Shattuck St. Mary's National Champs again

[pistol]

I can settle this argument for everyone:

Shattup=best in nation

BSM=better than best in nation

Edina=bested the better than best in nation

Hill-Murray=World High School Hockey Champions, again!

[2 sides]

Pistol- so using your theory every team that has beaten the to be determined Stanley cup champs is "better" than that team. PLEASE.
Or every team that has beaten the Ncaa d-1 champs is "Better" than that champion. PLEASE. What counts is "when" you win the game. Say per say "maybe" in a championship setting. This is what Shattuck does, wins when it matters. Yes, they have lost to MSHL teams, but I would say again, any given day and 9 out 10 games Shattuck wins. I am enjoying your tongue in cheek analolgies though.

[O-townClown]

Pistol would do well to stop posting. The misinformed jealousy is absurd. Where do you want Luke Greiner to play his hockey? Toews? It isn't like these kids are affecting local HSs.

Shattuck-St. Mary's operates outside the realm of Minnesota HS hockey. They just happen to be located in Faribault.

Guan Wang is from Iowa, right? If the kid stayed home and tore up the Iowa circuit he'd get blasted for not playing against decent competition.

The decision to attend Shattuck at a cost of $35-40,000 annually is not one to take lightly. Every year about 20 families decide to send their Bantam age boy to a boarding school in a foreign land. Why anyone in Minnesota cares is beyond me.

Edina, Hill-Murray, Benilde, Roseau, and Minnetonka would have a very hard time against Shattuck. A team fielding the best from each would be better than Shattuck. So?

[pistol]

Who's jealous?

I love Shattup! Shattup are the National Champs!

Of course, I love H-M more! The Pioneers are the World Champs after all.

[Bash Brother]

BSM has the win though and that is all that matters.

Ya one exhibition game win is a hell of a lot more important than back to back national titles.

[Tenoverpar]

Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder. While "winning" is a statistic that some of you focus on as a measuring stick, the only real way to objectively look at this debate is to consider "Who is moving players to the next level?".

Take a look at the Seniors at a BSM, Edina or Hill and the Seniors at Shattuck, where are they going next year? Do a google search for Shattuck Hockey and see how many players have interviews (college/AHL/pro) and mention their time in Faribault.

It's not about winning as much as it is about developing players. Shattuck, pound for pound develops players as well as any Minnesota High School.

Why are they hated by people in the state? Because the price tag is 34K?
Because they feed kids to UND? Because they're different?

Most likely the latter, they're different so they are bad bad bad...

If there were such a thing as Hockey Racism, and I believe there is. Those who don't understand Shattuck St Mary's and Tom Ward and what they have are obviously quick to judge rather than accept.

Crosby went to Shattuck as a 10th grader, not a 9th grader.

Oh, and the argument that if Minnesota took all star teams and they played Shattuck, they'd beat them easily, just reference back to the Elite league in the summer. Can someone who was around the Elite League last summer tell us about how the Shattuck vs whoever games were?

[gopherhockey1234]

Tenover you are a hockey guy. You truley get it. You could not have said that better. Shattuck produces 4th lines guys into hockey players. They have all but 1 senior that has a D1 ride right now. Tom Ward is considered one of the top U18 coaches in the country, and this is why. He produces "Hockey players". People in Minnesota have no idea how hard it is to win one National Championship let alone back to back. Most Midget teams that Shattuck plays are better than 90% of the Minnesota High School teams. I watched them play in the Elite Leauge in the spring and they beat everyone but the one team bad every time they played them. I am not taking anything away fron BSM that night but have them play Shattuck 5-6 times a year and that is the only win they get. Thanks for spelling it out Tenover, good stuff!!!!!!

[2 sides]

Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder. While "winning" is a statistic that some of you focus on as a measuring stick, the only real way to objectively look at this debate is to consider "Who is moving players to the next level?".

