98 Fire tryouts?

Discussion of Minnesota Youth Hockey

Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)

Deep Breath

Post by Deep Breath » Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:37 am

NO, helmuts for the most part are almost always just play black. The kids normally keep their "home" team decal on them is all. I did see the Dallas kid wearing a green helmut this winter when he came to Detroit to play in a series. That looked goofy but for the most part, almost always black helmets.

JSR
Posts: 1673
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 5:26 pm

Post by JSR » Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:43 am

Quasar wrote:Ok, JSR, let me give this a try...

As for the carpetbagger joke, perhaps if you know that I am a Wisconsin resident we can put that one to bed. I have been living in Wisconsin for over twenty years. I think that takes care of the previous subject.

You are correct that the whole issue is a Wisconsin issue.

There is nothing the Minnesota Fire supporters would like better than to move the team to Minnesota.

Because of the structure of Minnesota youth hockey this cannot be done.

For a while the Fire did their thing without any negative vibes from anyone.

But it became a threat to Minnesota hockey. So they found people like you in the Wisconsin system that didn't care about border town disputes.

It might be helpful to know that the Fire resides in the official greater Minneapolis/Saint Paul metro area. But you are right it is across the river in Wisconsin.

And yes you are correct... It is a hot button issue with me!!

I just don't like people wielding power over others just because they can, especially when it means zero to them as you stated.

I don't want to have a on-going verbal, or any other kind of contest about this with you.

So if I said, or did, anything that you feel was out of line you must understand I was reading between the lines.

So for that I apologize ....

For taking the side of the Fire ..Not so much....
People like me? What are people like me? People who tell others that a rule proposal was made for the May meeting and this is how/why it happened. You mean people who gather facts and relay facts without bias? Not sure what you are driving at here????

For the record, there have been "negative" things with the Fire from day one. There is a reason they are Unclassified instead of Tier 1 in the state, they felt they did not need to play by the rules and that was from day one and hence their current position within WAHA. There are actually a number of people, including me, who would like to see them become Tier 1 and repsent the state as a legit Tier 1 entity, we just want to see them play by the rules and do it right like the other 3 Tier 1 teams have done. For the record, being a border twon should have NOTHING to do with it. It should not matter if you are on the border or in the middle of the state ALL of the SAME rules should apply to EVERYONE across the board. Your border twon statement makes me and others think you should have special rules just because you live on teh border of MN, that is something no rationale person should ever buy into. Rules should apply to everyone fairly and equally, no special sub set of rules just because your twon is near the Twin Cities.

Quasar
Posts: 637
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:27 pm

Post by Quasar » Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:11 am

JSR wrote:
Quasar wrote:Ok, JSR, let me give this a try...

As for the carpetbagger joke, perhaps if you know that I am a Wisconsin resident we can put that one to bed. I have been living in Wisconsin for over twenty years. I think that takes care of the previous subject.

You are correct that the whole issue is a Wisconsin issue.

There is nothing the Minnesota Fire supporters would like better than to move the team to Minnesota.

Because of the structure of Minnesota youth hockey this cannot be done.

For a while the Fire did their thing without any negative vibes from anyone.

But it became a threat to Minnesota hockey. So they found people like you in the Wisconsin system that didn't care about border town disputes.

It might be helpful to know that the Fire resides in the official greater Minneapolis/Saint Paul metro area. But you are right it is across the river in Wisconsin.

And yes you are correct... It is a hot button issue with me!!

I just don't like people wielding power over others just because they can, especially when it means zero to them as you stated.

I don't want to have a on-going verbal, or any other kind of contest about this with you.

So if I said, or did, anything that you feel was out of line you must understand I was reading between the lines.

So for that I apologize ....

For taking the side of the Fire ..Not so much....
People like me? What are people like me? People who tell others that a rule proposal was made for the May meeting and this is how/why it happened. You mean people who gather facts and relay facts without bias? Not sure what you are driving at here????

For the record, there have been "negative" things with the Fire from day one. There is a reason they are Unclassified instead of Tier 1 in the state, they felt they did not need to play by the rules and that was from day one and hence their current position within WAHA. There are actually a number of people, including me, who would like to see them become Tier 1 and repsent the state as a legit Tier 1 entity, we just want to see them play by the rules and do it right like the other 3 Tier 1 teams have done. For the record, being a border twon should have NOTHING to do with it. It should not matter if you are on the border or in the middle of the state ALL of the SAME rules should apply to EVERYONE across the board. Your border twon statement makes me and others think you should have special rules just because you live on teh border of MN, that is something no rationale person should ever buy into. Rules should apply to everyone fairly and equally, no special sub set of rules just because your twon is near the Twin Cities.
Ok ..

