Twins Rotation

[packerboy]

If it was a fastball right down the middle and he lets it go for strike one before he dribbles one to 2b, is it a good at bat?

Maybe he just missed it. Cant changeups be hit into the gap?

[Irishmans Shanty]

I've been coaching JV ball for several years now at a high school with an enrollment that is similar in size to the entire city of Roseau. With that many guys trying out for the teams I am blessed to work with some pretty talented freshman and sophs. What has always driven me nuts is how bad they look when they don't have to swing. 0-0, 2-0, and 3-1 counts. I tell them from day 1 in the gym, look for one type of pitch in one location, if it's there, I want you to swing so hard your uniform falls off . If it's not there, take it. I am dead serious when I say this, the point I am trying to impress on the players is don't get cheated when you don't have to swing. Just like freshman and sophs in high school you see young pro hitters, including Morneau make the same mistake at their level. There is no magic count to swing, pitchers, even in the bigs can make mistakes at any time. But having an approach when you don't have to swing is important, and at times Morneau doesn't look like he has an approach, if he doesn't fix this he will be a career .235 hitter, and that means it won't be a long career.

[ChrisK]

Amen, Shanty.

And to answer your question packerboy, it would not be a good at bat because a fastball down the middle should be in Morneau's zone and should be crushed. A dribbler to second by a lefthanded batter can mean the batter tried to pull an outside pitch, but like I said before I didn't see the at bat. If Morneau did swing at a pitch that he thought was in his zone and mishit it, he should still have hit the ball hard which didn't happen.

[Irishmans Shanty]

Wow, lots of thoughts through 3.5 tonight. The impossibilities surrounding this edition of the Twins keep coming nightly, unfortunately most are on the dubious side for the Twins

1) Moyer records only his 7th out on his 59th delivery, yet is holding a three run lead
2) To no fault of Joe Mauer, he is unable to score on a double from second base.
3) Joe Mauer is 6x7 with three doubles in the series, yet has 2 RBI's
4) 2 doubles, a single, and a walk yield only one run in the Twins 2nd
5) Beltre nails Castillo at first from one of the most improbable throwing positions I've ever seen, Ford follows it with a double

[packerboy]

I have done some coaching myself IS and I tell my kids the same thing.

But I also tell them to rip the first good pitch they see. Often times thats the first pitch in the at bat.

Its comical at times. I hear coaches tell their pitchers to get ahead and throw strikes and their hitters not to swing at the first pitch. Well, whose side are they on?

Morneau thought it was a pitch he could drive and he missed it. Its the fact that he misses a lot of pitches that will keep his average down.

I think a good appraoch to hitting is important but if it was just about the approach ,everyone would have about the same batting average. There is a lot more to it.

[packerboy]

PS. Even it was a bad at bat by Morneau, why does Gardy sit him? Thats just BS. How many bad at bats has Torii Hunter had in key situations? He'd sit half the season if he was benched after every one.

They are blowing easy plays in the field and Gardy is sitting guys who make the mortal mistake of swinging at the first pitch.

I am not impressed with Gardy.

[Irishmans Shanty]

I think things for Gardy are beginning to unravel. Last night when Hunter got thrown out at home, Ulger did not tell him anything as he rounded the bag, verbally some communication could have happened, but visually he didn't hold him or stop him. Hunter looks bad by not sliding but the real error occured by the third base coach. Hunter's body language showed me that he was confused and not happy with Ulger. Simple mistakes like that by base coaches can cause players and a team to loose faith in the coaching staff. Sitting Morneau doesn't make sense either, percentages may say he doesn't hit lefties, but throw out the book on this one and play your prospect against the 43 year old lefty.

Physical errors are happening more frequently, but what gets a manager in trouble is the mental errors, this road trip has been a calamity of those. Don't look for Gardy to go anywhere, even if it gets real bad. This franchise had 8 or 9 consecutive losing seasons and no coaching changes or management changes ever occured.

[packerboy]

They didnt fire TK after a number of losing seasons but he won the World Series twice. Gardy doesnt have that on his resume.