Take a look at the Seniors at a BSM, Edina or Hill and the Seniors at Shattuck, where are they going next year? Do a google search for Shattuck Hockey and see how many players have interviews (college/AHL/pro) and mention their time in Faribault.

It's not about winning as much as it is about developing players. Shattuck, pound for pound develops players as well as any Minnesota High School.

Why are they hated by people in the state? Because the price tag is 34K?
Because they feed kids to UND? Because they're different?

Most likely the latter, they're different so they are bad bad bad...

If there were such a thing as Hockey Racism, and I believe there is. Those who don't understand Shattuck St Mary's and Tom Ward and what they have are obviously quick to judge rather than accept.

Crosby went to Shattuck as a 10th grader, not a 9th grader.

Oh, and the argument that if Minnesota took all star teams and they played Shattuck, they'd beat them easily, just reference back to the Elite league in the summer. Can someone who was around the Elite League last summer tell us about how the Shattuck vs whoever games were?

I can't thank you enough for "saying it" better than I could. You do truly get it. Excellent post!

[Turkeycut15]

Ok this might be a stupid question and one that’s not as on topic

but why fairbo? why are they staying somewhere that really doesn’t have any programs near it that are well known for having quality talent. Not to take away form the high school team that plays in fairbo hasn’t been known for the amount of player they turn out every year.
I don’t understand why they wouldn’t move either up north towards Warroad, Roseau, or Eveleth..
Or even move into the cities near Hill or BSM or AHA. It seems like that would create appreciation for the team if they played more high school teams.

[slapstkhound]

Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder. While "winning" is a statistic that some of you focus on as a measuring stick, the only real way to objectively look at this debate is to consider "Who is moving players to the next level?".

Take a look at the Seniors at a BSM, Edina or Hill and the Seniors at Shattuck, where are they going next year? Do a google search for Shattuck Hockey and see how many players have interviews (college/AHL/pro) and mention their time in Faribault.

It's not about winning as much as it is about developing players. Shattuck, pound for pound develops players as well as any Minnesota High School.

Why are they hated by people in the state? Because the price tag is 34K?
Because they feed kids to UND? Because they're different?

Most likely the latter, they're different so they are bad bad bad...

If there were such a thing as Hockey Racism, and I believe there is. Those who don't understand Shattuck St Mary's and Tom Ward and what they have are obviously quick to judge rather than accept.

Crosby went to Shattuck as a 10th grader, not a 9th grader.

Oh, and the argument that if Minnesota took all star teams and they played Shattuck, they'd beat them easily, just reference back to the Elite league in the summer. Can someone who was around the Elite League last summer tell us about how the Shattuck vs whoever games were?

This team should win. Any team that can recruit from around the world and draw the "best" players should win. If they don't, there's a coaching issue. The kids at SSM go there for one reason and one reason only......to play hockey. They could all be failing academically, but if their hockey is good, they're golden. I'm a proponent of public schools and like to see those schools who really have no choice in who goes there, other than location, create good programs. Send your kids to SSM, AHA, Hill, BSM or any other private hockey development school you wnat, but be clear as to why you're paying 34k /year.

[2 sides]

Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder. While "winning" is a statistic that some of you focus on as a measuring stick, the only real way to objectively look at this debate is to consider "Who is moving players to the next level?".

Take a look at the Seniors at a BSM, Edina or Hill and the Seniors at Shattuck, where are they going next year? Do a google search for Shattuck Hockey and see how many players have interviews (college/AHL/pro) and mention their time in Faribault.

It's not about winning as much as it is about developing players. Shattuck, pound for pound develops players as well as any Minnesota High School.

Why are they hated by people in the state? Because the price tag is 34K?
Because they feed kids to UND? Because they're different?

Most likely the latter, they're different so they are bad bad bad...

If there were such a thing as Hockey Racism, and I believe there is. Those who don't understand Shattuck St Mary's and Tom Ward and what they have are obviously quick to judge rather than accept.

