Who's Not Returning 2014-2015

[Wblhcky2424]

Is anyone 100% positive that Jake Wahlin won't be back at White Bear? I know for a fact that he really wants to return and play for the Bears, however, his dad is requiring Jake to play in the USHL.

I believe it's 100% he's gone but can totally see the rumor or Jerry not letting Jake return to be true. Jerry is one crazy hockey parent and it has always been the case that he wanted Jake to leave ( his dad doesn't like Sager) and his mom wanted him to stay. Jake loves playing for WBL so I can see him wanting to come back but he doesn't want to go against his dad cause of the way his father is. Also having his "advisor" Darryl Wolski whispering in his ear that he needs to leave didn't help either

[puckbreath]

Is anyone 100% positive that Jake Wahlin won't be back at White Bear? I know for a fact that he really wants to return and play for the Bears, however, his dad is requiring Jake to play in the USHL.

I believe it's 100% he's gone but can totally see the rumor or Jerry not letting Jake return to be true. Jerry is one crazy hockey parent and it has always been the case that he wanted Jake to leave ( his dad doesn't like Sager) and his mom wanted him to stay. Jake loves playing for WBL so I can see him wanting to come back but he doesn't want to go against his dad cause of the way his father is. Also having his "advisor" Darryl Wolski whispering in his ear that he needs to leave didn't help either

Classic scenario for a kid to end up quitting hockey, sick of the bs, in the near future.

[wbmd]

Is anyone 100% positive that Jake Wahlin won't be back at White Bear? I know for a fact that he really wants to return and play for the Bears, however, his dad is requiring Jake to play in the USHL.

Fact or Fiction?

100% fact that Wahlin wants to return to White Bear for his senior season and also 100% fact that his dad won't let him play for White Bear and that he is requiring Jake to play in the USHL.

It's too bad that his dad won't even let Jake play a before and after in the USHL.

[Gopher Blog]

I have to admit... that's an unusual twist. I've heard/seen plenty of examples of parents wanting their kid to finish out HS hockey (or letting the son go to juniors if he prefers it). I'm not sure I have ever heard of a situation where a father is the one that is demanding the kid play juniors while the son prefers to stay home and finish out HS hockey. His dad must be an interesting guy.

[puckbreath]

I have to admit... that's an unusual twist. I've heard/seen plenty of examples of parents wanting their kid to finish out HS hockey (or letting the son go to juniors if he prefers it). I'm not sure I have ever heard of a situation where a father is the one that is demanding the kid play juniors while the son prefers to stay home and finish out HS hockey. His dad must be an interesting guy.

May not be as rare as thought.

I've seen it.

More than once.

In fact, I've rarely seen/heard of the scenarios of your first examples.

Just my experience, etc.

[keepyourheadup]

Like most of us I have no firsthand knowledge specific to Jakes situation. That being said it's beyond my ability to comprehend why a parent would or could force a kid to leave high school hockey. It's hard enough for these young men to sort through all the outside advise they are getting much less having dad make up your mind for you at 17 years of age. My guess is it's more likely a case of a kid trying to please his father, after his dad has suggested that he believes leaving would be in his best interest. Jake is a great player but he's on the smaller side, he's going to be a D1 player so what's the rush? I'll miss getting to see him play this winter.

[puckbreath]

Like most of us I have no firsthand knowledge specific to Jakes situation. That being said it's beyond my ability to comprehend why a parent would or could force a kid to leave high school hockey. It's hard enough for these young men to sort through all the outside advise they are getting much less having dad make up your mind for you at 17 years of age. My guess is it's more likely a case of a kid trying to please his father, after his dad has suggested that he believes leaving would be in his best interest. Jake is a great player but he's on the smaller side, he's going to be a D1 player so what's the rush? I'll miss getting to see him play this winter.

This is a better way of putting it, what I've seen.

Regarding leaving early, as I've said before, I think it's a huge mistake, for anyone, period.

I have yet to hear someone say, "If only Joe hadn't stayed that last year in hs hockey. Boy, what a player he would have been"

There are stories of the opposite though; Joe left early, and got in over his head, burned out, etc.

Without knowing the exact numbers, I would bet the majority of even D-1 players never get to play hockey for money.
In other words, four years and done.

Better have a back up plan boys.

