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I also do believe Lou Nanne and his partner last year during the Cathedral semi final game. said if STA had kept all there talent through thier senior years they could have been one of the all time best dynasties in high school hockey. He also commentted or Housley did that they would have been considered the best team in state for both classes last yearand beyond.
Remember I am paraphrasing not quoting.
You would have to play the tape.
It would be tough to argue don't you think.

GO CADETS

behonestbenice wrote:I never said there wasn't great talent on mediocer teams. Its every where . I said find another program that lost this many players to NDTP, Colleg Early and the USHL in 3 years that could all still be playing together.

STA didn't steal anyone the students and families choose to go there. Because of great coaching were able to develop very good players into top talent creating other opportunities faster than most programs.

Also I didn't say the other programs UofM, NDTP, USHL stole them either.

I just said think of the talent lost by one program and can you name another that matches what STA lost in 3 years.

Also the Manning, Peyton analogy doesn't fit either. I never said whose better. I said name players that left on 1 team in a 3 year period that had the same accolades

Bye the way I would go with Manning, but I would also go with at least a hockey analogy to support your case.

Go T-Wolves

You are correct!!!! AND they all left STA for the same reasons as well...Better coaching elsewhere...

Most of the players being mentioned here were on the radar long before enrolling at STA. I contend that most of them were can't miss prospects for division 1 before they ever arrived. The coaching is great but these kids were elite players when they got there. This years freshman class is not on par with past years so lets see what happens in the future. If they develop the 3 freshman now playing into big time recruits they deserve credit. There are no Schroeders, Isaacksons, Larsons or Walters in this bunch. Please don't take this as a slam on these kids, that is not my point, the group of players that left early where widely considered at the very top of their age group when they got there, and yes the current STA team with all eligible players would be special there is little doubt about that but stroll down the west rink at braemar someday and look at the number of players Edina pumped into division 1 from 76-79. Then imagine one school instead of two. You'ld be looking at teams with an average of 12 players moving on to major college hockey.

behonestbenice wrote:I never said there wasn't great talent on mediocer teams. Its every where . I said find another program that lost this many players to NDTP, Colleg Early and the USHL in 3 years that could all still be playing together.

STA didn't steal anyone the students and families choose to go there. Because of great coaching were able to develop very good players into top talent creating other opportunities faster than most programs.

Also I didn't say the other programs UofM, NDTP, USHL stole them either.

I just said think of the talent lost by one program and can you name another that matches what STA lost in 3 years.

Also the Manning, Peyton analogy doesn't fit either. I never said whose better. I said name players that left on 1 team in a 3 year period that had the same accolades

Bye the way I would go with Manning, but I would also go with at least a hockey analogy to support your case.



Go T-Wolves

Wow, u dont know how to comprehend english, or continue an argument, or understand analogies.
The peyton brady comparison was to compare players that were lost by high schools to development or college etc. Your argument that STA lost the best players is simply a matter of opinion, not a fact.
To name a program that lost a lot of talent, comparable to STA, you already did that for me in your first post. (Roseau)
I never questioned whether or not you thought there was talent on mediocre teams. That was to another person who said you cant get noticed on a bad team...
Obviously STA didnt steal players. What the hell would that mean? They send some hitman into the players house and make them come? Obviously they chose to go to STA. Thats not my point. The schools which would have had these players are the schools that got screwed. STA never would have had them if they hadnt have chosen to go there instead. After they played at STA for a year, they again CHOSE to go elsewhere with their careers whether it be NDTP, College, or USHL. So maybe St thomas recruit their players more closely and choose players that will stay their whole high school career.
Sure Vanelli is a good coach... but why are they leaving early if they can develop so well at your school.
Learn how to spell by
If you really think a hockey analogy would help your brain to comprehend my extremely complicated analogy (sarcasm) then try Crosby, Ovechkin.

behonestbenice wrote:I also do believe Lou Nanne and his partner last year during the Cathedral semi final game. said if STA had kept all there talent through thier senior years they could have been one of the all time best dynasties in high school hockey. He also commentted or Housley did that they would have been considered the best team in state for both classes last yearand beyond.
Remember I am paraphrasing not quoting.
You would have to play the tape.
It would be tough to argue don't you think.

