they felt a freshman gave them a better chance to win than a senior goalie finalist with a .957 save percentage,
both goalies had nearly identical stats , cone only had a .915


as well as the return of a former state champion senior goalie finalist who is going to find out if she can compete at the D3 level this year after a heavy dose of D1 reality last year-

All the goalies(3) left to play elsewhere...you are right about D1 reality for goalies, Mn has only 18 D1 goalies on rosters this year(total 85),however, 18 is an increase from previous averages of 13-14

This is a rant for another thread but wouldn't it be nice if inclusion in the elite leagues, HP, all-state, senior goalie, etc were based solely on talent instead of talent plus inflated stats, reputation and certain schools getting preferential treatment?

Rant over, back to the topic.

I'm not knocking anybody's talent, but experience, strength and confidence are huge factors that may not show up drastically in save %, but they show up in W's and L's, especially the most important W's.

Freshman don't play pucks very well or very often. Going back and getting a ring-around for your D on your PK with lots of incoming pressure takes confidence and experience. It very well may mean the difference between killing that penalty or losing the game. Does your freshman play pucks in the face of pressure? All the ones I've seen don't, and getting your team out of the zone means less pucks in your net and more in the other.

Freshman worry about making saves and nothing else. Seniors know when their 3rd line is on the ice against the other team's 1st line, They know when their team is tired so they direct that puck into the netting so they can get a change. They play pucks to their D when they're on the PP rather than covering it and giving the other team a face-off in their own zone. Not scoring that PP goal won't effect her save % but it very well may make the difference between winning and losing.

Freshman are weak and timid compared to juniors and seniors. Fighting through screens and scrums, owning the top of your crease and having the strength to cover loose pucks or be mobile enough to make a recovery save are huge.

freshman goalies (alpha order)Bailey,Bizal,Frank, and Meyers are anything but weak and meek. If anything, they may be TOO aggressive, plus they are agile and strong. Your argument may have been true in the past, but today's kids are playing all the time and have a lot more game experience than previous freshman..IN the case of HM and WBL last year the seniors were totally inexperienced..when the seniors played they never left the crease, however, the freshman played the puck all the time

Maybe only a few goals a year difference between a senior and a freshman, but that's the difference between watching the state tournament and playing in it. Just ask Eagan.

yes, Eagan let in two SOFT goals,but, they lost the sectional final because of coaching. Eagan had the game in hand with a 3-2 lead, 2:30 left in the third period on a powerplay. Eastview jammed their 4 defenders in front of their goalie, Eagan players should have been told not to shoot,because, there was no one within 25 feet of the puck. After the shot and block Eastview gets the puck and Eagan gets a too-many-on-the-ice penalty, another coaching mistake. The rest is history..

Rebound control. If you play for a powerhouse with all college bound defenseman in front of you, you can spit out rebounds like a Pez dispenser and it won't hurt you. For the other 120(?) teams out there it's an important skill that freshman aren't that good at. Especially when it comes down to actual game situations where the best place to put a rebound may actually be right in front of you because there's a girl wide open on the back door. Seeing the entire ice and knowing where everybody is located is a skill learned through experience. How often does your freshman take her eyes off the puck? Watch a good older goalie and her head is on a swivel when the puck's in her zone.

Bottom line is, no matter how talented your freshman goalie is, she's going to lose some games because she's young and inexperienced. While you may describe goaltending as a strength at FL this year, I highly doubt your coach would do the same off the record.

Sincerely,

Parent of a goalie who played 4.5 years of varsity hockey.[/quote

Ouch. No Mas No Mas says the zambonidriver. .... well said bowhunter.

Hard water fan
Posts: 173
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2010 4:02 pm

Post by Hard water fan » Sun Oct 09, 2016 2:15 pm

Bowhunter...spot on. There were some very good goalies in the '98 class, but most didn't play at State. The young ones need to see some real rubber before being crowned...

