National and Select camp selections...

Discussion of Minnesota Girls High School Hockey

Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Tue May 14, 2019 11:10 am

I'm surprised there's been no discussion on this:

https://www.minnesotahockey.org/news_ar ... ow/1020625

11 02's selected (so far) for the Select Camp - 8F and 3D
7 -03's - 3F, 2D, 2G

The supporting text says 23 Minnesotans, so I assume that means 5 '04s, though I haven't seen them named anywhere. Based on the bias towards Gopher commits in the past, I'm assuming those 4 plus 1 other. Anyone know if that's the case or who those 5 are?

15 '03 MN players invited to 16/17 camp
7 '02 MN players

The way it has been described this year, only those 22 are competing for additional spots - no others will be considered (including any '04s).

Thoughts?

massalsa
Posts: 490
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:37 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by massalsa » Tue May 14, 2019 1:07 pm

I have heard from a couple of people over the last year that the MN 04 class is remarkably deep but 5 seems like a lot for the 66/select camp in July.

I like to look at the geographic distribution of kids that make camps as MN selections:

Looks like Andover and Edina are strong across all camps again. Minnetonka with 3 02's at 66/select camp and 1 03 at National camp. Farmington is strong at 16s. A handful of Benildes at 16 too. Edina and Andover will continue to be strong for years to come.

Notably there is 1 Blake at 17 and 1 Breck at 16. I think that both of those privates have stronger 04's but that remains to be seen.

I only see 1 kid to 66/select in both years who is not committed (congrats!!!). Her plus the Warroad kids at 2002 are not committed despite the flurry of commitment activity over the last 6 months.

I am sure that there will be a few more additions from MN to the national camp as the other regions/districts continue to finish their tryouts and selections to both camps. According to many MN continues year in and year out to be grossly underrepresented at the National camp as USA hockey has districts to satisfy for their spots.

Welcome to MN/USA hockey realities for those of you who feel wronged by the process. I am sure that you are not alone this year and many from years past feel your pain. There are several gopher commits who did not make a camp this year (yet) who arguably either were bad at 54's or did not get the Gopher commit easy pass to a camp.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Tue May 14, 2019 1:39 pm

I’ve heard the same about the ‘04s, but also that the top end is not as high as some other years (also consistent with your point). But my comment about 5 was based on the article from Minnesota hockey - said 23 Minnesota kids going to Select camp, then named 18 03s and 02s.

I’ve heard several parents say that the national camps at the 15 level are noticeably weaker than the MN camp at 15s - the rest of the country brings the quality down (top end kids from elsewhere are incredible, but depth is so far down that the artificial constraints on the number of Minnesota kids creates a weaker camp). Not sure that’s true at the much higher bar of the 66s.

Finally, one should not forget (and when I say that I don’t mean you, I mean others reading this) when looking at the schools represented three things: 1) there are kids that have aged out as seniors next year that will be major factors (Blake, for example, has (the) two (of the) best forwards in Minnesota as seniors next year), 2) several good 02s chose not to participate this year (knew they weren’t making the U18s team, but still at this skill level) and 3) the current rosters are not necessarily the final rosters (each private school might add some kids).

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:22 pm

15 camp underway - anyone have comments on action?

As of midday today, two leading scorers are both uncommitted Blake 8th graders (one has played an extra game tho)...

massalsa
Posts: 490
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:37 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by massalsa » Tue Jun 11, 2019 5:27 pm

Saw on twitter that the leading scorer's brother committed yesterday to the Gophers...wonder if that is where Samantha will end up...feels like that is a definite possibility. They are both very talented hockey players.

Any brother/sister tandem better than the Kessel's...ever?

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:33 am

Great question! Not sure who would belong on the list, but Sam and Tristan might earn their way someday - pretty good start so far!

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 6:27 pm

I’m interested in the age bias present in both USA hockey’s evaluation process and college recruiting. Led by Frost who has recruited almost exclusively kids with birth months between January and July in the last three years, kids born in the first half of the year have a HUGE advantage in birth-year based events like USA hockey evaluations, and that is quite short-sighted - talent does not favor those months that much.

