U15

[NORTHWOODS HOCKEY]

More parents than kids too worried about hockey she loved the kids. Didn't appreciate the behavior of some of the parents especially when she was hanging with the kids from Sweden. Again I was not there got the story from my wife and a few others. There was a definite split heard that from many non machine people that were on the trip. Again parents not kids the trip was not just about hockey. She is still in touch with the friends she made from other countries. I resent that you say I infer these are bad kids as a teacher I know there are no bad kids. The question was asked I answered honestly. I Know a lot of those kids and they are awesome!
Your daughter included. Philosophically is where I have the issue as was so plainly stated in the article that started this discussion.

It tells a lot about a person when they take 2nd hand info, draw concrete conclusions, blanket those conclusions over an entire group, and spread it as truth. That goes directly to credibility and character.

Your last statement make no sense. The article was written by someone outside of the 02 Machine team.

What philosophical differences do you have with the team, how it is coached or how the team plays? Winnie loves the team and how they play, so I am wondering where the difference is?

You love the kids, they are all great, but it is the parents? Weird how all the kids turned out great with such horrible people for parents. How many parents do you personally know on this team? How many have you actually sat down with and had a conversation with? Is it 2? Is it 4? What is the # you have to draw your opinions off of?

You know you have about as much credibility as president Nixon. I'll take what my wife and my good friend who was on the trip said over anyone of you on this board. You can take your cheap shots at me all you want but don't you accuse my wife and daughter or my friend who was on the trip of not telling the truth.

All my responses were in reference to your posts or statements. I don't think I implied that your wife or daughter didn't tell the truth, at least to what their experience was. If that is how it read, I apologies to them.

Hopefully you understand my comments are directed at how you took that info and used it to form "your" opinion as if fact and disparage an entire group of people.

My wife said she got along very well with your wife, had many nice conversations and so did most the parents I have talked to that went on the trip. My wife's experience was awesome and she didn't have a bad word to say about anyone on the trip. She said it was a great time, with what turned out to be a great group of people. It was much more than hockey to both my daughter and wife. It is a bummer that your wife and daughter didn't leave with the same positive feeling - about the group.

Listen, I do not care if you do not like the Made or the Machine Program. That is fine, no worries there. My experience with the program has been great. We have had 4 awesome coaches, in both the SL and on the Machine. Not one coach has been a yeller, not one coach has berated a player and not one coach treated the kids with anything but respect. Not saying that is or has been everyone's experience, but that has been ours. I don't own one piece of MM clothing or any Machine apparel and I certainly don't introduce myself as a Machine parent. My child's experience has been great, she likes and gets along great with all her teammates and it has been where she has played summer hockey - that is about it.

My experience with the parents of kids on the Machine has been equally positive and I have not met one (well maybe one) that matches what your opinions indicate or fits your general blanketing description. So I would and will continue to not only challenge your opinions of these people, but ask you how you come to your opinions.

I don't go after other programs, as I feel there are a number of very good ones. Programs that have very good people within them, offering valuable training and great experiences for young hockey players. I don't allow one parents actions, to form my opinion on an entire group of people. I don't allow one coaches antics, to form my opinion on an entire program. I certainly wouldn't blame a loss on a single player (goalie) or a specific group of 13 year old players.

When these things happen, it is just flat out wrong and the person making such statements on an open forum, should be challenged, questioned and should have facts to back up their statements. If they don't, the person posting statements shouldn't take offense when someone finds their opinion absurd.

[NORTHWOODS HOCKEY]

Guys, come on.

Northwoods and Zamboni - we all have girls in the O/S program playing on different teams. I presume we're all there for the same reason, to give our daughters a high quality spring and summer training opportunity. If that leads to something more during the high school years, bonus. If not, the group of girls and women our daughters gets to spend time with are amazing role models, dedicated to their craft, and respectful as an organization. Find me a better support group to lead them through their difficult adolescent years and create a network for their entire lives. Let's not sling arrows at colleagues.

Détente, please?

