Professionalism has been lacking in some places. The officials may be from the same town they are officiating in but they are supposed give at least the illusion of neutrality (based on their training).....example..... in one arena the officials walked in with their hometown gear on, joking with the hometown girls/parents/coaches and then on ice in their official gear they continued to joke around with the hometown girls and the coaches. They were a perfect example of what you are not supposed to do at the most basic level.
Granted officiating is a difficult job but bad officials give the good ones a bad rap. Our team has had their share of less than stellar officials as of late that we gave a set of good officials a round of applause the other night. Wanting to recognize a job well done. I bet they were shocked when they realized what the cheer was for.
The Refs are ruining the game
Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)
Girls Hockey needs to be taken more seriously by all administration who set up the games. That means hiring competent officials for every game. That means qualified refs and goal judges for every game. An example of this was the Crookston, Alexandria game a few weeks ago where No. 2 in the state was playing No. 5. There were no goal judges for this important game and the out come was almost decided by the lack of them. You wouldn't see that in a boys hockey game. If you give the game the respect it deserves then the best refs should get most of the work and the worst refs wouldn't, giving them more time to work on their game to get better or like any job done poorly they wouldn't be called back.
You have it all wrong!! The refs are the same ones that do boys and girls, yes this is true. Some of you know it alls are saying right now as you read this, this person is crazy. My brother refs for both boys and girls high school games. He takes all the crap that you experts give him, until you go overboard. Then he has the right to eject you from the arena, no questions asked. Yes refs make some bad calls, so what they are human. If you know it alls are so much better and knowledgable in the sport, get out there and get certified and ref the games. Then come back on this board and post, otherwise. Give them a break, they are blasted from all sides during a game.
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lovetopuck
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[quote="Zamman"]You have it all wrong!! The refs are the same ones that do boys and girls, yes this is true. Some of you know it alls are saying right now as you read this, this person is crazy. My brother refs for both boys and girls high school games. He takes all the crap that you experts give him, until you go overboard. Then he has the right to eject you from the arena, no questions asked. Yes refs make some bad calls, so what they are human. If you know it alls are so much better and knowledgable in the sport, get out there and get certified and ref the games. Then come back on this board and post, otherwise. Give them a break, they are blasted from all sides during a game.[/quote]
this happens in every sport. i ref basketball, and hockey and ump baseball. i would have to say hockey has the least to worry about because the fans are behind glass, although in hockey games the worst things are said. none the less, refs will always make bad calls, and no matter how much crap you give the call will never change. i have respect for every single ref who steps on the playing field, but once you lose control of the game and the players have control you might as well just step of the ice.
this happens in every sport. i ref basketball, and hockey and ump baseball. i would have to say hockey has the least to worry about because the fans are behind glass, although in hockey games the worst things are said. none the less, refs will always make bad calls, and no matter how much crap you give the call will never change. i have respect for every single ref who steps on the playing field, but once you lose control of the game and the players have control you might as well just step of the ice.
Two of my adult children are officials in multiple sports so I do have great empathy for officials and understand the challenges.
With that being said there are officials out there that do not demonstrate the appropriate professionalism that I know their training offers and those officials I will not respect. I am not one of those parents that are screaming in the stands either about officiating I will just shake my head when watching poor officiating and continue to cheer on our girls.
I do respect those officials who officiate as consistently as possible, present themselves in a professional manner and treat the teams in a similar fashion.
With that being said there are officials out there that do not demonstrate the appropriate professionalism that I know their training offers and those officials I will not respect. I am not one of those parents that are screaming in the stands either about officiating I will just shake my head when watching poor officiating and continue to cheer on our girls.
I do respect those officials who officiate as consistently as possible, present themselves in a professional manner and treat the teams in a similar fashion.
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northlandpro
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Refs
Being a ref has to be the toughest job in hockey followed by coaching. My hat is off to these individuals for the time and commitment that they contribute to the game of hockey. As a coach you realize that refs will make good and bad calls. As long as they somewhat balance out for each team I never get very excited. Parents tend to get too emotionally involved in their childrens athletics and need to take a step back & give these people a break. Have you thanked your refs or coach lately? 
Just wondering
You know, I've seen many posts on here about how officials are poor and we need better refs. I also have seen comlaining about penalties and what people who were at the game "think" were penalties. To those of you that support us refs, ( the professional, consistent ones anyway) I thank you for thinking of us. But for those of you sitting in the stands shaking your heads when a call doesn't go the way you think it should, I ask you this.
