Page 9 of 10
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 8:31 am
by Nevertoomuchhockey
JustWinBaby wrote:Also, get ready for the brave new world because the grapevine has it the AA's new management is going to take on MN Hockey over Tier 1 in Minnesota. Gonna be fun to watch MN Hockey get its head served up on a platter on that one. It's about time.
What does that even mean? You couldn't just share the announcement you had to make some generic "watch out here we come" comment? Welcome to the forum. Thanks for welcoming US to the "brave new world." Brave sure WOULD be new for AA. Your school's short history is nothing but shady. We can let it go if you can stop the ridiculous foreboding of AAs soon to be illustrious Tier 1 future.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 8:52 am
by WB6162
I can't believe anyone takes girls hockey seriously enough that there is actually an advanced program for them.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:03 am
by puckbreath
WB6162 wrote:I can't believe anyone takes girls hockey seriously enough that there is actually an advanced program for them.
No kidding !
Exactly
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:04 am
by goaline
Tigers33 wrote:Where is AAA dad now?? Where are all the achiever supporters now?? I feel awful for the kids getting caught up in this mess, but shows that things aren't always greener on other side.
I don't feel sorry for CP at all. He could careless about the kids. All he cares about is making himself look good. Well nice job on this one.
Maybe whinny will have the guts to can his butt from OS and the whitecap program.
Exactly
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:15 am
by Bulldog3489
JustWinBaby wrote:Also, get ready for the brave new world because the grapevine has it the AA's new management is going to take on MN Hockey over Tier 1 in Minnesota. Gonna be fun to watch MN Hockey get its head served up on a platter on that one. It's about time.
Isn't the bigger issue financial? Would parents give thousands of $$ in tuition hoping the school doesn't run out of money as was reported this year? I'm also wondering if this mess doesn't result in a lawsuit or two. Ice contracts and employees have to be paid.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 10:08 am
by D6 Girls Fan
JustWinBaby wrote:AA's new management is going to take on MN Hockey over Tier 1 in Minnesota. Gonna be fun to watch MN Hockey get its head served up on a platter on that one. It's about time.
Can you elaborate? Will they be creating a Tier 1 league?
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 10:29 am
by Nevertoomuchhockey
All the announcements have been about the boys side, Revolution teams. Which apparently are holding tryouts.....
Re: Exactly
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 11:32 am
by RailingWizardofOZ
goaline wrote:Tigers33 wrote:Where is AAA dad now?? Where are all the achiever supporters now?? I feel awful for the kids getting caught up in this mess, but shows that things aren't always greener on other side.
Let’s not shake the bush to get the possums out. Yes, after all the posts from the AA parents boasting about the strength and greatness of the school/program, it would have been nice to actually get some substantive information from those directly involved over the past week. I guess we should give some credit, however, as it seems that although rules are not big on the priority list, those on here did follow the one from AA not to discuss with anyone.
I for one, was enjoying looking to the forum for real hockey talk once again and anticipating all the State Tournament fun. Seeing this topic back to the top again was disappointing, as I am in myself for getting sucked back in one more time. No matter how many new angry AA elves’ come out of the woodwork, let’s try to let this thread finally go to its resting place.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 4:01 pm
by Pens4
puckbreath wrote:WB6162 wrote:I can't believe anyone takes girls hockey seriously enough that there is actually an advanced program for them.
No kidding !
Best of luck to you and your families.
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 5:08 pm
by karl(east)
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 6:54 pm
by MNHockeyFan
Great summary, Karl.
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:51 pm
by oldschoolpuckster
Very well done!!
I could go either way about the future of AA. I really enjoy the idea of a hockey based school (especially in the State of Hockey) and I wish them the best of luck moving forward. I would hope that they get the rules right this time and keep everything above board.
AA is a great concept and I guess I am having a really hard time with the fact that so many "hockey people" are against it. Is it envy...jealousy...fear...or just ingnorance that causes this hatred? I would think we should all support the growth of the game and the opportunity for more kids to play. There are many other specialized schools that don't get this kind of recognition or publicity.
Things will never be like they used to be...the world is ever changing and evolving. Hockey is no different people.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 6:58 am
by puckbreath
oldschoolpuckster wrote:
Very well done!!
I could go either way about the future of AA. I really enjoy the idea of a hockey based school (especially in the State of Hockey) and I wish them the best of luck moving forward. I would hope that they get the rules right this time and keep everything above board.
AA is a great concept and I guess I am having a really hard time with the fact that so many "hockey people" are against it. Is it envy...jealousy...fear...or just ingnorance that causes this hatred? I would think we should all support the growth of the game and the opportunity for more kids to play.
There are many other specialized schools that don't get this kind of recognition or publicity.
Things will never be like they used to be...the world is ever changing and evolving. Hockey is no different people.
