Districts and associations alignments at peewee A this fall

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frederick61
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Districts and associations alignments at peewee A this fall

Post by frederick61 » Sun May 31, 2009 10:56 pm

What will happen this fall and in the next few years with Districts and association alignments at the peewee level?

This is my opinion on how the 12 Minnesota districts will fair in the coming seasons in setting up their Peewee A level of play. To re-cap, Minnesota hockey regulates youth hockey through the 12 districts. Each district has representation at the state board level and collectively they drive youth hockey policy. That policy attempts to provide blanket coverage for all youth teams at all levels, from mites to high school age players, boys and girls. So my focusing on Peewee A level is more a matter of interest on my part and ignores other issues that may drive districts and their representatives.

And that is a good thing. Minnesota hockey has worked because it fosters a relationship between local town and city governing units and associations rather then simply “regulating”. That relationship provides a foundation for every youth to play the sport at a competitive level through associations and the foundation has worked over the years.

There are flaws. The most significant is that in some associations, a few parents seize control of the association with the intent to use the association’s program soley to better their kids. This usually results in the association’s youth development being stymied at all levels. Parents and kids simply want a level playing field and are quick to sense a “rigged” situation. They move on. They don’t play hockey.

Below is my summary, by district, of the coming 2009-2010 season, the associations likely to field peewee A level teams and hopefully provide some insight as to what maybe driving the associations and districts.

1. District 1 has eleven associations, but had only four associations skating peewee A last year; Mpls Park, Irondale, Richfield-Washburn and Highland. To get enough regular season games, Mpls Park and Richfield-Washburn played District 1 and District 3 schedules; and Irondale and Highland played District 1 and District 2. Now Mpls Park and R-W may combine and field only one team. Irondale and Highland appear at this point ready to field peewee A teams. If D1 drops to three teams, then two of the three teams will make it to the East Regional. Unfortunately unless an agreement can be worked out with D3/D2 then these teams will be scrambling to play a significant non-tournament schedule during the season. It also leaves the Park (St. Louis Park/D3) kids who want to try out for a peewee A team in limbo.

Last year, there were just two Minneapolis Public High School hockey teams, Minneapolis West and Minneapolis East; and there were just two St. Paul Public High School hockey teams, Como and Johnson. Though each city has private schools, they tap few D1 players.

2. District 2 has been a stable district with eight teams (White Bear Lake, Forest Lake, Mahtomedi, Roseville, North St. Paul, Moundsview, Tartan, and Stillwater). They should be stable this year with the same eight associations playing peewee A. This district has been one of the most balance evenly competed districts in the state for the last few years. White Bear Lake used to dominate, but no longer. The even competition shows in the number of peewee A teams. Only Mahtomedi could be suspect in fielding a peewee A team next due to a lack of numbers, but that is not likely to happen. The real question for D2 is the inclusion of the two D1 teams (Irondale and Highland) in regular season play. It is interesting that their stability maybe simply that each association has a single community supporting it and the association supports a single high school (although private school Hill-Murray sits in the middle of D2).

3. District 3 may face some turmoil starting this year since the Classic Lake High School Conference that this district fed will fold after the 2009-2010 season. The Classic Lake was the home for the D3 rivalries for the last 15 years or so with Wayzata, Hopkins, and Armstrong forming the core (St. Louis Park and Cooper moved out in the past few years, Armstrong is gone this year). Also in the classic lake were Edina and Minnetonka. It was funny how Edina would skate against D3 in regular high school season play and then skate against D6 rivals (Burnsville, both Bloomington teams, Chaska, Shakopee, etc) in sectional high school play. Wayzata would skate against mostly D3 rivals, but then have D6 Eden Prairie instead of Edina to contend with in the sectionals.

Setting the whimsy aside, in D3 for the coming season, six of the eight associations will likely field peewee A teams (Armstrong, Hopkins, North Metro, Orono, Osseo/Maple Grove and Wayzata). With Orono High School playing Wright County (against D5 foes and St. Cloud Cathedral), and with North Metro, Armstrong (Robinsdale) and Osseo/Maple playing Northwest Suburban, it will be interesting to see where Wayzata and Hopkins land when the Classic Lake folds. Armstrong (Robinsdale Cooper) plays in the North Suburban.

