Schwan Cup

LASERBLUE135 · Post by **LASERBLUE135** » Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:12 pm

[quote="Stang5280[/quote]
Talk about no respect for the WIAA. The two Wisconsin teams should absolutely rip through their respective brackets.[/quote]

I mean no disrespect to Hudson. I see them becoming an absolute dominant player in WI hockey for years to come (mostly because of the growing population and MN hockey influence), but the rest of the entire state is not up to par with the vast majority of MN schools. I remember a few years back when there was a WI team steamrolling everyone and was undefeated #1. They were beaten badly in a New Ulm holiday tournament. Things haven't changed that much over the last few years.

Stang5280 · Post by **Stang5280** » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:41 pm

LASERBLUE135 wrote:I mean no disrespect to Hudson. I see them becoming an absolute dominant player in WI hockey for years to come (mostly because of the growing population and MN hockey influence), but the rest of the entire state is not up to par with the vast majority of MN schools. I remember a few years back when there was a WI team steamrolling everyone and was undefeated #1. They were beaten badly in a New Ulm holiday tournament. Things haven't changed that much over the last few years.

Sorry for the confusion - my statement was directed at the tournament administrators. We’ll see how the Wisconsin teams fare, but it seems to me that each could be moved up a bracket. I know that Breck has a regular season game against Hudson in January, so it is probably safe to assume they believe it will be a competitive contest. Hudson also defeated Mankato East and Hopkins with relative ease a few weeks ago, so we have a few data points with MN teams.

Sparlimb · Post by **Sparlimb** » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:58 pm

Stang5280 wrote:
LASERBLUE135 wrote:I mean no disrespect to Hudson. I see them becoming an absolute dominant player in WI hockey for years to come (mostly because of the growing population and MN hockey influence), but the rest of the entire state is not up to par with the vast majority of MN schools. I remember a few years back when there was a WI team steamrolling everyone and was undefeated #1. They were beaten badly in a New Ulm holiday tournament. Things haven't changed that much over the last few years.
Sorry for the confusion - my statement was directed at the tournament administrators. We’ll see how the Wisconsin teams fare, but it seems to me that each could be moved up a bracket. I know that Breck has a regular season game against Hudson in January, so it is probably safe to assume they believe it will be a competitive contest. Hudson also defeated Mankato East and Hopkins with relative ease a few weeks ago, so we have a few data points with MN teams.

Well I'm happy with a strong Hudson program. They've been feeding HM like there is no tomorrow, especially on the girls side. Strong feeder programs are key...

Slap Shot · Post by **Slap Shot** » Wed Dec 13, 2017 4:37 pm

Since Edina-Tonka already play each other twice it in conference it would have been nice to see them each get a different opponent at least in the 1st round to mix things up. Maybe they'd have met up again regardless but still...

[edit] Just noticed MHS will have only played 3 games at Pagel out of 13 by the time they face DE there in January. Although 5 of those 10 away will have been on neutral ice so maybe that's not that big of a deal overall.

bauerman · Post by **bauerman** » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:29 am

the Gold matchups could be better but its laughable that STA can lose 2 first round games in the Tourney and win the next 2 games each time and somehow they are outcoached, I wonder if any other coach have lost 2 first round games?

O-townClown · Post by **O-townClown** » Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:07 pm

Stang5280 wrote:Talk about no respect for the WIAA. The two Wisconsin teams should absolutely rip through their respective brackets.

Prescient

CakeScout17 · Post by **CakeScout17** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:16 am

I posted a ramble on Tonka/Edina game within the "Schwans Cup: injury status" post, but as usual, Karl and OTC are spot on.
Edina CAN get very sloppy and go through the motions...its a result of an early season schedule, featuring normally strong teams, yet whose teams are down this year and trying to figure things out (or as in case of GR has lost so much in the off-season that well...) and thus the Hornets can get a lax & into that "lets dump the puck into the corners and watch the scorers go cycle away" opposed to staying disciplined and crisp.
Edina has been without a top goalie for a handful of years and Mackay is no different. Slow lateral movement and a soft glove while rarely cutting down the angles. No team in the state knows how to play Edina better than Tonka, at least this season as theyve been playing each other multiple times each season for 10+ years now, all those summers at Velocity and each teams top 5-6 were teammates on the 2017 Fall Elite League Champion 'Team Southwest' squad.
As Karl states re: Edina, "lets see how they respond"...they'll tighten it up, DK and Crosby will get more confidence through more healing time as they both seemed to be avoiding any physical contact tonight.
But facts remain in addressing Karls' take on Edina's back-end - and just my take but defensively, even with Boltmann, Brinkman, Vorlicky and Reiners - it appears Langevin had these guys tighter, crisper and more disciplined. They seem too loose in their freestyling ways.
And, all due respect to Mr. Harding but Im not seeing any Mackay improvement (should've accepted that CCM offer in Elite league son), playing w/ a positive attitude nor any definable style, per se. its 2 years now!?!? Beaupre seemed to coach the kids up...? Even the Kobe Boe's & Rohkohl's displayed improvement.
However, Edina is 8-1. Blemishes for sure...but thats ok. Humbled and back at it right away...Good luck boys!

