covid and MH

[green4]

Green what are you up to nowadays ? Obviously a long ways removed from your Braemar Zam days?

For work, I help in the construction of wind and solar farms doing various tasks. I have a role that is 50% in the Twin Cities where I work in GIS and then the other 50% is on the road. It is pretty nice, I like getting to travel and seeing the country. I got to watch the state tournament last March in a park along the river in Austin, Texas. I don't get to play hockey as much anymore, but I will be in Arizona from Thanksgiving to Christmas, so I would say that is a pretty decent trade.

[jg2112]

Guessing Jan 1 is comeback date, after 2 major holidays. Walz slipped and said 4 weeks... my guess.

January 1 would be 5 1/2 weeks if he started the "pause" on 11/23. I surely hope it won't be that long, but it might have to be.

No good answers here. Thanksgiving, Hanukkah, Christmas and Kwanzaa all coming in the next 45 days, along with college kids returning home from campus. This isn't going to be easy.

[BSUBeaver]

I think what everyone is missing it the fact that, especially here, we cannot keep enough teachers in the classrooms to have school. Whether close contact from a student, or close contact from a family member, they have to quarantine for 14 days. Retired teachers that used to substitute, don't want to step into the classrooms right now.

The same thing is happening on the ice, we have not had a full compliment of coaches since the season started, due to having to quarantine. We are running into the same issues with officials.

Following all the complaining online/social media and talking to my kids, I think the adults are having a harder time with it than the kids. The ones I see b****ing the most about the pause coming are the same ones b****ing the most about the "Stay Safe" recommendations. Well, guess what, you can't have it both ways.

[Duluthguy]

Twitter and other sources are flying with details of tonight's announcement by the Governor. Since the pandemic started, info like this seems to have been leaked and has generally been proven to be true. Blois Olson's blog is saying what most are, in short:

"At 6PM tonight, in a statewide address Gov. Tim Walz will announce a new series of COVID-19 restrictions on restaurants, gyms and most likely youth sports. The executive orders are a four week pause. They go into effect at 12 midnight Friday evening.

Restaurants, breweries, bowling alleys, movie theaters and bars service will be take-out only.

Gyms will close.

Organized indoor youth sports, a pause beginning Saturday.

Outdoor sports and recreation are not going to be impacted."

So....do some high school teams try to play outside when it's cold enough? In Duluth, mites and squirts spend a lot of their time outside....will that spread to peewees and bantams?

[jg2112]

I put the odds at 1-10 that crazy soccer parents are going to call around to local high schools and beg them to clear their fields, so their kids' winter league can proceed as scheduled.

[blueblood]

Duluthguy:

Thanks for the note. You used the term "youth" sports. Does youth include HS?

[Eagles93]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

[OldManRiver]

Eagles93 article matches what Tom Hauser is saying:

Tom Hauser @thauserkstp
3h

DEVELOPING: The new restrictions Gov. Walz will formally announce tonight will go into effect at midnight Friday. In addition to closing bars, restaurants, health clubs and youth sports...hockey arenas, movie theaters, bowling alleys and other "entertainment" venues also close.

Tom Hauser @thauserkstp
3h

They will be shutdown for four weeks, but I'm told that can be extended depending on the COVID situation. The hockey arena closures will only impact youth and high school hockey. College and pro hockey arenas not impacted.

I'm not sure what that means for a facility like St. Louis Park or Coon Rapids with refrigerated outdoor sheets - if they would close as part of "arena closures" or not. Perhaps similar to closing parks last spring?

[Stang5280]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

I wonder if the NAHL teams will work with colleges to buy ice time, since their season would also come to a halt. I would have to think that most colleges would be receptive to the idea, being that it is such an important development pipeline for them.

[BSUBeaver]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

I wonder if the NAHL teams will work with colleges to buy ice time, since their season would also come to a halt. I would have to think that most colleges would be receptive to the idea, being that it is such an important development pipeline for them.

What about places like Bemidji's Sanford Center, Mankato's Mayo Health Center and Duluth's Amsoil Arena, since they are publicly run and not owned by the college? It seems like a double standard if you are going to close down city run facilities like the RCC here in Alexandria, but then allow these facilities to operate.

[7TIMECHAMPS]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

If this is true WHAT A JOKE. Anybody want to explain the "science" behind Walz's decision to treat pro and college athletics differently? I have a feeling that an economist might be able to explain it better than a scientist. NFL, college sports, etc have proven they are not immune.

[HockeyStorm]

A true double standard, which our governor doesn't seem to care about. See big box stores vs. everything else shut down; hopefully most cities/associations have the resources available to move things outside as soon as the weather allows.

[Puckguy19]

Duluthguy:

Thanks for the note. You used the term "youth" sports. Does youth include HS?

Yes, the demarcation appears to be between Pro/College and "youth sports."

[Duluthguy]

Duluthguy:

Thanks for the note. You used the term "youth" sports. Does youth include HS?

Blueblood: Thanks for the question. Good catch. I simply cut and pasted the info from the Blois Olson blog. But as others have since pointed out, this change is intended to include high schools. I should have clarified.