When was the last time you went to one of our 8 hour seminars, watched countless videos, and spent many hours working on what we get yelled at for everyday?
I'm not saying that all officials are great, I've worked with several that aren't, but the constant whining from ignorant fans is what drives good refs away from the game at very young ages so that we don't have better , more experienced officials when they get older.
When was the last time you went to one of our 8 hour seminars, watched countless videos, and spent many hours working on what we get yelled at for everyday?
I'm not saying that all officials are great, I've worked with several that aren't, but the constant whining from ignorant fans is what drives good refs away from the game at very young ages so that we don't have better , more experienced officials when they get older.
How do you think that fans can be better informed about officiating or coaching for that matter without becoming refs or coaching or is it simply just the way it is? The old adage that people will be people or something?
Our school system has a sportmanship type of video that is presented at the parents' sports meeting and at the youth level there are sportsmanship statements that players, parents and coaches have to sign, etc.
I do get it there is significant time and training that goes into officiating and coaching sports and yes, we do thank our coaches and we even led a cheer for officials that did a good job just the other night so yep, we do thank them.
I am asking a serious question though in terms of suggestions on how to best educate parents or fans? I am board member of our local and regional fastpitch (I know different sport but same concept) organization and we discuss the best ways to encourage sportsmanship with the adults, in particular. Coaches and players we seem to have a good handle on.
Our school system has a sportmanship type of video that is presented at the parents' sports meeting and at the youth level there are sportsmanship statements that players, parents and coaches have to sign, etc.
I do get it there is significant time and training that goes into officiating and coaching sports and yes, we do thank our coaches and we even led a cheer for officials that did a good job just the other night so yep, we do thank them.
I am asking a serious question though in terms of suggestions on how to best educate parents or fans? I am board member of our local and regional fastpitch (I know different sport but same concept) organization and we discuss the best ways to encourage sportsmanship with the adults, in particular. Coaches and players we seem to have a good handle on.
Contact your local officials coordinator. For hockey, there are several videos that we watch explaining rules. Having players and parents watch this would be fundamental to good sportsmanship as your players and parents would know the rules better and then if something did arise they may even learn that officials have to see it from a different perspective. Thanks again for your praise of officials.
Thanks. I think when we have our parent booster club meeting it may be helpful at least we will have tried so I will give our head guy a call. Will have to check into other informational materials for other sports.
You make a valid point that we do lose officials. My youngest teenage daughter started with a group of 8 girls to train to officiate a few years ago and now it is down to only her continuing to get certified. The other ones quit for a variety of reasons but getting yelled at was a factor for many of them. So valid point you made.
You make a valid point that we do lose officials. My youngest teenage daughter started with a group of 8 girls to train to officiate a few years ago and now it is down to only her continuing to get certified. The other ones quit for a variety of reasons but getting yelled at was a factor for many of them. So valid point you made.
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lovetopuck
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[quote="SportsMa"]Thanks. I think when we have our parent booster club meeting it may be helpful at least we will have tried so I will give our head guy a call. Will have to check into other informational materials for other sports.
You make a valid point that we do lose officials. My youngest teenage daughter started with a group of 8 girls to train to officiate a few years ago and now it is down to only her continuing to get certified. The other ones quit for a variety of reasons but getting yelled at was a factor for many of them. So valid point you made.[/quote]
i think to truly appreciate what refs do, you have to do it yourself. i remember back in my first two years of high school yelling obscene things at refs and having my peers cheer me on. My junior year i started reffing basketball and umping baseball and i truly began to understand what really goes on in a ref's head throughout the competition. Then through college i reffed basketball and hockey and umped baseball and not only was it a great experience i also made a fair amount of money. i think creating a video or something to educate athletes and parents would be benifical but i think that its very difficult to understand offciating unless you do it first hand.
You make a valid point that we do lose officials. My youngest teenage daughter started with a group of 8 girls to train to officiate a few years ago and now it is down to only her continuing to get certified. The other ones quit for a variety of reasons but getting yelled at was a factor for many of them. So valid point you made.[/quote]
i think to truly appreciate what refs do, you have to do it yourself. i remember back in my first two years of high school yelling obscene things at refs and having my peers cheer me on. My junior year i started reffing basketball and umping baseball and i truly began to understand what really goes on in a ref's head throughout the competition. Then through college i reffed basketball and hockey and umped baseball and not only was it a great experience i also made a fair amount of money. i think creating a video or something to educate athletes and parents would be benifical but i think that its very difficult to understand offciating unless you do it first hand.
