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CTE in Hockey
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wbmd



Joined: 23 Dec 2005
Posts: 3788

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wbmd wrote:
Parker's brain has also been donated to Boston University to determine whether he suffered from the debilitating disease known as chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE).

Concussions is what shortened his NHL career.


Jeff Parker was recently officially diagnosed with CTE.

http://www.leadertelegram.com/News/Front-Page/2018/05/05/div-class-libPageBodyLinebreak-Out-of-the-dark-div.html
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
Posts: 2923

PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2018 6:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go to the girls forum and follow the concussion thread. A lot of information there. Karl won't link it but is current and information that is cited. Of my beefs with Karl this easily tops the list.....ignoring science...really Karl? He is the Roger Goodell of high school sports...put your neck in the sand and pretend it does not exist.
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Section 8 guy



Joined: 25 Jun 2012
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

goldy313 wrote:
Go to the girls forum and follow the concussion thread. A lot of information there. Karl won't link it but is current and information that is cited. Of my beefs with Karl this easily tops the list.....ignoring science...really Karl? He is the Roger Goodell of high school sports...put your neck in the sand and pretend it does not exist.


I don't get it. What did Karl do or not do in regards to concussions?

I've never seen it before but looked following your reference. That isn't really a thread on the girls forum.....it's a 30 page Google search by Greybeard. What's the backstory to his passion on the topic?
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He buried Grey beards thread. Minnesota state law now requires concussion education and protocol. The MSHSL, primarily Jason Nickleby, who took over for Dave Stead,ignores state law.

If you don't understand the systematic dismissal of brain trauma and the life long effects of there of maybe you think the earth is flat too.
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east hockey
Site Admin


Joined: 11 Dec 2002
Posts: 6617
Location: Proctor, MN

PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

goldy313 wrote:
He buried Grey beards thread. Minnesota state law now requires concussion education and protocol. The MSHSL, primarily Jason Nickleby, who took over for Dave Stead,ignores state law.

If you don't understand the systematic dismissal of brain trauma and the life long effects of there of maybe you think the earth is flat too.


This thread?

http://www.ushsho.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=34320

Lee
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Section 8 guy



Joined: 25 Jun 2012
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be clear.......I agree it’s an under reported topic at the high school level. Just trying to understand where everyone is coming from on the topic is all.

I still don’t know that I understand what Karl did wrong. It thats ok, I’ll take your word for it.
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greybeard58



Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1748

PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To Section 8 guy and all those wondering,

The safety of our daughters, sons, granddaughters and grandsons is of primary importance.

Firstly, the concussion thread began as a valuable resource for players, parents, coaches, administrators and officials.

Secondly, hundreds of players personal experiences provide the heart of the thread. These offer insight, comfort, hope and inspiration.

Thirdly, brain injuries are often hidden, unmentioned, or vaguely labeled. How many times have you read “upper body” or “day-to-day”? This thread sheds light into our reluctance to discuss brain trauma. We must ensure are children are not placed in further jeopardy after receiving a brain injury.

Fourthly, hockey concussions have not received the attention and research that other contact sports have gotten. Some people believe “no checking” means no concussion risk. That’s just not true. Brain injuries can have lasting consequences such as emotional issues, hearing difficulties, eyesight problems, behavioral issues, academic struggles, memory loss, chronic pain, migraine headaches, endless fatigue, lasting depression and higher risks or suicide, drug abuse, MS and more. This thread’s main focus is on hockey brain injuries, especially those that impact female skaters since they’re at the greatest risk and get the least assistance.

Lastly, do you know someone who was injured and returned too early? Ever watch a player get hit on the head and the ref didn’t see it or did see it and ignored it? See a playoff, state or AAA tourney game where previously injured players are miraculously healed and back on the ice? Ever listen to an overzealous coach refuse an athletic trainer’s efforts or hear a pushy parent demand a kid shake it off? For those of us old timers who’ve spent years in the rinks, we’ve seen the specialization of hockey and the heightened quest for the sports scholarship that comes at a very high price, in dollars, time and injuries. This thread doesn’t include rink gossip, it links to published articles that hold our community accountable for how we care for our kids.

Are we, as a hockey community, doing all we can to protect our young?

Please join in and share your own observations and thoughts.
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Section 8 guy



Joined: 25 Jun 2012
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2018 5:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Amen brother. Very frustrating to see head shots not called as majors or In all too many cases.....penalties at all. As you say, it's a significant issue.

It's none of my business so no need to answer......I just didn't know if your passion for the topic is driven by a personal experience that anyone was knowledgeable about.