[jg2112]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

If this is true WHAT A JOKE. Anybody want to explain the "science" behind Walz's decision to treat pro and college athletics differently? I have a feeling that an economist might be able to explain it better than a scientist. NFL, college sports, etc have proven they are not immune.

Could it be that the colleges and pros have television contracts funding their programs and access to instant or rapid testing?

[Duluthguy]

Eagles93 article matches what Tom Hauser is saying:

Tom Hauser @thauserkstp
3h

DEVELOPING: The new restrictions Gov. Walz will formally announce tonight will go into effect at midnight Friday. In addition to closing bars, restaurants, health clubs and youth sports...hockey arenas, movie theaters, bowling alleys and other "entertainment" venues also close.

Tom Hauser @thauserkstp
3h

They will be shutdown for four weeks, but I'm told that can be extended depending on the COVID situation. The hockey arena closures will only impact youth and high school hockey. College and pro hockey arenas not impacted.

I'm not sure what that means for a facility like St. Louis Park or Coon Rapids with refrigerated outdoor sheets - if they would close as part of "arena closures" or not. Perhaps similar to closing parks last spring?

At work, I happen to be looking at a State of Minnesota document regarding COVID-related requirements. It has a section on "indoor venues" that defines them in part as: "any area, building, structure, or other enclosure that is enclosed on at least two sides by walls, barriers, or partitions, whether temporary or permanent, and are also covered at least 50% by a ceiling, cap, canopy, or other similar means...."

When the Governor has made these pronouncements, highly detailed guidance documents are issued at the same time--the one I'm looking at is 26 pages. I'd expect similar guidance docs tonight, that may or may not use the same definition. But, if this language is any hint on a potential definition of "outdoor" activities, I'd guess "outdoor refrigerated" sheets such as at Edina and Grand Rapids (I haven't seen those at SLP or Coon Rapids) would be considered "outdoor" because they don't have two walls.

It's also crossed my mind that by "outdoor activities" the state might be thinking more of cross-country or downhill skiing--more individual sports with minimal contact. I hope I'm wrong.

We'll know more tonight.

[Stang5280]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

If this is true WHAT A JOKE. Anybody want to explain the "science" behind Walz's decision to treat pro and college athletics differently? I have a feeling that an economist might be able to explain it better than a scientist. NFL, college sports, etc have proven they are not immune.

Could it be that the colleges and pros have television contracts funding their programs and access to instant or rapid testing?

And basically able to “bubble” their players. Even during regular circumstances, college athletes do much of their coursework remotely these days. Pro athletes are adults with huge financial incentives to remain safe and keep playing. Yes, there have been outbreaks among college and pro athletic teams, but for the most part things have gone surprisingly smoothly, and the testing protocols have worked with regard to not spreading COVID to other teams.

[jg2112]

If this is true WHAT A JOKE. Anybody want to explain the "science" behind Walz's decision to treat pro and college athletics differently? I have a feeling that an economist might be able to explain it better than a scientist. NFL, college sports, etc have proven they are not immune.

Could it be that the colleges and pros have television contracts funding their programs and access to instant or rapid testing?

And basically able to “bubble” their players. Even during regular circumstances, college athletes do much of their coursework remotely these days. Pro athletes are adults with huge financial incentives to remain safe and keep playing. Yes, there have been outbreaks among college and pro athletic teams, but for the most part things have gone surprisingly smoothly, and the testing protocols have worked with regard to not spreading COVID to other teams.

Yes indeed. I recall when my skater was given a tour of Ralph Engelstad Arena in 2016, the tour guide (a UND player) seemed happy he never needed to leave the arena. He took all his classes online in the player lounge.

[Wise Old Man]

A true double standard, which our governor doesn't seem to care about. See big box stores vs. everything else shut down; hopefully most cities/associations have the resources available to move things outside as soon as the weather allows.

Storm..."big box stores" are considered essential businesses. Target/Walmart have pharmacies and sell groceries which are obviously necessities. Menards, Home Depot, and even local hardware stores are essential as well. What are you supposed to do if you have a plumbing or significant electrical issue? Go to Walgreens or CVS?

[Wise Old Man]

https://kstp.com/coronavirus/minnesota- ... s/5928102/

According to this article:
That means hockey arenas will be ordered closed, with exceptions for pro and college facilities.

If true, this removes any doubt that kids will not be playing (other than outdoors), whether under MN Hockey, MSHSL, or other bridge or AAA programs.

If this is true WHAT A JOKE. Anybody want to explain the "science" behind Walz's decision to treat pro and college athletics differently? I have a feeling that an economist might be able to explain it better than a scientist. NFL, college sports, etc have proven they are not immune.

Could it be that the colleges and pros have television contracts funding their programs and access to instant or rapid testing?

This... It's the same in Michigan. Any pro and college program that can meet required state/NCAA testing requirements is allowed to continue. The arenas that host NCAA teams will be allowed to stay open for those teams' activities, but not for youth or high school. If MH or the MSHSL could mandate weekly testing, they could probably keep playing. They can't so they aren't able to.

