Vikings in trouble for opening day?

Can't Never Tried · Post by **Can't Never Tried** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:42 pm

Any of you experts know this??? why when we called for the fair catch and McCaully picked it up and advanced it, then the officials brought it back saying..... that because of the fair catch signal being made the ball is placed at the spot where 1st being touched by the Viking player. ok fine... then why didn't the Vikes get the interference call for the player making the fair catch signal as he got popped after that??

Another one, why with about 13 min left I believe in the 3rd or 4th qtr they ruled the viking receiver out of bounds after catching the ball resulting in a incomplete pass but then yet did not stop the clock??

goldy313 · Post by **goldy313** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:28 pm

Anyone on the receiving team can signal a fair catch, upon doing so the ball can not be advanced if first touched by the receiving team. The player giving the signal for the fair catch is awarded protection, however if this player is moving the kicking team must make every opportunity to avoid him, but contact can occur. When the Viking picked up the ball and ran the play became dead, it also should have been a 5 yard penalty for illegal fair catch. The officials blew a bunch of calls in this game; the personal foul on the sideline at the end of the first half - Jackson stopped and cut with both feet inbounds the call went on the player that first hit him inbounds, the intentional grounding when a Viking had Orton by the foot, were just a couple that were blantant misinterpretations of the rules.

elliott70 · Post by **elliott70** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:29 pm

packerboy wrote:Thanks for saving my spot elliott. Ill buy the second round at the Liffey.

But we cant be too hard on the Viking fans who lost faith.

They are not who we thought they were.

And the first one is mine.?.?

Okay, everyone except, I mean including, Angus.

packerboy · Post by **packerboy** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:40 pm

The grounding call was right. Gutsy but right.

He threw the ball away while in the pocket to avoid a sack. Nobody was anywhre near the pass.

Can't Never Tried · Post by **Can't Never Tried** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:43 pm

goldy313 wrote:Anyone on the receiving team can signal a fair catch, upon doing so the ball can not be advanced if first touched by the receiving team. The player giving the signal for the fair catch is awarded protection, however if this player is moving the kicking team must make every opportunity to avoid him, but contact can occur. When the Viking picked up the ball and ran the play became dead, it also should have been a 5 yard penalty for illegal fair catch. The officials blew a bunch of calls in this game; the personal foul on the sideline at the end of the first half - Jackson stopped and cut with both feet inbounds the call went on the player that first hit him inbounds, the intentional grounding when a Viking had Orton by the foot, were just a couple that were blantant misinterpretations of the rules.

Why was it an illegal fair catch? there are tons of plays where they signal fair catch and let it go past them?? what's the difference?

Oh and IMO the receiver wasn't moving at the time he got hit but IDK maybe I was selective viewing

Can't Never Tried · Post by **Can't Never Tried** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:44 pm

packerboy wrote:The grounding call was right. Gutsy but right.

He threw the ball away while in the pocket to avoid a sack. Nobody was anywhre near the pass.

Agreed, closest player was 15yds away at least!

State Champ 97 · Post by **State Champ 97** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:54 pm

Can't Never Tried wrote:
packerboy wrote:The grounding call was right. Gutsy but right.

He threw the ball away while in the pocket to avoid a sack. Nobody was anywhre near the pass.
Agreed, closest player was 15yds away at least!

While I loved to see the Vikes get a call like that. You try to throw accurately on one leg with a 310# holding onto your other ankle and trying to pull you down. There was a reciever in the line of flight of the ball just further down field than the ball flew. The Bears never should have started Kyle Orton in the first place. But as a Vikes fan I'm glad they did.

goldy313 · Post by **goldy313** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:04 pm

It's an illegal fair catch when a member of the receiving team, upon first touching, advances the ball after a fair catch signal has been given by any player on the receiving team. Actually in the NFL it's an awarded fair catch at all other levels it's an illegal fair catch.

If a QB is being tackled and it affects his throwing motion it can't be intentional grounding. Orton had a guy on his leg which makes it near impossible to throw an accurate pass. Even still the ball did get beyond the line of scimmage and there was a Bear in the area. Now late on the Vikings last TD drive Jackson scrambled and threw the ball out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage yet the refs gave him an incomplete pass and the ball at the 8 instead of the 12. The refs were just bad, the Vikings benefitted from it, but that's the way it goes, these things seem to balance themselves out during the entire season.

Can't Never Tried · Post by **Can't Never Tried** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:10 pm

goldy313 wrote:It's an illegal fair catch when a member of the receiving team, upon first touching, advances the ball after a fair catch signal has been given by any player on the receiving team. Actually in the NFL it's an awarded fair catch at all other levels it's an illegal fair catch.

