Warroad

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newsguy35
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Post by newsguy35 » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:15 pm

packerboy wrote:Oooooh, poor witto Roseau and ooooh, poor witto Warroad.

What does enrollment size have to do with success in hockey?

You can say they are playing where their enrollment says they should but because the correlation between enrollment size and success is tenative at best, you have said nothing. Did Burnsville win it last year?

How do you even measure success at Class A when all of the truely respected programs that are "A size" opt up.

When you win the Class A trophy, what have you won? Nothing but a year end tournament involving some nondescript group of teams based loosely on enrollment sort of that was formed because of politics.

If you want to have Class A fine, have it, but dont claim that your success in it makes you a respected program. A lot of people would take issue with that.

Respect come froms taking on the best. Not ducking into some little politically manufactured competitive level known as Class A and and then claiming to be just as good as AA.
I see your points and agree with some of what you have written. Some teams, however, do not have the depth of players due to lack of enrollment. I am not giving Warroad, or any other team for that matter, an excuse to play in A. I am, however, explaining a valid point. If a team only has 3 lines and 2 sets of D due to less than spectacular numbers it would be tough to play a full AA schedule as well as a section playoff. Injuries also would deplete these teams where as a bigger school/co-op would be alright because they would have someone to put in that void.

Also, there are many nights where you see A teams beating AA teams. Not always is it a great AA school getting beat, but you still see it happen on occasion.

Undercover Hockey Lover
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Post by Undercover Hockey Lover » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:19 pm

Geez, that came out of left field. Are you sure your in the right topic or did that three martini lunch do more than you thought it did.

Oops..that's right someone mentioned SSP in a thread.

packerboy
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Post by packerboy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:23 pm

But newsguy, if they dont have the depth or whatever, the result should be that they dont win. Not, "oh we will manufacture it so that you do".

Isnt that what athletics is all about?

Shouldnt that be the message?

As far as A teams beating AA teams, thats meaningless unless it happens after Ash Wednesday.

If it does mean something, whose point does that prove? Why the heck do we have a Class A if all these teams can beat the AA teams.

Its nonsense.

carpenterguy
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Post by carpenterguy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:55 pm

Undercover Hockey Lover wrote:Wow. Three post in a row....in under 10 minutes...I don't even need bait....I'd call that jumping in the boat. :lol:

The post you point to is called chumming...dummy. :P
Just another empty post! :lol:

carpenterguy
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Post by carpenterguy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:56 pm

packerboy wrote:But newsguy, if they dont have the depth or whatever, the result should be that they dont win. Not, "oh we will manufacture it so that you do".

Isnt that what athletics is all about?

Shouldnt that be the message?

As far as A teams beating AA teams, thats meaningless unless it happens after Ash Wednesday.

If it does mean something, whose point does that prove? Why the heck do we have a Class A if all these teams can beat the AA teams.

Its nonsense.
I agree 100% packerboy! We have become a society of trying to make too many feel good! Kids get medals and trophies for losing every game in a tourney.

carpenterguy
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Post by carpenterguy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 1:58 pm

Undercover Hockey Lover wrote:Wow. Three post in a row....in under 10 minutes...I don't even need bait....I'd call that jumping in the boat. :lol:

The post you point to is called chumming...dummy. :P
His teeth are brighter than he is.[/b]

AngusYoung
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Post by AngusYoung » Fri Oct 19, 2007 2:02 pm

packerboy wrote:But newsguy, if they dont have the depth or whatever, the result should be that they dont win. Not, "oh we will manufacture it so that you do".

Isnt that what athletics is all about?

Shouldnt that be the message?

As far as A teams beating AA teams, thats meaningless unless it happens after Ash Wednesday.

If it does mean something, whose point does that prove? Why the heck do we have a Class A if all these teams can beat the AA teams.

Its nonsense.
PB - Would your line of reasoning then extend to the college ranks? Why have D1, D2, or D3 athletics - shouldn't they all be D1 and fight it out from that level?

CG - I Falls is a has been in the overall scheme of high school hockey. Better than a never was, but still a has been. Further, they are a never will be again, also.