Maybe because they follow the rules ?
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:39 am
by sinbin
oldschoolpuckster wrote:
AA is a great concept and I guess I am having a really hard time with the fact that so many "hockey people" are against it. Is it envy...jealousy...fear...or just ingnorance that causes this hatred?
I would imagine that many more people are against the "cheating" than they are against the concept, per se, although many certainly don't like the concept, either. And
hatred is perhaps too harsh an emotion (we don't even have a 'hatred' emoticon on this site). AA had a golden (and one-time) opportunity to convince people that their concept had merit, by doing things the right way, but they instead chose to set their concept back so far that it will takes years to recover, if at all.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:35 am
by 52cent
Last paragraph of the article "This isn’t to say that the Minnesota model is without its flaws; most of us have our critiques, and there will always be a space for outside organizations to fill the gaps that Minnesota Hockey and its affiliates cannot. Those affiliates, however, are much better served if they try to form a cooperative relationship with Minnesota Hockey and the MSHSL, or at the very least coexist, as Bernie McBain’s Edina-based Minnesota Made program usually manages to do. (Usually.) Achiever, on the other hand, took it a bridge too far, and is learning why the torch-and-pitchfork method of revolution has never been much of a winner."
You mean like the torch and pitchfork manor in which MSHSL went after Min Made?
Do you really think there is room for outside organizations to operate in season along side of the MSHSL or Assoc? Nice theory but is exactly that, a theory. Bernie McBain had to go to court, so that's an example of forced coexisting.
Karl, on a more ironic note that may contradict your closing statements, maybe you can provide some more info about recent rumors that Bernie McBain is in discussions with Northern Educate to support and develop the Tier 1 program they announced they would be pursuing. This would be an opportunity to provide Min Made customers a Tier 1 option since a couple years ago when MN-H and WI-H dissolved the Wisconsin Fire program. Bernie was not an official in the management of that program but he supported and developed it by providing many of his Made players and he and some of the Made parents coached teams.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 11:13 am
by mnhockeyguy2014
Bernie McBain will no doubt join any effort to expand hockey opportunities outside of association and the MSHSL. This year he became affiliated with AAU and is hosting a National Squirt Tournament at the Made in early March where he will enter 2 teams in a tournament including teams from about 11 states.
Bernie won his lawsuit to offer other options and I predict other challenges will be successful as well.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 11:13 am
by Bulldog3489
52cent wrote:
Last paragraph of the article "This isn’t to say that the Minnesota model is without its flaws; most of us have our critiques, and there will always be a space for outside organizations to fill the gaps that Minnesota Hockey and its affiliates cannot. Those affiliates, however, are much better served if they try to form a cooperative relationship with Minnesota Hockey and the MSHSL, or at the very least coexist, as Bernie McBain’s Edina-based Minnesota Made program usually manages to do. (Usually.) Achiever, on the other hand, took it a bridge too far, and is learning why the torch-and-pitchfork method of revolution has never been much of a winner."
You mean like the torch and pitchfork manor in which MSHSL went after Min Made?
Do you really think there is room for outside organizations to operate in season along side of the MSHSL or Assoc? Nice theory but is exactly that, a theory. Bernie McBain had to go to court, so that's an example of forced coexisting.
Karl, on a more ironic note that may contradict your closing statements, maybe you can provide some more info about recent rumors that Bernie McBain is in discussions with Northern Educate to support and develop the Tier 1 program they announced they would be pursuing. This would be an opportunity to provide Min Made customers a Tier 1 option since a couple years ago when MN-H and WI-H dissolved the Wisconsin Fire program. Bernie was not an official in the management of that program but he supported and developed it by providing many of his Made players and he and some of the Made parents coached teams.
Not aware that high school league ever went after Minnesota Made.
District 6 once made a strange rule about participating in both youth and Minnesota Made systems at the same time and that resulted in a lawsuit brought by Minnesota Made.
Tier 1 already exists in Minnesota. Want to start another Shattuck, go for it. The business people that try to start up such a school might find, like the first Achiever ownership group, that its not the greatest of investments with Shattuck, private schools, elite leagues, public schools, juniors, etc. But get your financing together and go for it.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 11:36 am
by mnhockeyguy2014
Correct Bulldog
District 6 said that any players at MN Made could not also participate in Assoc. Hockey and Bernie sued them saying that was illegal and won. He has recently added Pee Wees and bantams will prob follow and Tier 1 seems to be a reasonable end goal with the pipeline. Pretty sure Bernie would like to address the fact that no more Tier 1 teams are allowed based out of MN besides Shattuck and T-breds earlier than later. Makes sense he might partner with NE/AA to get it done??
