GOPHERS 2014-2015

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BodyShots
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Post by BodyShots » Thu Apr 02, 2015 4:19 pm

Sats81 wrote:
BodyShots wrote:
Tigers33 wrote:I tell you what though if I am fasching I would think long and hard about leaving. There won't be anybody left!
What do you mean.... he could be on a line with AJ and Cammy. :shock:
I am not a cammy fan but offensively speaking they are almost identical from a production standpoint. This is with Hudson being given every opportunity to succeed. He has played on the "first" line since the moment he stepped on campus and has played on the first PP unit his entire 2 years. Sure he's big and has an NHL frame but he doesn't use it to his advantage often.
They both have been given every opportunity to succeed, as both have gotten plenty of PP time. Both have had identical production year 1 and 2 and they need to step up their play dramatically from an offensive standpoint next year, for this team to have any success.

Sats81
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Post by Sats81 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 4:59 pm

BodyShots wrote:
Sats81 wrote:
BodyShots wrote:
Tigers33 wrote:I tell you what though if I am fasching I would think long and hard about leaving. There won't be anybody left!
What do you mean.... he could be on a line with AJ and Cammy. :shock:
I am not a cammy fan but offensively speaking they are almost identical from a production standpoint. This is with Hudson being given every opportunity to succeed. He has played on the "first" line since the moment he stepped on campus and has played on the first PP unit his entire 2 years. Sure he's big and has an NHL frame but he doesn't use it to his advantage often.
They both have been given every opportunity to succeed, as both have gotten plenty of PP time. Both have had identical production year 1 and 2 and they need to step up their play dramatically from an offensive standpoint next year, for this team to have any success.
I am not disagreeing with that. I guess my point is, people really pile on Cammy (deserved) but not as much on Fasching. Can we just agree that both were highly touted, overrated and have been dissapointing thus far?

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 1:31 am

BodyShots wrote:Does anybody know if they are going to shrink the ice at Mariucci? I've heard rumors, but haven't seen anything definitive yet.
A few years off at this point. But likely going to happen

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 1:44 am

mulefarm wrote:I think it will be very hard for Lucia to bring in older freshman.
This is not accurate. Among their incoming recruits for next season, they do have some older guys coming in.

Hults turns 21 next season

Romanko turns 21 next season

Schierhorn turns 20 next season

Sheehy turns 20 next season.

Ramsey turns 20 next season.

Yes, they will still bring in young guys (Novak and Gates for example) but even in those situations, those types have generally have played (and succeeded) at junior hockey before coming in. For instance, Gates turns 18 this summer but he is a big kid that will has played a couple of seasons of USHL.

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Post by mulefarm » Fri Apr 03, 2015 7:27 am

Gopher Blog wrote:
mulefarm wrote:I think it will be very hard for Lucia to bring in older freshman.
This is not accurate. Among their incoming recruits for next season, they do have some older guys coming in.

Hults turns 21 next season

Romanko turns 21 next season

Schierhorn turns 20 next season

Sheehy turns 20 next season.

Ramsey turns 20 next season.

Yes, they will still bring in young guys (Novak and Gates for example) but even in those situations, those types have generally have played (and succeeded) at junior hockey before coming in. For instance, Gates turns 18 this summer but he is a big kid that will has played a couple of seasons of USHL.
You are correct, But many of these players have been committed for some time and are not the late bloomers It is hard for him to get late bloomers to walk on when other schools can offer some money and abetter chance to play. Not like it use to be .

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Post by Tigers33 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:26 am

Most schools recruit them that young. My point is some of these kids, NOT ALL, need to play a year AFTER hs in the juniors too to come in older.

Kloos would've been much worse had he not done this and bischoff would be much better had he done it. The guys I am looking at are guys like glover, and Collins. Both considered great recruits. Glover would've been better off going to the ushl for 1 year. Collins certainly needs to beef up a bit.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:27 am

mulefarm wrote:You are correct, But many of these players have been committed for some time and are not the late bloomers It is hard for him to get late bloomers to walk on when other schools can offer some money and abetter chance to play. Not like it use to be .
Umm... 3 of those 5 names I mentioned committed within the last three months. The prior year, they had two older players commit in the late winter for the following season.

The reality is your perception is inaccurate. They can get those guys. The issue is they don't tend to rely on those types all that much. Not that they can't go that route.