Crosby went to Shattuck as a 10th grader, not a 9th grader.

Oh, and the argument that if Minnesota took all star teams and they played Shattuck, they'd beat them easily, just reference back to the Elite league in the summer. Can someone who was around the Elite League last summer tell us about how the Shattuck vs whoever games were?

This team should win. Any team that can recruit from around the world and draw the "best" players should win. If they don't, there's a coaching issue. The kids at SSM go there for one reason and one reason only......to play hockey. They could all be failing academically, but if their hockey is good, they're golden. I'm a proponent of public schools and like to see those schools who really have no choice in who goes there, other than location, create good programs. Send your kids to SSM, AHA, Hill, BSM or any other private hockey development school you wnat, but be clear as to why you're paying 34k /year.

Wow, you have no clue about Shattuck. No way does ANYONE fail academically or even flounder and continue playing on any team there. They have VERY strict rules about behavior and school. I know you would love to believe that they are only there for hockey, but don't blanket statement it about academics if you have no personal expericence with a child going there.
To say they would have a coaching issue if they don't win ALL the time is ridiculous. There isn't a team out there at any level, who wins ALL the time no matter how worldly their players are or who the coach is.
But thanks so much for the "clearing up" statement as to why a family would make a personal choice for their child about any private school.

[slapstkhound]

Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder. While "winning" is a statistic that some of you focus on as a measuring stick, the only real way to objectively look at this debate is to consider "Who is moving players to the next level?".

Take a look at the Seniors at a BSM, Edina or Hill and the Seniors at Shattuck, where are they going next year? Do a google search for Shattuck Hockey and see how many players have interviews (college/AHL/pro) and mention their time in Faribault.

It's not about winning as much as it is about developing players. Shattuck, pound for pound develops players as well as any Minnesota High School.

Why are they hated by people in the state? Because the price tag is 34K?
Because they feed kids to UND? Because they're different?

Most likely the latter, they're different so they are bad bad bad...

If there were such a thing as Hockey Racism, and I believe there is. Those who don't understand Shattuck St Mary's and Tom Ward and what they have are obviously quick to judge rather than accept.

Crosby went to Shattuck as a 10th grader, not a 9th grader.

Oh, and the argument that if Minnesota took all star teams and they played Shattuck, they'd beat them easily, just reference back to the Elite league in the summer. Can someone who was around the Elite League last summer tell us about how the Shattuck vs whoever games were?

This team should win. Any team that can recruit from around the world and draw the "best" players should win. If they don't, there's a coaching issue. The kids at SSM go there for one reason and one reason only......to play hockey. They could all be failing academically, but if their hockey is good, they're golden. I'm a proponent of public schools and like to see those schools who really have no choice in who goes there, other than location, create good programs. Send your kids to SSM, AHA, Hill, BSM or any other private hockey development school you wnat, but be clear as to why you're paying 34k /year.

Wow, you have no clue about Shattuck. No way does ANYONE fail academically or even flounder and continue playing on any team there. They have VERY strict rules about behavior and school. I know you would love to believe that they are only there for hockey, but don't blanket statement it about academics if you have no personal expericence with a child going there.
To say they would have a coaching issue if they don't win ALL the time is ridiculous. There isn't a team out there at any level, who wins ALL the time no matter how worldly their players are or who the coach is.
But thanks so much for the "clearing up" statement as to why a family would make a personal choice for their child about any private school.

Actually, my kid did have an opportunity to go there but we declined. WE were not contacted by the school for his grades (which are excellent) but by the hockey coach and were told this was the place to turn him into the player he can really be. My point with the coaching comment is that if you can draw the alleged best performers, as a coach, you should be able to mold them into a good, winning team. If you can't, as a coach, it's a performance issue on the coach. I am not so innocent as to think that any team can win all the time, but in the Shattuck environment, it should be far better than average. Also, I used the word could in my academic statement. I was not indicating that anyone is (although I do know of someone who is struggling academically and still plays) but that they could be.

