Transfers for 2019-20 season

The Latest 400 or so Topics

Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)

BP
Posts: 823
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:31 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by BP » Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:06 pm

yesiplayedhockey wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:22 pm
Do we know how many times since #7 was added has the High School league still said NO (even after both AD's signed off on it)?

To me, once they added in #7 the flood gates are now wide open....A good number of AD's could care less about hockey and will sign a piece of paper for any family wanting to leave. And if, for some strange reason, the AD wouldn't sign it, couldn't the family just scream "Bullied" The school would immediately panic and sign anything just to get them to go away


A couple things with the "bulllied" rule. 1) It needs to be documented with the school. If not - it won't hold up the MSHSL turns it down. 2) No WAY a school would sign off on that to get them away. You are admitting that you have kids that bullied a kid and did nothing about it. You are setting yourself up for a lawsuit.

In regards to AD's signing off - the AD's usually ask the coach if they should sign off on it. AD's aren't typically close enough to the situation. Some coaches say no way, some coaches want a problem to leave or if the kid will never play - let him go play somewhere else.

muckandgrinder65
Posts: 180
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:06 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by muckandgrinder65 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:45 pm

He should of never left he would be a defending champion like his buddies and we wouldn’t be having this discussion relative to the young man- and it’s a done deal so maybe talk about Hermantown it’s more fun

hockey59
Posts: 1328
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 11:01 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by hockey59 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:47 pm

BP wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:06 pm
yesiplayedhockey wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:22 pm
Do we know how many times since #7 was added has the High School league still said NO (even after both AD's signed off on it)?

To me, once they added in #7 the flood gates are now wide open....A good number of AD's could care less about hockey and will sign a piece of paper for any family wanting to leave. And if, for some strange reason, the AD wouldn't sign it, couldn't the family just scream "Bullied" The school would immediately panic and sign anything just to get them to go away


A couple things with the "bulllied" rule. 1) It needs to be documented with the school. If not - it won't hold up the MSHSL turns it down. 2) No WAY a school would sign off on that to get them away. You are admitting that you have kids that bullied a kid and did nothing about it. You are setting yourself up for a lawsuit.

In regards to AD's signing off - the AD's usually ask the coach if they should sign off on it. AD's aren't typically close enough to the situation. Some coaches say no way, some coaches want a problem to leave or if the kid will never play - let him go play somewhere else.
And most AD’s are intelligent enough...not to say no to the Gophers HC..especially if they want future Tonka players recruited by the U. End of Story :arrow:

bardown27
Posts: 470
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 10:20 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by bardown27 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:39 pm

hockey59 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:47 pm
BP wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:06 pm
yesiplayedhockey wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:22 pm
Do we know how many times since #7 was added has the High School league still said NO (even after both AD's signed off on it)?

To me, once they added in #7 the flood gates are now wide open....A good number of AD's could care less about hockey and will sign a piece of paper for any family wanting to leave. And if, for some strange reason, the AD wouldn't sign it, couldn't the family just scream "Bullied" The school would immediately panic and sign anything just to get them to go away


A couple things with the "bulllied" rule. 1) It needs to be documented with the school. If not - it won't hold up the MSHSL turns it down. 2) No WAY a school would sign off on that to get them away. You are admitting that you have kids that bullied a kid and did nothing about it. You are setting yourself up for a lawsuit.

In regards to AD's signing off - the AD's usually ask the coach if they should sign off on it. AD's aren't typically close enough to the situation. Some coaches say no way, some coaches want a problem to leave or if the kid will never play - let him go play somewhere else.
And most AD’s are intelligent enough...not to say no to the Gophers HC..especially if they want future Tonka players recruited by the U. End of Story :arrow:
Alright let’s keep track how many Tonka kids commit there in the future to see if that is one of the reasons you’re claiming it worked out for Mack

7TIMECHAMPS
Posts: 150
Joined: Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:58 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by 7TIMECHAMPS » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:50 pm

I am not sure I am following. SCC is a private school. How does any of this apply to him? Am I missing something?

Jeffy95
Posts: 748
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Jeffy95 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:39 pm

7TIMECHAMPS wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:50 pm
I am not sure I am following. SCC is a private school. How does any of this apply to him? Am I missing something?
Private schools have the same transfer rules as public schools. They’re part of the MSHSL.

Schotzy
Posts: 213
Joined: Tue Mar 03, 2015 10:36 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Schotzy » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:15 am

hockey59 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:47 pm
And most AD’s are intelligent enough...not to say no to the Gophers HC..especially if they want future Tonka players recruited by the U. End of Story :arrow:
59, I think you may be pushing the conspiracy needle waaay to the right here. I really don't see anything but a kid who was pulled from his program due to a move. Kid missed his team, that despite being a private school, was composed of friends he grew up playing with through the years. He had an opportunity to return, and I would hope, despite any of the rules in place, that the MSHSL would let him return. This is about a kid getting to play with his buddies. That is all.