So I see no benefit at all, including the oft used "development" excuse, to leaving hs early. Treating kids like an agricultural crop.

Staying in hs will not hurt, regress, whatever, anyone's development.

D-1, development, or whatever else, will still be there afterwards.

[Gopher Blog]

I have to admit... that's an unusual twist. I've heard/seen plenty of examples of parents wanting their kid to finish out HS hockey (or letting the son go to juniors if he prefers it). I'm not sure I have ever heard of a situation where a father is the one that is demanding the kid play juniors while the son prefers to stay home and finish out HS hockey. His dad must be an interesting guy.

May not be as rare as thought.

I've seen it.

More than once.

In fact, I've rarely seen/heard of the scenarios of your first examples.

Just my experience, etc.

I've been around college recruiting (which plays a lot into these situations) for 20+ years. Specifically the Gophers. I'm not sure which circles you run in but I can tell you that I have seen numerous situations where parents would prefer their kid stay home. Or at a minimum, they'd prefer their kid stay through their senior year but will allow the kid a chance to decide. But I don't know that I can recall a parent actually pushing a kid to leave when the kid wants to finish out HS with his friends, etc. I'm not saying I know every situation in existence but I can't recall in all my experiences around these situations where the parents pushed the kid out of the nest before they had to when the kid didn't want to leave yet.

[Gopher Blog]

Without knowing the exact numbers, I would bet the majority of even D-1 players never get to play hockey for money.

Actually, a significant chunk of D1 players end up playing hockey for money. It's just not the big pay day of the NHL. But the minor leagues in North America and a lot of the leagues overseas are littered with ex-NCAA players.

I agree it is wise to get as much education as you can though. The vast majority of these guys are not going to make the kind of money that they'll be able to retire on.

[puckbreath]

Without knowing the exact numbers, I would bet the majority of even D-1 players never get to play hockey for money.

Actually, a significant chunk of D1 players end up playing hockey for money. It's just not the big pay day of the NHL. But the minor leagues in North America and a lot of the leagues overseas are littered with ex-NCAA players.

I agree it is wise to get as much education as you can though. The vast majority of these guys are not going to make the kind of money that they'll be able to retire on.

Yeah, I was including the non-NHL leagues with my statement.

It would be interesting to see the actual numbers, per total players, etc.

[Gopher Blog]

A lot of them sign deals right after their eligibility is up. Heck, Tom Serratore was a career 4th liner at the U and he signed a tryout deal in the AHL right after the season.

[puckbreath]

I have to admit... that's an unusual twist. I've heard/seen plenty of examples of parents wanting their kid to finish out HS hockey (or letting the son go to juniors if he prefers it). I'm not sure I have ever heard of a situation where a father is the one that is demanding the kid play juniors while the son prefers to stay home and finish out HS hockey. His dad must be an interesting guy.

May not be as rare as thought.

I've seen it.

More than once.

In fact, I've rarely seen/heard of the scenarios of your first examples.

Just my experience, etc.

I've been around college recruiting (which plays a lot into these situations) for 20+ years. Specifically the Gophers. I'm not sure which circles you run in but I can tell you that I have seen numerous situations where parents would prefer their kid stay home. Or at a minimum, they'd prefer their kid stay through their senior year but will allow the kid a chance to decide. But I don't know that I can recall a parent actually pushing a kid to leave when the kid wants to finish out HS with his friends, etc. I'm not saying I know every situation in existence but I can't recall in all my experiences around these situations where the parents pushed the kid out of the nest before they had to when the kid didn't want to leave yet.

Oh well.

I've seen "numerous" situations where it's the parent(s) who are more interested in junior leaving, than the kid is, whether he actually does or not.

And amazingly, those that didn't leave, ended up playing college hockey anyway......

[puckbreath]

A lot of them sign deals right after their eligibility is up. Heck, Tom Serratore was a career 4th liner at the U and he signed a tryout deal in the AHL right after the season.

"A lot of them" is a subjective number.

As I said, be interesting to see actual numbers, vs. total of those that play college hockey.

No idea myself where to find that info. though.

Regarding Serratore, did he play there ?

Tryout is one thing, etc.