I agree that they wont fire him but he wont be given the slack TK was. They have some legitimate ,big time ,major young talent. Gardy will be given a chance to make it happen but they wont let this go on indefinitely.

[goldy313]

I think Morneau was sat for a reason, Gardy said someone missed a sign when Morneau tried to steal and White looked at a pitch right down the middle getting Morneau caught stealing. Gardy didn't say who missed a sign but one of the two did, and they both sat last night. Also, Morneau may have been given a take sign on that first pitch which he swung at, otherwise I don't think Gardy would have singled him out, unless your Cuddyer he doesn't seem to single anyone out for any reason. Either way you don't miss a sign, or ignore it.

As pointed out earlier these menatl mistakes are becoming more and more frequent, Gardy has to do something or it will just get worse.

TK's teams stunk but it wasn't for lack of trying, the effort was there, the fundementals were there, and players were held accountable. Gardy doesn't seem to hold his players to any standard.

[packerboy]

I doubt they would give Morneau a take sign on the first pitch.

But regardless, I agree with goldy on Gardy. Is he going to sit Hunter tonight for going thru the stop sign? What are his standards? They seem to be different for different players, which doesnt work.

[ChrisK]

I guess I'd have to see the pitch that Morneau swung at to make a concrete conclusion, but if he's dribbling a pitch he thought he could drive to the second baseman he has issues.

Here's what it said in the paper about Morneau sitting last night:

"Gardenhire held a closed-door meeting with Morneau before the game and declined to discuss what was said, other than to say "baseball stuff."

As for the lineup decision, Gardenhire said Morneau simply needed a breather after a rough game.

Morneau frustrated Gardenhire by not being more patient with his first-inning at-bat against Hernandez. After Cuddyer had been walked on four pitches to load the bases, Morneau swung at a first-pitch changeup and grounded out to end the inning.

Gardenhire said Morneau also missed a "don't-run" sign when he was caught stealing to end the sixth inning.

With about 20 friends and family in town from the Vancouver area to watch him play, Morneau remained in good spirits. He was wearing a Canucks T-shirt with Todd Bertuzzi's name on the back.

"Maybe it'll make my bats mean," Morneau said. "

Let's hope Morneau doesn't cheap shot somebody from behind...

[goldy313]

But regardless, I agree with goldy on Gardy. Is he going to sit Hunter tonight for going thru the stop sign? What are his standards? They seem to be different for different players, which doesnt work.

Hunter isn't in today's lineup, maybe Gardy's turning up the heat on these guys.

[Irishmans Shanty]

Where does Gardy start when it comes to benching players. Here's what he has to work with.

This is just off the top of my head and what I have seen
Castro - drops a Mauer throw that clearly beat the man stealing 2nd base, inning should be over with Twins still leading 2-1.
Ford - Picked off second
Hunter - continuous string of poor at bats with Mauer standing at 2nd base, doesn't slide or plow catcher at home, pulls shoot 20ft from home and says you got me.
Reyes - comes in for the Lefty, Lefty matchup and promptly gives up 3 run HR
White - takes pitch down hooter with Morneau running, picked off second in Anaheim, 0 HR through June 7
Morneau - Missed H/R sign, bad at bats, can't pick ball at first in crucial 8th in Anaheim last week
Castillo - putrid hitting, dropped line drive in 8th inning of Anaheim collapse
Batista -costly error in 8th inning of Anaheim collapse, runs like Tinkerbell

50% of players who have had meaningful time on this road trip have made mistakes to warrant a benching. Closed door one on one meetings with players (Morneau) are not a good sign. Publicly nothing negative will be said but you know this roadtrip is causing this team to come apart from the inside out. The continuous mistakes and confusion between the lines is overshadowing anything positve that does happen.

Joe Nathan are you out there? How are those simulated saves and side sessions going? Hope to see you again sometime.

[EREmpireStrikesBack]

I say we trade Nathan for anything. At this point we don't need a closer so might as well get some prospects or something.

