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Liriano's Future
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 3:15 pm
by HShockeywatcher
Two years ago Francisco Liriano was the top pitcher in MLB. Now he is 0-3 and could possibly not even have a future in MLB. What do people think of his future?
post 10332
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:12 pm
by boblee
HShockeywatcher wrote:Two years ago Francisco Liriano was the top pitcher in MLB. Now he is 0-3 and could possibly not even have a future in MLB. What do people think of his future?
As has been mentioned many times before, it takes almost every pitcher two years to comeback to his original form after tommy john surgery. The kid will be just fine.
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:55 pm
by goldy313
Can you name one that came back as an evective starter though? I can only think of a couple; Kenny Rogers and John Smoltz and in Smoltz's case it took him 5 years to return as an effective starter. Neither Smoltz or rogers were exceptionally hard throwers to begin with though.
Liriano is done as a starter in my opinion, much like Kerry Wood he has to violent of a delivery for his elbow to hold up. His slider was his big pitch and can't throw it anymore, possibly one of Terry Ryan's greatest moves was not signing Liriano to a big contract.
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:40 pm
by ap4mvp
goldy313 wrote:Can you name one that came back as an evective starter though? I can only think of a couple; Kenny Rogers and John Smoltz and in Smoltz's case it took him 5 years to return as an effective starter. Neither Smoltz or rogers were exceptionally hard throwers to begin with though.
Liriano is done as a starter in my opinion, much like Kerry Wood he has to violent of a delivery for his elbow to hold up. His slider was his big pitch and can't throw it anymore, possibly one of Terry Ryan's greatest moves was not signing Liriano to a big contract.
Smoltz not a hard thrower
You must not watch a lot of Atlanta Braves baseball.
Love they way you say Liriano is done as a starter after just 3 starts coming off major elbow surgery
Re: Liriano's Future
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:14 pm
by tomASS
HShockeywatcher wrote:Two years ago Francisco Liriano was the top pitcher in MLB. Now he is 0-3 and could possibly not even have a future in MLB. What do people think of his future?
Much better and brighter than yours even if everyone ignored him and he lost every game from this point forward. Pure speculation on my part
Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:22 pm
by UpNorthStars
Wow, i can't believe people would be giving up on this guy after 3 starts. He'll be just fine, this year will probably be a rough one, but he'll have a great year next year- probably just in time to be traded to Boston, i think they're next in line for our prospects right?
Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:45 am
by goldy313
Actually I watched a lot of Braves baseball, them and the Cubs were the only teams I could watch for many years. Smoltz had a hard fastball, but didn't throw a hard slider, unlike Liriano his strikeout pitch is a split finger not the slider. He also throws a good curve and a decent change, Liriano is basically a one trick pony with a tremendous slider. Smoltz never went out and threw sliders 70 of 100 pitches, more like 10 out of 100.
The only reason to give up on Liriano is history is not on his side, almost nobody comes back as an effective starter after that surgery. Liriano is a slider pitcher and unless he changes he won't be an effective pitcher. His work ethic and durability are also huge question marks. Remember he pulled himself out of games due to a little pain, the training staff and doctors could find nothing wrong with him. He went to numerous specialists who also found nothing wrong before 1 decided he needed surgery.
Move him to the bullpen, Mariano Rivera made a pretty good career after Tommy John surgery by doing that. It limits the number of pitches thereby reducing wear and tear on the elbow.
post 10335
Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 8:07 pm
by boblee
Liriano doesn't throw 70/100 sliders. It's more like 30. He is a starter and he will remain one. Let the kid throw every five days this year and let him go next year and be himself. He will produce for the big show next year.
Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:29 pm
by goldy313
Liriano was pulled after 4.1 innings in Rochester today, after 94 pitches and 4 earned runs. He walked 5 and gave up 5 hits. His lack of control is killing him.
post 10339
Posted: Fri May 02, 2008 1:57 pm
by boblee
goldy313 wrote:Liriano was pulled after 4.1 innings in Rochester today, after 94 pitches and 4 earned runs. He walked 5 and gave up 5 hits. His lack of control is killing him.
He'll get it back. Give him time, he had major surgery.
Re: post 10339
Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 1:06 am
by EREmpireStrikesBack
boblee wrote:goldy313 wrote:Liriano was pulled after 4.1 innings in Rochester today, after 94 pitches and 4 earned runs. He walked 5 and gave up 5 hits. His lack of control is killing him.