One more for the board - her name is Winny. Her brother's name (the HS coach at Roseville) is Victry. They live up to their names : ).

JG - way to force me to look up the definition of "Détente". Let me guess, you lost a challenge in a game of Scrabble?

[jg2112]

Guys, come on.

Northwoods and Zamboni - we all have girls in the O/S program playing on different teams. I presume we're all there for the same reason, to give our daughters a high quality spring and summer training opportunity. If that leads to something more during the high school years, bonus. If not, the group of girls and women our daughters gets to spend time with are amazing role models, dedicated to their craft, and respectful as an organization. Find me a better support group to lead them through their difficult adolescent years and create a network for their entire lives. Let's not sling arrows at colleagues.

Détente, please?

One more for the board - her name is Winny. Her brother's name (the HS coach at Roseville) is Victry. They live up to their names : ).

JG - way to force me to look up the definition of "Détente". Let me guess, you lost a challenge in a game of Scrabble?

Child of the 80s, and an International Relations / Global Studies major. : )

[zambonidriver]

Guys, come on.

Northwoods and Zamboni - we all have girls in the O/S program playing on different teams. I presume we're all there for the same reason, to give our daughters a high quality spring and summer training opportunity. If that leads to something more during the high school years, bonus. If not, the group of girls and women our daughters gets to spend time with are amazing role models, dedicated to their craft, and respectful as an organization. Find me a better support group to lead them through their difficult adolescent years and create a network for their entire lives. Let's not sling arrows at colleagues.

Détente, please?

One more for the board - her name is Winny. Her brother's name (the HS coach at Roseville) is Victry. They live up to their names : ).

JG - way to force me to look up the definition of "Détente". Let me guess, you lost a challenge in a game of Scrabble?

For the most part the trip was very enjoyable for my wife and daughter also. Though there were some issues my opinions come from my observations though I am vocal on this board I am not vocal at the rink. I can respect your opinions and everyone else's though there is not one way to skin a cat. I can honestly say that I differ with your opinion on the program. Personally after watching enough of your games I don't think I would want my daughter to play for your coaches. Again my opinion. You are entitled to yours no hard feelings.

[NORTHWOODS HOCKEY]

Guys, come on.

Northwoods and Zamboni - we all have girls in the O/S program playing on different teams. I presume we're all there for the same reason, to give our daughters a high quality spring and summer training opportunity. If that leads to something more during the high school years, bonus. If not, the group of girls and women our daughters gets to spend time with are amazing role models, dedicated to their craft, and respectful as an organization. Find me a better support group to lead them through their difficult adolescent years and create a network for their entire lives. Let's not sling arrows at colleagues.

Détente, please?

One more for the board - her name is Winny. Her brother's name (the HS coach at Roseville) is Victry. They live up to their names : ).

JG - way to force me to look up the definition of "Détente". Let me guess, you lost a challenge in a game of Scrabble?

For the most part the trip was very enjoyable for my wife and daughter also. Though there were some issues my opinions come from my observations though I am vocal on this board I am not vocal at the rink. I can respect your opinions and everyone else's though there is not one way to skin a cat. I can honestly say that I differ with your opinion on the program. Personally after watching enough of your games I don't think I would want my daughter to play for your coaches. Again my opinion. You are entitled to yours no hard feelings.

Noted and no worries.

A successful "Detente" or if one knows his audience, "a relaxing of tension!"

[HockeyDude20]

Wait, what?! Detente is over!! ZD, what is wrong with the coaches?! I am one of the coaches, for crying out loud. jg2112, you are going to have to step back in here! LOL. Kidding. Detente is now back in effect.

[zambonidriver]

Wait, what?! Detente is over!! ZD, what is wrong with the coaches?! I am one of the coaches, for crying out loud. jg2112, you are going to have to step back in here! LOL. Kidding. Detente is now back in effect.