GO CADETS

Oh and i almost forgot.. I'm not good with names, but i believe you would be talking about the hacks who are "announcers" for the high school hockey tournament. Don't forget they probably get most of their information from Gorg. Sure they obviously would have been a very good team, but those guys will say whatever they can think of to keep an audience entertained. And they still dont succeed. Thank god for the mute button.

If STA can manage to retain Isaakson, Crandall, Reid and their goalies from this year to next they'll have a good shot at any team in the state.

-While there are some names on the roster that are family names I recognize, as there were a very many a could years ago, now there are very few. I will admit that it has changed in just a couple years from good players who would've gone their anyway with a few there for hockey to people going there for hockey with a few who would've gone their anyway.

-Look at AHA and HM's non-conference schedules. They are awesome year after year. Teams around the state know they will be able to put together quality teams year after year. I'm a little surprised (and maybe it's that HM isn't up for the challenge) that Shattuck's top team doesn't play HM as they do AHA's. This could be a possibility for STA in the future.

-I do not think the powers in Class A should opt up, for two reasons. 1. It turns back into a tier systems, I believe teams shouldn't be allowed to opt. 2. Regardless of one's opinion, mine is that I like being able to see the my alma mater playing for a title in March more often. This being said, were STA a AA program, would these players, and future ones, have left? Hard to speculate, but would you prefer to stay at a program where you walk through sections or one where your section final game could possibly be against rivals Cretin or Hill (if put in the current 3AA or 4AA, the two most likely options) and winning would lead you to playing evening games at the X? I never played hockey, I wouldn't know

-Really good point about players choosing to go there AND choosing to leave.

You're right hshockeywatcher they should be tough next year but will need to get better defensively to match the level of the last 2 state champs. Last years defensive corp was as good as any in the state, its not easy to replace that kind of talent.

[b]To name a program that lost a lot of talent, comparable to STA, you already did that for me in your first post. (Roseau) [/b]

Dude. I didn't do that in my first post. I showed you even with Roseau losing Ness and Lee that it was a wash with STA loosing Shroeder and Crandall. Yet STA still lost in the 3 years Faulk,Walters,Larson and A.Lee.
Roseau nothing else early. That was my point ther is no other comparison until Edina guy with a nice piece of history.

Nice job Edina guy bringing out the old school history 3 year period 76-79.
I have been to that West rink and great point if they didn't go East and West.
We would never know but I have to think there would have not been enough playing time for that many great cake eater players and they would have left for private schools and then gone back when they could get more playing time. Just Kidding

I concede with the 76-79 analogy. Edina wins again.

Nice hockey analogy dude with Crosby and Ovechkin, but now you stayed pro. Get back to topic and compare amatures.

[b]Bye [/b]the way I would go with Crosby. Shattuck is the best and I agree 6-8 top high schools each year should schedule Shattuck. Maybe even a weekend home and home. They would be awesome.

It would also give people that dont know what the Shattuck program is truly about a better idea of why peole want to be thier from all over the world.

By and bookmark this. STA will regroup and repeat once again showing the talent that is there with another year of new leadership in Reid, Isacson, Crandall, Schroeder and Altrichter

Go 76-79 Edina Hornets

No Tom Vanellie is a top flight coach one of the best on and off the ice.

He would be one great USHL head coach or assistant D1 college coach. I still say some day he will be part of the Gopher program.

behonestbenice wrote:To name a program that lost a lot of talent, comparable to STA, you already did that for me in your first post. (Roseau)

Dude. I didn't do that in my first post. I showed you even with Roseau losing Ness and Lee that it was a wash with STA loosing Shroeder and Crandall. Yet STA still lost in the 3 years Faulk,Walters,Larson and A.Lee.
Roseau nothing else early. That was my point ther is no other comparison until Edina guy with a nice piece of history.

Nice job Edina guy bringing out the old school history 3 year period 76-79.
I have been to that West rink and great point if they didn't go East and West.
We would never know but I have to think there would have not been enough playing time for that many great cake eater players and they would have left for private schools and then gone back when they could get more playing time. Just Kidding

I concede with the 76-79 analogy. Edina wins again.