Unlike other associations, who facing dwindling numbers combine programs, Osseo and Maple Grove combined their peewee A teams last year and as a result fielded the largest number of peewee teams for one association in the state. Wayzata was a close second in size to OMG giving D3 the two largest peewee programs in the state last year. The single OMG association supports two AA high school teams, Osseo and Maple Grove. The number of D3 peewee A teams are unlikely to change from last year and D3 will have to decide on where the St. Louis Park kids end up since Mpls Park appears to be gone next year. That also poses the question to D3 on whether or not to include the new Southwest/Washburn/Richfield team in the regular season schedule.

But there might be some angst brewing among smaller associations in D3 like Armstrong, North Metro and Orono. In the same district with two of the largest associations in the state and with changes coming with the end of the Classic Lake (where Armstrong high school opted out), these smaller associations maybe looking to “make a move” based on where their high schools end up. One of the quirks in this district is that the Armstrong association is really the Armstrong Cooper Association and has two high schools that skate AA hockey at the high school level (Robinsdale Armstrong and Robinsdale Cooper)

4. District 4 has 17 associations. Because of the large number of associations representing smaller (then suburban or city schools) towns and cities, the current Minnesota Hockey district organization works fine for D4 at the peewee A level. D4 consistently fields 10-11 teams, but not always the same teams as each association evaluate their talent and numbers and make decisions on level of play. Four associations, Mankato, New Prague, Owatonna, and Faribault have been stable in fielding peewee A teams each year (although Faribault struggled more then usual last year). Albert Lea and Luverne have also been stable. Luverne may be pushed on numbers this year after coming off a great season. New Ulm showed some promise last year and it will be interesting to see if they continue to improve this coming season. Marshall, St. Peter and Waseca all played A level last year and had some good tourneys.

5. District 5 associations, like D4, works well under the current system. They have 11 associations and should have St. Cloud as a twelfth. A split St. Cloud association fielding two peewee A teams and moving Sauk Rapids out of D10 would really be a boon for the area and really take advantage of the available arenas. Having gone to tourneys in Sauk Rapids and in St. Cloud the last two years, one could sense there is a lot of interest in youth hockey.

Currently D5 is dominated by Buffalo at the peewee level. Mound/Westonka is usually their nearest rival, but the Winhawks had an off year last year. St. Michael/Albertville and Monticello-Annandale-Maple Lake joined the Bison in the South Regional, so D5 could continue to change and improve overall. Crow River and Sartell played well at times. River Lakes (Cold Spring), Hutchinson, and Willmar all had some good tourneys. D5 looks stable this year.

6. District 6 carries the reputation as being the toughest district, top to bottom. Burnsville emerged as the best peewee A team to not make state after beating Edina to take the regular season title, then beating the Hornets in the D6 playoffs to make the regional. They finally lost to the Hornets in the East Regional to be eliminated. D6 focus in both district and on-ice play is the Edina association and that may cause some problems with the Edina high school searching for a conference to play. A number of people remember the tack Edina took in leaving the Lake Conference to form the Classic Lake and now Edina’s on the loose again and will likely try to reshape D6 once the chips fall on the high school side.

An interesting side note is Eden Prairie’s state tourney win at the high school level. The Eagles have had solid coaching at the peewee level as have Edina and their high school programs have been successful though each coach takes a different tack in coaching peewees. This year the Eden Prairie peewee A coach is leaving the coaching ranks. Last year was his final season, but he is staying with the Eden Prairie youth program. He was a good coach to have on the bench whether you rooted for the Eagles or played against him. He will be missed in the coming season.

As for next season, the Jefferson/Kennedy associations face a decision at the peewee A level. Kennedy skated a partial D6 schedule and lacked numbers. The Eagles may face difficulty in fielding an A team this year. The issue is compounded by the Jags High School team coming off a great season (2 loses) and the Eagles high school team won only 5 games. Prior Lake, Shakopee, and Eastview all improved to make D6 even stronger than past years. For the 2009-2010 season, it would appear that eleven D6 associations will field peewee A teams. Only Waconia will pass.