MN_Bowhunter
Posts: 223
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:08 am

Post by MN_Bowhunter » Mon Oct 10, 2016 6:29 pm

nu2hockey wrote:
Didn't happen, they alternated every game except sec finals,freshman earned the right to play ...

both goalies had nearly identical stats , cone only had a .915

To my point, unless and until Hill had to play a quality opponent whoever was in the nets didn't matter. It's not hard to stop 15 dump-ins from the blue line, and being able to stop 15 dump-ins from the blue line shouldn't qualify someone for elite status.


freshman goalies (alpha order)Bailey,Bizal,Frank, and Meyers are anything but weak and meek. If anything, they may be TOO aggressive, plus they are agile and strong. Your argument may have been true in the past, but today's kids are playing all the time and have a lot more game experience than previous freshman..IN the case of HM and WBL last year the seniors were totally inexperienced..when the seniors played they never left the crease, however, the freshman played the puck all the time

I haven't seen all of these kids play but they all have one thing in common. They all play for high quality teams that limit scoring chances, clear lanes and rebounds, and tie up bodies and sticks. I watched Meyers vs MV (1 - 1) last year and both freshman goalies struggled with bad rebounds all night. It just never hurt them because they had good players around them to clean up.

My point is the team and coaching have a lot to do with the success of these kids, not that they're not talented. They are still weaker and more inexperienced than their older counterparts and given equal ability the senior is going to help you win more games.

yes, Eagan let in two SOFT goals,but, they lost the sectional final because of coaching. Eagan had the game in hand with a 3-2 lead, 2:30 left in the third period on a powerplay. Eastview jammed their 4 defenders in front of their goalie, Eagan players should have been told not to shoot,because, there was no one within 25 feet of the puck. After the shot and block Eastview gets the puck and Eagan gets a too-many-on-the-ice penalty, another coaching mistake. The rest is history..

Coaching or not, swap goalies and you have a different outcome. Eagan fan or just came out to watch?

nu2hockey
Posts: 606
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2013 8:19 pm

Post by nu2hockey » Tue Oct 11, 2016 9:23 am

MN_Bowhunter wrote:
nu2hockey wrote:
Didn't happen, they alternated every game except sec finals,freshman earned the right to play ...

both goalies had nearly identical stats , cone only had a .915

To my point, unless and until Hill had to play a quality opponent whoever was in the nets didn't matter. It's not hard to stop 15 dump-ins from the blue line, and being able to stop 15 dump-ins from the blue line shouldn't qualify someone for elite status.


freshman goalies (alpha order)Bailey,Bizal,Frank, and Meyers are anything but weak and meek. If anything, they may be TOO aggressive, plus they are agile and strong. Your argument may have been true in the past, but today's kids are playing all the time and have a lot more game experience than previous freshman..IN the case of HM and WBL last year the seniors were totally inexperienced..when the seniors played they never left the crease, however, the freshman played the puck all the time

I haven't seen all of these kids play but they all have one thing in common. They all play for high quality teams that limit scoring chances, clear lanes and rebounds, and tie up bodies and sticks. I watched Meyers vs MV (1 - 1) last year and both freshman goalies struggled with bad rebounds all night. It just never hurt them because they had good players around them to clean up.

My point is the team and coaching have a lot to do with the success of these kids, not that they're not talented. They are still weaker and more inexperienced than their older counterparts and given equal ability the senior is going to help you win more games.

yes, Eagan let in two SOFT goals,but, they lost the sectional final because of coaching. Eagan had the game in hand with a 3-2 lead, 2:30 left in the third period on a powerplay. Eastview jammed their 4 defenders in front of their goalie, Eagan players should have been told not to shoot,because, there was no one within 25 feet of the puck. After the shot and block Eastview gets the puck and Eagan gets a too-many-on-the-ice penalty, another coaching mistake. The rest is history..

Coaching or not, swap goalies and you have a different outcome. Eagan fan or just came out to watch?

