Will any team beat EP or come close?

[g31]

They lost Pezon, great talent, but gained a few high quality players. Can anybody beat them? Some what easy schedule for regular season, but what about the sections etc? Thoughts anyone? Curious!

[gopher25]

I would think that Roseville would have a shot. Cody is quite the playmaker and Brausen is only a 9th grader with tons of potential....their youth teams were quite good a few years back. I would also think that White Bear Lake and Stillwater should be pretty good...

[he_shoots-he_scores]

I hear BSM will be very talented this year. They only lose 2 impact players both very good. (Goalie and De tough positions to replace)

But I understand they will be picking up a very good freshman defenseman who played varsity at Armstrong or Andover (I don't remember which) last year.

Anybody know who she is, and is she that good?

[cluelessinminnesota]

It sounds like EP is losing Pezon but adding Kennedy's leading scorer, Ludwigson, one of Mound's most talented young athletes, K. Ketcher, and a defensemen from their Pee Wee A team. This looks to me like they should have more talent this year then last year. The others Lambert, Stoa, Feste, Seeler, Green and Burke should also all be better.

They should have an unbelievable team.

That being said, I think someone will beat them once this year and hopefully that will be in the playoffs. Edina was crashing the net late in their 3-2 playoff game and one bounce of the puck and things would be different. I think there are three teams in 6AA that could upset EP on the right night and I also think there are at least 9 other teams around the state that could also do the job. Outside of 6AA I like Roseville, Holy Angels, Stillwater, Cloquet, Centennial, Grand Rapids, Bemidji, Coon Rapids and Cretin D-H.

[ghshockeyfan]

Date Time Home/Host Opponent Location
11-14-06 7:30PM Eden Prairie Burnsville Senior High School Eden Prairie Community Center
11-21-06 7:30PM Eden Prairie Rosemount Eden Prairie Community Center
12-02-06 3:00PM Lakeville North Away vs. Lakeville North Ames Arena
12-05-06 7:00PM Eagan High School Away vs. Eagan High School Eagan Ice Arena
12-07-06 7:30PM Eden Prairie Eastview Eden Prairie Community Center
12-12-06 7:00PM Chaska Away vs. Chaska Chaska Community Center
12-16-06 7:30PM Apple Valley Away vs. Apple Valley Apple Valley Sports Arena
12-19-06 7:00PM Rosemount Away vs. Rosemount Rosemount Community Center
12-21-06 7:30PM Roseville Away vs. Roseville Coliseum Arena
12-29-06 TBA South St. Paul Away vs. TBA Wakota Arena
12-30-06 TBD South St. Paul Away vs. TBD Wakota Arena
01-01-07 TBD South St. Paul Away vs. TBD Wakota Arena
01-06-07 3:30PM Burnsville Senior High School Away vs. Burnsville Senior High School Burnsville Ice Center
01-09-07 7:30PM Eden Prairie Kennedy Eden Prairie Community Center
01-13-07 3:00PM Eastview Away vs. Eastview Apple Valley Sports Arena
01-16-07 7:30PM Eden Prairie Lakeville North Eden Prairie Community Center
01-18-07 7:30PM Eden Prairie Park Cottage Grove Eden Prairie Community Center
01-20-07 12:15PM Jefferson Away vs. Jefferson Bloomington Ice Garden
01-23-07 7:30PM Eden Prairie Eagan High School Eden Prairie Community Center
01-25-07 7:00PM Wayzata Away vs. Wayzata Plymouth Ice Center
01-27-07 3:00PM Lakeville South Away vs. Lakeville South Ames Arena
01-30-07 7:30PM Eden Prairie Chaska Eden Prairie Community Center
02-01-07 7:30PM Blaine Away vs. Blaine Fogerty Ice Arena
02-03-07 3:30PM Eden Prairie Apple Valley Eden Prairie Community Center
TBA TBA Section? TBA Parade
TBD TBD Section TBD Parade
TBD TBD Section TBD Parade
02-22-07 TBA MSHSL Away vs. MSHSL Xcel
02-23-07 TBD MSHSL Away vs. MSHSL TBD
02-24-07 TBD MSHSL Away vs. MSHSL TBD

[SEMetro]

I think Borer out of Armstrong is going to BSM.

I didn't think EP had a girl on its PWA state championship team last year but, as always, I could be wrong.

All this transferring ticking off the younger EP'ers and EPHA? Or do they like it because of the banners?