[komada77]

Ok this might be a stupid question and one that’s not as on topic

but why fairbo? why are they staying somewhere that really doesn’t have any programs near it that are well known for having quality talent. Not to take away form the high school team that plays in fairbo hasn’t been known for the amount of player they turn out every year.
I don’t understand why they wouldn’t move either up north towards Warroad, Roseau, or Eveleth..
Or even move into the cities near Hill or BSM or AHA. It seems like that would create appreciation for the team if they played more high school teams.

By staying out of the hockey hotpsots in MN, Shattuck is able to remain further outside the world of HS hockey, even though they tehnically are a high school hockey team and nothing more. If they were to move up north or into the cities there would be a ridiculous amount of resentment towards them, particularly up north. By staying in Faribault, they keep up their image as "a step above HS hockey."

[2 sides]

This team should win. Any team that can recruit from around the world and draw the "best" players should win. If they don't, there's a coaching issue. The kids at SSM go there for one reason and one reason only......to play hockey. They could all be failing academically, but if their hockey is good, they're golden. I'm a proponent of public schools and like to see those schools who really have no choice in who goes there, other than location, create good programs. Send your kids to SSM, AHA, Hill, BSM or any other private hockey development school you wnat, but be clear as to why you're paying 34k /year.

Wow, you have no clue about Shattuck. No way does ANYONE fail academically or even flounder and continue playing on any team there. They have VERY strict rules about behavior and school. I know you would love to believe that they are only there for hockey, but don't blanket statement it about academics if you have no personal expericence with a child going there.
To say they would have a coaching issue if they don't win ALL the time is ridiculous. There isn't a team out there at any level, who wins ALL the time no matter how worldly their players are or who the coach is.
But thanks so much for the "clearing up" statement as to why a family would make a personal choice for their child about any private school.

Actually, my kid did have an opportunity to go there but we declined. WE were not contacted by the school for his grades (which are excellent) but by the hockey coach and were told this was the place to turn him into the player he can really be. My point with the coaching comment is that if you can draw the alleged best performers, as a coach, you should be able to mold them into a good, winning team. If you can't, as a coach, it's a performance issue on the coach. I am not so innocent as to think that any team can win all the time, but in the Shattuck environment, it should be far better than average. Also, I used the word could in my academic statement. I was not indicating that anyone is (although I do know of someone who is struggling academically and still plays) but that they could be.

Who was the "coach" that contacted you? And are you saying there are performance issues with Shattucks coaches?

[Lily Braden]

Here's a little history about Shattuck that some of you might find interesting. Nothing about hockey, but about the school in general.

When I was growing up, Shattuck was a place in a middle of a corn field that my father was sent to because his parents caught him smoking. So when we were kids, the big threat around our house was "You better cut it out, or dad will send you to Shattuck."

My dad's long gone (and boy, do I miss him), but a few years ago I found a packet of letters he sent to his folks on the west coast from 9th grade on. He saw them once a year at Christmas. The letters were fascinating...all about the military drills the upper classmen put the younger kids thru at 5am...the first time he took a train to St. Paul by himself and saw someone who wasn't white...his friendship with kids exotic last names from foriegn countries (and a kid whose last name was Hormel). He talked about his professors and every letter he wrote in the 11th grade was in French because his teacher required it. He sent home his expenditures (I think he spent 32 dollars one year and apologized for it). He always asked about the dog and signed off by saying "Respectfully, Your Son".

I asked him once if he liked his time at Shattuck and he paused and said "I didn't realize it at the time, but it was the best thing that ever happened to me. I don't think I would be the person I am today, without Shattuck."

So I have to think, even if the kids playing hockey don't end up in the pros, they'll probably get something good out of the school that will last them for the rest of their lives.

