Future Minnesota recruits

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observer
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Post by observer » Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:32 am

Is Horn considered to be further ahead in his development than Kloos?
Exactly. I need to get into this scouting/recruiting game.

How many rank Horn ahead of Kloos?

How many rank Michaelson ahead of Kloos?

And, Bo is right. How many rank Horn ahead of Besse?

Gopher Blog
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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:55 pm

MNHockeyFan wrote:Is Horn considered to be further ahead in his development than Kloos? I was wondering why they are not asking him to play juniors for a year?
It's more about what does next year's team need

Horn can step into those lower line roles, play physical, and do some of the things you need from guys on those lines. It remains to be seen how the depth chart will work out and maybe he doesn't see a ton of ice next season. But if you are looking for a guy that is maybe a little more adept at playing a 3rd or 4th line role, I think Horn is the better fit for next season. Kloos is better suited for roles that the team already has covered. More offensive minded roles (top lines, PP units, etc). Not to mention, Horn has more size and better strength to handle the transition a little better next season.

May as well let a talented kid like Kloos mature a year in the USHL if you can. He'll come in if Bjugstad leaves this summer but I think it is a smart long term move to have him in the USHL for a season. It certainly didn't hurt Jack Connolly to make such a move after HS as an undersized forward.

Gopher Blog
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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:03 pm

observer wrote:How many rank Horn ahead of Kloos?
You aren't putting together an all star team for one game where nobody cares about anything but pretty passing plays. You have to blend a variety of players together to win trophies and some players fit a specific role better than others. Do you think Herb Brooks just looked at offensive ability when he put together his teams like the 80 Olympic team? Hardly. He blended players together based on the attributes his team needed.

Obviously Kloos is the more offensively skilled kid of the two (not that Horn is a slouch). But that's not a role that next year's Gophers are concerned about when you realize that (if Bjugstad returns), they only lose one player (Hansen) off of their top 2 lines from this past season. Not to mention the reality that some of the freshman from this past year will get better.

Horn is a bigger, stronger kid that fits a potential lower line role more effectively than Kloos would. Not to mention, I personally wouldn't want them to spend a year of Justin's eligibility putting him in a non-scoring role. That'd seem like a waste. Give him a year to add some strength and experience and he should be a very good college player for all four years.

observer
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Post by observer » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:16 pm

Can you say Joey Miller.

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Post by Gopher Blog » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:02 pm

We'll see how it goes. I think he is a nice late addition to a deep team next season. The main scoring roles are pretty well covered for the coming seasons so he's in a good spot to contribute in situations that play to his strengths.

I'm happy for the kid. Good athlete and a quality kid.
Last edited by Gopher Blog on Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BodyShots
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Post by BodyShots » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:30 pm

observer wrote:Can you say Joey Miller.
I was thinking more of a replacement for Larsen.

MrBoDangles
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Post by MrBoDangles » Sun Apr 22, 2012 1:45 am

observer wrote:
Is Horn considered to be further ahead in his development than Kloos?
Exactly. I need to get into this scouting/recruiting game.

How many rank Horn ahead of Kloos?

How many rank Michaelson ahead of Kloos?

And, Bo is right. How many rank Horn ahead of Besse?
We would need to figure out the exact number of Gopher fans.... :wink:

Sats81
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Post by Sats81 » Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:25 pm

Regardless whether Kloos comes straight in to the U next fall or ends up playing at Waterloo, he should have a very nice 4 year career at the U. I think playing in Waterloo does nothing but help his game and help his ability to contribute. He played very well in the USHL last spring and by the sounds of it played excellent the one game he did play for them this spring. Like Gopherblog said, you would hate to waste a year of his eligibility with his scoring ability on the 3rd or 4th line. I think he offers more potential upside than Michaelson or Horn do and the U realizes that.

Either way, best of luck to all of them

Tigers33
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Post by Tigers33 » Mon Apr 23, 2012 8:50 pm

According to BoDangles Kloos on the third or fourth line would be a recipe for success.

BoDangles would have d pairings like this...
Mike Reilly and Ben Marshall
Aaron Ness and Cade Fairchild
Justin Holl and Nate Schmitt

Throw all 5 guys in the offensive zone and hope your goaltender can save 2-0's all night long.

First line would be Barriball - Schroeder - Rau
Second line would be Cammarta - Warning - Haula
Third line Condon - Kloos - Boyd

Good consistency with all offensive players.

I think Kloos coming in the following year just strengthens that class, with the departures of Haula, Budish, and Bjugstad.

