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Since this game is being played at the worlds greatest hockey arena, the Vadnais Sports Center, there will be a pre-sale for tickets. Tickets go on sale tomorrow ( Tuesday) at 4pm at VSC. You might as well sleep in your car in the parking lot until the game on Thursday so you have a place to park. The Mounds View/ Woodbury game that was supposed to start at the same time as this game has been move up to 3:30pm. There are 13 year olds who have never seen White Bear win a regular season game against the Pioneers, how long will the streak continue?

[quote="Wblhcky2424"]Since this game is being played at the worlds greatest hockey arena, the Vadnais Sports Center, there will be a pre-sale for tickets. Tickets go on sale tomorrow ( Tuesday) at 4pm at VSC. You might as well sleep in your car in the parking lot until the game on Thursday so you have a place to park. The Mounds View/ Woodbury game that was supposed to start at the same time as this game has been move up to 3:30pm. There are 13 year olds who have never seen White Bear win a regular season game against the Pioneers, how long will the streak continue?[/quote Where is the town of Hill Murray?

Hill hasn't been great in the first period of games this year. I could be wrong, but I think they've given up the first goal in half their games so far. The pioneers just don't have the offensive weapons to consistently come from behind, especially when they start playing better teams. If the bears can get up quick and weather a couple of storms, they certainly could win. Big rivalry, home game for WBL, lack of scoring depth for Hill, all should give the Bears fans hope in his one. All that said, I think Hill pulls out a close one.

Bob steals the show in this one.

Clarkkent wrote:Bob steals the show in this one.

This is a terrific matchup of two very good senior goaltenders.

BlueLineSpecial wrote:Hill hasn't been great in the first period of games this year. I could be wrong, but I think they've given up the first goal in half their games so far. The pioneers just don't have the offensive weapons to consistently come from behind, especially when they start playing better teams. If the bears can get up quick and weather a couple of storms, they certainly could win. Big rivalry, home game for WBL, lack of scoring depth for Hill, all should give the Bears fans hope in his one. All that said, I think Hill pulls out a close one.

Doesn't probability indicate that is to be expected?

Goldy Gopher wrote:

BlueLineSpecial wrote:Hill hasn't been great in the first period of games this year. I could be wrong, but I think they've given up the first goal in half their games so far. The pioneers just don't have the offensive weapons to consistently come from behind, especially when they start playing better teams. If the bears can get up quick and weather a couple of storms, they certainly could win. Big rivalry, home game for WBL, lack of scoring depth for Hill, all should give the Bears fans hope in his one. All that said, I think Hill pulls out a close one.

Doesn't probability indicate that is to be expected?

Oh I'm not smart enough for this debate. But I think that for probability to be measured correctly, the event has to be completely equal and unbiased. This would not be the case with first goals in games. Talent, gameplan, ice conditions, etc. should alter the measurement.

I am going with Hill and Helgeson (via Roseau) will be the difference!

Just so everyone knows, The Horn will be broadcasting this live, in high definition, advertising free (!!!), with a crew of six announcers who know both these teams very well.

Pregame starts at 7:00, so you can tune in at http://TheHornWBL.com

Pioneers fans are welcome and encouraged!

presale. ok


assume plenty of tickets remain for WEd presale? anyone confirm?

hockeyhockeyhockey wrote:presale. ok


assume plenty of tickets remain for WEd presale? anyone confirm?

You should be fine on Wednesday

Wblhcky2424 wrote:

hockeyhockeyhockey wrote:presale. ok


assume plenty of tickets remain for WEd presale? anyone confirm?

You should be fine on Wednesday

Bought pre sale tickets last night during the WB girls HS game. This was several hours after pre sale tickets went on sale. There was never really a line. Plenty of tickets still available.

You might want to UBER in and UBER out Thursday night. With those two new stupid buildings in the parking lot it's hard to find parking during a squirt B game now.