Had he never played for the program before, I could see it being an issue, but that is not the case here.

The fact that the head coach of the Gophers is this kid's dad really has nothing to do with it. Really. That is the end of the story.

hockey59
Posts: 1328
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 11:01 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by hockey59 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:11 am

Schotzy wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:15 am
hockey59 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:47 pm
And most AD’s are intelligent enough...not to say no to the Gophers HC..especially if they want future Tonka players recruited by the U. End of Story :arrow:
59, I think you may be pushing the conspiracy needle waaay to the right here. I really don't see anything but a kid who was pulled from his program due to a move. Kid missed his team, that despite being a private school, was composed of friends he grew up playing with through the years. He had an opportunity to return, and I would hope, despite any of the rules in place, that the MSHSL would let him return. This is about a kid getting to play with his buddies. That is all.

Had he never played for the program before, I could see it being an issue, but that is not the case here.

The fact that the head coach of the Gophers is this kid's dad really has nothing to do with it. Really. That is the end of the story.
You’ve missed my point. Why bother to have transfer rules (at all) if the MSHSL is going to make exceptions for those not following the transfer rules to the letter and spirit of the rules? I don’t care if it’s for the son of the Gophers HC or a random kid wanting to transfer from Proctor to Duluth East. In the fall of 2006 the best player on Champlin Park transfered to Elk River for his senior year. No move involved, he simply drove another 10 miles to school, perfectly legal under MSHSL rules. My oldest son played on his line in the Elite League. Then years later the MSHSL (in their supposed wisdom) comes up with the transfer rules going on today. The problem is all the loopholes and special “exceptions” made for certain individuals. If you truly think playing for the defending AA State Champs (and in Hockey Day MN) constituted a legitimate “hardship” last season for MM & that being the son of the Gopher HC had no influence on the Tonka AD signing off on the transfer...I’ve got some swampland in Florida to sell you 😉 If they would have moved to another house, they’d of followed the letter & spirit of the rules. tBob choose not to move, and frankly I don’t blame him, he knew the MSHSL would go along with whatever he wanted them to do. You can choose to believe otherwise...that’s your prerogative 👍
Last edited by hockey59 on Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

Slap Shot
Posts: 716
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:44 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Slap Shot » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:12 am

Schotzy wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:15 am
hockey59 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:47 pm
And most AD’s are intelligent enough...not to say no to the Gophers HC..especially if they want future Tonka players recruited by the U. End of Story :arrow:
59, I think you may be pushing the conspiracy needle waaay to the right here. I really don't see anything but a kid who was pulled from his program due to a move. Kid missed his team, that despite being a private school, was composed of friends he grew up playing with through the years. He had an opportunity to return, and I would hope, despite any of the rules in place, that the MSHSL would let him return. This is about a kid getting to play with his buddies. That is all.
There may not be any conspiracy here with regards to recruiting Tonka kids to UM in the future, but this whole thing still stinks. I can't think of any recent examples of a kid leaving a school due to a legitimate relocation of their parents, play a year in their new district, then go back even though the parents remained in the new district. This sets bad precedent.

green4
Posts: 1470
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:02 am
Location: Edina

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by green4 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am

I’m with Schozty. This is not anywhere near a big deal to me. The kid wants to play with the friends he grew up with. Every time some kids leaves early for juniors half you freak out about how there is nothing better than playing with the kids you grew up with, and here a kid is trying to do that but half you are upset because a really good A team that didn’t need any additional help is going to get better.
Every year there are transfers that would be better to get worked up over than this one.

Jeffy95
Posts: 748
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Jeffy95 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:04 am

green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am
I’m with Schozty. This is not anywhere near a big deal to me. The kid wants to play with the friends he grew up with. Every time some kids leaves early for juniors half you freak out about how there is nothing better than playing with the kids you grew up with, and here a kid is trying to do that but half you are upset because a really good A team that didn’t need any additional help is going to get better.
Every year there are transfers that would be better to get worked up over than this one.
Why didn't he want to play with his friends that he grew up with last year?

Corn Cobb
Posts: 230
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2015 8:16 pm
Location: by the Abominable Snowman

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Corn Cobb » Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:38 am

Jeffy95 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:04 am
green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am
I’m with Schozty. This is not anywhere near a big deal to me. The kid wants to play with the friends he grew up with. Every time some kids leaves early for juniors half you freak out about how there is nothing better than playing with the kids you grew up with, and here a kid is trying to do that but half you are upset because a really good A team that didn’t need any additional help is going to get better.
Every year there are transfers that would be better to get worked up over than this one.
Why didn't he want to play with his friends that he grew up with last year?
Winner, winner. Chicken dinner.

muckandgrinder65
Posts: 180
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:06 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by muckandgrinder65 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:38 pm

I am glad MM is back at SCC.
You can't fault him for the path he has taken. Sometimes there are twists and turns.