AY 8)

carpenterguy
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Post by carpenterguy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 2:08 pm

AngusYoung wrote:
packerboy wrote:But newsguy, if they dont have the depth or whatever, the result should be that they dont win. Not, "oh we will manufacture it so that you do".

Isnt that what athletics is all about?

Shouldnt that be the message?

As far as A teams beating AA teams, thats meaningless unless it happens after Ash Wednesday.

If it does mean something, whose point does that prove? Why the heck do we have a Class A if all these teams can beat the AA teams.

Its nonsense.
PB - Would your line of reasoning then extend to the college ranks? Why have D1, D2, or D3 athletics - shouldn't they all be D1 and fight it out from that level?

CG - I Falls is a has been in the overall scheme of high school hockey. Better than a never was, but still a has been. Further, they are a never will be again, also.

Thank you Nostrodamis!

packerboy
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Post by packerboy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 2:28 pm

AY, I dont have any problem with following the NCAA "model" .

But your Class A pals would have a fit if their tournammet was relocated to St Cloud and not on TV.

They want to pretend like its all the same.

carpenterguy
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Post by carpenterguy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 2:30 pm

packerboy wrote:AY, I dont have any problem with following the NCAA "model" .

But your Class A pals would have a fit if their tournammet was relocated to St Cloud and not on TV.

They want to pretend like its all the same.
The key word is pretend! :wink: [/b]

SB24
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Post by SB24 » Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:45 pm

I've asked this question many times on this board and never really gotten an answer. To solve the situation that PB has described here about the Class A title meaning nothing (whether true or not), why not make schools play in whatever class their enrollment puts them into? This would make both tournaments quite equal in quality, would fill the X for all games instead of just the AA games, so it would make the league more money as well. yeah its great now that the teams that want to opt up have that ability, but if the classes were enforced there would be no reason to opt up, both classes would be very competitive.
RIP suzy 12.10.2006 - 2.27.2008

carpenterguy
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Post by carpenterguy » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:04 pm

SB24 wrote:I've asked this question many times on this board and never really gotten an answer. To solve the situation that PB has described here about the Class A title meaning nothing (whether true or not), why not make schools play in whatever class their enrollment puts them into? This would make both tournaments quite equal in quality, would fill the X for all games instead of just the AA games, so it would make the league more money as well. yeah its great now that the teams that want to opt up have that ability, but if the classes were enforced there would be no reason to opt up, both classes would be very competitive.
That would be better, but I would still prefer one tourney even with the possibility of 16 teams.

watchdog
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the answer

Post by watchdog » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:06 pm

SB24 i think i have one answer of many. TRADITION

ACTUALFORMERPLAYER
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Post by ACTUALFORMERPLAYER » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:12 pm

SB24 wrote:I've asked this question many times on this board and never really gotten an answer. To solve the situation that PB has described here about the Class A title meaning nothing (whether true or not), why not make schools play in whatever class their enrollment puts them into? This would make both tournaments quite equal in quality, would fill the X for all games instead of just the AA games, so it would make the league more money as well. yeah its great now that the teams that want to opt up have that ability, but if the classes were enforced there would be no reason to opt up, both classes would be very competitive.
The reasons to opt up are the desire to be the best, tradition, and the experience of the AA tourney. The NCAA allows schools to opt up to any level they chose. Schools should play where they want and then know there place. AA is better than A period. The class A title does not mean nothing. The players have the right to call themselves state champs the rest of their lives. The class title does not however give their fans and dads the footing to say they could beat the AA champs.

grindiangrad-80
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Post by grindiangrad-80 » Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:31 am

If you were asked to name the best players in Minnesota history:

I believe the vast majority would come from the smallest towns.

Then again, what do I know.

packerboy
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Post by packerboy » Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:15 pm

Class A would not exist if there was not an opt up provision. The coaches would have never voted for it.

