16 and 17 National Camp Invitees

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RRubberbeeskit
Posts: 178
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:23 am

Process is cloudy

Post by RRubberbeeskit » Tue May 07, 2013 9:41 pm

minnscout wrote:Mark Kaske was the best forward both weekends- , this process is a joke. Look at a couple of the names on the 16 list and you just have to wonder.
Get used to this joke of a process. I believe the majority of the best talent is selected however this being a "development program" I have never been sure that they are truly selecting the talent that will develop into the most complete player at each position.
When it comes to selecting defenseman It doesnt seem as though being a complete shutdown defenseman is nearly as important as having the ability to rush the puck from one end to the other.
As far as the 17s that were selected on defense to the 54s i am certain they completely missed the boat. How do you leave out Linstrand from Wayzata?
:-k

headshackers
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:41 am

Post by headshackers » Wed May 08, 2013 12:23 pm

Cole Borchardt F 1g 1a
Joseph Lau F 0g 1a
Dylan Malmquist F 3g 0a
Cullen Munson F 0g 0a
Jack Murphy F 1g 2a
John Peterson F 0g 1a
Chase Phelps F 3g 1a
Austin Poganski F 0g 3a
Mitchel Slattery F 0g 2a
Jacob Wahlin F 0g 1a
Travis Brown D 1g 1a
Seamus Donohue D 0g 0a
Jack Dougherty D 0g 1a
Tyler Nanne D 0g 0a
Hayden Shaw D 0 1
Jonathan Walker D 2 0
Jake Kielly G


Six of the forwards picked at the 17's never scored a goal at this tryout. Three players didnt even score a point. One of these kids is considered a professional hockey player. How many of these kids already have D-1 scholarships. Why wouldnt you allow other players the opportunity to be seen. Isnt that what Minnesota hockey should be about. Why didnt they ask lou to use the backdoor again and open up a spot for someone else.

D3Referee
Posts: 242
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:24 pm

Post by D3Referee » Wed May 08, 2013 1:09 pm

dogeatdog1 wrote:Strange that only 11 forwards for the 16s. You would think that we would get at least 20 kids at each level.
There will be 20. If last year is any guide, USA Hockey is saving a spot for Alec Baer, and so they should
headshackers wrote:Why didnt they ask lou to use the backdoor again and open up a spot for someone else.
Now that's funny :lol:
"See ya in another life brother"

Mailman
Posts: 206
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:08 pm

Post by Mailman » Wed May 08, 2013 2:40 pm

headshackers wrote:Cole Borchardt F 1g 1a
Joseph Lau F 0g 1a
Dylan Malmquist F 3g 0a
Cullen Munson F 0g 0a
Jack Murphy F 1g 2a
John Peterson F 0g 1a
Chase Phelps F 3g 1a
Austin Poganski F 0g 3a
Mitchel Slattery F 0g 2a
Jacob Wahlin F 0g 1a
Travis Brown D 1g 1a
Seamus Donohue D 0g 0a
Jack Dougherty D 0g 1a
Tyler Nanne D 0g 0a
Hayden Shaw D 0 1
Jonathan Walker D 2 0
Jake Kielly G


Six of the forwards picked at the 17's never scored a goal at this tryout. Three players didnt even score a point. One of these kids is considered a professional hockey player. How many of these kids already have D-1 scholarships. Why wouldnt you allow other players the opportunity to be seen. Isnt that what Minnesota hockey should be about. Why didnt they ask lou to use the backdoor again and open up a spot for someone else.
As someone else said, in another thread, to paraphrase, "If anyone think this process is anything but a money grab, you haven't been paying attention."

394 West
Posts: 53
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2013 5:40 pm

Post by 394 West » Wed May 08, 2013 5:58 pm

D3Referee wrote:
dogeatdog1 wrote:Strange that only 11 forwards for the 16s. You would think that we would get at least 20 kids at each level.
There will be 20. If last year is any guide, USA Hockey is saving a spot for Alec Baer, and so they should
headshackers wrote:Why didnt they ask lou to use the backdoor again and open up a spot for someone else.
Now that's funny :lol:
Why should they save a spot?