If a QB is being tackled and it affects his throwing motion it can't be intentional grounding. Orton had a guy on his leg which makes it near impossible to throw an accurate pass. Even still the ball did get beyond the line of scimmage and there was a Bear in the area. Now late on the Vikings last TD drive Jackson scrambled and threw the ball out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage yet the refs gave him an incomplete pass and the ball at the 8 instead of the 12. The refs were just bad, the Vikings benefitted from it, but that's the way it goes, these things seem to balance themselves out during the entire season.

If he's out of the pocket I thought it was ok to throw it away?

Anyway it's over, they tried their hardest to lose, and still ended up winning anyhow?

Neutron 14 · Post by **Neutron 14** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:32 pm

Can't Never Tried wrote: If he's out of the pocket I thought it was ok to throw it away?

He was judged to be in the pocket. Its a judgment call on whether he threw it away to avoid a sack. IMHO, it would not have been called on ANY other quarterback in the NFL.

Vikes got lucky.

packerboy · Post by **packerboy** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:48 pm

I dont think he was even close to being out of the pocket. I agree that you dont usually get that call but it was justified.

Remember that there was also holding on the Bears so they would have been 3rd and 20 anyways. Not an important call.

Govs93 · Post by **Govs93** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:03 pm

7 Vikes have made the most riveting of all the pro sports all-star games - the Pro Bowl. 6 are starters:

Adrian Peterson
Tony Richardson
Steve Hutchinson
Matt Birk (not starting)
Pat Williams
Kevin Williams
Darren Sharper.

Nice.

Can't Never Tried · Post by **Can't Never Tried** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:08 pm

Govs93 wrote:7 Vikes have made the most riveting of all the pro sports all-star games - the Pro Bowl. 6 are starters:

Adrian Peterson
Tony Richardson
Steve Hutchinson
Matt Birk (not starting)
Pat Williams
Kevin Williams
Darren Sharper.

Nice.

After as many times as Birk opened up the gate for Urlacher last night ?

I guess if it's about longevity fine, I think he's near the end though.
The rest I agree with I suppose.

BTW nice long snapper

Govs93 · Post by **Govs93** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:14 pm

Can't Never Tried wrote: After as many times as Birk opened up the gate for Urlacher last night ?
I guess if it's about longevity fine, I think he's near the end though.

You may be right. Another couple of years and then it's off to fill his role of O-line Coach (Recruiting Director) at CDH.

grindiangrad-80 · Post by **grindiangrad-80** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:59 pm

elliott70 wrote:
grindiangrad-80 wrote:I ripped on the Viks so bad for the last 2 years that it's almost embarrassing to try and act like a fan now. (They did earn some rippin)
Hard to figure.
At 2-5 they led the league in rushing and rush def.
Now ESPN says they are a dangerous playoff team because they lead the league in rushing and rush def.
Whatever, Go Viks.

80,
Welcome back to the wagon.
I'll move some people over and give you a good seat. Right next to PB.

Thanks for the seat.
Good to be 8-6.
Is it just me, or is there a lot of brutal football played this year?

Joey (nine toes) Marcoux · Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:30 pm

It looks like opening day

Neutron 14 · Post by **Neutron 14** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 10:18 pm

Joey (nine toes) Marcoux wrote:It looks like opening day

Joey the difference is we've already screwed up our draft pick....

grindiangrad-80 · Post by **grindiangrad-80** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 5:40 pm

I am trying to stay positive.

The Viks are makin it hard though.

There's always next week.

Go Viks.

Undercover Hockey Lover · Tue Dec 25, 2007 11:08 am

If your so positive...I've got a bunch of Vikes stuff for sale in the Antique Pox Mall in St. Cloud if you need some new bandwagon things.

grindiangrad-80 · Post by **grindiangrad-80** » Tue Dec 25, 2007 2:50 pm

Thanks man, I might have to check that out.

I imagine the Viks will make it a Happy New Year for us.

Irishmans Shanty · Post by **Irishmans Shanty** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:09 pm

The Viking season can be really broken down into three chapters

Chapter 1: 3-6 start plagued by awful quarterbacking, turnovers, and a one-dimensional defense.

Chapter 2: 5 straight victories over some bad teams and the luck of getting good teams on bad days and let's not forget a mind boggling ground assault that showed up as quickly as it inevitably disappeared.

Chapter 3: Back to back losses and the plot of this chapter completely plaguerized the first one.

All in all, it was just a season, it will be filed into the archives and it will have to get in line with all the others. The name of the starting QB and wide recievers and other various positions will be forgotten except for the few of us who retain it for no reason other than having the satisfaction of not needing to google it before refering to it years from now in some "bored" discussion concerning the state of the Vikings at that time.

Tip for the future: Never go into the last week of the season needing help from a team that has already cemented their playoff status.
(i/e; if anyone thought the Cowboys would resemble an NFL football team yesterday, they'd be wrong. Also, CLE fans, let me know the next time IND losses to TEN at home.)

packerboy · Post by **packerboy** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:26 pm

An accurate assessment IS.