Yep, swapping goalies would most likely have changed outcome with the coaching failures..
However,Eastview was a 2-trick pony last year with Tschida and Snodgrass...losing either really weakens them..this year with Tschida gone it will be interesting to see if they even get to Sec final


Not from Eagan, Sec Final games between rivals are the years best games...Eagan/Eastview, Blake/Breck,previously Ep/Edina, the two Lakeville schools, to name a few. We try to attend those games...We found seats on the Eagan side last year, watching those fans go from thrill of certain victory to the agony of defeat (to quote jim mckay) was something to behold.

massalsa
Posts: 476
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:37 pm

Post by massalsa » Wed Oct 12, 2016 11:15 am

MN_Bowhunter wrote:
freshman goalies (alpha order)Bailey,Bizal,Frank, and Meyers are anything but weak and meek. If anything, they may be TOO aggressive, plus they are agile and strong. Your argument may have been true in the past, but today's kids are playing all the time and have a lot more game experience than previous freshman..IN the case of HM and WBL last year the seniors were totally inexperienced..when the seniors played they never left the crease, however, the freshman played the puck all the time.


I believe that Harnett might be the best of all of the Freshman goalies.

itsfoilcoach
Posts: 153
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:02 pm

Post by itsfoilcoach » Sun Oct 16, 2016 5:11 pm

nu2hockey wrote: 1 Edina
2 MG
3 Blaine
4 Centennial
5 Eagan
6 HM - Lost too many D1 players this year (9?). re-tooling or not. Cant overcome that game flow and chenistry...this year
7 ER/Z
8 EP
9 CDH - Maybe a sleeper.
10 Eastview - Team to watch. Not a top five however.



1. Blake - Blake Don't think so - Didn't Blake lose three seniors this year. (2 forwards and 1 D) The top scorer & points leaders last year. Along with a starting senior D. Bullock (43 goals) being one of them. They only had one other skater get double digits, and that was only 11 goals. I’m sure with someone else on the ice getting all the attention even made that number a little easier to obtain.

2 P/H My #1 pick

3 Breck -- Yea right. Have another one.. Bartender says your cut off.

4 SPU - Should be higher. Lost a starting goalie. Never a good thing. But they have a very strong first line coming back that's been together for years.

5 Warroad

As to Forest Lake, with that weak schedule, 4-5 losses puts them in bottom of top 10....10-12 losses will be a BAD year compared to their expectations


..Roseau is AA
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Maybe I had one too many as well. But here are my top ten.


A

1. P/H
2. SPU
3. Warroad
4. SSP
5. Hibbing
6. Holy Family
7. Mound Westonka
8. Red Wing
9. Breck
10. Northfield

AA

1 Edina
2 MG
3 Blaine
4 Centennial
5 ER/Z
6 Hill
7 Eagan
8 EP
9 CDH - Sleeper pick
Tie - Eastview, Forest Lake

nu2hockey
Posts: 606
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2013 8:19 pm

Post by nu2hockey » Sun Oct 16, 2016 9:48 pm

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Maybe I had one too many as well. But here are my top ten.


A

1. P/H
2. SPU
3. Warroad
4. SSP
5. Hibbing
6. Holy Family
7. Mound Westonka
8. Red Wing
9. Breck
10. Northfield

AA

1 Edina
2 MG
3 Blaine
4 Centennial
5 ER/Z
6 Hill
7 Eagan
8 EP
9 CDH - Sleeper pick
Tie - Eastview, Forest Lake

Your AA is the same except switching ER/Z & EAGAN..that's cool

Class A

Blake has: Bizal,McClanahan,Burton,Daniel,Burton,Delianedis,Wethington, Vojta.... We are talking about class A where if you have 2 good players you are top 10. No other class A school has that much talent, and frankly except for a select few AA schools
..

Breck at three maybe too high,but:Zumwinkle,Williamson,Billing,Beniek,Mobley , with new goalie they are still a top class A

SPU lost Hansen also..

Since this is a pre-season list CDH & Eastview probably belong,but by year end they might not ...that"s why this is entertaining

FLAKE lost best 2 players (including goalie) ...considering that plus 11 of their wins were against teams with losing records plus another 2 wins against out-state teams who would struggle to win a combined 5 wins in Mn.....it will be interesting how they do this year, but for a pre-season poll, they would probably fall outside the top 10-15.

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