The cost side of testing is what will likely prevent all of DIII hockey to ultimately cancel as well.

Edit... meant to say it will force all of DIII to cancel

[7TIMECHAMPS]

If this is true WHAT A JOKE. Anybody want to explain the "science" behind Walz's decision to treat pro and college athletics differently? I have a feeling that an economist might be able to explain it better than a scientist. NFL, college sports, etc have proven they are not immune.

Could it be that the colleges and pros have television contracts funding their programs and access to instant or rapid testing?

And basically able to “bubble” their players. Even during regular circumstances, college athletes do much of their coursework remotely these days. Pro athletes are adults with huge financial incentives to remain safe and keep playing. Yes, there have been outbreaks among college and pro athletic teams, but for the most part things have gone surprisingly smoothly, and the testing protocols have worked with regard to not spreading COVID to other teams.

Sorry but I just don't believe that these 18-22 year olds are basically quarantining themselves. I don't know the actual numbers on this but I would venture to say that a similar share of high school kids are distance learning as college kids. And I would say those kids are easier to keep under wraps than 18-22 year olds. In college football is it something like 15%-20% of games recently have been postponed or canceled? Including 4 of 11 in the SEC this week? The testing thing sounds good in theory but is it actually working? How do those 46 outbreaks that was quoted in MN hockey as a percentage of total teams and contests compare to college football's? I don't know all the answers to this but the person making the distinction probably should. I would like to see the data behind the rationale. It must be a rather pronounced difference.

[BodyShots]

Be prepared for increased cases when the shutdown occurs due to kids maintaining a social life. MSHSL will regret this decision. Maybe not this year. But when their Bread and Butter money maker Hockey State Tournament is bye-bye, schools will be faced with increased fees which will lead to further moves by private firms to form leagues/associations with many sports.

Blueblood... my only push back on your point regarding kids will “maintain a social life”.... As a parent, if I say to my kids they can’t socialize with their friends outside the house due to wanting to minimize the opportunity for spread during a once in a hundred year pandemic, then they don’t leave the house. Period. Does that cause more conflict/frustration between me and my kids? You bet it does. But, that’s why parenting is one of the toughest jobs in the world. Sometimes you just have to be the ***hole. I often say that if my kids aren’t telling me they hate me at least once a month, then I’m not doing my job as a parent properly.

LMAO

My wife says the same thing. When our kids were young, she was known as the meanest mom in the world. The kids and wife laugh about it now!

[Stang5280]

Could it be that the colleges and pros have television contracts funding their programs and access to instant or rapid testing?

And basically able to “bubble” their players. Even during regular circumstances, college athletes do much of their coursework remotely these days. Pro athletes are adults with huge financial incentives to remain safe and keep playing. Yes, there have been outbreaks among college and pro athletic teams, but for the most part things have gone surprisingly smoothly, and the testing protocols have worked with regard to not spreading COVID to other teams.

Sorry but I just don't believe that these 18-22 year olds are basically quarantining themselves. I don't know the actual numbers on this but I would venture to say that a similar share of high school kids are distance learning as college kids. And I would say those kids are easier to keep under wraps than 18-22 year olds. In college football is it something like 15%-20% of games recently have been postponed or canceled? Including 4 of 11 in the SEC this week? The testing thing sounds good in theory but is it actually working? How do those 46 outbreaks that was quoted in MN hockey as a percentage of total teams and contests compare to college football's? I don't know all the answers to this but the person making the distinction probably should. I would like to see the data behind the rationale. It must be a rather pronounced difference.

The point of the testing protocols isn’t so much to prevent outbreaks from occurring within teams as it is to prevent those outbreaks from spreading further. You isolate and quarantine teams that have positive tests, and shut down activities for 14 days or until there are repeated negative tests.No, it isn’t perfect, but it is much better than relying on kids to come up symptomatic and then testing. Not that we want anyone coming down with Covid, but the cancellations should be viewed as a good thing in certain respects.

[Wise Old Man]

7Times...I'm not stating that the college kids are making any better decisions than the high school kids. You're exactly right. There's a DI team in our state that in the last two weeks had 12-15 kids positive. The difference is, they are tested literally three times every week. So, we know when they are infected and can quarantine them asap. That's obviously not the case at the youth and high school level. MH and the MSHSL can't force parents to test their kids or, make them pay for it. That's the difference as to why one needs to pause and the other doesn't. It's all about testing and contact tracing...

[MWS coach]

A total shutdown seems absurd to me.
Why not dial back to only skating with kids in your own community in pods, similar to when hockey opened back up? No games but limited contact and exposure going back to phase 1. Try this first instead of a complete shutdown.
What does the statistic as quoted by MN Hockey really mean 46 outbreaks? 46 teams with multiple players actually testing positive, or quarantine as a result of close contact? While I have not actual facts other then what I have observed and spoken to others, but very minimal players actually testing positive, more quarantine as a result of close contact with parent who tested positive. OMGHA as an association itself has 41 teams (not including mites), as such if 46 teams with either positive tests or quarantine, a very low percentage. Any data that confirms the outbreak was due to hockey?