Agree with lovetopuck. Unless you have ever refereed, the average fan has no idea how hard the job is. For starters, the fan has a much better vantage point than the ref. Fans have a much better view of the game than the refs. So, the fans often time see more than the refs.
The refs should be simply viewed as a part of the game. Like players, they will have good games, bad games; miss penalties; call the wrong penalties, etc. There are good refs and bad refs; in most seasons, it all balances out. 99.9% of all games are decided by the players.
Regarding the attrition rate of referees, I would bet it is around 90 - 95%. There really should be a rule at the youth hockey level that coaches are not allowed to talk to the referees. Young referees are berated by coaches and fans as soon as they start working traveling games. The result is (as everyone knows), that potentially qualified referees are essentially saying, "who needs this abuse?" The long term result is that the farther up the hockey ladder you go, the fewer good referees you have.
Another observation about teams and referees. It seems there is a direct correlation of teams that have players that complain about calls and coaches that whine about the calls. There was one coach in particular at the Kaposia Classic that would probaby win the "Whiner of the Year Award" from the referees if there was such an award.
The refs should be simply viewed as a part of the game. Like players, they will have good games, bad games; miss penalties; call the wrong penalties, etc. There are good refs and bad refs; in most seasons, it all balances out. 99.9% of all games are decided by the players.
Regarding the attrition rate of referees, I would bet it is around 90 - 95%. There really should be a rule at the youth hockey level that coaches are not allowed to talk to the referees. Young referees are berated by coaches and fans as soon as they start working traveling games. The result is (as everyone knows), that potentially qualified referees are essentially saying, "who needs this abuse?" The long term result is that the farther up the hockey ladder you go, the fewer good referees you have.
Another observation about teams and referees. It seems there is a direct correlation of teams that have players that complain about calls and coaches that whine about the calls. There was one coach in particular at the Kaposia Classic that would probaby win the "Whiner of the Year Award" from the referees if there was such an award.
You have a great point about setting the tone by the coaches' behavior, too. Whiners will whine and so likely then will their players, etc, etc....my daughter's current head coach very rarely shows an emotion about officiating calls and the players follow suit.
Youth traveling coaches and fans (squirts right now in our area) seem to be most vocal and negative to the officials so it may be of benefit to limit coach contact with the young referees so there can be a greater base of referees built up. Nice idea, not likely to happen but makes sense.
The jist of what I am getting since I sort of hijacked this thread to parents and sportsmanship is whiners will whine, lead by example and you cannot really understand the challenges of officiating unless you have been there and done it.
I still think it would be a good topic of conversation at a Booster Club meeting though to at least get people thinking a little bit. Thanks for the thoughts.
Youth traveling coaches and fans (squirts right now in our area) seem to be most vocal and negative to the officials so it may be of benefit to limit coach contact with the young referees so there can be a greater base of referees built up. Nice idea, not likely to happen but makes sense.
The jist of what I am getting since I sort of hijacked this thread to parents and sportsmanship is whiners will whine, lead by example and you cannot really understand the challenges of officiating unless you have been there and done it.
I still think it would be a good topic of conversation at a Booster Club meeting though to at least get people thinking a little bit. Thanks for the thoughts.
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lovetopuck
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thats a very good point.xwildfan wrote:
The refs should be simply viewed as a part of the game. Like players, they will have good games, bad games; miss penalties; call the wrong penalties, etc. There are good refs and bad refs; in most seasons, it all balances out. 99.9% of all games are decided by the players..
Sportsma:
Also agree with your point about if the coach is a whiner, the players will be too. I had a Bantam B2 championship game in a Proctor tournament and a certain team from the cities received alot of penalties. Everytime they did, the players would through up their arms or have something to say. After about the 3rd penalty, I saw why because the coach was doing the same. He and I had a nice discussion about how the kids will follow what he does and by the end of the second, we didn't see much more of that.
Also agree with your point about if the coach is a whiner, the players will be too. I had a Bantam B2 championship game in a Proctor tournament and a certain team from the cities received alot of penalties. Everytime they did, the players would through up their arms or have something to say. After about the 3rd penalty, I saw why because the coach was doing the same. He and I had a nice discussion about how the kids will follow what he does and by the end of the second, we didn't see much more of that.