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What gives with the refs this year it sure seems like they favor one team more than the other almost every game. I've always been a supporter but this is getting rediculous. Don't they know there's an oath to be neutral and consistant.

I'd like this post to mention good and badly ref'd games and maybe they'll realize it's about the girls and not them. They'll know everyones watching and be held accountable.

I really don't think the refs are siding one team "every game". I've been to a fair amount of girls games this year, and haven't noticed much.

hockfan1980 wrote:What gives with the refs this year it sure seems like they favor one team more than the other almost every game. I've always been a supporter but this is getting rediculous. Don't they know there's an oath to be neutral and consistant.

I'd like this post to mention good and badly ref'd games and maybe they'll realize it's about the girls and not them. They'll know everyones watching and be held accountable.

Seems like most of our games this year, the refs have been trying to make the games as even as possible, meaning if one team gets up by 2 goals, they start playing shorthanded alot more to try and get the score back to tied. Drives me crazy!!

hockfan1980 wrote:What gives with the refs this year it sure seems like they favor one team more than the other almost every game. I've always been a supporter but this is getting rediculous. Don't they know there's an oath to be neutral and consistant.

I'd like this post to mention good and badly ref'd games and maybe they'll realize it's about the girls and not them. They'll know everyones watching and be held accountable.

We have all seen the good the bad and the Ugly of a Ref, I would like to believe that they are all Neutral and are there to do a good Job and make the game what it should be, and we all know that they do make mistakes
I have seen some ref tandems or trio’s that have communicated and worked well together and some that are in power struggles, I think the Key is Communication between them, not to be afraid to ask each other what they saw, and the Key is to do what is right!!!! The NFL Refs are Starting to get better at this. we can only hope!

titleist wrote:

hockfan1980 wrote:What gives with the refs this year it sure seems like they favor one team more than the other almost every game. I've always been a supporter but this is getting rediculous. Don't they know there's an oath to be neutral and consistant.

I'd like this post to mention good and badly ref'd games and maybe they'll realize it's about the girls and not them. They'll know everyones watching and be held accountable.

Seems like most of our games this year, the refs have been trying to make the games as even as possible, meaning if one team gets up by 2 goals, they start playing shorthanded alot more to try and get the score back to tied. Drives me crazy!!

This bugs the heck out me also. Refs should never call the game by the score. I will say we've had some terrible ref's our tournament game against Centennial. Don't get me wrong a couple of our players take some bad penalties. But we had i think 3 - 3 against 5's and the second penalty were very weak. I think there were a total of 22 penalties called in that game. Terrible! Refs should have been able to get control and didn't.

I'm from the north and think the officiating is so much better than when we venture down to the cities. In the cities the ref's call tic tack penalties and lose the flow of games. Let them play only call the obvious penalties.

hockfan1980 wrote:I'm from the north and think the officiating is so much better than when we venture down to the cities. In the cities the ref's call tic tack penalties and lose the flow of games. Let them play only call the obvious penalties.

You mean when you come to the cities the refs call the hooking and holding like the rules indicate they should!

No up here they let the kids play. There are more that realize nobody is there to see them. I won't say all refs in the north are better than metro refs but there are more, good refs up here.

Some are even close to the ref's IQ maximum and will be eligible to become coaches.

Unfortunately all have actually played the game so they will never reach the superiority of the "I never played but my kid is the next Sidney Crosby" parent.

hockeya1a wrote:

hockfan1980 wrote:I'm from the north and think the officiating is so much better than when we venture down to the cities. In the cities the ref's call tic tack penalties and lose the flow of games. Let them play only call the obvious penalties.

You mean when you come to the cities the refs call the hooking and holding like the rules indicate they should!

i usually agreee with ya. I think hooking, holding, interference are all penalties that can be called on every play and I don't like those types of calls unless it's very obvious. Watch a college game and it has to be almost a take down before a penalty is called. I think HS should be called the same way.

Also I hate when they call a penalty when a strong player bumps in a weaker player and falls. A ref has to be able to see the difference between a check and a bump and no call it.

Rules You can't call girls games the way you call the boys. Ref's shouldn't decide a game. Let them play! I promise you'll like the game better.

I agree with Melvin and hockeyfan. They need to let the girls play. In girls hockey you have weak girls all the to very strong girls they cant make a call every time somebody falls down. some refs treat them like there U12 players.We had a game that they called 19 penalties against a top 10 team that wrecked the game.