One association within D6, Chaska, renamed itself Chaska/Chanhassen with the new Chanhassen high school opening. Like Woodbury/Cottage Grove, this association will face the decision on how to split, but for the next few years try to keep a single association knowing that kids on the peewee A will end up going to different high schools.

But there is another interesting situation that could develop over the next few years with the potential emergence of Shakopee, Prior Lake and Farmington high school teams as hockey powers in the Missota Conference (along with Holy Angels Academy). Decisions made as a result of Edina and Minnetonka trying to find a home could eventually cascade to the Missota. With Farmington’s new high school will be opening this fall, the Missota Conference could become the new high school hockey power conference in a few years.

7. District 8 has16 associations and 13 fielded A teams last year. D8 holds the number of regular season league games to 16 and that resulted in an odd split schedule last year where Lakeville South did not play Lakeville North during the regular D8 season. Still that was better then the previous year when as part of an attempt to combine with D4, D8 split the north and south resulting in Rochester not playing a tougher D8 schedule.

The Minnesota Hockey formula works for the smaller associations in D8. That allows the Dodge County, La Crescent, Northfield, Red Wing, South St. Paul, and Winona Area associations to play A level if they have the numbers or talent. Somehow, most of the smaller programs don’t seem to care about playing the larger associations in this district. They love to playing the bigger associations and pushing them to the edge and occasionally beating them in front of their home town fans.

Woodbury and Cottage Grove have a problem with the new high school coming on line. It is the same situation that Apple Valley faced 15 years ago when Eastview opened. It essentially forced Valley to divide into two associations with limited ice available. Woodbury and Cottage Grove are trying to ignore the inevitable split by keeping the new Eagle Ridge high school bound kids in their program. It won’t work and if they don’t address it correctly, they will end up being forced to take someone else’s answer.

There is one sad note in D8 next year. Inver Grove Heights and South St. Paul cooperation at the peewee A level looks to be over resulting in no South St. Paul peewee A team this year. Inver Grove plans to field an A team, but South St. Paul will have to send their kids to another association. The unfortunate part about this change is that it appears to be driven by a few influential Inver Grove Heights parents who are afraid for their own kids (fear that their kid may not make a coop peewee A team if slots are taken by the South St. Paul kids). That may also be the end to the River Heights team at the bantam A level, that has helped both associations.

The Inver Grove Heights/South St. Paul situation is a prime example of how one good year’s step forward (last year) to strengthen their program gets set back two to three years for selfish reasons. It also really hurts the South St. Paul kids who now have to scramble to find team.

8. District 10 had 15 of their 20 associations playing peewee A last year. They were split into two divisions, Blue and Green, geographically along northwest suburbs from St. Cloud to Elk River and along the north suburbs from Blaine to Chisago City. For these 15 associations, it was a logical split. It resulted in an 8-team Blue Division and a 7-team Green Division. Each Blue Team played a 21 game league season and each green team played a 20 game season. The top four teams in each division made the 8 team D10 playoffs with Green #1 playing Green #4 and Blue #2 playing Blue #3 on one side of the opening round of the double elimination playoffs. On the other side of the playoffs, Blue #1 played Blue #4 and Green #2 played Green #3.

Overall, D10 is stable with more then enough associations interested in playing at the peewee A level. In the Green Division, Elk River, St. Cloud, Rogers, Cambridge/Isanti, Sauk Rapids, and Chisago Lakes are likely to field A teams. Princeton may not. In the Blue Division, Blaine, Centennial, Andover, Champlin Park, Anoka, and Coon Rapids are likely to play teams at the A level. Spring Lake Park made the jump last year to A level and did well enough to play again this year if they have the numbers. St. Francis is one association that may struggle this year.

