Tonka 18-0 over STMA

[Brodziak Fan Club]

Brodz

Who's obsessive?

1. The parent for wanting to bust a family for cheating the system? Keep in mind in some cases these parents see this firsthand that the family never moved as they live in the same old neighborhood as the cheating family and see them coming and going like its no big deal

2. The parent(s) who send their kid to a hockey school and rent a house/apt the next town over just to beat the system. Then dear old dad convinces his family they have to lie to their friends the entire year by saying they "really did move" and the reason they moved was for the "education"

Totally get where you’re coming from. Obviously it’s wrong for people to circumvent the rules. That being said, the way you described staking out people’s homes caught me a little funny. I feel like the system needs to be fixed and not individual players/teams.

[High Heat]

Serious question here.

Is it really Goldsworthy recruiting or more the fact that Breakaway Academy is near by and run by Andy Brink (Who coaches at Minnetonka at the Peewee AA Level, Also the Bantam AA coach is a Breakaway employee). Seems like a nice little feeder system.

I just wonder how much that plays a bigger part.

Unless someone can provide some other info I actually think Brink is one of the good ones. Initially what he and Dave set out to do was what they thought was a better option. I actually think Brink was more invested in the CC association and was heavily involved. Of course at that time, BA was only based out of CC and with the new campus(es) they are not the same school/program they once were. When they started it was super exclusive with nearly all being D1 talent kids whereas now it’s more of a put my kid in and expect them to get better, when in reality they’re C and B2 level kids. They’ve also just opened the doors to nearly everyone and their recent announcement of having a campus on the East Coast further proves this (although I bet there are some talented kids out there)…

I’m sure there’s some of this going on at BA, but don’t think that’s what the problem is at the HS level in Tonka…

To be clear. I’m not bashing Mr. Brink or Breakaway Academy. I was trying to ask, is it more the kids following and staying together from Breakaway to Minnetonka because they are familiar and comfortable with the coaches & development.

[Slap Shot]

In the 80's there were some very lopsided scores between Hill and some of their City Conference opponents. The worst were against Central. It was often 18 to 20 goals for Hill, and Central would either get shut out, or score once or twice. At some point, instead of playing each opponent twice, Hill, STA, and Johnson would play each other 3 times (2 pts per game), and they would play Central, Humboldt and Hi Land once (6 pts per game). Harding and Como they'd play twice (3 pts per game). (Closed circuit to the SEC: you can do this too.*)

Terry Skrypek had his team shoot only on their back hands, and then only after 3 passes in the offensive zone. Johnson had a nice team in 83-84. They played Central in the first half of a double header, with Hill playing the second game. Skry watched in disgust as the Govies padded their stats against the hapless Minutemen, their starters running up the score.

Yes, there is only so much a coach can do. But there are things, long and short term, that a coach can do, if he understands sportsmanship.

Did HM make these adjustments the very first game that was this lobsided or maybe the 2nd and thereafter?

Coming into this game Tonka had scored 10 goals once and their largest margin of victory was by 9. It's very well possible Goldsworthy was caught off guard and failed to adjust rather than not "understanding sportsmanship". If something like this happens again there will be at least a 2nd example to make a more educated guess.

This comment has nothing to do with you, but I see what appears to be a lot of supposedly grown men grinding a lot of axes.

[SpreadOut!]

In the 80's there were some very lopsided scores between Hill and some of their City Conference opponents. The worst were against Central. It was often 18 to 20 goals for Hill, and Central would either get shut out, or score once or twice. At some point, instead of playing each opponent twice, Hill, STA, and Johnson would play each other 3 times (2 pts per game), and they would play Central, Humboldt and Hi Land once (6 pts per game). Harding and Como they'd play twice (3 pts per game). (Closed circuit to the SEC: you can do this too.*)

Terry Skrypek had his team shoot only on their back hands, and then only after 3 passes in the offensive zone. Johnson had a nice team in 83-84. They played Central in the first half of a double header, with Hill playing the second game. Skry watched in disgust as the Govies padded their stats against the hapless Minutemen, their starters running up the score.

Yes, there is only so much a coach can do. But there are things, long and short term, that a coach can do, if he understands sportsmanship.

Did HM make these adjustments the very first game that was this lobsided or maybe the 2nd and thereafter?

Coming into this game Tonka had scored 10 goals once and their largest margin of victory was by 9. It's very well possible Goldsworthy was caught off guard and failed to adjust rather than not "understanding sportsmanship". If something like this happens again there will be at least a 2nd example to make a more educated guess.

This comment has nothing to do with you, but I see what appears to be a lot of supposedly grown men grinding a lot of axes.

Yes, Slap Shot. I will give you credit for consistency. You have gone to the mat on this board to defend Tonka—which has one of the largest youth hockey associations in the state—and it’s coach recruiting players from other areas to chase state championships. You think it’s perfectly cool and 100% healthy for high school hockey in Minnesota. Kudos to you for your principled stance.

[yesiplayedhockey]

The bottom line is the landscape for hockey has changed and for the top teams, it is no longer a community based sport.