Dad takes new job in the Cities
Hmmm.. where should they we move to?
A) Stay at SCC with your 'buddies'- part of the Team.
OR
B) Is there a progam/school that would offer a great opportunity in the Cities?
(Hmmm.. defending state champs, hockey day MN, great coaching, great program- How about Tonka?)
Decision made-Move.
C) 3rd line role player, largest school in the state, home-sick, lose to HF in section semis, oops.... stuck it out- learning experience-character building,
D) Get to get back to the place that maybe never should have left-grass isn't always greener, learning experience- Line 2 for sure- live with Line 1family during season- repeat State Champs!
E) Life is good! It happens all the time- Glad he is welcomed back with open arms!!
F) Nothing would have stopped this from happening because all those involved agreed to and supported it- don't think MSHSL would think twice about not allowing this transfer.

spamtownusa
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:26 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by spamtownusa » Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:48 pm

I was fully on board with him going back to at SCC. I assumed that there may have been a personal situation/issue/etc. at Tonka and it was really no one else’s business. Special circumstance certainly can justify exceptions. Until I read that article.

Now I ‘m 100% on the side that this is total bs. Want to play with my friends??? This has everything to do with who he (his dad) is and makes a mockery of the transfer rules. I can’t wait until the next kid comes to an AD and MSHSL saying “I just want to play with my friends.” Friends from my AAA team... from my HP team... my Elite League team... I’ve “grown up” playing with them every spring/summer/fall. You can’t do this in youth hockey... but you can in high school?

Jeffy95
Posts: 748
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Jeffy95 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:54 pm

muckandgrinder65 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:38 pm
I am glad MM is back at SCC.
You can't fault him for the path he has taken. Sometimes there are twists and turns.

Dad takes new job in the Cities
Hmmm.. where should they we move to?
A) Stay at SCC with your 'buddies'- part of the Team.
OR
B) Is there a progam/school that would offer a great opportunity in the Cities?
(Hmmm.. defending state champs, hockey day MN, great coaching, great program- How about Tonka?)
Decision made-Move.
C) 3rd line role player, largest school in the state, home-sick, lose to HF in section semis, oops.... stuck it out- learning experience-character building,
D) Get to get back to the place that maybe never should have left-grass isn't always greener, learning experience- Line 2 for sure- live with Line 1family during season- repeat State Champs!
E) Life is good! It happens all the time- Glad he is welcomed back with open arms!!
F) Nothing would have stopped this from happening because all those involved agreed to and supported it- don't think MSHSL would think twice about not allowing this transfer.
I'm glad he's back too but that's for my own selfish reasons. I agree with everything above except E. It does not happen all the time because there are specific rules that prohibit it. Unless the sending school agrees to it, of course. That would not happen for very many kids, and I do have an issue with that.

Yes, leaving a team that is not expected to win and cherry picking a team that was heavily favored to win. Then leaving that team, who is not expected to win, for the original team who is heavily favored to win. That makes it a fair question in my mind. But I will let Schotzy and Green4 weigh in before making any assumptions. They said it's simply a kid who wants to play with the kids he grew up with. They obviously know him personally, or else they couldn't possibly know that. I don't know him so I will defer to them.

Slap Shot
Posts: 716
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:44 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Slap Shot » Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:08 pm

Nothing more character building then whining about a move and forcing your way out while being granted an exemption on the transfer process because of your dad's connections. He could have stayed at SCC last season. Also hasn't it already been stated a good chunk of the roster at SCC are not kids he played his whole life with?

green4
Posts: 1470
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:02 am
Location: Edina

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by green4 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:42 pm

Jeffy95 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:04 am
green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am
I’m with Schozty. This is not anywhere near a big deal to me. The kid wants to play with the friends he grew up with. Every time some kids leaves early for juniors half you freak out about how there is nothing better than playing with the kids you grew up with, and here a kid is trying to do that but half you are upset because a really good A team that didn’t need any additional help is going to get better.
Every year there are transfers that would be better to get worked up over than this one.
Why didn't he want to play with his friends that he grew up with last year?
Why did my parents make me eat vegetables? Why was I given a curfew? A lot of 17 years old have to do what their parents say and at least give something like a move a try

spamtownusa
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:26 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by spamtownusa » Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:10 pm

green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:42 pm
Jeffy95 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:04 am
green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am
I’m with Schozty. This is not anywhere near a big deal to me. The kid wants to play with the friends he grew up with. Every time some kids leaves early for juniors half you freak out about how there is nothing better than playing with the kids you grew up with, and here a kid is trying to do that but half you are upset because a really good A team that didn’t need any additional help is going to get better.
Every year there are transfers that would be better to get worked up over than this one.
Why didn't he want to play with his friends that he grew up with last year?
Why did my parents make me eat vegetables? Why was I given a curfew? A lot of 17 years old have to do what their parents say and at least give something like a move a try
I agree that he probably didn’t have a say in the move. My kids wouldn’t. But it’s this quote that gets me... Bob Motzko said. “We were in a situation where we could make that happen, and he went home” Really? Others do not have the pull to get that done.