NEVERTHELESS, led by a breakout offensive performance by Broz, U15 state camp concluded with the scoring leaderboard filled by:

1) Uncommitted 8th grader (Blake)
2) Uncommitted 8th grader (Andover)
3) 9th grade Clarkson commit
4) 9th grade Northeastern commit
5) Uncommitted 8th grader (Blake)
5) 9th grade Gopher commit
5) Uncommitted 9th grader (BSM)

Trailed by (all of these are 9th graders):
Forwards:
1 Gopher commit
2 Mankato commits
1 UMD commit

Defense:
2 Gopher commits
1 Harvard commit
1 Penn St commit
1 Brown commit
1 Dartmouth commit

Another Blake 8th grader was also near the top of the leaderboard, along with 8th graders from Moorhead, Buffalo and River Lakes (maybe 1 more).

All of those committed players are terrific, and the scoring stats were of very dubious quality - lots of missed assists, phantom assists and even mis-credited goals. Still, those 8th graders were at the top of a deep and talented pack while playing uphill against a predominantly older group of opponents all of whom were correspondingly playing downhill. Pretty impressive performances by some younger 04s...

jg2112
Posts: 524
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:36 am

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by jg2112 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 9:48 am

j4241 wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 6:27 pm
I’m interested in the age bias present in both USA hockey’s evaluation process and college recruiting. Led by Frost who has recruited almost exclusively kids with birth months between January and July in the last three years, kids born in the first half of the year have a HUGE advantage in birth-year based events like USA hockey evaluations, and that is quite short-sighted - talent does not favor those months that much.

NEVERTHELESS, led by a breakout offensive performance by Broz, U15 state camp concluded with the scoring leaderboard filled by:

1) Uncommitted 8th grader (Blake)
2) Uncommitted 8th grader (Andover)
3) 9th grade Clarkson commit
4) 9th grade Northeastern commit
5) Uncommitted 8th grader (Blake)
5) 9th grade Gopher commit
5) Uncommitted 9th grader (BSM)

Trailed by (all of these are 9th graders):
Forwards:
1 Gopher commit
2 Mankato commits
1 UMD commit

Defense:
2 Gopher commits
1 Harvard commit
1 Penn St commit
1 Brown commit
1 Dartmouth commit

Another Blake 8th grader was also near the top of the leaderboard, along with 8th graders from Moorhead, Buffalo and River Lakes (maybe 1 more).

All of those committed players are terrific, and the scoring stats were of very dubious quality - lots of missed assists, phantom assists and even mis-credited goals. Still, those 8th graders were at the top of a deep and talented pack while playing uphill against a predominantly older group of opponents all of whom were correspondingly playing downhill. Pretty impressive performances by some younger 04s...
I know all of the others. Who is the Penn State commit?

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:42 am

I actually think there’s a few I missed, too (UMD defenseman?). But I’m realizing I’m not sure the penn state commit has announced yet - I’d prefer not to share.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:43 am

Oh - whoops - not a D tho.

BeauKnowsHockey
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:55 pm
Location: Woodbury, MN
Contact:

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by BeauKnowsHockey » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:05 am

j4241 wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:42 am
I actually think there’s a few I missed, too (UMD defenseman?). But I’m realizing I’m not sure the penn state commit has announced yet - I’d prefer not to share.
When they decide to announce... I would like to know so I can update their profiles! Also, let me know if EliteProspects is missing any of these commits!
Minnesota based volunteer for EliteProspects.com

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:45 am

One of the ones I missed is a Mankato D commit. Lillie Ramirez, South St. Paul ‘22. She’s announced, and I can’t find her on eliteprospects.com at all.

The Harvard and Penn State are on the website but not announced (along with another Princeton commit), but the rest look like their college choices are on the website.

jg2112
Posts: 524
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:36 am

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by jg2112 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:50 am

j4241 wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:45 am
One of the ones I missed is a Mankato D commit. Lillie Ramirez, South St. Paul ‘22. She’s announced, and I can’t find her on eliteprospects.com at all.