Now I understand where your coming from ..
The Fire has been a negative situation from the start..
And you seem to know a little more about the fire than you let on
Gee whiz.. I would like them to be Tier 1 too then there would be no problem because Minnesota hockey says any kid can go over and play in Wisconsin if he goes to a tier 1 team.
But for some reason (they didn't play by the rules) they can only operate as unclassified

For the record. I have nothing to do with the Fire. I actually know very little about their organization. I am aware of their situation..

My only beef with you and all your pals is this..

Why does it matter to you where any kid from any state plays hockey?

You seem to like the summer tournaments, and comment on how the teams are structured..

So if I have it correct you can be a Fire in the summer where there are no rules, But not in the super organized winter because there are rules!

Also, you should just ignore me. My very last grandchild plays varsity hockey now, so I have no dog in the fight,

Live and let live.... it's no skin off your behind what a couple of kids from Minnesota do to your perfect Wisconsin hockey organization...

And yes my friend I do rant because many would like to but they have better manners than me...

Besides, 50 plus years of hockey wars entitle me to say whatever I please to you or anyone else.

"And that's just the way it is" Thank you Texas!

silentbutdeadly3139
Posts: 475
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 3:50 pm

Post by silentbutdeadly3139 » Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:40 am

Quasar wrote:So let’s play the what if game..

What if The Fire, The Machine, the Blades, The Reebok nationals, The TC Bulls, the Legacy, The Edge, and, The Icemen…formed a Tier 1 AAA league in the State of Minnesota?

Here is an 8 team league that would be competitive on the National scene out of the gate. With the addition of two or three kids per team, a national championship could be a reality for the State of Minnesota.

If the league were to end at Bantam age it would not hurt the Minnesota High School League. It would make it better!!

It would affect the association youth programs in as much as their studs would be doing something a lot more productive for their individual hockey development. All things being equal, Minnesota hockey would still have what they have now without penalizing a few elite players.

So tell me again ...why is this a bad thing ???
Ahhh there's the rub. Who and how would you decide what organizations are the tier 1 teams? The one's you listed might be good at one level but not another. No argument for or against just asking how "they" decide who the who tier I and who isn't or do they have to "earn" the right to be Tier I?

Quasar
Posts: 637
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:27 pm

Post by Quasar » Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:04 am

silentbutdeadly3139 wrote:
Quasar wrote:So let’s play the what if game..

What if The Fire, The Machine, the Blades, The Reebok nationals, The TC Bulls, the Legacy, The Edge, and, The Icemen…formed a Tier 1 AAA league in the State of Minnesota?

Here is an 8 team league that would be competitive on the National scene out of the gate. With the addition of two or three kids per team, a national championship could be a reality for the State of Minnesota.

If the league were to end at Bantam age it would not hurt the Minnesota High School League. It would make it better!!

It would affect the association youth programs in as much as their studs would be doing something a lot more productive for their individual hockey development. All things being equal, Minnesota hockey would still have what they have now without penalizing a few elite players.

So tell me again ...why is this a bad thing ???
Ahhh there's the rub. Who and how would you decide what organizations are the tier 1 teams? The one's you listed might be good at one level but not another. No argument for or against just asking how "they" decide who the who tier I and who isn't or do they have to "earn" the right to be Tier I?
I don't have the answer. Only the question

I think if it were to come about the scramble for players would be fierce, and the first couple of years would be hell. I think that's why many oppose AAA winter hockey in Minnesota.

I just like the idea of choice for kids. I would much rather see it happen within the Minnesota District structure.

The discussion going on about the Fire team is a good example of "Finding a way somehow"
I would like to see all of this solved in Minnesota by Minnesota hockey people. But I don't suppose that will happen until everyone accepts the fact that Bernie is a legitimate Minnesota hockey person that has provided a lot of energy to the game of hockey in Minnesota.

If he and others that agree with him are forced to hide out in Wisconsin on some red headed step child team, I guess that's a comment on Minnesota hockey in general.

Like I said .. I don't have a lot of answers. I just wish more people were asking the questions that need to be discussed.

Does that make any sense to you ?

JSR
Posts: 1673
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 5:26 pm

Post by JSR » Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:12 am

Quasar wrote:
JSR wrote:
Quasar wrote:Ok, JSR, let me give this a try...

As for the carpetbagger joke, perhaps if you know that I am a Wisconsin resident we can put that one to bed. I have been living in Wisconsin for over twenty years. I think that takes care of the previous subject.