[Irishmans Shanty]

That's what I call Instant offense. Cuddyer double, Kubel single, Morneau 3 run bomb. Three pitches, three runs. Packerboy, that one's for you, Morneau dials up long distance on the first pitch.

[Irishmans Shanty]

When is the Carlos Silva show finally going to be over for good. Three zip after three batters. This guy is awful.

[jimjackjohnmmmm]

Silva's worse than a ripe fart on a date. And not to mention the double play from cuddyer with the bases LOADED and one out in the first as well. God this team pisses me off.

[Irishmans Shanty]

Yah, and it's only the 4th inning. More bad news...Morneau thrown out stretching a single into a double.

[Irishmans Shanty]

Barring a major rally in the ninth, the Twins will loose both games this week in which they have hit a grand salami. The season of impossibilities continues.

[Irishmans Shanty]

Eric Bedard throws 71 pitches to record the six outs needed in the 4th and 5th innings, yet the Twins only score two runs. How is that possible?
The season of impossibilities trudges on.

[packerboy]

You are right IS. But lets look at the positive.

How is it possibe that Mauer can be that good so early in his career. I remember when Carew and Brett did this but they were both in their prime. Mauer hasnt played 2 full seasons yet.

How is it possible tht Justin Morneau has 14 HRs and 47 RBI. he nly hit 21 HRs all last year. He must be close to the top ten in both categories. How does a guy get that many RBI's on this team?

How is it possible that Liriano is that good at the age of 22. He isnt just good. He is dominant. He is unhittable most of the time.

But how is it possible that the Twins could have 3 such great young players and be way uder .500?

The leadership on this team ,from a performance standpoint, comes from 3 guys who have a combined 5 years in the big leagues. Impossible.

[Irishmans Shanty]

Packerboy...I agree, there are many positives coming out of this season. When its done, I believe the Twins will have four legitimate stars in Mauer, Morneau, Santana, and Liriano to lean on for some time. The nucleus that could be coming out of this rebuilding process will be far better than the nucleus that won three division titles. The only question in regards to their future playoff hopes is how strong the rest of the Central will be when these twenty-somethings are ready to drive the bus.

[packerboy]

The only way to go into the new park with a contending team is to spend some money...and lots of it.

The Brett Boone, Rondel White, Tony Batista stuff has got to stop. If things go right, the 4 guys mentioned by IS could be the corner stone of some very good teams.

Its not very often that you get these guys so good at this age. I am old enough to remember the Allison, Mincher, Versailles, Killebrew, Olivia, Carew, Kaat teams. Those teams were supplemented nicely with trades and aquisitions that lead to years of very good baseball for Twins fans.

Same deal with Viola, Kirby, Hrbie and the boys.

This could be even better. So, its OK to bitch about this team. I know I certainly will. But we could be seeing the start of something pretty fun if Pohlad and Ryan step it up a bit.

[Irishmans Shanty]

During free agency there was one player that I really coveted for this year's edition of the Twins. His name was Bill Mueller. He solved a lot of problems for the Twins coming into the year. He was an everyday 3B with a great glove who could bat at the top of the order for average. When I heard he was out of the Twins' price range at about 3.5-4 mill/year it was evident to me that they were still refusing to spend dollars.

During the summer of 1982 an Issue of Sports Illustrated entered my home, on the cover was a picture of a Twin, with the caption: Kent Hrbek, of the Terrible Twins. I wonder if we will see something similar from SI in the coming months.

[larsey]

Not that i'm a BIG baseball fan...but, the 9 (thats NINE million) they throw away on Radke would free up a heck of a lot $$$ Also, Justin needs to look (wait) for his pitch. If he waits for it, I believe this kid could spank 40+!
I know it's rebuilding time but it's time for some people to go. No sense in prolonging the eneviitable...? ie: RADKE! Liriano looks like a Santana duplicate, he works fast and gets the job done, and has some damn good stuff. No messin' with this guy, get ride of Radke and give Liriano a raise!

Well, that's my 2 cents...