Detente is still in effect. IMHO The machine now OS 02 ELITE is talented, gritty, hardworking team that plays their system very well. The practices are well organized and executed very well. Here is my beef I have seen and been witness to to many issues of uncontrolled behavior by coaches ranging from calling time outs and yelling at the girls on the bench to temper tantrums about roster to the intentional intimidation of referee's all to gain a competitive advantage. Again my opinion, I restate I am vocal on this board but at the rink I watch and enjoy the game. I believe that systems are not what is important especially in summer hockey but creativity and learning from playing the game. The game is the best teacher. I am long removed from my coaching career but my most successful teams were the ones that I would introduce a concept and get out of the kids way. That is why I am a big proponent of the OS program because that is what Winny stands for and all of the fun that these kids have. Fun especially in the summer is so important.

[HockeyDude20]

Our girls don't have any fun. They can't stand summer hockey because we run special teams. And breakouts. And face off plays. They hate it. My daughter can't wait to get back to the hockey that she despises. I can't quite understand why she is excited about April 12th. I am glad that we will finally be in for some fun now that we've come over. Long overdue!

And thank god we have systems because if we didn't the team would be awful. Individually, our girls can't skate, stick handle, shoot, or pass but if you put them in the right spot on the ice they are super good as a collective unit. It's amazing how implementing systems can completely disguise poor individual skills.

[Snap Happy]

Our girls don't have any fun. They can't stand summer hockey because we run special teams. And breakouts. And face off plays. They hate it. My daughter can't wait to get back to the hockey that she despises. I can't quite understand why she is excited about April 12th. I am glad that we will finally be in for some fun now that we've come over. Long overdue!

And thank god we have systems because if we didn't the team would be awful. Individually, our girls can't skate, stick handle, shoot, or pass but if you put them in the right spot on the ice they are super good as a collective unit. It's amazing how implementing systems can completely disguise poor individual skills.

[zambonidriver]

Our girls don't have any fun. They can't stand summer hockey because we run special teams. And breakouts. And face off plays. They hate it. My daughter can't wait to get back to the hockey that she despises. And thank god we have systems because if we didn't the team would be awful.

There is where we differ because our team is every bit as successful in the summer and we do none of that strictly skills and letting the game teach them. Systems are for them to learn in high school and beyond. Summer hockey is the time to play and let the game teach them plus Winny could care less about trophies. Remember the kids on our team are the same grade as the majority of the kids on your team. Somebody posted on one of these boards that your team had to leave the state to get competition I beg to differ. Because for the most part the kids on both of our teams are the same grade and to my recollection when we have both had full rosters your team has never beaten us. That is not including spring league last year when neither one of our teams had full rosters and we split. You will find when Winny runs practice or Winny's people run practice there won't be any of that structure it will be all skills and small games. You will also see a lot of smiling faces and creativity.

[zambonidriver]

Our girls don't have any fun. They can't stand summer hockey because we run special teams. And breakouts. And face off plays. They hate it. My daughter can't wait to get back to the hockey that she despises. I can't quite understand why she is excited about April 12th. I am glad that we will finally be in for some fun now that we've come over. Long overdue!

And thank god we have systems because if we didn't the team would be awful. Individually, our girls can't skate, stick handle, shoot, or pass but if you put them in the right spot on the ice they are super good as a collective unit. It's amazing how implementing systems can completely disguise poor individual skills.

Did I say that I don't think so I don't need to get into this again I have never said anything about skills but since you went there if you want to compare the two teams individually they don't match up. From the net on out what keeps you in games against us is your system again my opinion.

[NORTHWOODS HOCKEY]

Wait, what?! Detente is over!! ZD, what is wrong with the coaches?! I am one of the coaches, for crying out loud. jg2112, you are going to have to step back in here! LOL. Kidding. Detente is now back in effect.

Detente is still in effect. IMHO The machine now OS 02 ELITE is talented, gritty, hardworking team that plays their system very well. The practices are well organized and executed very well. Here is my beef I have seen and been witness to to many issues of uncontrolled behavior by coaches ranging from calling time outs and yelling at the girls on the bench to temper tantrums about roster to the intentional intimidation of referee's all to gain a competitive advantage. Again my opinion, I restate I am vocal on this board but at the rink I watch and enjoy the game. I believe that systems are not what is important especially in summer hockey but creativity and learning from playing the game. The game is the best teacher. I am long removed from my coaching career but my most successful teams were the ones that I would introduce a concept and get out of the kids way. That is why I am a big proponent of the OS program because that is what Winny stands for and all of the fun that these kids have. Fun especially in the summer is so important.