Of the remaining five associations in D10 who did not play A level last year, Becker/Big Lake had a good B1 season and their B2 team struggled, the Mora B1and B2 teams struggled, North Branch joined Cambridge/Isanti on a coop basis, Pine City B2 team had a good season and their C team struggled. Hinckley did not play D10 peewee hockey. Note that Mora and Hinckley combined the past few years at the high school level.

There maybe some shifting of some of these teams, but it would be nice to see if one could make the leap to peewee A level and balance the two divisions at 8 teams each.

9. District 11 has eleven associations and has had four teams playing A level for the past few years, Duluth East, Cloquet, Duluth Lakers and Hermantown. Because their youth hockey program was in place at the time Minnesota Hockey started, D11 and the Duluth association have some differences from Minnesota Hockey especially within Duluth. That is too confusing to really understand. For starters, there is only one Duluth hockey association listed on the Minnesota District 11 list of associations, Duluth. But there are two associations within the Duluth association, Duluth East and the Duluth Lakers. D11 will likely remain with the four peewee A teams.

Other D11 associations (Moose Lake, Proctor, Silver Bay and Two Harbors) all skated D11 B level last year, but it is unlikely that any of these associations will move up except Proctor. The Rails (no, they are not named after a bird, but the DM&IR, now renamed and Canadian owned, Railroad had a strong influence on the town) had a good B level team last year, missing the state tourney by one game. Without a team moving up, that leaves D11 with the same four teams. One thing that helps D11 is that Superior, Wisconsin from across the Duluth Harbor plays in D11 giving them added competition. But like D12, D11 struggles to find enough regular season games.

It would be nice if D11 and D12 could create more games by having something other then normal (league games, tournaments, and scrimmages) sanctioned by Minnesota Hockey that would allow more games with cities teams. The problem seems to be that the cities teams feel constricted by giving up tournament time or other plus travel and expenses for little gain. If a way could be found to remove these “constrictions” real or imaginary, then more games could happen. One solution would be to find a place between Duluth and the Twin Cities where teams from the cities could play northern teams in a “jamboree” like setting where twin cities teams could play games with the northern teams without fear of sanctions, sort of a hockey version of a “tax or duty free zone”. A similar set-up could be done west of the cities along I-94, south of the cities along 35, and southwest along Minnesota 169.

10. District 12 is the weakest district in the state. It has 10 associations fielded 5 peewee A teams last year. Grand Rapids, Virginia and Hibbing are the three associations that form the core of D12 with Eveleth/Gilbert starting to make some noise (their peewee A tourney last year had a great field of teams from the cities as well as from D12. International Falls is the 5th D12 team, but with Hibbing, Virginia and Eveleth 100 miles south, Baudette, Warroad and Roseau over a 100 miles west, and Bemidji just over 100 miles southwest, its tough for the Bronco’s to play a competitive schedule.

It is just hard for D12 teams to put a competitive schedule together without turning the season into a full time operation. First the other 5 associations in D12 are struggling. Ely and Mesabi East had great B level seasons last year, going to the north regional. Chisholm, Greenway and Babbitt have struggled. But these associations are not likely to play A level for the next few years.

What makes the most sense is to turn International Falls into D12/D16 team and have them play double games on a single weekend day home and home with among the 8 mentioned teams. That would give the Broncos a 28 game season to schedule around and then let them be seeded into its home district playoffs.

The other four D12 teams should be combined with the four D11 teams for regular season. That would create an approximate 60 mile triangle for all eight teams to drive for games and would give the eight teams a 14-game home and home schedule for the season (16 games if Superior is included).

11. District 15-Moorhead (like Grand Rapids and Rochester) has developed this late season charge attitude where their peewee teams come out slow in November and finish strong in January. But the last two years have seen D15 strength shifting from Moorhead in the west to Brainerd/Little Falls in central Minnesota with Little Falls (going to state in 2008) and Brainerd playing very well in the West Regional last year. If you add Alexandria and Fergus Falls to the mix, you would have a sound group of 5 associations, but in D15 it does not work that way. The associations operate on a very thin margin of players (outside of Brainerd and Moorhead) that criple the association’s decision process on fielding an A level team. Little Falls is a prime example of a D15 association that had a power house peewee A in 2008, and played only B hockey in 2009.

