Missing tryouts

[barry_mcconnell]

Every year a couple kids get injured during football season and miss hockey tryouts.

How do most associations handle these situations?

[old goalie85]

In FL if the kid was a first year A he/she would be a A player. First year would be one level below. [ squirt A to pee-wee B] I also thinkl the board talks to the coaches. [last years and this years]

[DrGaf]

Every year a couple kids get injured during football season and miss hockey tryouts.

How do most associations handle these situations?

2 associations I am familiar with do it this way:

second year returners at minimum get placed on their level from last year
(returning A player, get placed on the A team)

Second year players are available at the coaches discretion to move up one level
(returning B1 player, is guaranteed a B1 spot. But, is able to move up to A level at the coaches / boards discretion)

First year player is guaranteed at level below. Able to play at the same level at the coaches / board's discretion.
(last year player was PWA, he is guaranteed Bantam B1. Able to play BA at coaches / board's discretion.)

[JSR]

Depends on the injury and how long the kid will be out. If there is "question" as to what team the kid will be on our association actually "leaves room" so to speak on both teams to start the season as USA Hockey rosters are usually not due til the end of November. The player(s) in question practice for a few weeks with both teams and then the coaches place teh kid ont he appropriate team going forward.... Hoenstly I have never understood why we do tryouts the way we do, we should have a tryout for the general purpos of placing kids but the 'bubble kids" you would think we could wait for atleast a few weeks of practice to go by before we definitively place one kid on one team and another on the other team, I actually find it amazing how much kids progress (and others don't) after just 3 or 4 weeks.....

[helightsthelamp]

Depends on the injury and how long the kid will be out. If there is "question" as to what team the kid will be on our association actually "leaves room" so to speak on both teams to start the season as USA Hockey rosters are usually not due til the end of November. The player(s) in question practice for a few weeks with both teams and then the coaches place teh kid ont he appropriate team going forward.... Hoenstly I have never understood why we do tryouts the way we do, we should have a tryout for the general purpos of placing kids but the 'bubble kids" you would think we could wait for atleast a few weeks of practice to go by before we definitively place one kid on one team and another on the other team, I actually find it amazing how much kids progress (and others don't) after just 3 or 4 weeks.....

While I don't disagree with you on how kids can change rapidly, I don't think waiting 3 or 4 weeks to determine what team a bubble kid ends up on would be fair to the kid, especially at the younger ages. Kids know they are bubble kids and the tryout process is stressful enough without extending their "bubble" status for another month past tryouts.

[JSR]

Depends on the injury and how long the kid will be out. If there is "question" as to what team the kid will be on our association actually "leaves room" so to speak on both teams to start the season as USA Hockey rosters are usually not due til the end of November. The player(s) in question practice for a few weeks with both teams and then the coaches place teh kid ont he appropriate team going forward.... Hoenstly I have never understood why we do tryouts the way we do, we should have a tryout for the general purpos of placing kids but the 'bubble kids" you would think we could wait for atleast a few weeks of practice to go by before we definitively place one kid on one team and another on the other team, I actually find it amazing how much kids progress (and others don't) after just 3 or 4 weeks.....

While I don't disagree with you on how kids can change rapidly, I don't think waiting 3 or 4 weeks to determine what team a bubble kid ends up on would be fair to the kid, especially at the younger ages. Kids know they are bubble kids and the tryout process is stressful enough without extending their "bubble" status for another month past tryouts.

But isn't still better than the ongoing "stress" of ending up on the "wrong" team. I know kids and kids that end up on A teams that don't belong there and literally never touch the puck are often times the ones who drop out the following season believe it or not, I've seen it happen multiple times, yet the kid in the same situation who ended up on the B1 team and was the "star" alot of times does a "leap frog' the next season and is no longer the bubble kid and is solidly on the A team because of how much confidence he got from all the puck touches etc.... I don;t want to prolong stress of tryouts but I also don't want to add stress etc.... that comes from not being on the right team

[edgeless2]

Depends on the injury and how long the kid will be out. If there is "question" as to what team the kid will be on our association actually "leaves room" so to speak on both teams to start the season as USA Hockey rosters are usually not due til the end of November. The player(s) in question practice for a few weeks with both teams and then the coaches place teh kid ont he appropriate team going forward.... Hoenstly I have never understood why we do tryouts the way we do, we should have a tryout for the general purpos of placing kids but the 'bubble kids" you would think we could wait for atleast a few weeks of practice to go by before we definitively place one kid on one team and another on the other team, I actually find it amazing how much kids progress (and others don't) after just 3 or 4 weeks.....