It would really screw up the State Tournament if you took out the opt up. Think of the field in both tournaments. Ugly games.

newsguy35
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Post by newsguy35 » Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:51 pm

ACTUALFORMERPLAYER wrote:
SB24 wrote:I've asked this question many times on this board and never really gotten an answer. To solve the situation that PB has described here about the Class A title meaning nothing (whether true or not), why not make schools play in whatever class their enrollment puts them into? This would make both tournaments quite equal in quality, would fill the X for all games instead of just the AA games, so it would make the league more money as well. yeah its great now that the teams that want to opt up have that ability, but if the classes were enforced there would be no reason to opt up, both classes would be very competitive.
The reasons to opt up are the desire to be the best, tradition, and the experience of the AA tourney. The NCAA allows schools to opt up to any level they chose. Schools should play where they want and then know there place. AA is better than A period. The class A title does not mean nothing. The players have the right to call themselves state champs the rest of their lives. The class title does not however give their fans and dads the footing to say they could beat the AA champs.
PB- I agree, I never said that there should be 2 divisions. I was just giving a reason for that belief...

I do think that the 2 champs from the A and AA should play the next day. That would be a high quality game and I am sure a record attendance would be near...

packerboy
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Post by packerboy » Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:10 pm

That would be great.

We could have big school vs small school.

Except last year the smaller school was the Clas AA champ.

Clusterfluke.

ACTUALFORMERPLAYER
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Post by ACTUALFORMERPLAYER » Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:14 pm

Why should the class a champ get a free pass to play the AA CHAMP? The hardest part of winning the AA title is putting a run together at the right time. If people want to see how their team stacks up against the best they have an option; OPT UP.

Govs93
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Post by Govs93 » Tue Oct 23, 2007 10:44 am

Completely unrelated to anything, but suppose "one" were to travel north from the Cities to see the Warroad/Roseau game. How does "one" ensure that "one" would be able to get tickets to the game, because if "one" were to drive 7 hours in January and not get a ticket, "one" would be awfully irritated.

Can "one" buy them online or call a school or arena to have tickets held?

Irishmans Shanty
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Post by Irishmans Shanty » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:03 am

1991-92 was a good year for Sporting events in Minnesota as all of the following took place in the Mpls. vicinity.

The Stanley Cup finals
The Superbowl
The World Series
The US Open
The Final Four

I seem to remember of a guy who saw the superbowl, the final four, and game #6 of the Stanely Cup finals without a ticket.

All venues have breaches, as for the War/Ros game, try the Zamboni door.

Govs93
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Post by Govs93 » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:10 am

Irishmans Shanty wrote:All venues have breaches, as for the War/Ros game, try the Zamboni door.
Here we go again... the assumption that just because I'm an Eastsider, I should illegally gain access to a sporting event (or somebody's car, garage or home). Will the stereotyping never cease?!?!





That's actually a very good plan... thanks for the idea!

Can't Never Tried
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Post by Can't Never Tried » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:35 am

Govs93 wrote:
Irishmans Shanty wrote:All venues have breaches, as for the War/Ros game, try the Zamboni door.
Here we go again... the assumption that just because I'm an Eastsider, I should illegally gain access to a sporting event (or somebody's car, garage or home). Will the stereotyping never cease?!?!





That's actually a very good plan... thanks for the idea!
Govs Proper dress should allow for easy undetected excess. :lol:
Image

Govs93
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Post by Govs93 » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:43 am

Can't Never Tried wrote:
Govs93 wrote:
Irishmans Shanty wrote:All venues have breaches, as for the War/Ros game, try the Zamboni door.
Here we go again... the assumption that just because I'm an Eastsider, I should illegally gain access to a sporting event (or somebody's car, garage or home). Will the stereotyping never cease?!?!





That's actually a very good plan... thanks for the idea!
Govs Proper dress should allow for easy undetected excess. :lol:
Image
Ah! While I appreciate the tip, it should be noted that Max Goldman (pictured above) is technically an Eastsider as well. While the film was supposedly set in Wabasha, Max's & John Gustafson's homes were actually on Hyacinth Ave. on St. Paul's East Side!

I'll look like one of those fancy city slickers if I go to Roseau dressed like that, and they'll nab me for sure!

Neutron 14
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Post by Neutron 14 » Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:47 am

Govs93 wrote: I'll look like one of those fancy city slickers if I go to Roseau dressed like that, and they'll nab me for sure!
What'll give you away is trying to order one of those "femmy" beers you like to drink. :lol:

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