[offsides]

cluelessinminnesota Wrote:

"That being said, I think someone will beat them once this year and hopefully that will be in the playoffs. Edina was crashing the net late in their 3-2 playoff game and one bounce of the puck and things would be different. I think there are three teams in 6AA that could upset EP on the right night and I also think there are at least 9 other teams around the state that could also do the job. Outside of 6AA I like Roseville, Holy Angels, Stillwater, Cloquet, Centennial, Grand Rapids, Bemidji, Coon Rapids and Cretin D-H".



Clueless, your list is way too long. Someone may well beat EP, but most of your list will/could not. One of the primary requisites for beating EP will be extremely good goaltending, and not all of the teams you listed have that.

The biggest problem for EP opponents will be their depth. Why did AHA, RV, CR, Bemidji, SW lose to them by multiple goals last year? Because none of them could come close to matching the skill level and speed three lines deep. And that's saying nothing about an extremely strong defense and good goaltending. I don't know without looking it up, but I'll guess that not a single one of those teams were as young as EP last year either. Scary. I agree with you, losing Pezon is a big blow, but they may be deeper and faster this year.

Edina was awesome against them last year in sections, and will have a fine team this year, but unless they've added a whole lot of speed up fromt, mobility on defense, and Patrick Roy, they will have a tough time staying as close again.

Like it or not, EP has the potential to be one of the best ever.

[ghshockeyfan]

Only one other team that I know of has sent 4+ players to NDP NY in one season is Kennedy of 2004-5 (3 homegrown, 1 transfer). I'm guessing that a SSP during the past 5 years could have done this too, and maybe a Jefferson of the late 90's as well. EP should have had 6 last year, but a couple amazing 89's got left off due to amazing 88's... EP may have as many as 10 this year (2007). Jefferson, SSP, & EP all were built with amazing homegrown talent in addition to outstanding transfers.

I find it hard to believe that anyone can beat this team. Look at the roster. It will take amazing goaltending, a lucky goal or two, and just amazing luck on the part of any team to stay within a few goals of this team.

Returning/Incoming (may be a couple others incoming...)
F
Feste - 1th 25-34-59 (NDP Lake Placid/Rochester 05 & 06)
Green - 11th 16-28-44 (NDP Lake Placid/Rochester 05 & 06)
Ludwigson - 11th - new from BK 32-7-39 (w/o supporting cast of EP) NDP Lake Placid 05
Riggs - 11th 31-22-53 (NDP P2???)
Stoa - 12th 31-27-58 NDP Lake Placid 05
*Return all but 3F listed below + may be a couple others incoming...

D
LaComb - new from PWA - N/A (expected NDP P2+ candidate when eligible)
Lambert - 12th 5-27-32 NDP Rochester 06 (did not tryout in 05)
Seeler - 11th 8-30-38 (NDP Lake Placid/Rochester 05 & 06)
*Return all other D...

G
Burke(11th)/Elliot(12th) (both NDP P1+???)

Lost (F):
Pezon 43-47-90 NDP Lake Placid multiple times...
Riggs 10-14-24
Schneider 13-11-24

[wings7811]

[quote="ghshockeyfan"]LaComb - new from PWA - N/A (expected NDP P2+ candidate when eligible)

Nice list and EP "should be" the team to beat next year. As we all know, hockey is a funny game and any team can beat another on any given night. It may be a hot goaltender, a bad bounce here or a post rung too many times. Who knows but it will be fun to watch them play this year.

LaCombe, if I'm not mistaken, was B1 Bantam last year. Her father coaches the Bantam A's in EP. She's a good player that will do well in girl's hockey as she makes the transition.

[mnhockey36299]

Wings your right about Lacombe, PeeWee 2 years ago, Bantam B1 last year.

[ghshockeyfan]

Wings your right about Lacombe, PeeWee 2 years ago, Bantam B1 last year.

Good call - I'm a year behind on the Lacombe girl. I will say that a gal coming out of B1 Bantams should make an impact at the G HS level.

I'd say it's quite possible that EP won't lose a game until 2008-9 & beyond that it's hard to tell as they'll lose Seeler, Feste, Green, Ludwigson, both goalies, etc. by then to graduation. Anyone who thinks it's over at EP after 2006-7 is wrong.

[xwildfan]

Is Shattuck on EP's schedule? If they are, I would bet on Shattuck. Would be essentially a game between two Select teams. If I was a HS coach, I would instruct my players to view any game against EP as an exhibition game against an All Star/Select team. EP is the epitome of what is wrong at the HS level regarding sports with all their transfers.

[ghshockeyfan]

Is Shattuck on EP's schedule? If they are, I would bet on Shattuck. Would be essentially a game between two Select teams. If I was a HS coach, I would instruct my players to view any game against EP as an exhibition game against an All Star/Select team. EP is the epitome of what is wrong at the HS level regarding sports with all their transfers.