Melvin44 wrote:

hockeya1a wrote:

hockfan1980 wrote:I'm from the north and think the officiating is so much better than when we venture down to the cities. In the cities the ref's call tic tack penalties and lose the flow of games. Let them play only call the obvious penalties.

You mean when you come to the cities the refs call the hooking and holding like the rules indicate they should!

i usually agreee with ya. I think hooking, holding, interference are all penalties that can be called on every play and I don't like those types of calls unless it's very obvious. Watch a college game and it has to be almost a take down before a penalty is called. I think HS should be called the same way.

Also I hate when they call a penalty when a strong player bumps in a weaker player and falls. A ref has to be able to see the difference between a check and a bump and no call it.

I agree completely but the game does also slow down when someone is always being held or hooked, and a weaker team can take advantage of this, I was watching a game this last week and the flow of the game was slowed down because every time a player got a little space they were held up by a hook and on a few occasions even spun around and puck taken away.

hockeya1a wrote:

Melvin44 wrote:

hockeya1a wrote: You mean when you come to the cities the refs call the hooking and holding like the rules indicate they should!

i usually agreee with ya. I think hooking, holding, interference are all penalties that can be called on every play and I don't like those types of calls unless it's very obvious. Watch a college game and it has to be almost a take down before a penalty is called. I think HS should be called the same way.


Also I hate when they call a penalty when a strong player bumps in a weaker player and falls. A ref has to be able to see the difference between a check and a bump and no call it.

I agree completely but the game does also slow down when someone is always being held or hooked, and a weaker team can take advantage of this, I was watching a game this last week and the flow of the game was slowed down because every time a player got a little space they were held up by a hook and on a few occasions even spun around and puck taken away.

I do agree with you here. Those are penalties and should be called. I just don't like the 1 second hook like in the pro's. Unless we play Roseville they're very good at the 1-2 second hook.

Melvin44 wrote:

hockeya1a wrote:

Melvin44 wrote: i usually agreee with ya. I think hooking, holding, interference are all penalties that can be called on every play and I don't like those types of calls unless it's very obvious. Watch a college game and it has to be almost a take down before a penalty is called. I think HS should be called the same way.


Also I hate when they call a penalty when a strong player bumps in a weaker player and falls. A ref has to be able to see the difference between a check and a bump and no call it.

I agree completely but the game does also slow down when someone is always being held or hooked, and a weaker team can take advantage of this, I was watching a game this last week and the flow of the game was slowed down because every time a player got a little space they were held up by a hook and on a few occasions even spun around and puck taken away.

I do agree with you here. Those are penalties and should be called. I just don't like the 1 second hook like in the pro's. Unless we play Roseville they're very good at the 1-2 second hook.

Followed by the 2 minute retaliation penalty on the bears??

Hansonbrother wrote:

Melvin44 wrote:

hockeya1a wrote: I agree completely but the game does also slow down when someone is always being held or hooked, and a weaker team can take advantage of this, I was watching a game this last week and the flow of the game was slowed down because every time a player got a little space they were held up by a hook and on a few occasions even spun around and puck taken away.

I do agree with you here. Those are penalties and should be called. I just don't like the 1 second hook like in the pro's. Unless we play Roseville they're very good at the 1-2 second hook.

Followed by the 2 minute retaliation penalty on the bears??

Well I guess if you only get one second to hook you might as well make it a good one!!!

When you're right your right. I missed you hansonbro.

Hansonbrother wrote:

Melvin44 wrote:

hockeya1a wrote: I agree completely but the game does also slow down when someone is always being held or hooked, and a weaker team can take advantage of this, I was watching a game this last week and the flow of the game was slowed down because every time a player got a little space they were held up by a hook and on a few occasions even spun around and puck taken away.

I do agree with you here. Those are penalties and should be called. I just don't like the 1 second hook like in the pro's. Unless we play Roseville they're very good at the 1-2 second hook.

Followed by the 2 minute retaliation penalty on the bears??

Don't forget the 10 minute misconduct for throwing their stick.

I've seen a few one sided games. The refs call a couple too many penalties on one team, and then they make a "make up" call on the other. I think they should just let the girls play. I mean there are the obvious calls, but then there is the bigger girl bumps the smaller girl and the bigger girl gets the penalty. Those kind of calls I could live without.

Melvin, couldn't agree with you more on the 2 player in the corner penalty when one comes away standing up and then is escorted right to the box.