PS - sorry, but one more item: Could be nothing, but might be everything:
during last 2 min of Cent/H-M regulation the Tonka kids started lining up in tunnel in full dress pacing side-to-side like panthers...e.g., READY TO GO!
Meanwhile? Edina's #9 and #23 still sitting in stands watching end of game, headphones on, taping up their sticks...
Hmmm....not sayin, just sayin.

ryguyMN · Post by **ryguyMN** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:22 am

I haven't see many Centennial games this year, but if Lucas McGregor is not on the roster, it feels like a very average team offensively. What a playmaker McGregor is. Actually heard a comment from someone sitting around me asking "Why is Centennial ranked so high, they haven't beaten anybody [good]?" as they were looking up SOH rankings on participating teams. I'm starting to question whether they are a top ten team and whether they should be a part of the hodgepodge of teams all wanting to crack the top ten. Guess we'll see what they are made of against Edina.

Stang5280 · Post by **Stang5280** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:12 pm

O-townClown wrote:
Stang5280 wrote:Talk about no respect for the WIAA. The two Wisconsin teams should absolutely rip through their respective brackets.
Prescient

I don’t pretend to have any great knowledge of Wisconsin hockey (particularly sitting here in Denver), but apparently the tournament organizers have far less than I do

LASERBLUE135 · Post by **LASERBLUE135** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 3:10 pm

Stang5280 wrote:
O-townClown wrote:
Stang5280 wrote:Talk about no respect for the WIAA. The two Wisconsin teams should absolutely rip through their respective brackets.
Prescient
I don’t pretend to have any great knowledge of Wisconsin hockey (particularly sitting here in Denver), but apparently the tournament organizers have far less than I do

That's a pretty great comment, LOLOL! I do follow WI hockey closely and Hudson is a beast this year (I'd like to see them play Stillwater every year like Superior plays Duluth). University School is a very good WI program, but usually not up to par with MN teams. I think WI hockey is on the upswing and MN is stale at the moment. MN hockey is SO good its hard to see quick improvement. Maybe after this year they will bump the WI teams up a slot. I'm still not penciling in University School with the championship yet.

Stang5280 · Post by **Stang5280** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:51 pm

Schwan’s Cup consolation semifinals

Here are the results of today’s early action, with two afternoon games still remaining. (Updated to reflect afternoon scores.)

Gold Division
STMA 5, Burnsville 2
Edina 5, Centennial 2

Silver Division
St. Louis Park 4, Buffalo 3
St. Cloud 9, Mounds View 4

Bronze Division
Northfield 6, Kennedy 4
St. Paul Academy 2, Mankato East 1

Open Division
Pine City 4, Cambridge-Isanti 1
Princeton 6, Chisago Lakes 0

Three 8AA teams involved, which may speak to how weak the section appears to be behind clear frontrunner Moorhead. STMA cruised past Burnsville for the second time this season. The Knights have defeated some pretty solid teams with relative ease, but have been crushed by the two big boys they have faced (HF and EP). They should battle Brainerd for the two seed, but it is hard to see them posing a challenge to Moorhead.

While SLP has continued to prove themselves to be a tough out, Buffalo has continued to disappoint. The Bison lack any real scoring depth, though the goalie play keeps them in most games. They may well end up as the seven seed in the section.

St. Cloud bounced back nicely after a somewhat surprising loss to Minneapolis. They are a bit tough to gauge at this point since they have played a heavily single A schedule, but do have a 4-1 win over Buffalo. The January schedule features almost exclusively sectional opponents, however.

HappyHockeyFan · Post by **HappyHockeyFan** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:06 pm

ryguyMN wrote:I haven't see many Centennial games this year, but if Lucas McGregor is not on the roster, it feels like a very average team offensively. What a playmaker McGregor is. Actually heard a comment from someone sitting around me asking "Why is Centennial ranked so high, they haven't beaten anybody [good]?" as they were looking up SOH rankings on participating teams. I'm starting to question whether they are a top ten team and whether they should be a part of the hodgepodge of teams all wanting to crack the top ten. Guess we'll see what they are made of against Edina.