MrBoDangles
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Post by MrBoDangles » Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:18 am

Tigers33 wrote:According to BoDangles Kloos on the third or fourth line would be a recipe for success.

BoDangles would have d pairings like this...
Mike Reilly and Ben Marshall
Aaron Ness and Cade Fairchild
Justin Holl and Nate Schmitt

Throw all 5 guys in the offensive zone and hope your goaltender can save 2-0's all night long.

First line would be Barriball - Schroeder - Rau
Second line would be Cammarta - Warning - Haula
Third line Condon - Kloos - Boyd

Good consistency with all offensive players.

I think Kloos coming in the following year just strengthens that class, with the departures of Haula, Budish, and Bjugstad.
I would bring Kloos in for next year..... Rau and Kloos' scoring touch and a nice mix of big talented forwards could give them the extra scoring touch they need. Need to put the puck in the net too.

Now's their chance..

Tigers33
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Post by Tigers33 » Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:45 am

Pure freshman scoring is difficult to come by in college hockey. As good of a year as Rau had, most of his goals were slam dunks from the crease. I think this is something the Gophers need to do more, let their talented forwards play a year in the juniors after high school. I agree next year could set up for high expectations, and that would mean "now is the time." If it was me I would set the top two lines up something like this.

Budish - Bjugstad - Rau
Warning - Haula - Condon

So, Kloos would be a 3rd or 4th liner at best. Boyd, Ambrosz, and Michaelson could make up the 3rd line. Is Kloos ready in to step into that role? I dont know. He looked like a pure goal scorer the times I wateched him.

FYI - Chris Student choosing to transfer. That leaves the Gophers with 9 defenseman.

auld_skool
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Post by auld_skool » Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:34 am

observer wrote:
Is Horn considered to be further ahead in his development than Kloos?
Exactly. I need to get into this scouting/recruiting game.

How many rank Horn ahead of Kloos?

How many rank Michaelson ahead of Kloos?

And, Bo is right. How many rank Horn ahead of Besse?
I got to see Horn a lot last fall in the elite league. Here's why you'd consider taking him right out of HS: He has a great attitude and a fantastic work ethic. He makes everyone on his line a better player. Congrats to him and good luck as well!

auld_skool
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Post by auld_skool » Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:38 am

Tigers33 wrote: I think this is something the Gophers need to do more, let their talented forwards play a year in the juniors after high school.
To me it comes down to this: Would you rather have Rau (or Kloos, or Horn, or whomever) from 18 to 22 yrs old or 21 to 25 yrs old? They're all great players...will they get better as they get older?

xy
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Post by xy » Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:08 pm

auld_skool wrote:To me it comes down to this: Would you rather have Rau (or Kloos, or Horn, or whomever) from 18 to 22 yrs old or 21 to 25 yrs old?
Excluding all other considerations you'd obviously want older players - I believe the general scientific consensus is that humans are at their peak in physical ability at age 27 - but there are other factors at play. If a player has any realistic chance to make a living at the game, he's almost certainly not going to be in college at 25. It's too early to tell for the three players you named, but it's at least possible. Pro teams know that players are depreciating assets, so to speak, with a limited potential career span, and won't look fondly on players spending that many of their viable playing years in college. I know we talk about the growing emphasis on smaller, four-year players who aren't top pro prospects, but you don't always know which ones those will be, and if you have a player in juniors for a few years and he really blossoms you're certainly not going to have him in college for four years.

And also, there are things in life besides hockey, and there's an argument that 25-year-olds should be moving on with their lives. Kids will vary - some will never want to leave college; some will feel they're falling behind their peers who've graduated and gotten jobs - but I don't think they'll all want to stay in school that long. And if 25-year-old athletes were common, instead of the exception as they are now, I think a lot of university administrators would wonder whether it really fit in with what college athletics are supposed to be about.

auld_skool
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Post by auld_skool » Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:58 am

xy wrote:And if 25-year-old athletes were common, instead of the exception as they are now, I think a lot of university administrators would wonder whether it really fit in with what college athletics are supposed to be about.
Very thoughtful response, I appreciate what you're saying. I could be way off, but I think hockey is somewhat unique in that you could see a game in which every freshman on the ice is 19 or 20 years old. Being that hockey is now and in the foreseeable future driven by how things are done in Canada, I guess that's what it is.

To your larger point, I think losing athletes to the pros makes recruiting a real mine field. Hats off to the schools that can do it well year after year.

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