It is best to supplement your team with those types of players... not build your program around them. It really isn't a huge issue in that sense.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:44 am

Tigers33 wrote:Most schools recruit them that young. My point is some of these kids, NOT ALL, need to play a year AFTER hs in the juniors too to come in older.

Kloos would've been much worse had he not done this and bischoff would be much better had he done it. The guys I am looking at are guys like glover, and Collins. Both considered great recruits. Glover would've been better off going to the ushl for 1 year. Collins certainly needs to beef up a bit.
I don't think any player would be worse off getting the extra year of juniors after HS. That is pretty obvious.

The problem is you aren't going to get 99% of kids that are legit pro prospects to wait that one extra year after HS. Not only do they not want to do it but their NHL teams don't want it in many cases. If you play hard ball on it, the kid will just go to some other program that is offering him an immediate spot.

Kloos wasn't really a pro prospect at the time and we were fortunate in his case because he was the guy that was going to replace Bjugstad if Nick hadn't come back for his junior year. We were fortunate Bjugstad came back and allowed Kloos the year in junior hockey (just as we were fortunate with Rau giving Sheehy extra time).

The usual response to that is... OK, then let the kid walk if he won't play an extra year. Of course, it is easy to say that now. But when that kid starts playing well in college a year or two later, fans will inevitably criticize Lucia for not getting that kid.

I really don't care about the extra year after HS depending on what they had been doing prior to that. Glover and Collins had two years of juniors already. Lots of hockey vs. junior, international, and college competition by the time they hit campus. I don't really care for the kids who go right from MNHS to college hockey but occasionally you bite the bullet depending on team need.

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Post by mulefarm » Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:52 am

Where do the Gophers compare to the other schools when it comes to the average age of their roster? What was the average age of their incoming freshman? How many schools have players accelerate their education so they can start a year earlier? Honestly I have no idea, just seems they are always younger than most teams?

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 1:11 pm

mulefarm wrote:Where do the Gophers compare to the other schools when it comes to the average age of their roster? What was the average age of their incoming freshman? How many schools have players accelerate their education so they can start a year earlier? Honestly I have no idea, just seems they are always younger than most teams?
I'm sure you can average out that stuff. The dates of birth are on various sites.

Likely they would trend more toward the younger side of the average ages of their team/recruits. I'd say programs that typically land more of the "blue chip" kids (MN, BC, UND, Michigan, etc) tend to run a little on the younger side.

Only one kid on the Gophers accelerated to get into college early (Travis Boyd). I know BC had Noah Hanifin accelerate to be able to play this past season. It is an occasional practice.

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Post by Tigers33 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:55 pm

Ok gopher blog then I will say it like it is. Glover and Collins was worthless to have them both here like that if they are considered to be that good. I get one of them but both doesn't make much sense. Glover got little to no experience at playing D this year.

This team is in a world of hurt next year. It's funny that the gophers go through these ups and downs, but North Dakota doesn't. Michigan also seems to as well. I would hate to be a Michigan college hockey fan.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:38 pm

Tigers33 wrote:Ok gopher blog then I will say it like it is. Glover and Collins was worthless to have them both here like that if they are considered to be that good. I get one of them but both doesn't make much sense. Glover got little to no experience at playing D this year.
You have to have depth and competition on a team. Unlike the pros, we don't have the luxury of calling many different guys up from the minors to cover for injury, performance needs, etc. You generally need to carry 7 or 8 defensemen on a roster. Somebody is going to see less ice time no matter what the case is and a coach has to plan for more than one year when building a program.

Glover was not going to go off to the USHL and still play for the Gophers. He never would have committed under those circumstances. As I said, the response to that is usually (in hindsight of course), then let him walk. OK... but if we do that and he starts playing well elsewhere, then you have no room to complain about instances where they do just that.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:50 pm

Tigers33 wrote:This team is in a world of hurt next year. It's funny that the gophers go through these ups and downs, but North Dakota doesn't. Michigan also seems to as well. I would hate to be a Michigan college hockey fan.
A world of hurt? Well, I guess every fan is due their opinion.

There were probably a decent percentage of people that said the same type of thing after Bjugstad, Haula, Schmidt, Budish, Alt and Helgeson left a few years ago yet they ended up doing pretty darn well the following year.

I am not sure how "up and down" the team is when they have been a part of 4 straight conference championships and a couple of Frozen Fours in recent years. They didn't perform great this year but it wasn't an awful year by any means either.

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Post by Tigers33 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:44 pm

Winning the big 10 doesn't mean a thing.