Does your opinion of the coaches carry over from association hockey? Is it just one or all the coaches?

I know it is your "opinion" and you said it is from what you have witnessed, but I have not witnessed any of what you described above, in over 4 years, in over 300 hours of practice and over 120 games.

What is odd to me, is that not one parent on this team - including me, would put up with the behavior you describe above, nor would they expose their daughter to it. I believe the retention rate of the team has been 100%. I think that points directly to the coaches providing a rewarding atmosphere for the girls and doing a good job keeping it all fun. I just don't think people would come back, if what you indicated above was truly happening.

[HockeyDude20]

Technically speaking it would be "couldn't care less" because if she "could care less" then it leaves open the possibility that she really could care less than she does about trophies so it is not as dramatic or definitive as saying "couldn't care less". But that is splitting hairs.

You only might see a few smiling faces at our practices. Mostly crying girls because the coaches are monsters.

We have 30 skaters on our team. 13 of the 30 skaters are 12U eligible (a few are very young 8th graders, most are 7th graders, and there is one 6th grader) this current winter season. 17 of them are 15U eligible. How many girls on your team are currently 12U eligible this winter? Because I have tremendous deductive reasoning skills (it would be impossible for an 01 team to have any 12U eligible girls for this winter) I would deduce that the number would be zero. How'd I do?

By the way, I never said your daughter's team wasn't successful. They are an outstanding group of girls.

[zambonidriver]

Technically speaking it would be "couldn't care less" because if she "could care less" then it leaves open the possibility that she really could care less than she does about trophies so it is not as dramatic or definitive as saying "couldn't care less". But that is splitting hairs.

You only might see a few smiling faces at our practices. Mostly crying girls because the coaches are monsters.

We have 30 skaters on our team. 13 of the 30 skaters are 12U eligible (a few are very young 8th graders, most are 7th graders, and there is one 6th grader) this current winter season. 17 of them are 15U eligible. How many girls on your team are currently 12U eligible this winter? Because I have tremendous deductive reasoning skills (it would be impossible for an 01 team to have any 12U eligible girls for this winter) I would deduce that the number would be zero. How'd I do?I must have hit a nerve not my intention I am just pointing out the differences in the programs remember you guys chose to move I am giving you my reasons for not wanting my daughter to play on your team personally again I am entitled to my opinion. I was standing right next to JB when he went ballistic on the people running the I cup my daughter was on the blades when the time out was called and the kids were on the bench and the coach was on the ice facing them giving them an earful. If that's what you consider fun then you have a different idea of fun. We all know the officiating in the summer is horrendous but the displays I have seen by some of your coaches actions both in association hockey and in the summer is inexcusable. When they react like that what are the girls seeing. I have seen too many example both on the bench and in the stands either that or I was dreaming. My main reason for my daughter playing summer hockey is this it is an opportunity for her to get on the ice compete against girls that are bigger stronger faster learn the game and what the game can bring and for my wife and I to enjoy not only watching those games but to drink beer's and bloodies in the parking lot.

By the way, I never said your daughter's team wasn't successful. They are an outstanding group of girls.

[Mavs]

Technically speaking it would be "couldn't care less" because if she "could care less" then it leaves open the possibility that she really could care less than she does about trophies so it is not as dramatic or definitive as saying "couldn't care less". But that is splitting hairs.

You only might see a few smiling faces at our practices. Mostly crying girls because the coaches are monsters.

We have 30 skaters on our team. 13 of the 30 skaters are 12U eligible (a few are very young 8th graders, most are 7th graders, and there is one 6th grader) this current winter season. 17 of them are 15U eligible. How many girls on your team are currently 12U eligible this winter? Because I have tremendous deductive reasoning skills (it would be impossible for an 01 team to have any 12U eligible girls for this winter) I would deduce that the number would be zero. How'd I do?