[mulefarm]

It may not be the NHL, but if a decent D1 or top D3 player wanted to play a few more years, there are quite a few leagues and overseas opportunities. May not make a lot of money. I think Let's Play Hockey lists all Mn players a few times a year, lots of guys still playing.

[WestMetro]

All time leading Edina scorer and Notre Dame alum Dan Carlson finished out with a career in the UK of almost 10 years I think

[puckbreath]

As I've said, I'm fully aware of players getting paid to play hockey in non-NHL leagues, and my question pertained to those too.

The question, again, was what is the number of players that play college hockey, that go on to play hockey for money, vs. the total number that play college hockey.

It's great seeing individual examples given, but it doesn't answer the question.

I'm of the opinion, that the majority of kids that play college hockey do not advance to playing hockey for pay.

But I have no facts to back it up, just opinion.

[WestMetro]

I would agree, but likewise have no numbers to back it up.

Would be interesting to see how the number has trended over time

[InTheKnow]

All time leading Edina scorer and Notre Dame alum Dan Carlson finished out with a career in the UK of almost 10 years I think

Just an FYI, Dan Carlson is not the all time leading scorer at Edina.

[Sats81]

All time leading Edina scorer and Notre Dame alum Dan Carlson finished out with a career in the UK of almost 10 years I think

Just an FYI, Dan Carlson is not the all time leading scorer at Edina.

Who is?

[Bluewhitefan]

All time leading Edina scorer and Notre Dame alum Dan Carlson finished out with a career in the UK of almost 10 years I think

Just an FYI, Dan Carlson is not the all time leading scorer at Edina.

Who is?

I'm not sure that such a list exists - at least not officially. Relies too much on proper reporting on the part of game officials which, over the years, is hit or miss at best.

[WestMetro]

Ive got Dan Carlson at 191 points ( from his NotreDame profile site), and the following other people were over 150 (from the HockeyHub top 100 Players All Time, of which Dan Carlson was not one ), but perhaps Green4 or another HornetFan can add to the list. Many of the more recent high profile Edina names were not Hornets for their entire high school eligibility

Dan Carlson 191
Craig Norwich 168
Bob Krieger 166
Bill Nyrop 162

[ZachHalverson]

I wrote about Jared Bethune and the topic of players staying and going. http://zachhalverson.com/post/924181779 ... have-to-be

[karl(east)]

Picking at a bunch of loose ends here:

I did a quick search of the Duluth East database for players who played college hockey and graduated between 1995 and 2008 (anything more recent involves players who haven't graduated yet/just graduated this year). 49 players went to the NCAA, and of them, 13 (26.5%) played professionally after college. There's a pretty big D-I vs. D-III split, though: 12 of 27 (44.4%) of D-I players did, while only 1 of 22 D-III players (4.5%) did. I'm not sure how well the Hounds line up with the rest of the hockey world, but it's a decent sample size.

(And, of course, whether a player plays after college can be as much a matter of will as it is of talent. Some kids are just ready to move on after graduation. One '97 East grad who only played varsity as a senior is still active because he stuck it out, while all but one of his former teammates, many of them more talented, have hung up the skates.)

The Gophers probably aren't a great guide to the likelihood of a post-college career, since they usually get many of the top recruits to begin with.

As for the players vs. parents leading the push to leave, it cuts both ways. I've seen players pulling along reluctant parents, but more often, I've seen parents who are dead-set on departure while the kid is pretty ambivalent. I'm not saying they're making the kids do things they don't want to do, but they're certainly the ones leading the charge. The reasons vary. It happens with some regularity.

On the Edina list, where did Marshall Everson and Anders Lee end up? That wasn't that long ago, so the stats should still be out there somewhere. I know Lee was at STA for a bit, but he still spent a while in Edina, and racked up some big numbers. In more recent years, the team has been so deep and the schedule has been so tough that I doubt anyone has gotten close, though Malmquist may have a shot at least of making the leaderboard, assuming he's back this coming season.

[puckbreath]

I wrote about Jared Bethune and the topic of players staying and going. http://zachhalverson.com/post/924181779 ... have-to-be

Nice article.


p.s. he didn't grow up in Warroad.

[green4]

Everson had 155 points in 3 seasons while Anders Lee had 138 in only 2 seasons. If Lee would have played a 3rd season at Edina he might of had the record. Budish for the comparison was 110 in his two healthy seasons