Gentry Galaxy

Discussion of Minnesota Youth Hockey

Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)

blindref
Posts: 229
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 7:10 am

Post by blindref » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:59 am

old goalie85 wrote:Didn't Edina have line? three kids Budish being one that played three sports not long ago ?? They couldn't have skated year round. I think all three moved on to "the next level". Yes I understand not the norm, still possible.
You are correct.
Everyone should google Adam Carlson from the Edina Junior Gold A, NA3HL,
NAHL, Mercyhurst University and now the top Washington Capital's
Minor League team in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

He was cut from his high school team twice and was still noticed.....

Jeffy95
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:45 pm

Post by Jeffy95 » Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:20 pm

blindref wrote:
old goalie85 wrote:Didn't Edina have line? three kids Budish being one that played three sports not long ago ?? They couldn't have skated year round. I think all three moved on to "the next level". Yes I understand not the norm, still possible.
You are correct.
Everyone should google Adam Carlson from the Edina Junior Gold A, NA3HL,
NAHL, Mercyhurst University and now the top Washington Capital's
Minor League team in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

He was cut from his high school team twice and was still noticed.....
It is IMPOSSIBLE to play High School Hockey in MN in this day and age and not get noticed if you're good.

old goalie85
Posts: 3695
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:37 am

Post by old goalie85 » Sat Mar 11, 2017 7:17 am

how did this season go for that GROUP

H0ckeyman
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:40 am

Post by H0ckeyman » Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:46 am

What are the thoughts as to how Gentry is doing so far?

oldgoalie85
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:36 pm

Post by oldgoalie85 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 3:36 pm

Do they have teams ? have heard nothing

blueline_6
Posts: 80
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:23 pm

Post by blueline_6 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:31 pm

https://www.mshsl.org/mshsl/schoolactpa ... actnum=410

Co-op with Gentry, DeLaSalle, Minnehaha and St. Agnes. I think in standings they are listed under Minnehaha.

H0ckeyman
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2017 2:40 am

Post by H0ckeyman » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:39 pm

Looks like Gentry Academy has a few younger teams at the Tier 1 level and that the program is growing. Am I correct that even though their 03 team that is ranked in the top 10 in the county, they cannot be a national bound team? Earlier posts seemed to reflect that and was wondering if things have changed.

O-townClown
Posts: 3332
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:22 pm
Location: Typical homeboy from the O-Town

Post by O-townClown » Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:40 pm

Is plan for Gentry to field a standalone HS team that plays a Minnesota Varsity schedule when the Bantams are older?
Be kind. Rewind.

zooomx
Posts: 263
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:34 pm

Post by zooomx » Tue Mar 13, 2018 2:19 pm

Jeffy95 wrote:
blindref wrote:
old goalie85 wrote:Didn't Edina have line? three kids Budish being one that played three sports not long ago ?? They couldn't have skated year round. I think all three moved on to "the next level". Yes I understand not the norm, still possible.
You are correct.
Everyone should google Adam Carlson from the Edina Junior Gold A, NA3HL,
NAHL, Mercyhurst University and now the top Washington Capital's
Minor League team in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

He was cut from his high school team twice and was still noticed.....
It is IMPOSSIBLE to play High School Hockey in MN in this day and age and not get noticed if you're good.
Jack Powell disagrees

Jeffy95
Posts: 563
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:45 pm

Post by Jeffy95 » Wed Mar 14, 2018 4:02 pm

zooomx wrote:
Jeffy95 wrote:
blindref wrote:
old goalie85 wrote:Didn't Edina have line? three kids Budish being one that played three sports not long ago ?? They couldn't have skated year round. I think all three moved on to "the next level". Yes I understand not the norm, still possible.
You are correct.
Everyone should google Adam Carlson from the Edina Junior Gold A, NA3HL,
NAHL, Mercyhurst University and now the top Washington Capital's
Minor League team in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

He was cut from his high school team twice and was still noticed.....
It is IMPOSSIBLE to play High School Hockey in MN in this day and age and not get noticed if you're good.
Jack Powell disagrees
How is that? Didn't he play Juniors last year and HS Elite League this year?

JSR
Posts: 1670
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:26 pm

Post by JSR » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:16 pm

blindref wrote:
old goalie85 wrote:Didn't Edina have line? three kids Budish being one that played three sports not long ago ?? They couldn't have skated year round. I think all three moved on to "the next level". Yes I understand not the norm, still possible.
You are correct.
Everyone should google Adam Carlson from the Edina Junior Gold A, NA3HL,
NAHL, Mercyhurst University and now the top Washington Capital's
Minor League team in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

He was cut from his high school team twice and was still noticed.....
Actually, this example is the exact OPPOSITE of being noticed. This guy had to work his arse off and go through the hardest possible road there is to get where he got because no one was noticing him in high school. He was dismissed by his varsity team, he was overlooked by every USHL, NAHL and Tier 2 Canadian Jr team out there. He had to settle for going to a pay or play NA3HL option where he finally did well enough there that an NAHL team allowed him to go to their main camp to tryout and he made it through their tryouts. From there folks started to notice him. But stop with this nonsense of "if you are good enough they will find you" or the whole "you will get noticed in high school" blah blah blah. It's nonsense. Either that or you and I have WAY different definitions of what it means to "be noticed" or found or whatever. Grinding your way up the food chain is not being noticed, it's literally you the player just never giving up and finding ways to get there.