Coaches are now encouraged to recruit

Parents are as crazy as crazy can be...The more time and money they invest, the crazier they become. Setting up a fake address for 6 months is now the norm. Soon hockey schools will be popping up on every corner like a Starbucks...

I'm going off topic here but if you think High school hockey is bad, wait until the NCAA allows players from WHL and OHL to start playing college hockey. With the new NIL rules, it's not a if...it's most likely a when....

I predict in 2-3 years, college hockey rosters will be polluted with a bunch Canadian players who, for the past 3-4 years, were getting paid to play hockey up in the W...

Back to the topic.....When a high school hockey game is 12-0 after 2 periods, you sit your top kids in the 3rd....End of discussion...

[Slap Shot]

In the 80's there were some very lopsided scores between Hill and some of their City Conference opponents. The worst were against Central. It was often 18 to 20 goals for Hill, and Central would either get shut out, or score once or twice. At some point, instead of playing each opponent twice, Hill, STA, and Johnson would play each other 3 times (2 pts per game), and they would play Central, Humboldt and Hi Land once (6 pts per game). Harding and Como they'd play twice (3 pts per game). (Closed circuit to the SEC: you can do this too.*)

Terry Skrypek had his team shoot only on their back hands, and then only after 3 passes in the offensive zone. Johnson had a nice team in 83-84. They played Central in the first half of a double header, with Hill playing the second game. Skry watched in disgust as the Govies padded their stats against the hapless Minutemen, their starters running up the score.

Yes, there is only so much a coach can do. But there are things, long and short term, that a coach can do, if he understands sportsmanship.

Did HM make these adjustments the very first game that was this lobsided or maybe the 2nd and thereafter?

Coming into this game Tonka had scored 10 goals once and their largest margin of victory was by 9. It's very well possible Goldsworthy was caught off guard and failed to adjust rather than not "understanding sportsmanship". If something like this happens again there will be at least a 2nd example to make a more educated guess.

This comment has nothing to do with you, but I see what appears to be a lot of supposedly grown men grinding a lot of axes.

Yes, Slap Shot. I will give you credit for consistency. You have gone to the mat on this board to defend Tonka—which has one of the largest youth hockey associations in the state—and it’s coach recruiting players from other areas to chase state championships. You think it’s perfectly cool and 100% healthy for high school hockey in Minnesota. Kudos to you for your principled stance.

I haven't defended anything per se - I have asked two questions 1) How does anyone know Tonka broke rules with regards to transfers and 2) Is it not possible Goldsworthy was not prepared for a situation like this and didn't adjust in a way some of you feel necessary? Heaven forbid someone ask for some decorum.

Kudos to you for your holding your composure and not repeatedly treating a h.s. hockey program as though it insulted your mother.

[East Side Pioneer Guy]

In the 80's there were some very lopsided scores between Hill and some of their City Conference opponents. The worst were against Central. It was often 18 to 20 goals for Hill, and Central would either get shut out, or score once or twice. At some point, instead of playing each opponent twice, Hill, STA, and Johnson would play each other 3 times (2 pts per game), and they would play Central, Humboldt and Hi Land once (6 pts per game). Harding and Como they'd play twice (3 pts per game). (Closed circuit to the SEC: you can do this too.*)

Terry Skrypek had his team shoot only on their back hands, and then only after 3 passes in the offensive zone. Johnson had a nice team in 83-84. They played Central in the first half of a double header, with Hill playing the second game. Skry watched in disgust as the Govies padded their stats against the hapless Minutemen, their starters running up the score.

Yes, there is only so much a coach can do. But there are things, long and short term, that a coach can do, if he understands sportsmanship.

Did HM make these adjustments the very first game that was this lobsided or maybe the 2nd and thereafter?

Coming into this game Tonka had scored 10 goals once and their largest margin of victory was by 9. It's very well possible Goldsworthy was caught off guard and failed to adjust rather than not "understanding sportsmanship". If something like this happens again there will be at least a 2nd example to make a more educated guess.

This comment has nothing to do with you, but I see what appears to be a lot of supposedly grown men grinding a lot of axes.

I did not intend for my comments to necessarily apply directly to Tonka in this instance. I only intended to illuminate the discussion by giving some examples of what other coaches have done in the past. Still, lopsided scores are an unfortunate part of youth athletics in general, so anyone with a reasonable amount of experience coaching should be prepared for this. In a tight game you the 3rd and 4th lines may not see much ice time, and you make up for it when the can.

[yesiplayedhockey]

Slap Shot

I think you have your answer

Last night..7-0 after two..shots 44-4 yet in the third the top guys are out there again including getting points very late in the 3rd

Can we all just all admit it now

Tonka recruits...Tonka's coach could care less about sportsmanship let alone what a bunch of us write up on some forum..

The coach, the AD, School administrators and the parents of the tops kids are all happy happy happy with what they've become...This is what defines them.....

[HockeyTalk2020]

Javon Moore had 1 A.

Several goals were scored by Scheetz (6th in scoring), Browning (13th), Baer (10th) and Lunski (9th) while several assists went to House (12th), Baer, Stout (7th), Thompson (15th) and Browning. Are they supposed to sit their top players for the rest of the game once they reach 8 goals? 10?