He'll get it back. Give him time, he had major surgery.
Will you be saying the same thing in two years?
You should definitely go into business as a sports agent. Your clients like Kevin Jones would love you. "He did after all have major surgery...give him 6 years."
Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 11:03 am
by NumberCruncher
Yeah I don't know. It's hard because even he was very doubtful he'd make it this far. He was CONVINCED last year that he'd never pitch ever again until he decided to give it a go. His slider no doubt was his money pitch and if they're limiting that amount by about 1/3 then he of course won't be nearly as devastating as before. I'll give him the year to kind of recoup. It's hard to beleive, but he still doesn't even have a full year of MLB service under his belt so I'll give him a little wiggle room. But after having to wait over a year for our Franchise to come back from injury, I can see how everyone would be anxious for him to come back as if yesterday was July 2006.
Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 12:31 am
by Reggie
Next year!
Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:47 am
by schwang17
goldy313 wrote:Liriano is a slider pitcher and unless he changes he won't be an effective pitcher.
What exactly is a slider pitcher? I seem to remember a 97 mph heater and a jaw dropping changeup that nobody could touch a year or so ago. Maybe I'm wrong.
Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:18 am
by NumberCruncher
schwang17 wrote:goldy313 wrote:Liriano is a slider pitcher and unless he changes he won't be an effective pitcher.
What exactly is a slider pitcher? I seem to remember a 97 mph heater and a jaw dropping changeup that nobody could touch a year or so ago. Maybe I'm wrong.
Hmmm sounds more like Santana than Liriano to me ...
Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:34 am
by schwang17
NumberCruncher wrote:schwang17 wrote:goldy313 wrote:Liriano is a slider pitcher and unless he changes he won't be an effective pitcher.
What exactly is a slider pitcher? I seem to remember a 97 mph heater and a jaw dropping changeup that nobody could touch a year or so ago. Maybe I'm wrong.
Hmmm sounds more like Santana than Liriano to me ...
Santana rarely touched 97 on the gun. This year he's struggling to hit 93-94. A few years back, I do seem to remember people saying Liriano had better stuff and outpitched him most turns through the rotation.
Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:35 am
by GR3343
Listening to the game on radio the other day, they had a good report on Liriano. 96 pitches or so, 1 run on 3 hits 6 or 7 innings pitched with 7 K's. Not a bad line. Sounds like he's starting to shape up and could be back after the break. Also said he touched mid 90's with the fastball and did use the slider. Encouraging.
post 10422
Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:02 pm
by boblee
GR3343 wrote:Listening to the game on radio the other day, they had a good report on Liriano. 96 pitches or so, 1 run on 3 hits 6 or 7 innings pitched with 7 K's. Not a bad line. Sounds like he's starting to shape up and could be back after the break. Also said he touched mid 90's with the fastball and did use the slider. Encouraging.
I was saying earlier, along with many, that he just needs more time... Looks like he could be getting close to ready for a possible stretch run with the big club.
Posted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 6:30 pm
by grindiangrad-80
I hope he can regain his form.
The Twins, IMHO, are a mild surprise. Lots of new faces. I didn't think they would hang around this long.
A healthy Liriano would be a nice boost for the 2nd half.
Go Twins.
Posted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:40 am
by NumberCruncher
ESPN.com wrote:
WATCH THIS PLOT LINE FROM NOW TO OCTOBER: Remember Francisco Liriano? He was a far cry from his old Johan Jr. self in the first chapter of his post-Tommy John surgery comeback (0-3, 11.32 ERA). But mark this down: He will be back. He has now gotten through at least six innings in five straight Triple-A starts. And his command is back (only six walks in his past 34 innings). So we haven't heard the last of one of the most charismatic young pitchers around. "Our hope is that he only has one more move left," Smith said. "And that's [back] to Minnesota."
Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 1:39 pm
by GR3343
Latest start : Sunday, 7 1/3 innings, 2 runs 5 hits 5 strikeouts, NO walks 100 pitches. Consistently hit 90 with the fastball and threw the slider well but not overpowering.
Sounds like he's getting closer to his return to the Show. Drop Boof and call him up.
Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 1:47 pm
by sachishi4
they are going to wait for casilla or buscher to stop being productive until they bring liriano up. Boof would get taken off waivers, even if he isnt doing well.
OR they might drop lamb