If all the A teams return from last year and Little Falls re-joins the A level, there will be a good, interesting, 8 team league (Moorhead, Brainerd, Fergus Falls, Alexandria, Pequot Lakes, Park Rapids, Detroit Lakes and Little Falls). The D15 problem is that the associations often make their decisions late because the level of play rests on those decision of a few kids/parents. This problem is more difficult in D15 than in other districts because their core is basically only two teams Moorhead and Brainerd. Those two associations will play A level peewee this fall, the other associations fall into a wait and see mode. Fergus Falls, Alexandria and Detroit Lakes are the most likely to play A level, but the other associations are questionable. One thing nice about D15 is that all the associations are within a 100 miles of each other.

12. District 16-The eleven D16 associations fielded eight teams peewee A teams last year. At the high school level, nine of the associations supported high school teams. Roseau plays large high school hockey and Bemidji played large high school hockey until two years ago. Last year, the Rams High School team lost the trip to state tourney to a surprising Moorhead team that went on to take #2 in the state.

An interesting point is that Warroad peewee A team finished last in D16 this year; Roseau finished first and won the state tourney. This year Warroad finished second in the high school Class A state tourney. The point is both associations have been successful in providing talent at the high school level. Roseau appears to accomplish this through a community wide effort that encourages kids to play and strives to do well at all level of play from squirt to bantams.

On the other hand, Warroad peewee teams seem to get beat badly often. Both of the peewee A and B level teams lost half of their D16 games by more then 10 goals. But Warroad competes very well at the high school level and that maybe contributed to an association attitude that says let the kids play, win or lose “big”, they learn. That’s what Minnesota Hockey approach to association hockey does, it sets rules that allows each association to develop kid’s interest in hockey that fits the association’s style, a kid’s development over time (Warroad) or a kid’s development based on excelling each season (Roseau). Within association hockey, both approaches work because unlike USA hockey, no standards are applied to the associations that force the associations to play at a certain level (forces the association to play only B level, because they have not met A level standards).

The peewee A teams seem unlikely to change this coming season. Roseau and East Grand Forks have battled the last two seasons for the regular season title, won seeds to the regions and battled in the regional two years ago to go to state (Green Wave won). But last year the Rams had the best team in the state from the start and won the state title.

Bemidji, Thief River Falls and Crookston have fought it out for the third seed to the regional tourney, but this year there is no third seed for D16 this year in the West Regional, but D16 will host the regional. These five associations plus Warroad and LOW have been and are the backbone of D16 and look to be there with peewee A teams this fall. Hallock is struggling, but Bagley and Red Lake Falls had good B teams last year. D16 looks to have eight or more peewee A teams this fall.

elliott70
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Re: Districts and associations alignments at peewee A this f

Post by elliott70 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:37 am

frederick61 wrote:What will happen this fall and in the next few years with Districts and association alignments at the peewee level?

This is my opinion on how the 12 Minnesota districts will fair in the coming seasons in setting up their Peewee A level of play. To re-cap, Minnesota hockey regulates youth hockey through the 12 districts. Each district has representation at the state board level and collectively they drive youth hockey policy. That policy attempts to provide blanket coverage for all youth teams at all levels, from mites to high school age players, boys and girls. So my focusing on Peewee A level is more a matter of interest on my part and ignores other issues that may drive districts and their representatives.
There are 12 district directors ont he state board. Whether they drive youth hockey policy is debatable as there are 15 other board members, so they would be in the minority if acting collectively (which they do not always do).

SWPrez
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Post by SWPrez » Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:40 am

Frederick,

Good breakdown. To clarify District 1.

Como is talking to Johnson regarding co-oping to create A teams. Don't know if the firepower is there to create solid A teams, but this is a good approach as the numbers of both associations individually do not provide a talent pool deep enough to compete at the A level.