What would satisfy you and your never-ending vendetta?

Up 12-0 going into 3rd you sit your top 6f and top 2 D. Its embarrassing top 2 lines score in 3rd period. You can make the case midway through game you make the move but for sure after 2nd up 12.

[Slap Shot]

Slap Shot

I think you have your answer

Last night..7-0 after two..shots 44-4 yet in the third the top guys are out there again including getting points very late in the 3rd

Can we all just all admit it now

Tonka recruits...Tonka's coach could care less about sportsmanship let alone what a bunch of us write up on some forum..

The coach, the AD, School administrators and the parents of the tops kids are all happy happy happy with what they've become...This is what defines them.....

Slap Shot, probably: “It’s not Tonka’s fault that other schools and coaches don’t destroy the spirit of high school hockey by recruiting a bunch of rich parents to rent apartments for their talented players to live in their school district boundaries like we do. These parents didn’t ‘move’ to watch their little super stars sit in the 3rd period. Suck it up, buttercups.”

Let me repeat the two items you can't seem too get away from - I've asked for proof on rules violations and I don't find one game with such a lopsided score to be the same level of scourge that you do. That's it.

Additionally to be clear I've never defended the number of transfers that occurred depending upon the circumstances. You can't judge each on them en masse. But if they've violated rules than by all means take the appropriate measures to respond with punishment whatever that may be.

I've simply taken issue with the level of shrieking happening here that to me has gone way over the top.

[SEC Scotty]

Minnetonka is a bag of air who will in it this year.

[yesiplayedhockey]

Slap...If I drive 95MPH down I35W and don't get caught, then I must not be speeding...Listen I have no dog in this fight other than I am so disappointed in what Minnesota High School hockey has become.

But do you really really think 8-10 families all sold their houses right around the exact same time and all moved to the exact same school on accident?

Everyone who looks at it subjectively knows exactly how these families are getting around the transfer rule...It's no secret. And it's also crystal clear that the MSHSL has zero resources to go out and enforce it (remember it's just as bad in football and basketball)

The Minnesota community based hockey model that we've embraced for the past 100 years is gone. All but wiped out by a bunch of wacked out hockey parents and a few coaches who put winning above anything else. Yes I know 30-40 years ago some dad from Thief River Falls would get a great job offer at Polaris and move his family to Roseau but we didn't see "groups" getting together in the Metro area and doing what Tonka is doing today.

Listen for all I know the 8-10 kids from Tonka that lose their jerseys every year to a move in could care less. Hopefully they see the bigger picture in life and are off working on things other than hockey. But for those families who do hold a grudge...Who spent the past 10 years volunteering their time helping to build Tonka youth programs up. I don't blame them and would get a kick out of seeing them try and expose the coaches and cheating families.

There's one easy fix to this.... Transfer rule by miles.. Starting in 9th grade....If you transfer to a school within 40 Miles of your previous school (whether you move or not)...You sit out one year or still play for your old school...No exemptions... this protects the family that move from say the east cost to Minnesota for a job. But it also says "no more selling your house in Chaska and moving to Tonka when your kid is going to be a senior...

[Slap Shot]

You say '8-10 every year' and I'm supposed to consider that post is objective?

And you can bring all the analogies you want - if they're effing around the rules it surely can't be that difficult for all the internet sleuths and butthurt parents out there to find something to bring to light. I hope they do if it exists.

Meanwhile... https://www.minnesotahockey.org/news_ar ... 7-13546789

New Changes To Go In Effect Prior to the 2024-25 Season

[Brodziak Fan Club]

40 miles??? As the crow flies? Tell me more about this 40 mile rule . Mom gets a new job and the family moves to EP but the kid still has to go to Centennial High School? This thread has had some of the best unintentional comedy I’ve seen in a while.

Never thought I’d see the day when I was taking Minnetonka’s side, but here we are. Keep pushing back Slap Shot, this is too entertaining.

[The51]

The fix to the transfer rule is actually really simple. Set a threshold for number of games played at the varsity level, (10?, just spit balling on the number and obviously make it sport specific for other sports), once a player has played more varsity games than that he/she can't transfer without sitting out a year. This prevents players from moving solely for a better situation but also doesn't hurt the kids who go into their senior year having only been a JV player at a top program from moving somewhere where they would have a better chance of getting to have a senior season.

[WestMetro]

Some diff topics being discussed above

Yes , use 3rd line / DPair during running time

As far as movement between schools goes ....

According to lists on Loren Nelson's Legacy.Hockey site , there were approx a dozen varsity transfers without sitting out for a year for the 2023-24 season vs a couple dozen for 2022- 23 season .

Also in that site , for 2023-24 there were about 20 kids left MShsl for juniors or AAA hockey , Vs approx 40 in 2022-23 and about 15 for 2021-22

So by both measures , much less movement this season than in the previous .

[East Side Pioneer Guy]

Or, if kid transfers for "academic reasons", they can only play JV for one full season. They're only motivated to get into that wonderful IB program, amirght?

[east hockey]

Well, took awhile for certain participants to turn this into a name calling/insult fest, but they got there! Bravo.

Lee