[O-townClown]

Lily, thanks for sharing. Shattuck was definitely a school for the unmotivated or undisciplined when I was in HS, but I only knew one kid that actually went there.

Credit the school for finding a few niches to fill (figure skating, drama/arts, hockey) and reinventing itself. Post about them somehow hurting Minnesota hockey when they operate independent of it are nonsensical.

If people in Minnesota understood what it means to be a very good Bantam player in the Sun Belt or less robust cold-weather hockey areas they'd realize the school is a godsend to some families. We're talking about roughly 20 families a year that make the choice to send little Johnny up north to Faribault to a boarding school, hardly something to concern yourself about.

I realize some Minnesotans have gone there, but the program targets mostly players from other areas.

[2 sides]

Here's a little history about Shattuck that some of you might find interesting. Nothing about hockey, but about the school in general.

When I was growing up, Shattuck was a place in a middle of a corn field that my father was sent to because his parents caught him smoking. So when we were kids, the big threat around our house was "You better cut it out, or dad will send you to Shattuck."

My dad's long gone (and boy, do I miss him), but a few years ago I found a packet of letters he sent to his folks on the west coast from 9th grade on. He saw them once a year at Christmas. The letters were fascinating...all about the military drills the upper classmen put the younger kids thru at 5am...the first time he took a train to St. Paul by himself and saw someone who wasn't white...his friendship with kids exotic last names from foriegn countries (and a kid whose last name was Hormel). He talked about his professors and every letter he wrote in the 11th grade was in French because his teacher required it. He sent home his expenditures (I think he spent 32 dollars one year and apologized for it). He always asked about the dog and signed off by saying "Respectfully, Your Son".

I asked him once if he liked his time at Shattuck and he paused and said "I didn't realize it at the time, but it was the best thing that ever happened to me. I don't think I would be the person I am today, without Shattuck."

So I have to think, even if the kids playing hockey don't end up in the pros, they'll probably get something good out of the school that will last them for the rest of their lives.

Beautiful! That is what is heard year in and year out on campus at Shattuck. Thank you for the wonderful post. Also to O-town-- you also have a very good post on Shattuck, you both "get it".

[gopherhockey1234]

O town great job!!! Shattuck has a 150 year history in Faribault. They have a 62 acre beatuiful school, why would they move it. If you have never seen the school inside you would never understand. If people new what this place has done for kids you would not bash it. Tom Ward and JP Parise could care less about Minnesota High School hockey. They don't pull from Minnesota. The only two kids on this years Prep team were Derek Stepan (Hastings) and Ben Montgomery (Oakdale).

Someone said it in a earlier post, They produce hockey players, thats what makes this school special. I can guarentee you that they have to keep up with there grades, or they do not play. If you ask the college kids that move on and play D1 hockey everyone of those kids would tell you that Shattuck is harder than there college courses. Tom Ward is a great hockey coach, this team is not full of superstars from around the Country. He has made these young men into complete hockey players, and that is why these kids get so much attention from the College and Pro Scouts. They learn how to play in all three zones. They have a saying above there door in the locker room it says"Make the plays that your teammates expect you to make". There is not a kid that leaves that locker room that does not touch that every time they leave that locker room. Until your son or daughter has been asked to play there, please don't make stupid comments. If your son or daugher has a chance to excel at the greatest sport on earth, there is no better place in the world than Shattuck!!!!!!!!!!! Again Otown great post.

[Can't Never Tried]

O town great job!!! Shattuck has a 150 year history in Faribault. They have a 62 acre beatuiful school, why would they move it. If you have never seen the school inside you would never understand. If people new what this place has done for kids you would not bash it. Tom Ward and JP Parise could care less about Minnesota High School hockey. They don't pull from Minnesota. The only two kids on this years Prep team were Derek Stepan (Hastings) and Ben Montgomery (Oakdale).