The Harvard and Penn State are on the website but not announced (along with another Princeton commit), but the rest look like their college choices are on the website.
Completely understand. I know of the Harvard and Princeton commits. I have a guess as to who the Penn State commit is, but I'll wait to see who it is when it goes public in 12 months and one day : ).

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:52 am

I am not previously familiar with EliteProspects.com, other than just seeing it show up in search results. But I admire your efforts to be exhaustive.

It is aimed at a different role (evaluation vs database), but I was an early fan of NeutralZone, at least in concept. Unfortunately the ridiculous gaps in their coverage and their very superficial evaluations make it almost useless as a tool to follow the good kids in the game. I may start keeping a closer eye on yours.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:59 am

When I click on subscribe to premium, I go to a dead page. What do I get if I pay for it?

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:03 pm

Back to the subject of the thread, it will be interesting to see on Monday who gets invited to the 18 development camp (not to mention the 15 national camp). There were some terrific performances by kids that I don’t think would have been on anyone’s radar screen, and some (slight) duds by bigger name players. It was a short event, suspect stat keeping, some kids putting up big stats played with past teammates and had more instant chemistry, which may or may not be taken into account. Regardless, it would be hard for me to believe the Gopher commits are just the automatic invites, based on the weekend.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:24 pm

My last point on the 15 camp (week, not weekend) - points, obviously, are a very poor way to identify talented defense. I saw some kids get on the front page of the scoring list that are really dangerous defense to have on the ice, and others not hitting the score sheet that are absolute studs.

BeauKnowsHockey
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:55 pm
Location: Woodbury, MN
Contact:

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by BeauKnowsHockey » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:26 pm

j4241 wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:45 am
One of the ones I missed is a Mankato D commit. Lillie Ramirez, South St. Paul ‘22. She’s announced, and I can’t find her on eliteprospects.com at all.

The Harvard and Penn State are on the website but not announced (along with another Princeton commit), but the rest look like their college choices are on the website.
I sent you a message to not clog the board with off topic stuff!

https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/5 ... ie-ramirez
Minnesota based volunteer for EliteProspects.com

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:59 am

Invitations have been issued, but USA hockey has still not updated the public lists. It's a really cruel thing to do - they very openly said that rosters would be updated June 17, then only told the kids that got in via email. The rest are dangling in the wind... Hopefully the full lists will be published shortly.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:44 pm

Now out.

For those curious:

https://www.minnesotahockey.org/page/sh ... ional-camp

5 to the 18 camp (1D , 4F; also 1 8th grader, 4 9th graders)

45 to the 15 camp (15D, 25F, 5G; also 16 8th graders, 29 9th graders)

Three from Blake, three from Benilde, three from Andover, three from Holy Family. No other schools with more than two.

jg2112
Posts: 524
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:36 am

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by jg2112 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:50 pm

j4241 wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:44 pm
Now out.

For those curious:

https://www.minnesotahockey.org/page/sh ... ional-camp

5 to the 18 camp (1D , 4F; also 1 8th grader, 4 9th graders)

45 to the 15 camp (15D, 25F, 5G; also 16 8th graders, 29 9th graders)

Three from Blake, three from Benilde, three from Andover, three from Holy Family. No other schools with more than two.
From what I've heard at the rink, there's at least 4-5 Blake girls on these lists.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:08 pm

Katelyn Roberts committed to Penn State - that was the one I held back on, but I saw an announcement on SportsRecruits - U18 camp invitee.

j4241
Posts: 137
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:38 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by j4241 » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:12 pm

Possible on the Blake front - I understand two possible new students played with Blake at the Lakeville stp event this weekend...

Thoen88
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:53 am

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by Thoen88 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 10:05 am

Curious if anyone knows why they would send 10 forwards per team to the National Camp? Why not 9 or 12? Thanks.

Lake South Alum
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:35 pm

Re: National and Select camp selections...

Post by Lake South Alum » Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:58 am

I'm not certain the reason for 10 forwards, but I think its a great number as long as they roll the players.

It allows the players to basically get on the ice every 1/3 shift, but doesn't lock them in with the same players for the entire game.

12 forwards (as they have in the Minnesota Spring Festival) is too many as the players don't get as many shifts and can end up playing the whole game with someone they don't mesh with.

Post Reply