Has the running time protocol outlived its usefulness...

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LSQRANK
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Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014 6:05 pm

Has the running time protocol outlived its usefulness...

Post by LSQRANK » Sat Jun 16, 2018 12:28 am

Has the running time protocol outlived its usefulness in today's socioeconomic environment of high school hockey?

Abstract

The use of running time protocol affected 18.3% of the hockey games played by the Girls Minnesota State High School League (MSHSL) and Wisconsin Interscholastic Athletic Association (WIAA) during the 2017-18 season. For the purposes of determining an accurate least squares rating profile of the teams in these two leagues, a correction term is derived and applied to the raw game score to account for this known systematic error caused by running time clock management. During the analysis of league game data, it was found that the net effect of running time protocol varied with the magnitude of the final game score differential, and the time distribution of when goals were scored during each individual hockey game, i.e. the rate of scoring prior to the start of running time. Overall, it was observed that in 51.3% of these games that reached running time, the final raw game score differential was completely unaffected by the protocol, while in the remaining 48.7% of these games, the mean magnitude of the correction term was 1.052 goals per game. Averaging over all running time games, the average score correction is approximately one-half of a goal. Recommendations are made with respect to the justification of continuing the usage of running time in lop-sided high school level contests compared to the incremental increase in cost to these sporting events caused by running time.

Link to paper:
https://www.researchgate.net/publicati ... ool_hockey

blueblood
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Joined: Fri May 26, 2006 8:36 am

Really

Post by blueblood » Sat Jun 16, 2018 12:24 pm

WTH? 🤪
Play Like a Champion Today

blondegirlsdad
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Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 12:30 am

Post by blondegirlsdad » Sat Jun 16, 2018 1:23 pm

Quote: "For the purposes of determining an accurate least squares rating profile of the teams in these two leagues"

Perhaps I'm not the brightest bulb in the scoreboard, but, ummmm.... Who cares?

The silly comparison of teams across states, divisions and grade levels is not only unnecessary, it's useless. Means nothing. Less than nothing, really.

I'd say, "enjoy the games." Your kid only plays so long.

LSQRANK
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Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014 6:05 pm

Post by LSQRANK » Sat Jun 16, 2018 10:12 pm

blondie .. just read the paper, then extrapolate to men's professional leagues, is that useful enough for you?

zooomx
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Post by zooomx » Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:08 am

Running time (in my opinion) is to lessen the length of time that players, coaches and crowd suffer during a lop sided game. There are so many silly things that can happen in a 7-0 game and we all know what they are. Shortening the game to help avoid these is a good thing. I don't think it was ever designed to affect the actual score, whether it actually does or not.

As far as the usefulness of scientific ratings of the teams? I only pay attention during section and state seeding. It is nice to have some data driven rankings to help the people who seed make an informed decision. I appreciate the efforts of LSQRANK, KRACH, etc.

LSQRANK
Posts: 415
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014 6:05 pm

Post by LSQRANK » Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:09 pm

zooomx wrote:Running time (in my opinion) is to lessen the length of time that players, coaches and crowd suffer during a lop sided game. There are so many silly things that can happen in a 7-0 game and we all know what they are. Shortening the game to help avoid these is a good thing. I don't think it was ever designed to affect the actual score, whether it actually does or not.
Zoomx, Although I have never been fond of running time, up until recently (prior to doing this study) I would have agreed with your point of view. But after reading a few papers and taking a developmental psychology class I think that these folks have a valid point that we are denying these teens the opportunity to act responsibly in the face of adversity. Here are two links to a couple papers that address this:

https://arttek.spb.ru/parenting/Childre ... or-Failure

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog ... -teasing-0


Summarizing:
Secondly, by invoking runtime protocol, one is denying these teenage players the full
opportunity and benefits of learning to constructively deal with a set of less than ideal conditions.
Running time protocol in some circles might be considered as a preventative mechanism to
minimize teasing by the leading team (Gray), but in reality this protocol is very detrimental to
the development of important social skills that can only be mastered by enduring and reconciling
one's actions and motivations in adverse situations, such as, in this case being on the
overwhelming short end of the stick (Berk). Studies performed by developmental psychologists
show that there is evidence to suggest that sports communities are being overly protective of our
teenagers which is causing them a large disservice in the long run (Williams). Lop-sided losses
in hockey games are opportunities to learn by, and not one to be avoided by minimizing the
event and even stigmatizing the situation with running time clock management.

zooomx
Posts: 463
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:34 pm

Post by zooomx » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:22 am

LSQRANK - with all due respect, how many skaters have these researchers parented, and watched grow from a Mite to a high school player? We have a son who just graduated and a daughter who is close. We have fortunately been on the winning side of blowouts way more often than the losing side.

I have never felt that running time was denying my skater of a learning lesson. The lesson is pretty much the same whether you lose 12-0 in running time, or 13-0 in stop time. When a game is that mismatched, it is just not a good athletic experience for anyone involved. It sucks for the losing team, and honestly, it sucks more for the winning team. Things get sloppy, and if your next game is against a quality opponent? Look out.

There are plenty of opportunities for skaters to act responsibly in the face of adversity. In fact, in a running time game they still have that opportunity.

Your link to over protective parents... yes, there is a huge parent problem in youth sports. This has nothing to do with running time, as I just don't think it was over protective parenting that instituted this rule.

In the end, I think a poll would show that the vast majority of everyone involved is fine with running time. I get that it messes up the stats, but as much as I am a stat head, I would hate to see this rule changed.

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