I don't think there is as much excitement for this game as there was in the past. I think Both teams are down compared to previous years, and there is no super stars, on either team that draws the excitement. I guess that my opinion coming from someone who did use to get excited about watching the two teams play. This year I'm not sure who id go there to watch. I think Stillwater would be more of a draw against maybe the winner of this game. I hope the WBL / Hill matchups of old do return though....

Daulton21 wrote:I don't think there is as much excitement for this game as there was in the past. I think Both teams are down compared to previous years, and there is no super stars, on either team that draws the excitement. I guess that my opinion coming from someone who did use to get excited about watching the two teams play. This year I'm not sure who id go there to watch. I think Stillwater would be more of a draw against maybe the winner of this game. I hope the WBL / Hill matchups of old do return though....

Rivalries are what you make of them. Much of what makes a great rivalry is that people get up for the game regardless of record. I'd also disagree that both teams are down:

PageStat as of 12/10:
WBL #13
HM #5

HockeyHub as of 12/21:
WBL #19
HM #10

Karl (East) as of 12/18:
WBL Bubble Team
HM #9

And while I get that there aren't any massive superstars, there are plenty of very good (if not great) players, and no shortage of kids that will play collegiate hockey down the road. You also have two of the state's best goalies going head to head. This game also has serious section implications. I'd have to go back and look at records and rankings from recent years, but this match-up is probably as close in record/ranking of these two teams that there has been in several years.

I'm excited for the game. Unfortunately I can't make it, so I'll be watching Zach's totally unbiased and balanced commentary. I said it at the end of last season, and I still think it's true. This year's HM team is going to be very good, and has the potential to be great. If a few things fall into place, and they can make it past thru whats shaping up to be a tough section, they can do some damage.

Fun facts about this once great rivalry:

The schools are 4 miles apart.

The 85th game is tonight.
HM 55-23-2 vs. WBL and 4-0 vs. WB Mariner.

Hill-Murray (27) and White Bear Lake (11) have won 38 of the 42 Section Titles since 1975. The only exceptions are North St Paul in 1981, Centennial in 2004 and Stillwater in 2014 and 2016.

Current HM win streak is 6.
HM is 20-1 since 2005.

This was a balanced rivalry. For 17 seasons from 1989 to 2005: HM won 22, WBL won 19 and there was 1 tie. WBL went to State 9 times and HM 7 times.

1st game 1/3/1963 at Aldrich - WBL won 2-0.
Most recent game 12/8/2015 at Aldrich - HM won 5-2.

HM's 3 greatest wins:
1. 3/1/1991 Section Final at Met Center - HM won 4-3. HM rallied from 3-0 down and then won the State Championship the following week.
2. 3/3/2006 Section Final at the Coliseum - HM won 5-4 in 2OT.
3. 2/29/2008 Section Final at the Coliseum - HM won 2-1 and won the State Championship the following week.

WBL's 3 greatest wins:
1. 2/28/1996 Section Semi-final at the Coliseum - WBL won 4-3 in OT. HM was ranked #1 in the State at 22-1. WBL was 8-14-1.
2. 3/4/2011 Section Final at the Coliseum - WBL won 5-4 in OT. Ended a 14 game HM win streak.
3. 2/27/1998 Section Final at the Coliseum - WBL won 4-1 to win their 4th section title in 5 years.

Most lopsided games:
12/19/1997 HM won 12-1
2/17/2001 WBL won 8-0

HM joined the MSHSL in 1974-5. HM beat WBL Mariner 3 times in Section Finals and 1 Semi-final between 1975 - 1980. 3 of those were in OT and the other was a 1 goal game. Thus the beginnings of the rivalry.

Good stuff stpaul.

How many times have they played against each other in section finals?

blueblood wrote:Good stuff stpaul.

How many times have they played against each other in section finals?