You are correct that the whole issue is a Wisconsin issue.

There is nothing the Minnesota Fire supporters would like better than to move the team to Minnesota.

Because of the structure of Minnesota youth hockey this cannot be done.

For a while the Fire did their thing without any negative vibes from anyone.

But it became a threat to Minnesota hockey. So they found people like you in the Wisconsin system that didn't care about border town disputes.

It might be helpful to know that the Fire resides in the official greater Minneapolis/Saint Paul metro area. But you are right it is across the river in Wisconsin.

And yes you are correct... It is a hot button issue with me!!

I just don't like people wielding power over others just because they can, especially when it means zero to them as you stated.

I don't want to have a on-going verbal, or any other kind of contest about this with you.

So if I said, or did, anything that you feel was out of line you must understand I was reading between the lines.

So for that I apologize ....

For taking the side of the Fire ..Not so much....
People like me? What are people like me? People who tell others that a rule proposal was made for the May meeting and this is how/why it happened. You mean people who gather facts and relay facts without bias? Not sure what you are driving at here????

For the record, there have been "negative" things with the Fire from day one. There is a reason they are Unclassified instead of Tier 1 in the state, they felt they did not need to play by the rules and that was from day one and hence their current position within WAHA. There are actually a number of people, including me, who would like to see them become Tier 1 and repsent the state as a legit Tier 1 entity, we just want to see them play by the rules and do it right like the other 3 Tier 1 teams have done. For the record, being a border twon should have NOTHING to do with it. It should not matter if you are on the border or in the middle of the state ALL of the SAME rules should apply to EVERYONE across the board. Your border twon statement makes me and others think you should have special rules just because you live on teh border of MN, that is something no rationale person should ever buy into. Rules should apply to everyone fairly and equally, no special sub set of rules just because your twon is near the Twin Cities.
Ok ..

Now I understand where your coming from ..
The Fire has been a negative situation from the start..
And you seem to know a little more about the fire than you let on
Gee whiz.. I would like them to be Tier 1 too then there would be no problem because Minnesota hockey says any kid can go over and play in Wisconsin if he goes to a tier 1 team.
But for some reason (they didn't play by the rules) they can only operate as unclassified

For the record. I have nothing to do with the Fire. I actually know very little about their organization. I am aware of their situation..

My only beef with you and all your pals is this..


Why does it matter to you where any kid from any state plays hockey?

You seem to like the summer tournaments, and comment on how the teams are structured..

So if I have it correct you can be a Fire in the summer where there are no rules, But not in the super organized winter because there are rules!

Also, you should just ignore me. My very last grandchild plays varsity hockey now, so I have no dog in the fight,

Live and let live.... it's no skin off your behind what a couple of kids from Minnesota do to your perfect Wisconsin hockey organization...

And yes my friend I do rant because many would like to but they have better manners than me...

Besides, 50 plus years of hockey wars entitle me to say whatever I please to you or anyone else.

"And that's just the way it is" Thank you Texas!
What pals??? I have no pals. I am on no board, no committee, no nothing. None of my kids play Tier 1. Most of what I know about the Fire comes from this message board, with a few tidbits I hear from others down here along the way. I do try and learn things and try and share what I learn with others and occassionally I express an opinion as well.

As for why does it matter where kids play hockey. It shouldn't matter, however because fo the all mighty dollar and insurance it does. And since that dollar comes from my pocket as much as the next guy with a kid in hockey we have either have to try and create our own league (good luck) or play by the rules of the one that exists and do our best to create change where it's good for the sport in ones we don't agree with. Again, I would LOVE it if the Fire would do what was necessary to become a legit Tier 1 entity, my only beef is that they seem unwilling to do so and hence to some degree they appear to be trying to skirt rules on both sides of the border. The system in in place, the rules are there and clear for all to see and understand, play by the rules, get accredited as a Tier 1 entity and all would be fine on both sides of the border. Why is this an unreasonable outlook/opinion to have? I think because I have no dog in the fight, I have no "pals" and because I think I do have a handle on both sides of the argument I am being pretty objective here in my assessment, sometimes you need someone from afar that is not in the mix to offer up some objectivity

Quasar
Posts: 637
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:27 pm

Post by Quasar » Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:23 am

JSR.....

I accept what you are saying. I have no beef with you

The problem is with Minnesota not Wisconsin...

Read my previous post to SBD to understand my position..

Oh, and when I said you and your pals, I just meant like minded people.
not meant to be a slur of any kind...

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