Let's remove glover from the conversation and say they had 11 forwards on the roster in their last game. They lose 5 of those 11 forwards. They lose 3 of their top 6 defenseman. The defenseman in my opinion were the biggest weakness of this program. And they lose a goalie with no real solid #1 on the horizon.

They will be awful next year but still contend in the fabulous big 10. Is that better.

I think playing a defenseman at forward the last 2-3 years chalks off how lazy don is at recruiting.

The only reason the team does well next year is because they got rid of all the drama in the locker room.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:21 pm

Tigers33 wrote:Winning the big 10 doesn't mean a thing.
No doubt it was a down year in the B1G this year. No argument from me. However, they probably could have won any conference the year before given they were the #1 seed in college hockey and had played the 4th toughest schedule in the country that year.
Let's remove glover from the conversation and say they had 11 forwards on the roster in their last game. They lose 5 of those 11 forwards. They lose 3 of their top 6 defenseman.


I'd argue they lost more talent in that Bjugstad/Schmidt group than what they lose this year and they still thrived. Will they next year? We'll see. But they definitely have some good players coming in (and some much needed size/grit as well).
The defenseman in my opinion were the biggest weakness of this program.
We'll have to see how an off-season of hard work helps. Bischoff is an example of a guy that played significantly better as a soph compared to his first year. That doesn't tend to be unique. It's not as if these guys stay as is and don't get better as they mature. Seeler should also be a good veteran addition.
And they lose a goalie with no real solid #1 on the horizon.
Wilcox was once a freshman that started the majority of the year and played well. Schierhorn has the chance to do the same. Leads the USHL in save percentage, saves, 2nd in wins, 5th in GAA, etc.

While you'd prefer to have a veteran guy start the year as the top guy, we've also seen quite a few first year goalies do well in college hockey (especially since they tend to come in as 19 or 20 year old players after ample junior hockey time). UMD's top goalie this year is an example. Stephon Williams was very good his freshman year at Mankato. Just a couple of examples off of the top of my head.

Statistically speaking... if you look at Wilcox's numbers this past season, they aren't terribly hard to replace. A .912 save percentage was something near 50th in the country. Not all that good. Yes, defense plays a role in that but everybody that watched him play this year could see he did not play nearly as well as the prior two seasons.
I think playing a defenseman at forward the last 2-3 years chalks off how lazy don is at recruiting.
Do you compare his travel schedule on recruiting with what Hakstol, Motzko, etc? How is this opinion being built? Anything factual?

Motzko has played guys that were recruited as a D man at forward in recent years too. Is he lazy?
Last edited by Gopher Blog on Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:48 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Post by Tigers33 » Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:34 pm

Does motzko play them as a defenseman their whole career or just one year?

I think they lost more "talent" that year but this year has to be the most bodies they've ever had to replace probably. As of now it's 8 and more then likely 9. It wouldn't surprise me if it went to 10. That's a lot.

I will agree bischoff improved but not sure I would say any of the D were very good defensively that is. Next year seeler, brodzinski, and bichoff will have to have big years. Like I said they might be better just because of a better locker room. Returning forwards that matter :)
Connor Reilly
Hudson fasching
Leon bristedt
Justin Kloos
Taylor cammarata
Vinny liettieri

That means 6 players need to step up. That's a lot!!

Lazy recruiting equals always going after the easy recruit. Letting them come to you rather then work to find the right ones. I credit condon, holl, and seratorre to a lot of the success this team had two years ago. All players that went out and worked hard every shift! Kind of like Matson the year before. They need more of these players. The right amount of grit with skill!!

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 03, 2015 6:47 pm

Tigers33 wrote:Does motzko play them as a defenseman their whole career or just one year?
I know he moved Ben Storm to forward. I don't know if that is going to be a full time thing or not. He shuffled Jarrod Rabey back and forth from D to forward when he was in college as well. So it's not like he has done anything different than Lucia.
Lazy recruiting equals always going after the easy recruit. Letting them come to you rather then work to find the right ones.
I am confused how you determine "easy". They almost always go after high end guys that all the big time programs compete for. That's not exactly a walk in the park. They usually win those battles but they lose too.

Heck, even the Hults kid (who isn't projected to be a big time scoring star) was offered by a number of schools (BU, OSU, UMD, Mankato, LSSU, Wisconsin, Northeastern, etc)

I definitely agree that the locker room cohesiveness was a big issue this year. If anything, it is likely to improve a lot in that regard next year because most of the worst offenders are going to be gone.