ClassAGuy
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:51 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by ClassAGuy » Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:42 pm

Good for Motzko. I support this one also.

Sounds like he went through the proper steps with the MSHSL and got approved.

The plot just keeps getting better in Class A this winter.

EGF- Bringing in high-end kids from North Dakota
Hermantown- Bringing in their normal batch of recruits
SCC- Bringing home another great piece

Should be a fun year in a very top-heavy field!

Jeffy95
Posts: 748
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Jeffy95 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:24 pm

green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:42 pm
Jeffy95 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:04 am
green4 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 10:50 am
I’m with Schozty. This is not anywhere near a big deal to me. The kid wants to play with the friends he grew up with. Every time some kids leaves early for juniors half you freak out about how there is nothing better than playing with the kids you grew up with, and here a kid is trying to do that but half you are upset because a really good A team that didn’t need any additional help is going to get better.
Every year there are transfers that would be better to get worked up over than this one.
Why didn't he want to play with his friends that he grew up with last year?
Why did my parents make me eat vegetables? Why was I given a curfew? A lot of 17 years old have to do what their parents say and at least give something like a move a try
Yeah, it is what it is. And the MSHSL can't discuss anything relating to a kid so they're always going to be in a perfect spot. It's not the same game I grew up playing that's for sure. But I suppose all of us old fat guys can say that. It's passing me up quick.

ThatMNHockeyGuy62
Posts: 382
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 8:44 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by ThatMNHockeyGuy62 » Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:53 pm

School size and education was absolutely a factor here. However, these issues were known going into the original move to Minnetonka, so clearly hockey and the fact that the skippers were favorites also played a major role in the first transfer. I truly believe that the transfer back has more to do with education and what’s best for the kid than hockey though. Just my 2 cents from somebody only partially in the know.

On another unrelated note, since there are clearly a fair few mshsl rule experts on this forum (not sarcastic): I always had an assumption that recruiting in hs is not allowed, but when I look through the rules, I don’t see it ever discussed or explicitly forbidden. Was I just mistaken, or am I missing a section of the rule book? (Note: I’m not saying the MM case is recruiting. Again, this is entirely unrelated).

greenwayraider
Posts: 624
Joined: Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:54 am
Location: Bovey

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by greenwayraider » Sat Sep 14, 2019 8:47 am

ClassAGuy wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:42 pm
Good for Motzko. I support this one also.

Sounds like he went through the proper steps with the MSHSL and got approved.

The plot just keeps getting better in Class A this winter.

EGF- Bringing in high-end kids from North Dakota
Hermantown- Bringing in their normal batch of recruits
SCC- Bringing home another great piece

Should be a fun year in a very top-heavy field!
Don’t forget about Hermantown’s 3rd line of last year led by Pionk. They were very good. Hermantown panicked against Greenway and went with two lines in the third period and overtimes. If they would have stuck with three they might have pulled it out. Hermantown players were totally gassed in the second overtime.

Slap Shot
Posts: 716
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:44 pm

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by Slap Shot » Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:16 am

ThatMNHockeyGuy62 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:53 pm
School size and education was absolutely a factor here.
Yeah because if Tonka is known for anything it's a bad education.

blindref
Posts: 230
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 1:10 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by blindref » Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:59 am

Slap Shot wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:16 am
ThatMNHockeyGuy62 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:53 pm
School size and education was absolutely a factor here.
Yeah because if Tonka is known for anything it's a bad education.

Tonka offers 28 AP classes, SCC has 11 so it must be education... =D>

ThatMNHockeyGuy62
Posts: 382
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2017 8:44 am

Re: Transfers for 2019-20 season

Post by ThatMNHockeyGuy62 » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:39 am

Slap Shot wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:16 am
ThatMNHockeyGuy62 wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:53 pm
School size and education was absolutely a factor here.
Yeah because if Tonka is known for anything it's a bad education.
Not what I said. Anyhow, “good education” and “bad education” for describing an entire school is ridiculous. Different schools fit different students well... differently. Some thrive with all of the opportunities provided at Minnetonka. Others, who need smaller class sizes and need somebody to be checking in to support them, drown at such a big school. For every 4 kids who transfer to Minnetonka, 1 leaves for a smaller setting. Doesn’t make Minnetonka’s education “bad,” just not the right fit for every kid.

Post Reply