SWHA/Washburn - These two programs have run separately in the Southwestern region of Minneapolis. While both programs pull from throughout the city, 90% of the combined players come from an area half the size of Edina...and a quarter the size of Wayzata. These boundaries were set up 40 years ago when SW and Washburn both had very competitive high school programs. In light of both programs feeding one high school (to my knowledge, we are the only associations doing this in the state), the boards have agreed to bring the two programs together over the next few years. WAHA and SWHA have had co-op partners over the last several years in Richfield and Saint Louis Park and are fully supportive of these partners.

For the upcoming season, Saint Louis Park and SWHA will run the Mpls Park Storm program at the Bantam and Peewee levels with WAHA/RYHA allowed to tryout for A and B1 teams. Players that do not make those teams return to their respective co-op (Park/SWHA or WAHA/RYHA) to play B2 (B in District 1) or C hockey.

Saint Louis Park's A level players are not in 'limbo' and looking for a place to play. A cross scheduling between Minneapolis Park and D3 has already been arranged just as it was done last year (associations on the east side of the river scheduled against District 2 last year).

Saint Louis Park's mite numbers are up and they have expressed their desire to sunset out of the Storm co-op over the next few years and this will start with squirts in 09-10. 09-10 Storm squirts will be run by SWHA/WAHA/RYHA. Numbers at the squirt level for SWHA/WAHA/RYHA are good and would place the program size about the equivalent of Minnetonka or Eagan.

My understanding is that Irondale has had some early discussions with Moundsview regarding pulling together. If this happens, my assumption would be that they would move to District 2. Doesn't sound like anything will happen in 09-10.

I post this for clarification purposes so that false rumor do not fly.

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Post by elliott70 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:55 am

District 16 policy is that your first team is an 'A' team (even if you have only one team).
BUT, at the September meeting you can request to play at the B level and the other associations vote on it. Generally, the requests are allowed.
Of course, the Director has the final say as he approves rosters and has the right to change an A to a B or vice versa.

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Re: Districts and associations alignments at peewee A this f

Post by elliott70 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:02 am

frederick61 wrote: 12. District 16-The eleven D16 associations fielded eight teams peewee A teams last year. At the high school level, nine of the associations supported high school teams. Roseau plays large high school hockey and Bemidji played large high school hockey until two years ago. Last year, the Rams High School team lost the trip to state tourney to a surprising Moorhead team that went on to take #2 in the state.
10 of the 11 associations have HS hockey
Lake of the Woods, Warroad, Roseau, Hallock,
Theif River Falls, Red Lake Falls,
East Grand Forks, Crookston, Bagley, and Bemidji.

The 11th assn, Blackduck, has a mite/squirt program. Kids interested in hockey at the higher levels are waived into Bemidji (or perhaps Bagley). They open enroll into Bemdiji if they are interested in HS hockey.

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Post by dogeatdog1 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:19 am

I hear a rumor that there will be no regional tourney this year only district then state? any confirmation.

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Post by elliott70 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:41 am

dogeatdog1 wrote:I hear a rumor that there will be no regional tourney this year only district then state? any confirmation.
Not true.
This is the final year of the 'new' region alignment.
If not adopted (or another plan adopted) then we revert back to the old plan.

Discussion of an 8 or 16 team district opton has been brought up but no action has been taken.

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Post by TriedThat2 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:40 am

Mark,
That is not the information that I am getting. It sounds as if the MN Hockey Tournament Committee wants to eliminate Regional Tournaments. Have you heard anything regarding this?

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Post by frederick61 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:58 am

I think that regionals are not the issue. The number of peewee A teams in the state is constant (around 100 or so) each year. There will also always be 200-300 or peewee B teams in the state. To date Minnesota Hockey treats both A and B tournaments the same. It should open up the B tourney to more participation and fix the A tournament flaws by allowing more flexibility in how peewee A districts/regional tourneys are grouped.