D3Referee
Posts: 242
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:24 pm

Post by D3Referee » Thu May 09, 2013 1:46 pm

394 West wrote:
D3Referee wrote:
dogeatdog1 wrote:Strange that only 11 forwards for the 16s. You would think that we would get at least 20 kids at each level.
There will be 20. If last year is any guide, USA Hockey is saving a spot for Alec Baer, and so they should
Why should they save a spot?
Well, the whole idea is to gather the very players from the different USA Hockey Affiliates, so USA Hockey will definitely want him at the National Camp. As we've seen in past years, the HPC (formerly Select 16 Festival) is not the only identification tool they utilize. Baer is the kind of players they want at the National Camp. Period.

I will be extremely surprised if he is not invited, and then in hindsight, you'll know why there were only 11 spots available.
"See ya in another life brother"

hockeyoldtimer
Posts: 83
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 10:47 pm

16 and 17 national camp

Post by hockeyoldtimer » Fri May 10, 2013 7:51 am

Happy to see Ellingson and Tufto going. Both had good 54 weekends.

hipcheck62
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Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:11 am

Post by hipcheck62 » Fri May 10, 2013 1:20 pm

To slightly change the subject, let me ask a question about these kids. Were they all superstars through squirts and peewees and everyone knew who they were or are there a couple that developed late and went from good players to great players at bantam or later?

Just curious as I am not from there and want to see if the theory of being a good 10 year old does not matter as kids get older and their bodies develop. I imagine that there has to be a couple of late bloomers in there.

Tuuk2score
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Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 3:57 pm

Post by Tuuk2score » Fri May 10, 2013 10:38 pm

63% of the goals were scored on penalty shots All weekend KARL MALONE.............. aka The --------

D3Referee
Posts: 242
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:24 pm

Post by D3Referee » Sun May 12, 2013 5:12 pm

hipcheck62 wrote:To slightly change the subject, let me ask a question about these kids. Were they all superstars through squirts and peewees and everyone knew who they were or are there a couple that developed late and went from good players to great players at bantam or later?

Just curious as I am not from there and want to see if the theory of being a good 10 year old does not matter as kids get older and their bodies develop. I imagine that there has to be a couple of late bloomers in there.
I don't recognize a single late bloomer on the 16's or 17's. If I'm wrong here, please point it out. Maybe Travis Brown? Hayden Shaw was with the Nats I believe? If you pull up your AAA summer programs from tournaments dating back to 2007 and even 2006, it's the same names from the top teams then. Outside of the Northern kids, I think just about every one of the 16's /17's at one time wore a Blades or Machine jersey or Legacy at the least. The Northern boys have been the top players on those Can Am and Northern Wings teams for the past 6-8 years. I guess it pays to get started early and go year round.

So you have to wonder if these boys presence on the 16 and 17 rosters have more to do with their Machine / Blades / Legacy summer training than it does with Minnesota Association hockey winter training, since the common denominator is that most of these boys trained with the top AAA teams in the State since they were mites and squirts.
"See ya in another life brother"

puckhead17
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:04 pm

The Facts

Post by puckhead17 » Thu May 16, 2013 1:36 pm

Ok, for all of you conspiracy theorists here are the facts. The MN HP Program is Minnesota's process of selecting players to send to the USA Hockey National Select Camp. Pay attention to the last part, USA Hockey Select Camp. Each year USA Hockey sends all of its affiliates allocations for the National Select Camps. MN has no say in this number but we generally get more than any other area do to the quality of hockey in MN.

This years allocations:
16's - 2(G), 11(F), 6(D) Only MN, Central, NY and Rocky Mountain gets 2 the rest get 1.

17's - 1 (G), 10 (F), 6(D) All Districts send 1 goaltender.

The High Performance staff has no say in who gets to go after that. However the staff pushes very hard to get our alternates to New York as well. They care about all of the kids and want to get as many there as possible.