That's why I have them ranked #16.

Post by **karl(east)** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:08 pm

ryguyMN wrote:I haven't see many Centennial games this year, but if Lucas McGregor is not on the roster, it feels like a very average team offensively. What a playmaker McGregor is. Actually heard a comment from someone sitting around me asking "Why is Centennial ranked so high, they haven't beaten anybody [good]?" as they were looking up SOH rankings on participating teams. I'm starting to question whether they are a top ten team and whether they should be a part of the hodgepodge of teams all wanting to crack the top ten. Guess we'll see what they are made of against Edina.

I think Centennial was just cruising on preseason status...sure, they hadn't beaten anyone good (outside of Elk River), but they also hadn't lost to anyone at all until last week, and that was a competitive loss against a consensus top 5 team. Only now are they really getting tested.

On the eye test I prefer them to the likes of Duluth Marshall and Cloquet, but they're certainly closer to that jumble of teams than they are to the top few, as today's result underscored. If you stop McGregor, they become pretty average...but stopping him isn't always easy.

O-townClown · Post by **O-townClown** » Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:23 pm

Tonka-STA
Hill-EP
Edina-STMA
Centennial-B'ville

Gold games for 28th

ryguyMN · Post by **ryguyMN** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:13 pm

karl(east) wrote:
ryguyMN wrote:I haven't see many Centennial games this year, but if Lucas McGregor is not on the roster, it feels like a very average team offensively. What a playmaker McGregor is. Actually heard a comment from someone sitting around me asking "Why is Centennial ranked so high, they haven't beaten anybody [good]?" as they were looking up SOH rankings on participating teams. I'm starting to question whether they are a top ten team and whether they should be a part of the hodgepodge of teams all wanting to crack the top ten. Guess we'll see what they are made of against Edina.
I think Centennial was just cruising on preseason status...sure, they hadn't beaten anyone good (outside of Elk River), but they also hadn't lost to anyone at all until last week, and that was a competitive loss against a consensus top 5 team. Only now are they really getting tested.

On the eye test I prefer them to the likes of Duluth Marshall and Cloquet, but they're certainly closer to that jumble of teams than they are to the top few, as today's result underscored. If you stop McGregor, they become pretty average...but stopping him isn't always easy.

That is true about the schedule. Duluth East was the first test for Centennial. The Cougars were still a bit of a mystery team to me of everyone in the top ten. I do like them more than Duluth Marshall and Cloquet, but Marshall's performances against Tonka and Duluth East were noticed even if they didn't earn the win. Curious to see if there is any more to Cloquet's victory over Moorhead, but based on the box score Wayzata beat up on Cloquet pretty bad.

What I have seen so far from Centennial in the Schwan's Cup is that they might be better off playing a more defensive game and try to keep opponents to two or three goals to have a chance at winning games. This team isn't built to win the high scoring track meets. If McGregor gets shut down by the opposition, they are going to have trouble getting anything going offensively. Of course, they aren't playing the likes of Edina each night, but I can imagine the opposition's gameplan would be to keep bodies around McGregor. Even if McGregor is clicking, it still doesn't guarantee anything as in the Hill-Murray game.

Stang5280 · Post by **Stang5280** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:37 pm

LASERBLUE135 wrote:
Stang5280 wrote:
O-townClown wrote: Prescient
I don’t pretend to have any great knowledge of Wisconsin hockey (particularly sitting here in Denver), but apparently the tournament organizers have far less than I do
That's a pretty great comment, LOLOL! I do follow WI hockey closely and Hudson is a beast this year (I'd like to see them play Stillwater every year like Superior plays Duluth). University School is a very good WI program, but usually not up to par with MN teams. I think WI hockey is on the upswing and MN is stale at the moment. MN hockey is SO good its hard to see quick improvement. Maybe after this year they will bump the WI teams up a slot. I'm still not penciling in University School with the championship yet.

Good call on University School, and congratulations to Simley. They have quietly put together a pretty nice season so far, and could make 4A somewhat interesting. It looks like they have strong goaltending and lots of seniors, which is always a good formula.

Hudson is already laying the smack down on Minnehaha after one period, and I can’t imagine the game being a close one.

