AAU hockey

Discussion of Minnesota Youth Hockey

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elliott70
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AAU hockey

Post by elliott70 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:54 am

Any one stop by the AAU kiosk at the Hockey Expo at the MSHSL state tourney?

MrBoDangles
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Post by MrBoDangles » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:57 pm

Didn't notice it. What's the scoop?

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 7:58 pm

MrBoDangles wrote:Didn't notice it. What's the scoop?
AAU had a hockey meeting over the weekend and had a booth at the expo.

MrBoDangles
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Post by MrBoDangles » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:01 am

elliott70 wrote:
MrBoDangles wrote:Didn't notice it. What's the scoop?
AAU had a hockey meeting over the weekend and had a booth at the expo.
What was the meeting for? Is there something new in Minnesota?

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:13 am

MrBoDangles wrote:
elliott70 wrote:
MrBoDangles wrote:Didn't notice it. What's the scoop?
AAU had a hockey meeting over the weekend and had a booth at the expo.
What was the meeting for? Is there something new in Minnesota?
AAU will host a squirt tourney in MN next yeAr sometime.

O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:25 am

Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.
Be kind. Rewind.

barry_mcconnell
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Post by barry_mcconnell » Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:49 am

AAU? Isn't that roller hockey?

edgeless2
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Post by edgeless2 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:04 pm

barry_mcconnell wrote:AAU? Isn't that roller hockey?
I thought it was roller derby.

greybeard58
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Post by greybeard58 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:27 pm

OTC
Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.

The answer is MONEY in their pockets. Look deeper.

barry_mcconnell
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Post by barry_mcconnell » Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:44 pm

What is AAU? I honestly don't know.

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:04 pm

O-townClown wrote:Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.
They were non-MN people at the meeting.
If they were here at some MN people bidding I do not know.

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:05 pm

elliott70 wrote:
O-townClown wrote:Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.
They were non-MN people at the meeting.
If they were here at some MN people bidding I do not know.
But, it seems the tourney wil be held at some private rink owned by Bernie somebody.

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:06 pm

Oops

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:10 pm

barry_mcconnell wrote:What is AAU? I honestly don't know.
It is a national organization promoting, organizing sports.
Big in basketball, but all sports.
Very little hockey but a. Desire to expand.

old goalie85
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Post by old goalie85 » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:53 pm

What ever. :roll:

MNM JMH
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Post by MNM JMH » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:01 pm

So basically AAU Hockey would be a year round traveling team. Or would this be considered Tier 1 ? Really I don't know , from what I have read on my naked lady giver it is just like tier 1? Can someone get more info on why they would have been at the Expo this year for the 1st time.

O-townClown
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Post by O-townClown » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:08 pm

For Youth, Tier I is a USA Hockey designation granted by your affiliate that means a team is eligible to play in the USA Hockey national championship at the Tier I level.

They hold three: Bantam, U16 & U18.

AAU hockey is nothing like that.

Club hockey would probably be how teams form, like Summer hockey in Minnesota and not geographically bound association hockey.
Be kind. Rewind.

MNM JMH
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Post by MNM JMH » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:10 pm

O-townClown wrote:For Youth, Tier I is a USA Hockey designation granted by your affiliate that means a team is eligible to play in the USA Hockey national championship at the Tier I level.

They hold three: Bantam, U16 & U18.

AAU hockey is nothing like that.

Club hockey would probably be how teams form, like Summer hockey in Minnesota and not geographically bound association hockey.
Ok so year round youth AAA hockey then?

SCBlueLiner
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Post by SCBlueLiner » Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:56 am

Basically, yeah like summer hockey.

AAU provides the insurance coverage and would be the sanctioning body.

Why are they moving into hockey? Look no further than USAH's cross-ice mandate at Mites. People don't want it. Michigan went with a cross ice mandate so AAU stepped in and sponsored full ice Mite tournaments. Many Mite age kids went that route rather than registering with USAH. It's a big problem and threat to USAH, IMO. AAU is getting the kids in young, giving parents the freedom of a more "club" based structure as opposed to association based.

Personally, I think USAH does some great things to grow the sport in the U.S. At the same time they get things wrong and they need to learn to change direction when they are wrong. I think they are wrong with the cross-ice mandate. I think there's a better way to promote cross ice and small area games yet still allow for some full ice competition for those older Mites. I don't think anything good can come from youth hockey splitting into two organizations on a national level, USAH and AAU.

Froggy Richards
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Post by Froggy Richards » Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:07 am

SCBlueLiner wrote:Basically, yeah like summer hockey.