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Post by Lazy Scout » Sat Apr 04, 2015 5:50 pm

Gophers need to stop committing Freshman and Sophmores in high school. I've said it before and I will stand by it now, they will never win the big one with a young team. Don goes after the super skilled superstar as a sophmore, makes them leave their senior year early and then joins the team as a true freshman. A true freshman cannot compete against a 24 year old man in some cases. Look at Union last year, most of the team were 22-24 yr olds. North Dakota this year, they have quite a few 1990/91 birth years on their team.

Occasionally their may be a great high school player that Don can't wait on but overall his recruiting strategy stinks. Glover has been so overrated too. I don't care if he played Ann Arbor for one year. He was not ready to be a gopher this year. It will be very interesting to see what this team does next year. I don't see one player coming in next fall and making a huge difference as a freshman.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Sun Apr 05, 2015 10:43 pm

This year's incoming class has some very good players... as well as some older, more physically mature players that you seem to think they should pursue more.

I don't care who the coach at the U is, there will always be a percentage of fans that complain about how they do things. Especially when it comes to recruiting/roster decisions.

For instance, we still have a percentage of fans (albeit continually shrinking over time) that still whine about having non-MN kids on the team. Doesn't matter if the non-MN guy is a better player than a lot of MN kids, he still shouldn't be on the team in their mind. It is silly but it is a reality.

Some people get ticked if a kid like Mismash (a 16 year old that is two years away from college) picks UND rather the Gophers. Then we have people like Lazy Scout that think they should be much less active recruiting those elite young guys (btw, if you think UND isn't recruiting those same guys, you are kidding yourself). Like I said... damned if you do, damned if you don't.

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Post by Lazy Scout » Mon Apr 06, 2015 9:13 am

Yea but you see most of the UND players played a minimum of two years in the USHL/BCHL with some even playing three. Poganski is only one who played one year USHL. So they may recruit some younger players but they are not in a hurry to get there. A big difference between a 1996 birth year like Collins and Glover vs. a 1990 birth year of Poolman.

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Post by Lazy Scout » Mon Apr 06, 2015 9:16 am

I mean Gaarder, not Poolman :)

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Post by Gopher Blog » Mon Apr 06, 2015 10:05 am

Lazy Scout wrote:I mean Gaarder, not Poolman :)
Gaarder is a forward that has never scored above 20 pts. in any of his four years in college hockey. I am not saying he is a bad player but he's not exactly the kind of player that is leading the charge either.

I don't know that looking at any one season is great perspective on how teams are built, etc. It isn't going to be the same way every year. Some years you will look less experienced/younger than others. Just the reality of college sports

I find it tough to complain about how the Gopher are built with all the success they have had over the course of the last 4 seasons. League titles, Frozen Fours, etc. Not an NCAA champion but only one team is blessed with that title every year so that is a pretty tough way to judge success.

This year should have been better and more consistent than what it was. I won't argue that. But let's not be shortsighted either. Their formula for building a team has been pretty successful in recent times. Though I do think it is always wise to honestly assess things and tweak it when necessary

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Post by Tigers33 » Mon Apr 06, 2015 10:29 am

How many times have the gophers missed the NCAA since Lucia has been here?

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Post by Sats81 » Mon Apr 06, 2015 11:17 am

Gopher Blog wrote:
Lazy Scout wrote:I mean Gaarder, not Poolman :)
Gaarder is a forward that has never scored above 20 pts. in any of his four years in college hockey. I am not saying he is a bad player but he's not exactly the kind of player that is leading the charge either.

I don't know that looking at any one season is great perspective on how teams are built, etc. It isn't going to be the same way every year. Some years you will look less experienced/younger than others. Just the reality of college sports

I find it tough to complain about how the Gopher are built with all the success they have had over the course of the last 4 seasons. League titles, Frozen Fours, etc. Not an NCAA champion but only one team is blessed with that title every year so that is a pretty tough way to judge success.

This year should have been better and more consistent than what it was. I won't argue that. But let's not be shortsighted either. Their formula for building a team has been pretty successful in recent times. Though I do think it is always wise to honestly assess things and tweak it when necessary
Great role player though, with lots of experience and grit/toughness in his came that others tend to follow.

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Post by Sats81 » Mon Apr 06, 2015 11:18 am

Tigers33 wrote:How many times have the gophers missed the NCAA since Lucia has been here?
3 I believe?

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