While I don't disagree with you on how kids can change rapidly, I don't think waiting 3 or 4 weeks to determine what team a bubble kid ends up on would be fair to the kid, especially at the younger ages. Kids know they are bubble kids and the tryout process is stressful enough without extending their "bubble" status for another month past tryouts.

But isn't still better than the ongoing "stress" of ending up on the "wrong" team. I know kids and kids that end up on A teams that don't belong there and literally never touch the puck are often times the ones who drop out the following season believe it or not, I've seen it happen multiple times, yet the kid in the same situation who ended up on the B1 team and was the "star" alot of times does a "leap frog' the next season and is no longer the bubble kid and is solidly on the A team because of how much confidence he got from all the puck touches etc.... I don;t want to prolong stress of tryouts but I also don't want to add stress etc.... that comes from not being on the right team

Interesting idea I think would work for Bantams but probably not younger. Much like High Schools use swing lines and move kids between JV and Varsity. Though you would be subjecting coaching staffs to more scrutiny it would be from a smaller group of kids/parents. IMO it would be a trade off most would leap at given the opportunity to develop with a more talented group of kids and coaches, not to mention the chance to get it right for the player.

[helightsthelamp]

Depends on the injury and how long the kid will be out. If there is "question" as to what team the kid will be on our association actually "leaves room" so to speak on both teams to start the season as USA Hockey rosters are usually not due til the end of November. The player(s) in question practice for a few weeks with both teams and then the coaches place teh kid ont he appropriate team going forward.... Hoenstly I have never understood why we do tryouts the way we do, we should have a tryout for the general purpos of placing kids but the 'bubble kids" you would think we could wait for atleast a few weeks of practice to go by before we definitively place one kid on one team and another on the other team, I actually find it amazing how much kids progress (and others don't) after just 3 or 4 weeks.....

While I don't disagree with you on how kids can change rapidly, I don't think waiting 3 or 4 weeks to determine what team a bubble kid ends up on would be fair to the kid, especially at the younger ages. Kids know they are bubble kids and the tryout process is stressful enough without extending their "bubble" status for another month past tryouts.

But isn't still better than the ongoing "stress" of ending up on the "wrong" team. I know kids and kids that end up on A teams that don't belong there and literally never touch the puck are often times the ones who drop out the following season believe it or not, I've seen it happen multiple times, yet the kid in the same situation who ended up on the B1 team and was the "star" alot of times does a "leap frog' the next season and is no longer the bubble kid and is solidly on the A team because of how much confidence he got from all the puck touches etc.... I don;t want to prolong stress of tryouts but I also don't want to add stress etc.... that comes from not being on the right team

Is what you discribe because it was the "wrong" team, or is it the age old debate of which is better for development? #15 on top team or #1 on second team, I would typically think being #1 on second team is a better enviornment to be the "star" and ""leap frog" ahead of #15... completely theoretical, but in what you discribe would the outcome be any different a month later if you switched the players? Think of the loss of confidence #15 would face if now moved down to second team.... On the flip, #16 would get a huge boost of confidence by being moved up, but after a few months of being #15 does the confidence erode?

[helightsthelamp]

Getting back on topic:

An injured/ill player must be expected to return to 100% of his/her playing capabilities by December 1st, based on doctors’ estimation, to be eligible for a spot on any A or B travel team. This date is based on the Minnesota Hockey roster deadlines. Players who cannot be expected to perform at their full playing potential by December 1st can be placed on a C team for the season, provided there are openings.