AAU provides the insurance coverage and would be the sanctioning body.

Why are they moving into hockey? Look no further than USAH's cross-ice mandate at Mites. People don't want it. Michigan went with a cross ice mandate so AAU stepped in and sponsored full ice Mite tournaments. Many Mite age kids went that route rather than registering with USAH. It's a big problem and threat to USAH, IMO. AAU is getting the kids in young, giving parents the freedom of a more "club" based structure as opposed to association based.

Personally, I think USAH does some great things to grow the sport in the U.S. At the same time they get things wrong and they need to learn to change direction when they are wrong. I think they are wrong with the cross-ice mandate. I think there's a better way to promote cross ice and small area games yet still allow for some full ice competition for those older Mites. I don't think anything good can come from youth hockey splitting into two organizations on a national level, USAH and AAU.
This is definitely an issue that USA Hockey should have left alone. 2nd and 3rd graders should not be "mandated" to play cross or half ice. It's especially a big problem when you have advanced 3rd graders who can't move up to Squirts because of numbers. I understand the benefits of it but they need both in my opinion. After playing full ice last year many of our kids skated about 3/4 in half ice because they didn't like it. I understand what they like isn't always what's best for them but sometimes I think we need to listen to the kids. If they're not having fun, nothing else we do matters. There was nothing wrong with the current system. This year our Mite 2 team did about 60/40 half ice, full ice and it seemed to be perfect. Minnesota has applied for an exception to this rule. The hearing is in May and USA Hockey will decide whether or not to accept it. Even if they do, the full ice games will be very limited, probably 6-9 games. I think it should be more like 12-15.

This should be left up to the Associations. If the exception is not granted, there is already talk between associations in our area to form Squirt C teams. This would solve the issue for the more advanced skaters but would water down the competition for the younger Mite 2's, which I don't think is good either. First year Mite 2's make a huge jump over the course of the season, partly because of being pushed by better team mates and competition.

IHEA
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Post by IHEA » Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:37 am

elliott70 wrote:
elliott70 wrote:
O-townClown wrote:Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.
They were non-MN people at the meeting.
If they were here at some MN people bidding I do not know.
But, it seems the tourney wil be held at some private rink owned by Bernie somebody.



http://www.hockeycolorado.org/page/show ... y-colorado

From the Hockey Colorado AAU Website:

2014 AAU National Mite Championships & 2014 The AAU National Squirt Championships in Minnesota

AAU Ice Hockey will organize the, 2014 AAU National Mite Championships & 2014 The AAU National Squirt Championships in Minnesota.

Host will be Minnesota Made Hockey, (www.mnmadehockey.com)

elliott70
Posts: 13584
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:47 pm
Location: Bemidji

Post by elliott70 » Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:44 am

Froggy Richards wrote:
SCBlueLiner wrote:Basically, yeah like summer hockey.

AAU provides the insurance coverage and would be the sanctioning body.

Why are they moving into hockey? Look no further than USAH's cross-ice mandate at Mites. People don't want it. Michigan went with a cross ice mandate so AAU stepped in and sponsored full ice Mite tournaments. Many Mite age kids went that route rather than registering with USAH. It's a big problem and threat to USAH, IMO. AAU is getting the kids in young, giving parents the freedom of a more "club" based structure as opposed to association based.

Personally, I think USAH does some great things to grow the sport in the U.S. At the same time they get things wrong and they need to learn to change direction when they are wrong. I think they are wrong with the cross-ice mandate. I think there's a better way to promote cross ice and small area games yet still allow for some full ice competition for those older Mites. I don't think anything good can come from youth hockey splitting into two organizations on a national level, USAH and AAU.
This is definitely an issue that USA Hockey should have left alone. 2nd and 3rd graders should not be "mandated" to play cross or half ice. It's especially a big problem when you have advanced 3rd graders who can't move up to Squirts because of numbers. I understand the benefits of it but they need both in my opinion. After playing full ice last year many of our kids skated about 3/4 in half ice because they didn't like it. I understand what they like isn't always what's best for them but sometimes I think we need to listen to the kids. If they're not having fun, nothing else we do matters. There was nothing wrong with the current system. This year our Mite 2 team did about 60/40 half ice, full ice and it seemed to be perfect. Minnesota has applied for an exception to this rule. The hearing is in May and USA Hockey will decide whether or not to accept it. Even if they do, the full ice games will be very limited, probably 6-9 games. I think it should be more like 12-15.