That would mean deciding and changing the handbook for the next cycle (for the 2010-11 season) and have a separate peewee A and peewee B schedules. The peewee B schedule could outline a fixed four year peewee B-schedule much like the peewee A/B schedule is today, but with expanded number of teams participating. The peewee A schedule could adopt a more flexible approach that restructures district and regional alignments based on the number of associations each district has playing A hockey. Such a formula would tie to the number of seeds each district receives to a regional tourney (keeping the regional slots to a total of 32) to the number of A teams a district has that participates in their playoffs. Remember some districts have teams that play only regular season district schedules.

Each District would have to choose a play-off tourney format at the start of the year and designate that format to Minnesota Hockey (send an email). Districts with small numbers of peewee A teams could coop with other districts to set up a joint district playoff tourney to increase the number of seeds to the regional. The formula should be designed to encourage associations to play A level hockey and for larger associations to field more then one A level team.

Since the B level hockey has significantly more teams, the B regional should be expanded to 12 or 16 teams with pools used to determine the top teams that play in a double elimination format for the two regional seeds.

Remember, the B level state tourney was added at the start of the 2004-05 season and has been (to me) one of the reasons that peewee hockey has kept the numbers of kids participating. But when it was added, nobody could anticipate the interest in the B state tourney. So it was treated equal to the A tourney. After 5 years, it is time to recognize its importance and be treated differently.

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frederick61

Post by northwoods oldtimer » Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:47 pm

I agree with your District 11 and 12 combine all the way. For all associations mentioned it makes logical sense and adds to the depth and strength of schedule for each respective program involved. An A level league for Duluth East, Duluth Lakers, Hermantown, Superior, Cloquet, Hibbing, Viriginia, Grand Rapids. Followed by great B level league with Silver Bay, Two Harbors, Moose Lake, Proctor, Greenway, Eveleth, Greand Rapids, East, Lakers, Hermantown, Cloquet, Hibbing, Virginia reduces some travel for teams involved and give them great competition. When some of the B level programs have strong groups of players they simply declare A level and move up. It is the way to go in the future. Very good post.

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Post by nerve » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:38 pm

There is one sad note in D8 next year. Inver Grove Heights and South St. Paul cooperation at the peewee A level looks to be over resulting in no South St. Paul peewee A team this year. Inver Grove plans to field an A team, but South St. Paul will have to send their kids to another association. The unfortunate part about this change is that it appears to be driven by a few influential Inver Grove Heights parents who are afraid for their own kids (fear that their kid may not make a coop peewee A team if slots are taken by the South St. Paul kids). That may also be the end to the River Heights team at the bantam A level, that has helped both associations.

The Inver Grove Heights/South St. Paul situation is a prime example of how one good year’s step forward (last year) to strengthen their program gets set back two to three years for selfish reasons. It also really hurts the South St. Paul kids who now have to scramble to find team.


WOW! What does IGH think there doing!

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Post by Vapor » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:41 pm

Warroad has had strong HS teams, but I don't think it's because they're developing the players in their youth program. I'm guessing most everyone knows how they do it.

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Post by Jerry » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:28 pm

IGH/SSP put up some good numbers last year at the Peewee A level. I have been told, that one of the Board members that did not run for office this year was a major blow to keeping this program going when he stepped down. I hope they figure this out before it is to late if this is true.

freighttrain
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Post by freighttrain » Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:53 pm

From what i understand of the IGH/SSP deal is that the IGH board decided that since IGH has 50 plus players at the PeeWee level that they are going to field an A team themselves.

frederick61
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Post by frederick61 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:49 pm

freighttrain wrote:From what i understand of the IGH/SSP deal is that the IGH board decided that since IGH has 50 plus players at the PeeWee level that they are going to field an A team themselves.
But what are the IGH squirt numbers in the following two years? My understanding is that they are low.

nerve
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Post by nerve » Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:50 pm

Good Luck With That One IGH. You might want to re-think an A team and stick to what you do best B/C hockey.

OGEE OGELTHORPE
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Post by OGEE OGELTHORPE » Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:11 pm

Vapor wrote:Warroad has had strong HS teams, but I don't think it's because they're developing the players in their youth program. I'm guessing most everyone knows how they do it.
How do they do it?

ctbrow1
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Post by ctbrow1 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:34 pm

Como and Johnson will be putting their top players together and have a co-op a the 'A' level this season, at least for Peewees and Bantams. This should produce a competitive team at the Peewee level. They each had a Squirt A team 2 seasons ago.