By the way, I never said your daughter's team wasn't successful. They are an outstanding group of girls.

You have 30 skaters on one team? How the heck does that work?

There is no arguing that the 02 Machine Orange/OS Elite is a big time group of talent. The systems thing I hear all the time but I don't have a clue other than an association parent telling me it takes a month of the regular season to get the machine out of his machine kids? I honestly don't know what this means and I didn't ask a follow up question as I don't want to get into that stuff. I take it as maybe jealousy or something...not sure. I certainly can't watch this team and see Jacque Lemaire neutral zone trap but they do probably run power play, etc and maybe more focus on winning than Winny.

No matter how you slice it this team is legit and can play with or beat just about anyone at their age level. Is it because of a focus on wining, power play, fore check system, etc? We will never know but the kids have talent and skill and would do extremely well in pond hockey too.

[zambonidriver]

Technically speaking it would be "couldn't care less" because if she "could care less" then it leaves open the possibility that she really could care less than she does about trophies so it is not as dramatic or definitive as saying "couldn't care less". But that is splitting hairs.

You only might see a few smiling faces at our practices. Mostly crying girls because the coaches are monsters.

We have 30 skaters on our team. 13 of the 30 skaters are 12U eligible (a few are very young 8th graders, most are 7th graders, and there is one 6th grader) this current winter season. 17 of them are 15U eligible. How many girls on your team are currently 12U eligible this winter? Because I have tremendous deductive reasoning skills (it would be impossible for an 01 team to have any 12U eligible girls for this winter) I would deduce that the number would be zero. How'd I do?I must have hit a nerve not my intention I am just pointing out the differences in the programs remember you guys chose to move I am giving you my reasons for not wanting my daughter to play on your team personally again I am entitled to my opinion. I was standing right next to JB when he went ballistic on the people running the I cup my daughter was on the blades when the time out was called and the kids were on the bench and the coach was on the ice facing them giving them an earful. If that's what you consider fun then you have a different idea of fun. We all know the officiating in the summer is horrendous but the displays I have seen by some of your coaches actions both in association hockey and in the summer is inexcusable. When they react like that what are the girls seeing. I have seen too many example both on the bench and in the stands either that or I was dreaming. My main reason for my daughter playing summer hockey is this it is an opportunity for her to get on the ice compete against girls that are bigger stronger faster learn the game and what the game can bring and for my wife and I to enjoy not only watching those games but to drink beer's and bloodies in the parking lot.

By the way, I never said your daughter's team wasn't successful. They are an outstanding group of girls.

Never said you did.You just proved my point more than one way to skin a cat.
Morgan Albrecht

Emily Bayless 8th

Mackenzie Bourgerie 8th

Lucy Bowlby 8th

Hannah Chorske 7th also plays for our team

Chloe Fisher?

Rory Guilday 8th

Addy Hackley 8th

Lily Hendrickson 8th

Gwen Hendrickson?

Tella Jungels 8th

Vivian Jungels 6th

Sydney Langseth 8th

Kennedy Little 8th

Kensie Malone 8th

Lindsay Maloney 8th

Lacey Martin 8th

Krista Martinson 8th

Paige McNeil?

Kylie Melz?

Maggie Nicholson 8th

Addy Olson 8th

Peyton Parent 8th

Allyson Qualley 8th?

Olivia Rinzel 8th

Madelyn Skelton 8th

Annie Spring?

Jordann Swingle 8th

Sophie Urban 8th

Brier Ziemer 7th?

[HockeyDude20]

No, ZD, you didn't hit a nerve. You stated that the girls on the respective teams were the same age. I was just pointing out that that isn't the case. That's all. JB doesn't coach the team.

[HockeyDude20]

Mavs, my reply was meant as a direct response to zambonidriver not to you. But to answer your question we dress 18 for each game. We have registered for 7 tourneys so all girls will see tourney time.