This should be left up to the Associations. If the exception is not granted, there is already talk between associations in our area to form Squirt C teams. This would solve the issue for the more advanced skaters but would water down the competition for the younger Mite 2's, which I don't think is good either. First year Mite 2's make a huge jump over the course of the season, partly because of being pushed by better team mates and competition.
District 16 will allow the decision to be made at the local level.
I believe the final MH decision will be something similar to what D16 plans on doing.

elliott70
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Post by elliott70 » Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:45 am

IHEA wrote:
elliott70 wrote:
elliott70 wrote:
O-townClown wrote:Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.
They were non-MN people at the meeting.
If they were here at some MN people bidding I do not know.
But, it seems the tourney wil be held at some private rink owned by Bernie somebody.



http://www.hockeycolorado.org/page/show ... y-colorado

From the Hockey Colorado AAU Website:

2014 AAU National Mite Championships & 2014 The AAU National Squirt Championships in Minnesota

AAU Ice Hockey will organize the, 2014 AAU National Mite Championships & 2014 The AAU National Squirt Championships in Minnesota.

Host will be Minnesota Made Hockey, (www.mnmadehockey.com)
Well, there you go. Now we know what and where.

hipcheck62
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Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:11 am

Post by hipcheck62 » Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:57 am

IHEA wrote:
elliott70 wrote:
elliott70 wrote:
O-townClown wrote:Elliott, any idea who is the driving force? Some of the people that have sought out AAU are actually one-time USA Hockey (or affiliate) leaders that see it as an easier way to do what they want. Others are anti-establishment guys from the outside that have been challenging status quo.

It's interesting to me that two disparate groups find the common ground with an AAU label.
They were non-MN people at the meeting.
If they were here at some MN people bidding I do not know.
But, it seems the tourney wil be held at some private rink owned by Bernie somebody.



http://www.hockeycolorado.org/page/show ... y-colorado

From the Hockey Colorado AAU Website:

2014 AAU National Mite Championships & 2014 The AAU National Squirt Championships in Minnesota

AAU Ice Hockey will organize the, 2014 AAU National Mite Championships & 2014 The AAU National Squirt Championships in Minnesota.

Host will be Minnesota Made Hockey, (www.mnmadehockey.com)
Let me read that again ... "National Mite Championship"... Nope, still sounds ridiculous.

IHEA
Posts: 42
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 11:37 am

Post by IHEA » Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:04 pm

and here's a little about the HOW and WHY the AAU got into hockey and how Minnesota Made got involved

AAU Site

With the remarkable growth of AAU ice hockey at Mites, as well as at the High School level in New York and at Juniors in the western United States, it’s important to note that within some USA Hockey affiliates there have been issues and resistance to AAU growth. Mite growth could have been even more dramatic if not for rumors of potential reprisals against players, coaches and referees for choosing to participate within non-USAH programs.

AAU has informed USA Hockey of such actions directly. And some AAU affiliates have notified the US Olympic Committee (USOC) as well. The USOC has supervisory control over all National Governing Bodies (NGB) of any Olympic based sports. This includes the power to discipline and/or remove USA Hockey from serving as a NGB.

Apparently in response to these actions, the USA Hockey - General Counsel (their Legal Department) recently issued USA Hockey Guidelines Regarding Non-Sanctioned Play to USAH affiliates, which have now been accepted as official USAH policy.

To help summarize this guidance, please consider the following quotations;

•Membership in or registration with another sanctioning body may not be used as a basis to deny membership in USA Hockey, its Affiliates or local programs.

•No Individual Participant may be penalized for participating in a program that is not sanctioned by USA Hockey.

•No USA Hockey official may be penalized, threatened, excluded or made ineligible for officiating USA Hockey games based on that official being certified by or officiating games that are not sanctioned by USA Hockey or are sanctioned by some other entity.

Also front and center during this season has been the memoranda issued in the federal antitrust lawsuit of Minnesota Made Hockey, Inc versus Minnesota Hockey, Inc. et al, case number 0:2010cv03884. A USAH affiliate had created a rule, which would have suspended players who dared to participate within an alternative non-USAH youth hockey program. US District Court Judge Tunheim found that such a rule was an attempt to create and maintain an unlawful monopoly, which is a felony under the Sherman Antitrust Act. Such violations carry potential criminal and civil damages, as well as being grounds for removal of a NGB.

However, it’s important to note that USA Hockey has asked to be kept informed about any similar violations of USAH affiliates, leagues or local programs. Any large organization will always have members who don’t get the memo and/or who act as loose cannons. The question is how an organization responds to such incidents. If USAH corrects its members and repairs any damage that occurs then they should be commended. Therefore, we should be willing to aid them in these efforts.

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