Keep up the good work.
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karl(east)



Joined: 18 Jul 2007
Posts: 5855

PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Per a request I have split this topic off from the thread on Jeff Parker, as the discussion had wandered away from condolences or reflections on his death.
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greybeard58



Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1748

PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2018 11:38 pm    Post subject: protecting children from risk Reply with quote

Use the link

protecting children from risk

“The research is clear — when children participate in high-impact, high-contact sports, there is a 100 percent risk of exposure to brain damage and once you know the risk involved in something, what’s the first thing you do? You protect children from it.”

Children are Suffering Brain Injuries from Contact Sports—And Now Parents are Demanding Action
Read more: https://www.healthline.com/health-news/science-says-to-ban-youth-football#3
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
Posts: 2923

PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 6:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

karl(east) wrote:
Per a request I have split this topic off from the thread on Jeff Parker, as the discussion had wandered away from condolences or reflections on his death.


And moved it to a bored seldomly used....go figure.....
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
Posts: 2923

PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

east hockey wrote:
goldy313 wrote:
He buried Grey beards thread. Minnesota state law now requires concussion education and protocol. The MSHSL, primarily Jason Nickleby, who took over for Dave Stead,ignores state law.

If you don't understand the systematic dismissal of brain trauma and the life long effects of there of maybe you think the earth is flat too.


This thread?

http://www.ushsho.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=34320

Lee


Yes, which lives on the seldom read girls thread.....though Minnesota state law has concussion protocol many including the MSHSL ignore it. Burying this issue does no good, Karl being the Marlboro man......
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Section 8 guy



Joined: 25 Jun 2012
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't have any ties to Karl. I don't know him and he doesn't know me.

I don't get your point Goldy313. At all. What is it exactly you would like Karl to do?
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east hockey
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Joined: 11 Dec 2002
Posts: 6617
Location: Proctor, MN

PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

goldy313 wrote:
east hockey wrote:
goldy313 wrote:
He buried Grey beards thread. Minnesota state law now requires concussion education and protocol. The MSHSL, primarily Jason Nickleby, who took over for Dave Stead,ignores state law.

If you don't understand the systematic dismissal of brain trauma and the life long effects of there of maybe you think the earth is flat too.


This thread?

http://www.ushsho.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=34320

Lee


Yes, which lives on the seldom read girls thread.....though Minnesota state law has concussion protocol many including the MSHSL ignore it. Burying this issue does no good, Karl being the Marlboro man......


Karl buried nothing. Greybeard started the thread in the girls' forum, and it stayed in the girls' forum. Karl stickied the topic, which doesn't appear to me like it was buried. Are we supposed to move any important (in your eyes) topics to the boys high school forum so it can get maximum visibility?

Lee
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 5:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes.

Given the health implications concussions play not only legally in Minnesota but as a condition of returning to competition of all 4 major sports leagues.

Greybeard cites his sources. The MSHSL, at best, pays lip service to state law.......

Concussions are the public Health issues tabacco was when we were in our twenties.
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Jeffy95



Joined: 17 Nov 2015
Posts: 547

PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

goldy313 wrote:
Yes.

Given the health implications concussions play not only legally in Minnesota but as a condition of returning to competition of all 4 major sports leagues.

Greybeard cites his sources. The MSHSL, at best, pays lip service to state law.......

Concussions are the public Health issues tabacco was when we were in our twenties.


I haven't seen anyone disagree with you. But what does that have to do with Karl? Have you chosen him as the guy that needs to lead the charge on awareness of the risks of head trauma in youth athletics? Did you ask him first?
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have asked Karl and Lee numerous times to sticky GreybeArds thread. He cites everything. Make your own decisions about risk vs reward. Hiding information is a negative. I can get personal in this but choose not to.

The basic understanding that concussions are the driving factor of every contact sport needs to be the primary concern of every administrative body,coach, player, and parent should be the A1 topic. The very fact all 4 major sports have stricter concussion protocol than the MSHSL tells a strong tale.
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Section 8 guy



Joined: 25 Jun 2012
Posts: 308

PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off......the thread is stickied isn't it? Seems like it makes sense that it's in the girls thread because all, or at least nearly all, of the data greybeard cites is related to girls.

Second, I'm not sure who it is that you think is in the dark on concussions and needs a thread on Minnhock to save them. The hockey people I know are well aware of the risk reward equation as it pertains to concussions.......and I'll strongly emphasize the risks in that comment.