Someone said it in a earlier post, They produce hockey players, thats what makes this school special. I can guarentee you that they have to keep up with there grades, or they do not play. If you ask the college kids that move on and play D1 hockey everyone of those kids would tell you that Shattuck is harder than there college courses. Tom Ward is a great hockey coach, this team is not full of superstars from around the Country. He has made these young men into complete hockey players, and that is why these kids get so much attention from the College and Pro Scouts. They learn how to play in all three zones. They have a saying above there door in the locker room it says"Make the plays that your teammates expect you to make". There is not a kid that leaves that locker room that does not touch that every time they leave that locker room. Until your son or daughter has been asked to play there, please don't make stupid comments. If your son or daugher has a chance to excel at the greatest sport on earth, there is no better place in the world than Shattuck!!!!!!!!!!! Again Otown great post.

Unless I'm missing something there are 4 other MN kids.
http://www.s-sm.org/athletics/interscho ... 007+-+2008


Edit: bad link before click on this one and go to roster.


Including Williams from Mound.

Is it possible the three listed as Faribault players are actually from else where?

[O-townClown]

Can't - are you counting Jordy Murray and Luke Greiner? Murray's dad is the NHL coach that used to be at Shattuck (I think that's his dad)...so calling him Minnesotan is a little misleading. He could have grown up all over and would not be in Minnesota if it weren't for Shattuck.

Greiner is from California.

There are very few players leaving their Minnesota associations to attend Shattuck. I understand the number isn't zero, but it isn't many either.

[Can't Never Tried]

Can't - are you counting Jordy Murray and Luke Greiner? Murray's dad is the NHL coach that used to be at Shattuck (I think that's his dad)...so calling him Minnesotan is a little misleading. He could have grown up all over and would not be in Minnesota if it weren't for Shattuck.

Greiner is from California.

There are very few players leaving their Minnesota associations to attend Shattuck. I understand the number isn't zero, but it isn't many either.

Agreed, I really didn't know about the the 3 from Faribault, which is why I asked, but I knew Mac Williams was MN for sure.
I don't dispute the fact they come from all over the country/world.
Also it is a pretty cool place, I wonder if there is a dungeon there it has that castle look to it!

[suntzu]

Looks like SSM will be losing J.P. Parise - rumor is that he'll be named the new coach of the Des Moines Bucs of the USHL later this afternoon. He's been an integral part of the SSM program for a long time.

[observer]

JP is also listed as the coach of a new 1994 Blades Gray team.

http://www.minnesotablades.com/

[2 sides]

Jordy Murray's dad is the nhl coach, and was the Prep coach before getting his nhl job. They are Canadian. It is sometimes deceiving on the hometown page because some parents choose to move to Faribault to be with their kids when they attend High School. So it will say hometown is Faribault.
JP hasn't had much to do with the program since Ward was named director of the WHOLE hockey program at Shattuck, along with head coaching the Prep team. I think JP just coached one of the lower bantam teams. He really just wanted to spend more time watching his own boys play in the Devils organization. JP was important in developing the whole program from the get go to where it has come today. He did so by having his boys leave Bloomington Jefferson to attend Shattuck many years ago. That was kind of the start of the hockey there. If JP goes to the Bucs, I would kind of be surprised, but hey, crazier things have happened. But Shattuck will be just fine either way. Interesting conversation though!

[O-townClown]

JP hasn't had much to do with the program since Ward was named director of the WHOLE hockey program at Shattuck, along with head coaching the Prep team. I think JP just coached one of the lower bantam teams. He really just wanted to spend more time watching his own boys play in the Devils organization. JP was important in developing the whole program from the get go to where it has come today. He did so by having his boys leave Bloomington Jefferson to attend Shattuck many years ago. That was kind of the start of the hockey there.

His most recent title is something like Director of Recruitment or Player Evaluation or something. I believe it is essentially a sales job where he explains to families the benefits of attending Shattuck for hockey and justifies the expense.