Another thought. Last night I watched a game where refs called a couple of ticky tacky penalties that allowed a weaker team to get back in the game. Example, too many men on the ice where it was obvious one girl got stuck in the door as the other was coming off. There was no unfair advantage and it never affected the play (heck, I've seen a sixth skater fly around for 20 seconds and nobody notices). They tied it up on that power play (about 2 minutes left in the game) and went into overtime where the refs then swallowed their whistles. Then in OT a girl was obviously tripped as she had clear sailing on her way to the net, what could have easily been a penalty shot turned out to be no call at all. You could tell the fans from the other team knew they got away with one. Bottom line, the other team scores a cheesey goal on the next shift and wins the game. Just another example of how the refs had more to do with the outcome than what they should have.

I've said it before, there should be an unbiased group of people that grade these guys and hold them accountable.

I've said it before, there should be an unbiased group of people that grade these guys and hold them accountable.[/quote]


This last statement is great. Why not have a representative of HS hockey be present when top teams play or at least let the fefs know they might be in attendance? I know they can't be at all games but could probably make a few top tilts.

The MSHSL does send people out to evaluate referess for possible State tournament candidates.
They obviously can't go to every game or school.
Some Referee associtations hand out Coach's evaluation cards to head coaches before every game that allow Coaches to evalutate each individual ref.
The MSHSL has a website that allows referees and coaches to evaluate each other, players, fans and arena staff.
Some conferences have chosen to go to two man instead of three man crews to save money. You get what you pay for sometimes.

Girls hockey is not that easy to officiate.
Girls play no checking, not no contact hockey.
Every time two girls run into each other trying to play the puck, one team wants a powerplay, the other wants them to "let em play".

When in doubt, score one more goal than the other team and everything will be OK.

I've said it before, there should be an unbiased group of people that grade these guys and hold them accountable. Which group would you suggest these unbiasd grading people come from? Parents, school districts, players, or who? Everyone has a jaded view related to game calling in one respect or another. There are plenty of evaluators coming to the rink at all levels of hockey. Another volunteer task that goes un-noticed most of the time.

When our teams run up against tight game callers, we set our game plan to match the game calling. Same deal when you have officials that tend to let you play a bit more. With the number of games being played, and the amount of officials needed to cover them, it's unlikely anyone will see the same game calling each night.

Bottom line, it's not always the officials that ruin a good game. Many times you can look to a foolish player that consistently gets that stupid penalty or a coach that doesn't control their team properly. No doubt you will run into subpar officials now and then. That's life and you need to adjust when it happens.

I get a kick out of anyone here, or at the arena judging on ice officials and or coaches. Seems unless you have been there, it's a bit foolish to criticize something you don't have experience with.

Imagine for a second if your child was the on ice official, rather than the player. How would you critique the effort differently? Part of the reason we see a decline in new officials, is the constant barrage of unrealistic expectations put on them by "some" coaches, and many fans. It's easy to spot the parent of a ref. They are usually enjoying a hockey game, and not worrying so much about how the officials screwed them somehow.

Cheer for your player, encourage them to work hard, support their efforts. Past that your job is pretty much done.

Just so you know I have refed games and it is a tough job. But there are some out there who do abuse their responsibility to call a fair, consistant game. When I coached I also tried to help my players adjust to the different styles. I also understand players and teams also make bad decisions and have stated so in my posts.

This year I have seen at least 6 games which the referee's were not consistant at all or called per score. I've seen a couple refs actually talking to players and coaches while play is going on. It just isn't right and so I've commented. Ref's are paid a good amount of money call a FAIR AND CONSISTANT GAME. Be neutral or don't be a ref...

If you can honestly say during a game you've never said what the heck is going on or what are these refs thinking. I wouldn't believe you. Or you must be a ref.

Bottom line is i've always supported refs but it seems they're really trying to control outcomes of games and it's wrong and should be held accountable.

And yes there are a lot of outstanding refs. The 2 in our SWC vs WBL game were pretty good. Consitant for both sides.

My job is tough, your job is tough, we all get paid to do a good job or we don't have a job!

I think that what most of us are saying is that the refs should not determine the outcome of a game.

Decide early in the game whether you're calling it tight or loose and then be consistent end-to-end.

I have seen 2 or 3 games this year called in favor of the ranked team when the unranked team is outplaying them. I have seen a ref go so far as to start to raise his arm to call a penalty and then rub his eye instead. Two goals were scored in that game on advantages gained by the ranked team on tripping/hooking non-calls. The ranked team won by a score of 4-3. That particular game is on tape for anyone who wishes to pay $25.

Be consistent and get out of the way. The refs should be barely visible. Let the girls play decide the game for BOTH teams.

Agree 100%. Well said.

I have a tendency to babble.