The matter will be discussed between the player’s previous years coach and current years level director. The final decision regarding an injured player’s placement will be the respective level director’s and the Athletic Director.

[C-dad]

Getting back on topic:

An injured/ill player must be expected to return to 100% of his/her playing capabilities by December 1st, based on doctors’ estimation, to be eligible for a spot on any A or B travel team. This date is based on the Minnesota Hockey roster deadlines. Players who cannot be expected to perform at their full playing potential by December 1st can be placed on a C team for the season, provided there are openings.

The matter will be discussed between the player’s previous years coach and current years level director. The final decision regarding an injured player’s placement will be the respective level director’s and the Athletic Director.

Is this per your personal dictate, or is this a specific association rule book?

[JSR]

While I don't disagree with you on how kids can change rapidly, I don't think waiting 3 or 4 weeks to determine what team a bubble kid ends up on would be fair to the kid, especially at the younger ages. Kids know they are bubble kids and the tryout process is stressful enough without extending their "bubble" status for another month past tryouts.

But isn't still better than the ongoing "stress" of ending up on the "wrong" team. I know kids and kids that end up on A teams that don't belong there and literally never touch the puck are often times the ones who drop out the following season believe it or not, I've seen it happen multiple times, yet the kid in the same situation who ended up on the B1 team and was the "star" alot of times does a "leap frog' the next season and is no longer the bubble kid and is solidly on the A team because of how much confidence he got from all the puck touches etc.... I don;t want to prolong stress of tryouts but I also don't want to add stress etc.... that comes from not being on the right team

Is what you discribe because it was the "wrong" team, or is it the age old debate of which is better for development? #15 on top team or #1 on second team, I would typically think being #1 on second team is a better enviornment to be the "star" and ""leap frog" ahead of #15... completely theoretical, but in what you discribe would the outcome be any different a month later if you switched the players? Think of the loss of confidence #15 would face if now moved down to second team.... On the flip, #16 would get a huge boost of confidence by being moved up, but after a few months of being #15 does the confidence erode?

I guess both scenarios exist, those being sometimes there is the developmental aspect but sometimes there is also the kid just flat out got put ont he wrong team. And it does go both ways. It is very rare but I know of an assoication where they had non-parent and non-coach evaluators to keep things "fair".... well one of the "star" kids, who plays invite level AAA in the spring/summer was sick during tryouts. They put him on the B team but he was so far and above better than everyone else it wasn't fun for him and it wasn't fun for his teammates, he would have been probably the #2 player on the A team... this is an extreme example and this association made a huge mistake not involving previous years coaches etc.... but sometimes kids do end up on the "wrong" team, it is rarer than the developmental scenario but it can happen

[helightsthelamp]

Getting back on topic:

An injured/ill player must be expected to return to 100% of his/her playing capabilities by December 1st, based on doctors’ estimation, to be eligible for a spot on any A or B travel team. This date is based on the Minnesota Hockey roster deadlines. Players who cannot be expected to perform at their full playing potential by December 1st can be placed on a C team for the season, provided there are openings.

The matter will be discussed between the player’s previous years coach and current years level director. The final decision regarding an injured player’s placement will be the respective level director’s and the Athletic Director.

Is this per your personal dictate, or is this a specific association rule book?

Association Rule Book

[MNM JMH]

But isn't still better than the ongoing "stress" of ending up on the "wrong" team. I know kids and kids that end up on A teams that don't belong there and literally never touch the puck are often times the ones who drop out the following season believe it or not, I've seen it happen multiple times, yet the kid in the same situation who ended up on the B1 team and was the "star" alot of times does a "leap frog' the next season and is no longer the bubble kid and is solidly on the A team because of how much confidence he got from all the puck touches etc.... I don;t want to prolong stress of tryouts but I also don't want to add stress etc.... that comes from not being on the right team

Is what you discribe because it was the "wrong" team, or is it the age old debate of which is better for development? #15 on top team or #1 on second team, I would typically think being #1 on second team is a better enviornment to be the "star" and ""leap frog" ahead of #15... completely theoretical, but in what you discribe would the outcome be any different a month later if you switched the players? Think of the loss of confidence #15 would face if now moved down to second team.... On the flip, #16 would get a huge boost of confidence by being moved up, but after a few months of being #15 does the confidence erode?