I will admit to being surprised at 8-8. I thought they'd win 4 maybe 6.

#18 was good and #28 was great at times.

#7 played like I expected but I think he has up side. Somebody said that he will never QB them to the Super Bowl.I dont agree. If they get a couple of WRs and a reliable TE with an offense that can open it up for AP, he could get them there.

Childress isnt able to coach at this level yet. How do you let teams shut you down the same way for 4 games in a row and do nothing to counter act it? #15 for Denver is their leading reciever and he caught 9 balls yesterday. Tell me why teams can shut down our big guy but we cant shut down theirs.

They need one stud reliable pass rusher; TJack to get better; at least one stud WR; and Childress to get some flexibility in his offense.

goldy313 · Post by **goldy313** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 3:22 pm

I disagree, Jackson is horrible. He's the worst rated QB in the league for a reason. He looked good twice in the past two weeks, both times when the game was out of reach and the defense was playing to kill the clock, not let 1 big play hurt them. Denver screwed up by only rushing 3 guys in the 4th quarter, given the current rules in the NFL anyone; including me, PB, IS, ChrisK, Govs, and Neut can make a play in those circumstances. What happened in OT? Denver decided to play defense again and Jackson went back into his old self. He can't read a defense, commentators have said it time and again, he looks at 1 guy the whole way.

Chilly is bad, it took Tony Seragusa 1 half of watching the Vikings to figure out when Peterson was running the ball, he gave it away by his depth in the backfield. After that Peterson had nothing in 4 games. Defenses couldn't play the same with Tayor for a number of reasons and he was the better back by the end of the year. The Vikings pass defense was worst in the league for the second year in a row, and at the end of the season their rush defense wasn't as good as it had been.

There are a lot of reasons for optimism, Peterson has an entire off season to improve his role in the passing game. If he can he will be an elite back, if not he may be the next Darrell Thompson. His last 4 games he averaged just over 3 yards a carry, if you take away his long run in each of those games he had 50 carries for 87 yards; just over 1.5 yards a carry. He has to improve in all aspects of the passing game.

The NFC is bad and going from the Superbowl to bust is very possible, right Chicago? Going from 8-8 to 13-3 is also very possible. In the NFC 9 of the 16 teams finished at .500 or one game to either side of it compared to only 4 in the AFC. Only 3 NFC teams finished worse than 7-9, meaning the Vikings improvement from 6-10 to 8-8 has to be taken with a grain of salt. Will the Vikings rise above the parity? They haven't in years.

Govs93 · Post by **Govs93** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 3:45 pm

Here's the thing... Jackson is servicable, and for the time being, that's all this team needs. Remember, Trent "F'n" Dilfer won a Super Bowl.

Ultimately, I think T-Jack will be fine in the offense. The kid has only started 12 games, but I think he learned quite a bit about what not to do in the last 3. Did he hurt the team on occasion? Yes, he sure did. But did he also show signs of being able to maintain his composure and help the team out out? Yes, he did.

IMO, what they need to do is this...

#1 - Get another "hands" receiver in here. If T-Jack can can loosen up the offense a little by hitting the quick slants or outs for 7 or 8 yards to receivers that can catch the ball, that would help the running game immensely. As long as Peterson is in the backfield, you can bet they're going to want to run a ball control offense, and that - to me - is a good thing. They don't need another Randy Moss in here so that Jackson can try to air it out. They need a good Hines Ward type of guy who isn't afraid to go over the middle. Unless it's 3rd and 20, Jackson should never be dropping back more than 5 steps.

#2 - As mentioned earlier - get a another pass rusher. They need to get more pressure off of the the defensive backfield. Who knows - maybe getting Antoine Winfield and Tank Williams on the field again next year will help, but the rush still has to be addressed. Erasmus James clearly isn't the answer so there's another wasted pick, and Udeze doesn't have the talent to do it alone... they need another end.

#3 - A veteran backup QB. Jackson hasn't had a whole lot of guidance in his 2 years. Brad Johnson may have been around, but Jackson really didn't see much of the field, and Kelly Holcomb really has only started about 20 games in his career. Get somebody in here who's been through it, and can help get Jackson a little more real world expreience - a calming influnce maybe.

This team may not be too far off from getting somewhere, and I don't think it needs a major overhaul - many of the pieces are in place.

Can't Never Tried · Post by **Can't Never Tried** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 4:40 pm

Govs93 wrote: This team may not be too far off from getting somewhere, and I don't think it needs a major overhaul - many of the pieces are in place.

Ok well I found some of the pieces that are not!

For Troy to help catch a flippin ball,

For TJ to read a defense,

This should be enough for the whole secondary,

And a couple of ends,

Then to use all this good stuff and put it all together I found one of these,

That should about do it!!!
I'm pumped for next year already