This is all subjective and USA Hockey does have at large bids for kids that they "subjectively" think should be there.

This is not tryouts for your AAA team, its a selection process for USA Hockey to get who they think are the best players to New York. Not a perfect process, but that is how it works.

I can tell you that HP Staff members do not have agendas and do the best they can to move the right players through. There will always be disappointments in life. If every time I was disappointed in life I whined on a forum, I would get carpal tunnel from typing.

Keep working hard and good things will come.

SuperStar
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 10:26 am

Post by SuperStar » Thu May 16, 2013 2:13 pm

WOW. Thank you Confucious.

Confucius say...
"It take many nail to build crib, but one screw to fill it."

black sheep
Posts: 332
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:57 pm

Post by black sheep » Tue May 21, 2013 7:45 am

I am not framiliar with this age group but would be very curious to see an actual list of the AAA programs these guys played with. We are getting to the point now where most of the higher end kids are playing AAA up unitl the HP programs begin.

If someone has some old programs that could compile a list of AAA affiliation for the 16's & 17's it would be super cool to see.

Some of these players / parents get TONS of heat trucking around all over the country as kids but maybe there is a link.......

bafata88
Posts: 105
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 8:12 pm

Post by bafata88 » Sat Jun 22, 2013 2:51 pm

It is good to see Keegan Iverson and Paul Bittner invited to the national camp [Dominic Turgeon from Portland as well]. Good luck guys!

Tigers33
Posts: 877
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:06 pm

Post by Tigers33 » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:35 am

It's funny how grown men and some immature men make comments in here about "back door" and "conspiracy theories." Yet when you are looking fr your first job after college, or deciding to try a new career. What's the saying everyone uses? IT'S NOT WHAT YOU KNOW, IT'S WHO YOU KNOW.

Why would you expect anything different? Loads of us on here and some connection getting their first job, a better job, making this team or that team, etc...

Right?? Or should it be different when it's kids playing a game compared to a person looking for a job to support his/her family.

almostashappy
Posts: 930
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 1:07 pm

Post by almostashappy » Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:12 pm

Tigers33 wrote:It's funny how grown men and some immature men make comments in here about "back door" and "conspiracy theories." Yet when you are looking fr your first job after college, or deciding to try a new career. What's the saying everyone uses? IT'S NOT WHAT YOU KNOW, IT'S WHO YOU KNOW.

Why would you expect anything different? Loads of us on here and some connection getting their first job, a better job, making this team or that team, etc...

Right?? Or should it be different when it's kids playing a game compared to a person looking for a job to support his/her family.
This is how it would work if your analogy was valid....

Company X announces that it will hire 20 new employees for entry-level management positions on September 1. New college grads are invited to apply for a chance to participate in the first round of interviews, to be conducted at eight regional locations across the state. The 20 best candidates from each region are then invited to participate in the second round of interviews, where they are judged against the other 140 candidates. The 54 candidates with the highest scores in this second round of interviews are then invited to a third and final round of interviews on the corporate campus. They are told that the 20 new hires will be identified after this stage of the hiring process. But after all that effort, it's revealed that 3 of those spots have been held for someone's niece or nephew (they never bothered to interview, by the way), 2 more were reserved for recent grads from the CEO's alma mater, and another 2 or 3 went to kids who scored extremely well on their ACTs four years back, but haven't really distinguished themselves since then.

Oh, and did I forget to mention that these prospective employees have to pay a $200 interview fee at each stage of the game?

Now, if this is a private company can they hire whomever they judge to be best for these slots? Absolutely (assuming they steer clear of EEOC issues). But if a third of the slots have already been earmarked, then the company ought to be honest enough to disclose the true number of open slots...and make this disclosure before the job seekers fork over their cash.

Tigers33
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Post by Tigers33 » Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:53 pm

Well since you are using that analogy...

* there are a lot of jobs out there that people apply for but already know who they are going to hire. If they are honest and don't let anyone apply/interview then they get in trouble.