[Mavs]

Mavs, my reply was meant as a direct response to zambonidriver not to you. But to answer your question we dress 18 for each game. We have registered for 7 tourneys so all girls will see tourney time.

Got it, makes sense

[zambonidriver]

No, ZD, you didn't hit a nerve. You stated that the girls on the respective teams were the same age. I was just pointing out that that isn't the case. That's all. JB doesn't coach the team.

Tarasov does though he is probably a great guy he and my brother went to dental school together and he says he is a really good person,but I have seen enough of his antics to not want my daughter anywhere near him.

[zambonidriver]

Mavs, my reply was meant as a direct response to zambonidriver not to you. But to answer your question we dress 18 for each game. We have registered for 7 tourneys so all girls will see tourney time.

What are you guys going to do with all the Machine apparel?

[HockeyDude20]

ZD, here is the accurate breakdown:

Morgan Albrecht 7th
Emily Bayless 8th but back half 02
Mackenzie Bourgerie 8th but back half 02
Lucy Bowlby 8th
Hannah Chorske 7th
Chloe Fisher 8th but back half 02
Rory Guilday 7th
Jada Habisch 8th
Addy Hackley 8th but back half 02
Ashley Halvorson 8th but back half 02
Lily Hendrickson 7th
Gwen Hendrickson 7th
Tella Jungels 8th
Vivian Jungels 6th
Sydney Langseth 8th
Sydney Lemke 8th
Kennedy Little 8th
Kensie Malone 8th
Lindsay Maloney 8th
Lacey Martin 8th
Krista Martinson 8th
Paige McNeil 8th but back half 02
Kylie Melz 8th
Maggie Nicholson 8th
Peyton Parent 8th
Allyson Qualley 8th
Olivia Rinzel 8th
Madelyn Skelton 8th
Annie Spring 8th
Jordann Swingle 8th
Sophie Urban 8th
Brier Ziemer 7th

The dentist you are referring to is not the head coach although he is a coach and a great dude. The machine apparel will be framed and hung in my home office, of course. Wait, I don't own any machine apparel...dang.

[Mavs]

You shoot one famous lion and everyone gets bent out of shape

[NORTHWOODS HOCKEY]

Technically speaking it would be "couldn't care less" because if she "could care less" then it leaves open the possibility that she really could care less than she does about trophies so it is not as dramatic or definitive as saying "couldn't care less". But that is splitting hairs.

You only might see a few smiling faces at our practices. Mostly crying girls because the coaches are monsters.

We have 30 skaters on our team. 13 of the 30 skaters are 12U eligible (a few are very young 8th graders, most are 7th graders, and there is one 6th grader) this current winter season. 17 of them are 15U eligible. How many girls on your team are currently 12U eligible this winter? Because I have tremendous deductive reasoning skills (it would be impossible for an 01 team to have any 12U eligible girls for this winter) I would deduce that the number would be zero. How'd I do?I must have hit a nerve not my intention I am just pointing out the differences in the programs remember you guys chose to move I am giving you my reasons for not wanting my daughter to play on your team personally again I am entitled to my opinion. I was standing right next to JB when he went ballistic on the people running the I cup my daughter was on the blades when the time out was called and the kids were on the bench and the coach was on the ice facing them giving them an earful. If that's what you consider fun then you have a different idea of fun. We all know the officiating in the summer is horrendous but the displays I have seen by some of your coaches actions both in association hockey and in the summer is inexcusable. When they react like that what are the girls seeing. I have seen too many example both on the bench and in the stands either that or I was dreaming. My main reason for my daughter playing summer hockey is this it is an opportunity for her to get on the ice compete against girls that are bigger stronger faster learn the game and what the game can bring and for my wife and I to enjoy not only watching those games but to drink beer's and bloodies in the parking lot.

By the way, I never said your daughter's team wasn't successful. They are an outstanding group of girls.

This is a jumbled mess so I am not sure if the above response was to my questions.

I wouldn't doubt that you were just dreaming and the lines of reality were blurred.

[HockeyDude20]

You shoot one famous lion and everyone gets bent out of shape

Lol