This a logical co-op that could develop into a larger merger in years to come. This should benefit both associations greatly.

As far as finding scimmages at this level, Kennedy wants a home and home with each District 1 team and it was my understanding the District 2 was willing to put a scrimmage versus each D1 team this season as well.

freighttrain
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Post by freighttrain » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:43 pm

frederick61 wrote:
freighttrain wrote:From what i understand of the IGH/SSP deal is that the IGH board decided that since IGH has 50 plus players at the PeeWee level that they are going to field an A team themselves.
But what are the IGH squirt numbers in the following two years? My understanding is that they are low.
Dont know the numbers. probably in the 30-40 range.

Got this from SSPYHA meeting minutes:

Dennis Viner and President Lick attended meetings in IGH about where the two associations may cooperate. IGH proposed that they should host the A Peewee team this coming season even though they had it last season. IGH also proposed they host the 12A team this coming season as SSP had it last year.

By Darin Pederson Seconded by Dennis Viner
That the SSPYHA give IGH until June 2nd to accept the A Peewee in SSP and the 12A in IGH rather than what IGH has proposed and that if IGH comes back with anything less than yes, that we dissolve the working relationship between both associations at all levels with the exception of the Bantam for the next two years.
Motion carried (8 yeas – 1 nay)


There are other things that may factor into some of this from what I hear but I dont think it should be said on a open forum.

frederick61
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Post by frederick61 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:05 pm

ctbrow1,
That's good news to see both Johnson/Como back at the A level. That will give D1 five teams next year (Mpls Park, Richfield/Washburn, Irondale, Highland and Como/Johnson). If you have a home and home with Kennedy and then add 8 D2 games, the D1 (St. Paul) teams will have 16 regular season games to build their season around. That's really good to hear. Kennedy is a good fit.

frederick61
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Post by frederick61 » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:17 pm

freighttrain,
I am sentimental about wanting to have a South St. Paul peewee A team in D8 that would be competitive with a shot at the regionals again. I suspect many other Minnesota hockey fans would like to see that happen. It's an "old school" hockey feeling. I felt that combined with IGH this year they could have enough talent and coaching to really make a run. Imagine, the Packers are back (and they don't wear green and gold).

IGH would gain also by creating interest in a peewee program that would have put two good seasons back-to-back and bring up those numbers at the squirt age. It is June 3, do you know IGH's answer?

SWPrez
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Post by SWPrez » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:19 pm

Frederick,

That will give District 1 four teams: Mpls Park (Washburn/Richfield players will be allowed to tryout for A and B1 teams hosted by Southwest), Irondale, Highland, and Como/Johnson.

See my prior post outlining.

Air Force 1
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Post by Air Force 1 » Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:41 am

OGEE OGELTHORPE wrote:
Vapor wrote:Warroad has had strong HS teams, but I don't think it's because they're developing the players in their youth program. I'm guessing most everyone knows how they do it.
How do they do it?
Hark, what light through yonder WINDOW breaks?

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Wed Jun 03, 2009 9:55 am

TriedThat2 wrote:Mark,
That is not the information that I am getting. It sounds as if the MN Hockey Tournament Committee wants to eliminate Regional Tournaments. Have you heard anything regarding this?
It has been brought up, but no clear cut plan has been pushed forward.
But modification of districts is part of this and theat is not moving very fast.
Discernment has had it on their list to do also, but nothing gets done very fast.

A new VP of tournaments has started last month and I do not know his take on this.

I do know there will be no change in format for this season.

Jerry
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Post by Jerry » Wed Jun 03, 2009 4:08 pm

Igh could only have at best 3 Peewee teams this year. almost 2 full teams of peewees move up and the squirts only had 3 teams last year with very few moving up and they had no A team so it will be a long year for that club. I also heard a rumor that the coach is not coming back this year. So with that said it seems you are right Fred, the board is only worried about where there kids are placed.

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