If you don't like the process stop sending your kid. This is the only way changes will be made is if everyone stops sending their kids to the advance process. It's a money maker...

almostashappy
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 1:07 pm

Post by almostashappy » Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:11 pm

Tigers33 wrote:Well since you are using that analogy...

* there are a lot of jobs out there that people apply for but already know who they are going to hire. If they are honest and don't let anyone apply/interview then they get in trouble.

If you don't like the process stop sending your kid. This is the only way changes will be made is if everyone stops sending their kids to the advance process. It's a money maker...
Been there, did that.

Ugottobekiddingme
Posts: 327
Joined: Wed Apr 07, 2010 9:53 pm

Post by Ugottobekiddingme » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:52 am

Tigers33 wrote:Well since you are using that analogy...

* there are a lot of jobs out there that people apply for but already know who they are going to hire. If they are honest and don't let anyone apply/interview then they get in trouble.

If you don't like the process stop sending your kid. This is the only way changes will be made is if everyone stops sending their kids to the advance process. It's a money maker...
When does the job market = opportunities for youth hockey? The last time I looked these kids couldn't start a lemonade stand without approval. It's not about stop sending your child to a youth event, it's about getting the obstruction out of way...many self serving obstructionists that would never be considered viable for a good paying wage job.

Tigers33
Posts: 877
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:06 pm

Post by Tigers33 » Mon Jun 24, 2013 8:28 am

It's all about who you know!

My point is its funny how adults do it in the job world, but then adults cry about it when the process is similar to picking kids for the advanced teams.

northwoods oldtimer
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Post by northwoods oldtimer » Mon Jun 24, 2013 9:59 am

Guys don't wast a lot of energy stressing over this process. MN Hockey is a sad joke in the hockey world. Falling behind year after year after year when compared to midget level hockey and junior ranks. Each season MN Hockey becomes less and less of an resource hotbed. It is dying and rightly so due to lack of innovation.
The hockey market is growing and growing both nationally and internationally and MN hockey and its crony process is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Its so called elite league combined with ridiculous 25 game mnhsl is the laughing stock of the hockey world. The knuckle dragging baboons that run the show are falling behind....big time!

Lowstickside
Posts: 101
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Post by Lowstickside » Mon Jun 24, 2013 10:37 am

Tigers33 wrote:It's all about who you know!

My point is its funny how adults do it in the job world, but then adults cry about it when the process is similar to picking kids for the advanced teams.
This is true, but when you have your tryouts, get cut, and then someone who never attended tryouts ends up at the National Camp, it hurts and seems a bit unfair. Or, as in the previous three years, someone gets cut at the 54 stage yet shows up to camp AND makes the tournament team. People just start to wonder and that's natural when the system has that compromised feeling.

Also, what is with saving spots for kids playing in the "dub"? They have given up their NCAA eligibility, and more importantly, I am sure their league does not require a USA hockey card, so why are these players at a USA Hockey National Camp?

observer
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Post by observer » Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:22 pm

why are these players at a USA Hockey National Camp?
Regardless of where they play they are considered among the best American players at their age.

Lowstickside
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2008 8:38 pm

Post by Lowstickside » Mon Jun 24, 2013 5:07 pm

observer wrote:
why are these players at a USA Hockey National Camp?
Regardless of where they play they are considered among the best American players at their age.
So they skip the tryouts? Seriously, they are automatically better because of where they play? I think we have plenty of MN kids who are playing HS hockey here who are as good or better then these guys. Nothing personal against the players. This is the kind of thinking that kills the process.

Ugottobekiddingme
Posts: 327
Joined: Wed Apr 07, 2010 9:53 pm

Post by Ugottobekiddingme » Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:49 pm

Tigers33 wrote:It's all about who you know!

My point is its funny how adults do it in the job world, but then adults cry about it when the process is similar to picking kids for the advanced teams.
There's going to be a lot of crying soon, I called the White House Administration and Pres; because I "know" him. Advanced programs will soon be eliminated due to lack of adversity and the IRS is looking closely at the non-profit status of all associations. Stupid adults...another life lesson learned and still no jobs.

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