I have personally spoken to several D1 coaches and dozens of junior hockey coaches, guess what they all tell me to a "T".... They all tell me that there are "way too many really good hockey players in North America now and we have no way of seeing or finding the overwhelming majority of them. We have relationships with certain coaches and teams and scouts and we rely on them to tell us who is out there, but the reality is there are tons of kids being overlooked or not noticed at all because they are not in those coaches or advisors networks". Yes even the USHL and NAHL take kids all the time that aren't remotely as good as some other players purely because of who they know and not how good they are. It's not jealousy, it's not rhetoric, it's reality and the coaches readily admit it because they don't have time to scout themselves most of the time.

Are the best, of the best, of the best usually found and on the radar, yep, but all the rest of the kids who make up 85% of the rosters at the highest level, those kids are there partly because they are decent hockey players but almost more so because of who they knew.

OldManRiver
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:31 pm

Post by OldManRiver » Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:17 pm

It feels a bit to me like you're trolling, but I'm waiting for the Wild to play so I'll bite - you're telling me that in your expert opinion, 85% of the players at the highest levels are there because of who they knew...unlike the top 15% who are there because of pure talent?

Even as a newbie, I call complete and utter BS on this.

JSR
Posts: 1670
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:26 pm

Post by JSR » Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:09 pm

OldManRiver wrote:It feels a bit to me like you're trolling, but I'm waiting for the Wild to play so I'll bite - you're telling me that in your expert opinion, 85% of the players at the highest levels are there because of who they knew...unlike the top 15% who are there because of pure talent?

Even as a newbie, I call complete and utter BS on this.
You are putting words in my mouth and seemingly purposefully misunderstanding what I said.

I am saying that when it comes to junior hockey (USHL, NAHL etc..) and college hockey there are just as many players not getting opportunities to play in those leagues that are just as good as those playing in those leagues because they do not have an "in". There are literally hundreds of kids who are good enough to play in those leagues but because they didn't hire the advisor who directs players to the team they are trying out for they don't stand a chance. It basically creates a situation where really good players don't even try because the deck is stacked against them.

For further clarification I am saying a kid like Oliver Wahlstrom as an example, he is so unbelievably good he was going to likely get noticed and make it no matter what because his gifts are amongst the 0.01% so we aren't talking about him. We are talking about the "Adam Carlson's" of the world who obviously had and does have the skills to play at the highest level but he wasn't on the in crowd in Edina obviously so he never got a shot in Edina (I know how good Edina is but don't tell me a kid like this was not "good enough" to play for them if his dad had been say Jim Dowd, as opposed to "Mr. Carlson". Same thing when he went the junior route, because he wasn't on a varsity team in Edina the Tier 1 and Tier 2 junior teams basically just dismissed him as not being able to play regardless of how well he performed at their tryouts. I was scouting a NAHL tryout recently where there were atleast a half dozen kids who were not even close to being good enough for their all start game but made it to the allstar game over far better talent purely because those kids were clients of advisors who had "deals" with the coaching staff of that team.

Again lets be clear, I am not saying that 85% of players playing at the highest levels are there purely because of who they know. I said they have to be talented "enough" o be there but the thing that put them over the top compared to the kid who was just as good was who they knew and even in some cases they were not even as good but it was still who they knew that put them over the guy who was slightly better. If you call BS on that you are either uninformed or willfully ignorant.

That said, the point of the original post was refuting the whole "if you are good enough they will find you" nonsense. Because that is blatant nonsense. You HAVE to market yourself somehow, plain and simple you have to. I am not saying you have to spend money on a advisor or anything but you'd better have a respected coach, or a famous hockey parent, or rich parent, or something in your corner otherwise your only other miniscule slim hope is to have the deep deep resolve to go the route Carlson went. It happens but hockey is such a grind to begin with just to be good enough talent wise, that you throw that extra amount of rejection etc... on there it's no wonder so many talented players don't even try.

lostmyonlypuckindasnow
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 6:43 pm

Post by lostmyonlypuckindasnow » Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:06 pm

Resources basically scarce in terms of getting a chance to go check random players out, making those with an "in" simply more likely to be "found" as admin rely largely on a filtering system, but further stacking the deck against diamonds in the rough is the fact that our current information super-highway puts pressure to try and grab the kids that there is already some chatter about or that come from particular programs.

Anyone at any level who passes on a player who has received some attention or is in a strong program to take a chance on the player who is probably just as good or better, but is currently a member of the unnoticed/unconnected/unwashed, will be harshly criticized by every armchair quarterback that catches wind of it unless that diamond in the rough immediately starts to shine. If that diamond don't shine: lots of "told you so" will be going on. Why risk your job/reputation/deal with vocal critics (even if it's just internet trolls) to take a chance on an unknown commodity. Whether or not it is the right thing to do, few have the sand do to it. Going with the known commodity is much safer (in terms of longevity safer usually means smarter); if he does't pan out, well, then, he simply didn't pan out and you are among a crowd of people who thought he would.

It will only get worse, not better, for the unwashed in terms of being found or getting a chance in our information/self-promotion age. Awe heck, Ill say it: you need to be a member of the hockey gentry (please excuse the double entendre). Every once in a while you will have the kid that has the drive passion and personal fortitude to stick with it and claw his way up from a Jr Gold team to a college or pro team, but most of the time any lower-tier team anywhere after squirts (maybe even mites, as commits get younger) will be the express ticket to the bar league.

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