I don't believe SSM is or will be on the EP schedule - but it would make more sense now that SSM is out of the MWEHL and maybe looking for some games. Similarly, I don't believe BSM will be on the EP schedule. I could be wrong though. I think part of this is protecting players from desire to move to the other. Many never mention the number of EP kids at BSM, other schools, etc. historically.

I look at EP from a different angle as I know a few players that have went there via transfer. May it be that EP also shows us what is wrong with some other programs that these players originated from? Was there reason to stay put? It's like I tell those around me now. It needs to be more about us making kids have something to "stay for" vs. giving them incentive to "go to" something else... I have told my top HS players that if they want to seek out a transfer, let me know - I'll help them however I can within the rules of the MSHSL. I don't want kids in my program that don't want to be there.

There are lots of OE considerations. Hockey is just one part (I hope), and not the driving force, but sometimes it may be that athletics are one thing that help keep a kid happy where they're at, and if that goes downhill in a hurry...

Will be interesting to see what the MSHSL does about the xfer rules. And also will be interesting to see if anyone challenges them. I'll also be curious to see if this won't be the beginning of the end of G HS hockey as we know it as it could instead force more AAA T-Bred like hockey to become the place to go. I hope not.

[hshockey]

It is amazing that the president of the girls high school association is the biggest recruiter in the state. He goes to EP where he just has to open the gates and win a state tournament. He must really be involved in the youth program, everyone else's. His assistant coaches work harder in the off season than they do during the season. The girls he has moving in he does not even need but he wants to make his job easier. The Kennedy girl is just doing this because her friends did it.The Mound girl is not even the best player on the Mound team. I have a idea lets leave our high school where we are above average players and go to a team where we will play JV maybe or be a role player on a varsity. Time for a change!!!

[d1wannabe]

EP will NOT go undefeatd and here is why...

1. Lack of Team Chemistry. There are going to be some very upset players that expected to play bigger roles this year and they wont due to transfers... and there are going to be some returning letter winners that are going to have a hard time making varsity.

2. Season is going to be boring... They are in one of the weakest confrences in the league and they are going to face no competition untill the Kaposia and or section tournament where they wont be ready for it. and they are going to lack the teamwork needed to stay in tight games.

3. Coach Morris... enough said.

[hockeywild7]

I don't know coach Morris enough to comment on him and I dont like it when we make judgements on people in a forum like this anyway. I do know he seemed to handle the team very well last year in the state tournament. Recruiting is a tough call as many times the coach has nothing to do with the kids deciding to transfer. Usually it is driven by the parents, not the coaches. A coach has no control over who decides to show up at tryouts. The only contol a coach has is whether or not they decide to put them on the team or cut them. You could say it makes a coaches job tougher in some situations as a transfer may disrupt team chemistry. Usually these players have a relationship with some of the players of the school they are transferring to because of offseason teams and or camps.
Getting to the question at hand of whether or not EP will go undefeated and repeat as state champs. I would say there isnt much doubt that EP has great talent back from last years team and from the apparent transfers. but each year is different and sometimes you dont get the breaks or crucial plays at key times. That being said I would have a hard time picking anyone ahead of them.

[ghshockeyfan]

Four dynasty programs in G HS hockey have been:

Approximately:

Roseville - 1996-2000
Jefferson - 1998-2002
SSP - 2000-2006
EP - 2005 - 2009???

The last 3 built as much with transfers as with amazing homegrown talent. The first one did it almost entirely homegrown, but had lots of transfers afterwards.

Many overlook the coaching needed to keep these teams from imploding with so many superstars in one locker room. Like some of the NHL teams that were loaded with talent (Red Wings of a few years ago, etc.), much of this is about success of the coach (Bowman) to manage player personnel issues that could otherwise destroy team chemistry. Coaching a group of superstars isn't any easier. In some respects it may be, but in others it is much, much harder.

Also, as to the reference made to a BK player "following her friends" let me say this. Yes & no. She doesn’t follow many athletically or academically. She's as brilliant a person and equally as amazing an athlete as I've ever met - for someone her age she is also has a pretty good level of maturity. This being said, if she was just "following her friends" then why would she have waited a year and not left when they did a year ago? Instead of dishonoring her by saying she's a follower, maybe some should give her credit for staying last year at BK and then making the informed decision to consider her options a year down the road vs. just blindly follow her friends.

[OnFrozenPond]

I agree that it is difficult to run the tables, but EP has a great opportunity to do it again. They are by far the deepest team in the state. When you can send out the equivilant of two first lines and a second line, you are going to create match-up problems for your opponents. The only thing that stands in their way would be complacency or an incredibly hot goaltender.