I guess both scenarios exist, those being sometimes there is the developmental aspect but sometimes there is also the kid just flat out got put ont he wrong team. And it does go both ways. It is very rare but I know of an assoication where they had non-parent and non-coach evaluators to keep things "fair".... well one of the "star" kids, who plays invite level AAA in the spring/summer was sick during tryouts. They put him on the B team but he was so far and above better than everyone else it wasn't fun for him and it wasn't fun for his teammates, he would have been probably the #2 player on the A team... this is an extreme example and this association made a huge mistake not involving previous years coaches etc.... but sometimes kids do end up on the "wrong" team, it is rarer than the developmental scenario but it can happen

This is exactly what happened in EP last year at the Squirt level.

Which was to bad cause that kid could flat out play with 1-5 on the A team.

[MNM JMH]

But isn't still better than the ongoing "stress" of ending up on the "wrong" team. I know kids and kids that end up on A teams that don't belong there and literally never touch the puck are often times the ones who drop out the following season believe it or not, I've seen it happen multiple times, yet the kid in the same situation who ended up on the B1 team and was the "star" alot of times does a "leap frog' the next season and is no longer the bubble kid and is solidly on the A team because of how much confidence he got from all the puck touches etc.... I don;t want to prolong stress of tryouts but I also don't want to add stress etc.... that comes from not being on the right team

Is what you discribe because it was the "wrong" team, or is it the age old debate of which is better for development? #15 on top team or #1 on second team, I would typically think being #1 on second team is a better enviornment to be the "star" and ""leap frog" ahead of #15... completely theoretical, but in what you discribe would the outcome be any different a month later if you switched the players? Think of the loss of confidence #15 would face if now moved down to second team.... On the flip, #16 would get a huge boost of confidence by being moved up, but after a few months of being #15 does the confidence erode?

I guess both scenarios exist, those being sometimes there is the developmental aspect but sometimes there is also the kid just flat out got put ont he wrong team. And it does go both ways. It is very rare but I know of an assoication where they had non-parent and non-coach evaluators to keep things "fair".... well one of the "star" kids, who plays invite level AAA in the spring/summer was sick during tryouts. They put him on the B team but he was so far and above better than everyone else it wasn't fun for him and it wasn't fun for his teammates, he would have been probably the #2 player on the A team... this is an extreme example and this association made a huge mistake not involving previous years coaches etc.... but sometimes kids do end up on the "wrong" team, it is rarer than the developmental scenario but it can happen

This is exactly what happened in EP last year at the Squirt level.

Which was to bad cause that kid could flat out play with 1-5 on the A team.

[black sheep]

anybody seen overlapping issues with hockey tryouts and fall sports events?

i have heard of a few but would be interested on how different associations handle these.

bantam / 14U ages seem most difficult as you may have kids from 7th-10th grade participating in a fall school event that have overlapping bantam / 14 u tryouts.

[JSR]

anybody seen overlapping issues with hockey tryouts and fall sports events?

i have heard of a few but would be interested on how different associations handle these.

bantam / 14U ages seem most difficult as you may have kids from 7th-10th grade participating in a fall school event that have overlapping bantam / 14 u tryouts.

Our association has four days of tryouts> They will have tryouts on Tuesday & Thursday one week for a particular level then on Monday and Wednesday the following week. They do this to accomodate fall sports, and they tell the kids to try and make atleast two tryout days minimum. If they can make all four that is all the more opportunity to be seen but if they make atleast two they can qualify for any team. The hope being by doing it on different night s of the week that everyone can make atleast two, as alot of fall teams will practice Tuesday/Thursday or Monday/Wednesday .... you get the idea.... we have rare to no situations (aside from unexpected illness or injury) where kids cannot make two sessions or more