Nice hockey analogy dude with Crosby and Ovechkin, but now you stayed pro. Get back to topic and compare amatures.

Bye the way I would go with Crosby. Shattuck is the best and I agree 6-8 top high schools each year should schedule Shattuck. Maybe even a weekend home and home. They would be awesome.

It would also give people that dont know what the Shattuck program is truly about a better idea of why peole want to be thier from all over the world.

By and bookmark this. STA will regroup and repeat once again showing the talent that is there with another year of new leadership in Reid, Isacson, Crandall, Schroeder and Altrichter

Go 76-79 Edina Hornets

"Roseau is the only school that comes close"
are ya sure about that...

I just dont think you are understanding my analogy, or maybe what an analogy is... i hate to do the dictionary.com thing again but

analogy: a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based

Crosby represents the Roseau players that left, and Ovetchkin represents the STA players.. ask a bunch of people and you will get different opinions

Heck I'm not even an Edina guy, just spent my formative years getting pounded by them and only now am I able to appreciate how good they were.

keepyourheadup wrote:You're right hshockeywatcher they should be tough next year but will need to get better defensively to match the level of the last 2 state champs. Last years defensive corp was as good as any in the state, its not easy to replace that kind of talent.

Keepyourheadup-Getting a little of topic, (STA vs. Cent.) but wanted to repond to your post.

I’ve been reading a lot of posts comparing last years STA team to this year. Obviously, they lost a key player in Walters and 5 sr. blue liners, who were very good. They are no doubt, a different team.

On paper, coming into the season everyone knew that STA still had some talented forwards coming back, with two solid goal tenders in the net. But the big question mark was their defensemen. Carrying the load right now for STA is three underclassmen, two with no varsity experience, freshman Eric Schurhamer, sophomore Taylor Fleming, junior JP Graveline who has some limited varsity experience from last year and Sr. Matt Bare, who did not play last year due to a broken leg.

Since everyone wants to compare last years team to this years, lets take a look at the numbers/results of their common opponents at this point into the season:

Team Result/07-08 Result/08-09
Marshall L/2-8 L/1-2
Breck L/5-6 W/7-2
Tartan W/7-0 W/5-1
Simley W/12-2 W/10-1
NSP W/10-0 W/6-2
Mtka L/2-8 W/4-3 OT
CDH W/4-2 W/4-1

Record 4-3 6-1
Goals for 42 37
Goals against 23 12
Differential +19 +25

Last years team seemed to be able to find consistent offensive production from their second or third lines. This year’s team has yet to see this consistencey. Since Reid has been moved to Issacson & Crandell line, the first line has been consistently producing, but collectively, they have not reached thier potential. STA still looking for the right combination of another line that will also consistently produce for them. I like the changes they made during the Moorhead Spuds game, pairing Schroeder, Sienko and Gavin together (1 point), with Kroska, Krieger and Daily (1 point).

STA PP has also not reached thier potential, with several missed empty net scoring chances. PK is doing pretty good, but has room for improvement.

I look for the STA make some offensive gains in 09 half of the season.

Goaltending is better than last year, as both goalies have improved.

We are only 10 games into the season, with a lot more hockey to play. But it appears the young STA defensemen seem to be stepping up to meet the challenge. Sure, they have made some mistakes, but no doubt they will improve as they progress through the season, as all three are logging over 50% of the ice time this year. Last years STA defensive core was very good, but I suspect there are a lot of people who may have under estimated the overall effectiveness of this year’s young defense core. The results are speaking for themselves.

They still need to develope at least one more consistant blue liner from with in thier program and there are a couple who may make that jump. It does looks like they will have at least 3 solid defensemen returning next year, each with one more year of varsity experience, who is bigger, stronger and faster.

afalsf

While the defense has held up, it was really the core of last years team. The 07-08 Cadets spent very little time in their own end. Mergens, Vanelli,Schriner and Stepan broke the puck out as well as any team in the state. This years lowered offensive production is partially a result of the amount of time they spend penned up in the defensive zone. Quality defense makes playing offense a whole lot easier.