Looking forward I see them as favorites again in 07-08, but the bottom drops out in 08-09. If the open enrollment policy changes, they are in big trouble. They are losing most of their best talent to private schools. They lost their best player from a very thin Sophmore class. They have lost several of their top players from the Freshman class. And their top 3-4 players from the U12 team will be playing for Privates. Lacombe may be the only impact player they have from 8 - 10 grade.

[ghshockeyfan]

I agree that it is difficult to run the tables, but EP has a great opportunity to do it again. They are by far the deepest team in the state. When you can send out the equivilant of two first lines and a second line, you are going to create match-up problems for your opponents. The only thing that stands in their way would be complacency or an incredibly hot goaltender.

Looking forward I see them as favorites again in 07-08, but the bottom drops out in 08-09. If the open enrollment policy changes, they are in big trouble. They are losing most of their best talent to private schools. They lost their best player from a very thin Sophmore class. They have lost several of their top players from the Freshman class. And their top 3-4 players from the U12 team will be playing for Privates. Lacombe may be the only impact player they have from 8 - 10 grade.

This is an interesting phenomenon as well. The impact that OE has on homegrown youth. EP had a tough time retaining some of the top homegrown talent historically, but those losses may be inevitable when you are in a relatively economically affluent community. The upswing of the HS team may have been incentive to stay, but when the inward movement became so great that it bypassed the need - you just can't say what this will do youth wise. The best model to use is the Roseville/Jefferson/SSP one. They’ve been through this. More Jefferson/SSP than Roseville. I would say that West Bloomington is very much like EP in some respects, but also there is a really unique side to Bloomington as well (I know from experience & I say this with many fond memories of Bloomington). SSP is a class A community, and it stood the chance of being most volatile youth wise just from a numbers perspective. Roseville, while moderately affluent, attracted many kids out of neighboring communities after their teams had become less dominant vs. during. Roseville has always maintained a strong youth program. I think the greatest danger in any of these situations is that youth go from aspiring/dreaming to play for the hometown squad because they have become so good, to seeing that they likely never will due to how strong the team is. There can become resentment & hostility for the program attracting so much strong outside talent. Actually, in girls hockey when this happens (i.e. kids get cut from HS team) it is simply the same as the way it is with the boys programs. They have cut kids for years, the only difference is that the kids being cut are homegrown that feel displaced by transfers. The thing that parents don't realize is that NO COACH CAN REFUSE AN OE KID BECAUSE THE ARE AN OE KID!!! So, I think that as long as we have OE, this resentment & hostility needs to be understood in the proper context. It's not the coach that is allowing these kids to OE, but the laws of the state of MN. We could argue about the "recruiting" but the bottom line is that the best programs & coaches (@ top academic schools) indirectly will attract the best players looking for better options.

[OnFrozenPond]

One thing should be said...Most of the movement to private schools has little or nothing to do with hockey. I would hope this is the case for all, but am not naive enough to believe it. A lot of the kids have been in private school all along or had planned to go to private school for HS all along. Those players that may have been leaning that way now have one more reason to add to the list.

I know there are several players and parents that are upset with the OE situation, however my post was not an indictment of the program at all. Most of girls coming into the program have not had to deal with being cut from the Youth through HS. It is very difficult to accept that things have changed. It makes for an easy target when the player that beats you out has come from a neighboring community instead of your own.

[ghshockeyfan]

Agreed 100%. In some respects I think the OE is more hated now than the Private xfer. It truly is a situaion where the tables have turned. Unfortunately in this scenario the homegrown average AA schools can't compete, and even the top privates/top OE publics are in an arms race to compete.

This is why I have to say I enjoy my Class A public metro situation. Every kid on my roster lives in the same city and is attending their home HS. Yes, we'll lose a few to OE/Private I'm sure out of our youth ranks, but that happens. We enjoy the challenge that the top private/A&AA OE teams pose, and we played one of the top scheudles last year of any team in the state. Our kids played above their ability regularly, and while some scores were close we had a hard time just hanging with some amazing teams. Class A hockey is "bad" in many people's eyes, but there is also a more level playing field usually. There are still a couple private/OE dominated A teams, but many have jumped to AA or graduated many of their OE kids. As the A tourney moves to 8 teams, I expect this will be a great experience and a more level playing field (yes, I say this even knowing that a likely 2007 Ms. Hockey is in my section...).

It's been a great experience to coach a city co-op, a AA lake conf team, and now a class A squad. Maybe one day I'll add the private school experience to the list just for the experience, but likely not anytime soon.

At some point there may need to be some discussion about inviting SSM back into the league, grouping them in a top "tier" with the best private & big school AA teams - maybe create a second tier of more homegrown AA teams, and then have the third tier be class A as we now know it?