I get the issue.......and would say that any information being made available on the topic is a positive. I just don't understand the venom towards the board mods. With all due respect to the board......this probably isn't where I'm coming for information if I'm concerned my son or daughter is at risk with a concussion type injury.
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Schotzy



Joined: 03 Mar 2015
Posts: 192

PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup. Seriously, this is not the place I am going to come to find this information, nor would I think for a second that it was the responsibility of the forum moderators to make sure it was here and in a place where everyone can see it. This forum is in no way an extension of the MSHSL, so why get all salty on Karl et all.

I understand the crusade, but disagree with the choice of battlefield.
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elliott70



Joined: 08 Jan 2004
Posts: 11899
Location: Bemidji

PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

goldy313 wrote:
east hockey wrote:
goldy313 wrote:
He buried Grey beards thread. Minnesota state law now requires concussion education and protocol. The MSHSL, primarily Jason Nickleby, who took over for Dave Stead,ignores state law.

If you don't understand the systematic dismissal of brain trauma and the life long effects of there of maybe you think the earth is flat too.


This thread?

http://www.ushsho.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=34320

Lee


Yes, which lives on the seldom read girls thread.....though Minnesota state law has concussion protocol many including the MSHSL ignore it. Burying this issue does no good, Karl being the Marlboro man......


I don't know about the MSHSL but Bemidji high school and the youth programs in Bemidji are very serious about concussions.
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Slap Shot



Joined: 27 Jan 2008
Posts: 539

PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Karl once said something mean about Edina and nice about Tonka and goldy never got over it.
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east hockey
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Joined: 11 Dec 2002
Posts: 6617
Location: Proctor, MN

PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slap Shot wrote:
I think Karl once said something mean about Edina and nice about Tonka and goldy never got over it.


Nah, he dissed 1AA Smile

Lee
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zooomx



Joined: 05 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I don't get the angst against the moderators on this one. Go start your own forum. Concussion education is very important, but I don't know if a fan forum needs to do anything more than this one is currently doing. I would say 95 % of parents, kids and coaches have all the info they need to make the right decisions regarding concussions. The issue is there are people out there who don't think the rules and the risks apply to them. They worry about their kid losing a spot in the pecking order and hide concussion symptoms.
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

east hockey wrote:
Slap Shot wrote:
I think Karl once said something mean about Edina and nice about Tonka and goldy never got over it.


Nah, he dissed 1AA Smile

Lee


Once! Hardly! Exactly, you don’t ever recover from a 1AA slight, especially when it is at least weekly Very Happy
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goldy313



Joined: 05 Mar 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 6:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Schotzy wrote:
Yup. Seriously, this is not the place I am going to come to find this information, nor would I think for a second that it was the responsibility of the forum moderators to make sure it was here and in a place where everyone can see it. This forum is in no way an extension of the MSHSL, so why get all salty on Karl et all.

I understand the crusade, but disagree with the choice of battlefield.


I disagree with you on this point, Greybeard cites nearly everything and since the MSHSL and state law makes concussions a priority, and high school hockey is governed by the MSHSL it should be a topic easily found. Whether you choose to read it or do anything about is up to each individual but the information should be provided.

Also the FACT the MSHSL chooses to do only lip service to state law needs to be provided so it doesn’t look like an extension of the MSHSL. As Elliot posted most schools take concussions far more seriously than the MSHSL. At an MSHSL officials clinic in 2017 we as officials were told not to eject players for targeting fouls, contrary to the NFHS rule, and that we could not send a player to an athletic trainer for showing signs of a concussion.

The “battlefield” as you call it takes many fronts.

Combating concussions takes a 3 pronged approach; coaches, players, and officials. Coaching the proper technique, playing the right way, and calling the fouls. To take one of the 3 out hurts everyone.....to not teach the right way to check, to check improperly, and to not call the infraction hurts the game.....and at each part all should be held accountable.

Having a duckies and bunnies forum where everyone follows the MSHSL mantra is not what this forum has ever been. Debates on class structure, private schools, section alignment, etc. are debated annually......I don’t see why concussions, which are a major problem in all 4 major pro sports leagues and the biggest issue in contact sports should be buried.

Football participation rates at the 7-12 grades are falling pretty dramatically, the reasons are debated but seeing as overall fall sport participation rates are fairly steady due largely to an increase in cross country and trap shooting it is fairly easy to draw a conclusion. In Rochester, a town of 110,000 there are about half as many boy hockey players as there were when it was a town of 70,000. Economics play a role but you can’t ignore the real threat and cause concussions and risk there of play.
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