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 12:06 pm
by Bulldog3489
mnhockeyguy2014 wrote:Correct Bulldog
District 6 said that any players at MN Made could not also participate in Assoc. Hockey and Bernie sued them saying that was illegal and won. He has recently added Pee Wees and bantams will prob follow and Tier 1 seems to be a reasonable end goal with the pipeline. Pretty sure Bernie would like to address the fact that no more Tier 1 teams are allowed based out of MN besides Shattuck and T-breds earlier than later. Makes sense he might partner with NE/AA to get it done??
At the high school ages, there have been other Tier 1 teams in recent years so saying Minnesota hockey only let's Shattuck and T-Breds do it is not true.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:00 pm
by 52cent
Bulldog3489 wrote:mnhockeyguy2014 wrote:Correct Bulldog
District 6 said that any players at MN Made could not also participate in Assoc. Hockey and Bernie sued them saying that was illegal and won. He has recently added Pee Wees and bantams will prob follow and Tier 1 seems to be a reasonable end goal with the pipeline. Pretty sure Bernie would like to address the fact that no more Tier 1 teams are allowed based out of MN besides Shattuck and T-breds earlier than later. Makes sense he might partner with NE/AA to get it done??
At the high school ages, there have been other Tier 1 teams in recent years so saying Minnesota hockey only let's Shattuck and T-Breds do it is not true.
My post said ---in season-- programs and, as far as I know other than Shattuck, there are no in season Tier 1 teams out of Minnesota. Name them if there were.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:20 pm
by MNHockeyFan
52cent wrote:My post said ---in season-- programs and, as far as I know other than Shattuck, there are no in season Tier 1 teams out of Minnesota. Name them if there were.
Are the Thoroughbreds considered Tier 1? With a record of 1-25-1 they are still really struggling in their league (JWHL).
http://www.jwhl.org/page/show/902258-mi ... roughbreds
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:54 pm
by Coachk
Yes our Minnesota Thoroughbred team is Tier 1 and has been for many years. SSM is the only other Tier 1 U19 team.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:32 pm
by karl(east)
52cent wrote:
You mean like the torch and pitchfork manor in which MSHSL went after Min Made?
Do you really think there is room for outside organizations to operate in season along side of the MSHSL or Assoc? Nice theory but is exactly that, a theory. Bernie McBain had to go to court, so that's an example of forced coexisting.
Karl, on a more ironic note that may contradict your closing statements, maybe you can provide some more info about recent rumors that Bernie McBain is in discussions with Northern Educate to support and develop the Tier 1 program they announced they would be pursuing. This would be an opportunity to provide Min Made customers a Tier 1 option since a couple years ago when MN-H and WI-H dissolved the Wisconsin Fire program. Bernie was not an official in the management of that program but he supported and developed it by providing many of his Made players and he and some of the Made parents coached teams.
Of course it goes both ways; as others have said, D6 overplayed its hand in that particular case, and got burned. The focus on this article was on the alternatives to MH, of which there are plenty that coexist just fine, from AAA teams to Shattuck. Achiever probably would've pulled it off if they'd managed to follow some pretty basic rules. They still might.
I'm just some kid from Duluth; I'm not the person to ask for inside info on a possible MN Made-Northern Educate partnership. On a certain level it certainly makes sense, if Bernie thinks he can trust the NE people not to screw this one up. I'd need to look into it a lot more to have any idea of what the suit's chances would be. I certainly wouldn't predict shiny, happy co-existence if it does go forward.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:08 pm
by TXinMyRearView
karl(east) wrote: On a certain level it certainly makes sense, if Bernie thinks he can trust the NE people not to screw this one up.
It's my firm belief that most of the "screw-ups" from AA have exited, stage left. Hopefully the new folks can pull off a successful school in the years to come and fix the problems we have all been discussing.
Posted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:35 pm
by Bulldog3489
52cent wrote:Bulldog3489 wrote:mnhockeyguy2014 wrote:Correct Bulldog
District 6 said that any players at MN Made could not also participate in Assoc. Hockey and Bernie sued them saying that was illegal and won. He has recently added Pee Wees and bantams will prob follow and Tier 1 seems to be a reasonable end goal with the pipeline. Pretty sure Bernie would like to address the fact that no more Tier 1 teams are allowed based out of MN besides Shattuck and T-breds earlier than later. Makes sense he might partner with NE/AA to get it done??
At the high school ages, there have been other Tier 1 teams in recent years so saying Minnesota hockey only let's Shattuck and T-Breds do it is not true.
My post said ---in season-- programs and, as far as I know other than Shattuck, there are no in season Tier 1 teams out of Minnesota. Name them if there were.
On the girls side, something called the Minnesota Crunch a couple years ago. Before that there was another team besides T-breds that lost to Shattuck in the state tournament I can't remember the name. Someone here will.