LASERBLUE135 · Post by **LASERBLUE135** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 3:02 pm

Stang5280 wrote:
LASERBLUE135 wrote:
Stang5280 wrote: I don’t pretend to have any great knowledge of Wisconsin hockey (particularly sitting here in Denver), but apparently the tournament organizers have far less than I do
That's a pretty great comment, LOLOL! I do follow WI hockey closely and Hudson is a beast this year (I'd like to see them play Stillwater every year like Superior plays Duluth). University School is a very good WI program, but usually not up to par with MN teams. I think WI hockey is on the upswing and MN is stale at the moment. MN hockey is SO good its hard to see quick improvement. Maybe after this year they will bump the WI teams up a slot. I'm still not penciling in University School with the championship yet.
Good call on University School, and congratulations to Simley. They have quietly put together a pretty nice season so far, and could make 4A somewhat interesting. It looks like they have strong goaltending and lots of seniors, which is always a good formula.

Hudson is already laying the smack down on Minnehaha after one period, and I can’t imagine the game being a close one.

Looks like Simley goalie had a solid game! 40+ shots and 2 goals. Hudson dominated.

pioneers · Post by **pioneers** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:00 pm

H-M takes third place in shootout. 4-4 tie vs EP

mulefarm · Post by **mulefarm** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:47 pm

would the HS rules allow a 3on3 after the regular OT do determine who advances? Might be more exciting than a shootout.

ryguyMN · Post by **ryguyMN** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:58 pm

mulefarm wrote:would the HS rules allow a 3on3 after the regular OT do determine who advances? Might be more exciting than a shootout.

It would require a rule change. The bylaws state that a shootout must be used to determine a winner in a school-sponsored tournament.

https://www.mshsl.org/mshsl/publication ... Hockey.pdf

ryguyMN · Post by **ryguyMN** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 5:17 pm

pioneers wrote:H-M takes third place in shootout. 4-4 tie vs EP

Hill might be the biggest surprise of the tournament so far among the eight teams in the Gold Division. They didn't officially win any of the three games they played, but they put up a strong showing against Centennial, Minnetonka, and Eden Prairie finishing with two ties and a loss. Perhaps a sign that this inexperienced team is starting to gel and trending back towards their preseason ranking in the top ten. On paper and the eye test seem to indicate it's a talented group of kids. The ceiling on this team is high.

WestMetro · Post by **WestMetro** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 8:38 pm

Great all around quality hockey game between Skips and Cadets. Befitting a tie outcome . Skips should now be No. 1,with previous wins over STa and Edina.

East Side Pioneer Guy · Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:29 pm

ryguyMN wrote:
mulefarm wrote:would the HS rules allow a 3on3 after the regular OT do determine who advances? Might be more exciting than a shootout.
It would require a rule change. The bylaws state that a shootout must be used to determine a winner in a school-sponsored tournament.

https://www.mshsl.org/mshsl/publication ... Hockey.pdf

With 3 games in 3 days, let's not wear out the kids. Plus, let's keep things mostly on schedule.

I say, 3 games/ 3 days = 3 on 3 OT. The first OT that is. There are always ties in the Gold division, and it really means that the results should be treated more like a round robin format. I wouldn't care if they used a coin flip in place of a shoot out.

Even 4 on 4 would be better than a shoot out.

Post by **karl(east)** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:47 pm

Very well-played game tonight. Tonka seemed to have the early momentum, but that flipped when Luedtke got hurt...Tonka's D corps never really seemed settled after that, and Docter saw a ton of ice time. Credit to Brink for scoring that impressive goal to pull them back within one, and they managed to bang in an equalizer and earn the tie. There's a reason both these teams' two games have gone to OT, and I wouldn't be surprised to see it again if they meet in March. Top to bottom, they're the most complete teams in the state right now...but, as some of their other recent results have shown, they're not safe bets against teams in the 10-20 range, either. It sets up a great remainder of the season.

ifallsin64 · Post by **ifallsin64** » Thu Dec 28, 2017 10:31 pm

PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 12:17 am Post subject: Reply with quote
pioneers wrote:
H-M takes third place in shootout. 4-4 tie vs EP

Hill might be the biggest surprise of the tournament so far among the eight teams in the Gold Division. They didn't officially win any of the three games they played, but they put up a strong showing against Centennial, Minnetonka, and Eden Prairie finishing with two ties and a loss.

They did have a strong showing but moral victories must be the new norm for hill according to you, they could of played in the Open division and got a couple actual wins,

HighSchoolHockeyForums.com

Schwan Cup

Re: Bumping the Schwan Cup (2 weeks out)

Re: Bumping the Schwan Cup (2 weeks out)

Re: Bumping the Schwan Cup (2 weeks out)

Re: Bumping the Schwan Cup (2 weeks out)

Spot on Karl and OTC...

Re: Bumping the Schwan Cup (2 weeks out)

Re: Bumping the Schwan Cup (2 weeks out)