Not as many as you would think. 19 times including 3 vs Mariner, 16 times without. HM is 11-5 vs WBL and 3-0 vs Mariner in Section Finals. They also have met 10 times in the Semi-finals. HM is 7-3 in those. HM 21-8 in 29 playoff games.

stpaul wrote:Fun facts about this once great rivalry:

The schools are 4 miles apart.

The 85th game is tonight.
HM 55-23-2 vs. WBL and 4-0 vs. WB Mariner.

Hill-Murray (27) and White Bear Lake (11) have won 38 of the 42 Section Titles since 1975. The only exceptions are North St Paul in 1981, Centennial in 2004 and Stillwater in 2014 and 2016.

Current HM win streak is 6.
HM is 20-1 since 2005.

This was a balanced rivalry. For 17 seasons from 1989 to 2005: HM won 22, WBL won 19 and there was 1 tie. WBL went to State 9 times and HM 7 times.

1st game 1/3/1963 at Aldrich - WBL won 2-0.
Most recent game 12/8/2015 at Aldrich - HM won 5-2.

HM's 3 greatest wins:
1. 3/1/1991 Section Final at Met Center - HM won 4-3. HM rallied from 3-0 down and then won the State Championship the following week.
2. 3/3/2006 Section Final at the Coliseum - HM won 5-4 in 2OT.
3. 2/29/2008 Section Final at the Coliseum - HM won 2-1 and won the State Championship the following week.

WBL's 3 greatest wins:
1. 2/28/1996 Section Semi-final at the Coliseum - WBL won 4-3 in OT. HM was ranked #1 in the State at 22-1. WBL was 8-14-1.
2. 3/4/2011 Section Final at the Coliseum - WBL won 5-4 in OT. Ended a 14 game HM win streak.
3. 2/27/1998 Section Final at the Coliseum - WBL won 4-1 to win their 4th section title in 5 years.

Most lopsided games:
12/19/1997 HM won 12-1
2/17/2001 WBL won 8-0

HM joined the MSHSL in 1974-5. HM beat WBL Mariner 3 times in Section Finals and 1 Semi-final between 1975 - 1980. 3 of those were in OT and the other was a 1 goal game. Thus the beginnings of the rivalry.

White Bear Mariner went in 1982 and finished second. Do we need to pull out the history of WB Mariner pdf? I see, you're shoving that in the WBL column.

Highlighted game above was against #1 in state WBL with their best player ever as a senior (Brian Bonin), who I believe beat Hill both times in the regular season. It was a great game.

Sparlimb wrote:

stpaul wrote:Fun facts about this once great rivalry:

The schools are 4 miles apart.

The 85th game is tonight.
HM 55-23-2 vs. WBL and 4-0 vs. WB Mariner.

Hill-Murray (27) and White Bear Lake (11) have won 38 of the 42 Section Titles since 1975. The only exceptions are North St Paul in 1981, Centennial in 2004 and Stillwater in 2014 and 2016.

Current HM win streak is 6.
HM is 20-1 since 2005.

This was a balanced rivalry. For 17 seasons from 1989 to 2005: HM won 22, WBL won 19 and there was 1 tie. WBL went to State 9 times and HM 7 times.

1st game 1/3/1963 at Aldrich - WBL won 2-0.
Most recent game 12/8/2015 at Aldrich - HM won 5-2.

HM's 3 greatest wins:
1. 3/1/1991 Section Final at Met Center - HM won 4-3. HM rallied from 3-0 down and then won the State Championship the following week.
2. 3/3/2006 Section Final at the Coliseum - HM won 5-4 in 2OT.
3. 2/29/2008 Section Final at the Coliseum - HM won 2-1 and won the State Championship the following week.

WBL's 3 greatest wins:
1. 2/28/1996 Section Semi-final at the Coliseum - WBL won 4-3 in OT. HM was ranked #1 in the State at 22-1. WBL was 8-14-1.
2. 3/4/2011 Section Final at the Coliseum - WBL won 5-4 in OT. Ended a 14 game HM win streak.
3. 2/27/1998 Section Final at the Coliseum - WBL won 4-1 to win their 4th section title in 5 years.

Most lopsided games:
12/19/1997 HM won 12-1
2/17/2001 WBL won 8-0

HM joined the MSHSL in 1974-5. HM beat WBL Mariner 3 times in Section Finals and 1 Semi-final between 1975 - 1980. 3 of those were in OT and the other was a 1 goal game. Thus the beginnings of the rivalry.

White Bear Mariner went in 1982 and finished second. Do we need to pull out the history of WB Mariner pdf? I see, you're shoving that in the WBL column.

Highlighted game above was against #1 in state WBL with their best player ever as a senior (Brian Bonin), who I believe beat Hill both times in the regular season. It was a great game.

Bonin graduated in 1992, meaning he was a junior in the 1991 section final.

In Bonin's three years with White Bear, the Bears were beaten five times by Hill-Murray in the eight games they played. Also in those eight games, both teams scored 22 goals.

They split two games in Bonin's sophomore year, Hill won two of the three games when Bonin was a junior and did the same thing in Bonin's senior season.

Well that's not satisfying

From my seat it was a pretty good hockey game. Both teams have very strong D and really good Senior goalies. Not a lot of room to move out there. HM has a little more skill & speed up front and Parenteau had to make a couple of big time saves. Both teams will get better when they settle on line combinations. Stillwater is rightfully ranked #1 in the State, but it will not be easy for them to get by both WBL and HM. Too bad there is no HM - Stillwater regular season game this year.

stpaul wrote: Most lopsided games:
12/19/1997 HM won 12-1
2/17/2001 WBL won 8-0

That's the year Hill finished 12-14-1, their only losing season in a very long time, possibly their only season under .500.

stpaul wrote: HM beat WBL Mariner 3 times in Section Finals and 1 Semi-final between 1975 - 1980. 3 of those were in OT and the other was a 1 goal game.

For your information, Hill beat Mariner 4-1 in the 1975 Region 3 finals, 4-3 in O.T. in the semifinals in 1976, 2-1 in regulation in the 1977 finals and 4-3 in double O.T. in the 1980 finals.

That makes two of those in O.T. and one (1977) as a 1-goal game in regulation.

Get your facts correct.

stpaul wrote:Most lopsided games:
12/19/1997 HM won 12-1
2/17/2001 WBL won 8-0

The 12-1 loss for White Bear was actually on December 19, 1996 (Steve Hurt's first year as head coach of the Bears. Hurt only lasted two years before he was released from the school for illegal doings).

If there is one thing that Section Playoff hockey is known for, it's upsets. Sure, the favorites carry it most of the time, but it is the possibility of an upset that fills the stands of whatever venue that game is being played at.

Depending on how one looks at it, hockey either sucks or is amazing because of the frequency of said upsets. From Duluth East over Edina to the other hundreds of famous upsets at all levels of hockey including the biggest upset in all of sports, no team should ever feel safe entering the playoffs.

I am happy to be a WBL fan this year because I would be terrified of playing this team. As they showed on Thursday night, this team has all of the ingredients to pull a rabbit or two out of their helmets in February. Solid goaltending, impressive defense, and an offense that can surprise you all add up to a very scary team to have to play.

Are Hill-Murray and Stillwater more skilled? Possibly. Will they end WBL's season at Aldrich Arena? Probably, but not definitely. The way this Bears team is built, I will take "probably" at this point.

More questions will hopefully be answered when WBL plays Stillwater on January 14 in WBL and, get this, in their final regular season game in Stillwater February 16. There could be some serious seeding implications for that final game, and I'd imagine a good size crowd filling the St. Croix Valley Rec Center that night.

I asked for a White Bear Lake - Hill-Murray section playoff game for Christmas this year. Let's hope Santa comes through.