Too many penalties

hockeyjunkie2 · Post by **hockeyjunkie2** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 6:21 pm

I wasn't at the game but my parents were. My little brothers Bantam game at the Minnetonka tournament this weekend they were playign i think Champlin Park and there were over 40 penalties! I've seen a few of his games and there have always been mroe this year than usual but over 40? Any other games like this?

wildforhockey · Post by **wildforhockey** » Sat Feb 03, 2007 9:19 pm

If you are talking about district 6 this is a very good chance depending on who the refs are, they are very inconsistent in calling and you get one ref calling one penalty and another one will let the same call go.........there is one ref in d6 that likes to take the games away from players and teams......

...... for instance our coach pointed out with this one ref we average 26 penalty minutes a game, we dont play any different than any other game, when we dont have this d6 ref we average 9 minutes a game

QuackerTracker · Post by **QuackerTracker** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 6:33 am

This new line of enforcement is tough. The thing is you get guys that just don't care and will call nothing so they can get out of the rink and go home and wait for the paycheck. Other refs have not bought in to the idea of calling a game tight. Then yet you have guys who enjoy refing and being on the ice. Finaly there are refs that take the game too seriously. The best refs will be somewhere between having fun and taking it too seriously. D6 has way too many of the first too, the paycheck collectors and the guys who don't care. These are the guys that need to go first.

ramstein · Post by **ramstein** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:06 am

No one would complain about the reffing or the number of penalties if they were consistent. There are to many times when teams play in the morning and then the afternoon in different arenas and there seems to be a different rule system......or worse the home coach is calling out penalties to young refs.....for example...a coach would holler out a players number and the young ref would turn and blow his whistle....now the penalties were justified for kids not wearing there mouthguards BUT why was it the coach that was calling it not the ref..

QuackerTracker · Post by **QuackerTracker** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:41 am

ramstein wrote:No one would complain about the reffing or the number of penalties if they were consistent. There are to many times when teams play in the morning and then the afternoon in different arenas and there seems to be a different rule system......or worse the home coach is calling out penalties to young refs.....for example...a coach would holler out a players number and the young ref would turn and blow his whistle....now the penalties were justified for kids not wearing there mouthguards BUT why was it the coach that was calling it not the ref..

I wish I had an answer for you. A lot of young refs can get intimidated by coaches and don't return after 1 year. As far as the penalty calling I really hope in the next year it gets better and more consistan. I have watch a lot of games this year, waiting for mine to start and there is a lot of intresing things that go on that just make me shake my head!

oxotartanoxo · Post by **oxotartanoxo** » Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:31 pm

tartan is deff. on the top for most penalties

ohMY · Post by **ohMY** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 9:27 am

I watched a D6 game last night - and some of the calls both ways were outlandish. None worse than a "revisit" call by a ref. Nearly 60 seconds after the player left the ice with no call made at the time, the 3 refs conferenced up at a stoppage of play. The Head ref than visited the teams bench and it appeared they informed the coach that "upon further review" they elected to assess a penalty on a player in "arrears". I have never seen that one before and brings new meaning to the term "delayed penalty" - I am hopeful that D6 does a thorough review of referee performance this year and chooses not to invite some back, just as associations do with coaches.

QuackerTracker · Post by **QuackerTracker** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 11:45 am

ohMY wrote:I watched a D6 game last night - and some of the calls both ways were outlandish. None worse than a "revisit" call by a ref. Nearly 60 seconds after the player left the ice with no call made at the time, the 3 refs conferenced up at a stoppage of play. The Head ref than visited the teams bench and it appeared they informed the coach that "upon further review" they elected to assess a penalty on a player in "arrears". I have never seen that one before and brings new meaning to the term "delayed penalty" - I am hopeful that D6 does a thorough review of referee performance this year and chooses not to invite some back, just as associations do with coaches.

Ok... first there is not a head ref. There are 2 linesmen and 1 ref. The linesmen can not assess penalties but only report to the ref what they saw and it is the refs job to then assess a penalty. What was the penalty for? Too many men, ruffing, slashing? The linesman can only report infractions like this that the ref may not have seen. This happens more then you might think. You may want to know what the officials jobs are before you make comments that make you sound clueless.

omg4 · Post by **omg4** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 12:11 pm

I'm sure there was a perfectly good explanation that a goal was taken away after both ref's pointed towards the goal. They were both headed for center ice for the face off when the other teams coach called him over and a magical offsides appeared to be the call, neither one raised there arm or blew there whistle to stop play. It was a real cluster. It happened this weekend in the Elk River Tournament when we were playing Rogers. I have watched alot of hockey games and I've never witness anything like that. You had to be there. It would've tied the game in the 3rd period which we did eventuly do. I'm not saying that it cost the game but we did go on to score another goal to tie it up after that. Also it not often that a team can go thru almost 3 periods without a penalty in a very physical game which it was. As I said... you had to be there to get the full jest of it but I'm sure you've all been there.

QuackerTracker · Post by **QuackerTracker** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 12:53 pm

omg4 wrote:I'm sure there was a perfectly good explanation that a goal was taken away after both ref's pointed towards the goal. They were both headed for center ice for the face off when the other teams coach called him over and a magical offsides appeared to be the call, neither one raised there arm or blew there whistle to stop play. It was a real cluster. It happened this weekend in the Elk River Tournament when we were playing Rogers. I have watched alot of hockey games and I've never witness anything like that. You had to be there. It would've tied the game in the 3rd period which we did eventuly do. I'm not saying that it cost the game but we did go on to score another goal to tie it up after that. Also it not often that a team can go thru almost 3 periods without a penalty in a very physical game which it was. As I said... you had to be there to get the full jest of it but I'm sure you've all been there.

Sounds like a differn't situation with a 2 man ref system. The officials should have reported the reason why the goal was waived off and reported it to the scorebox to be anounced over the loud speaker. Sounds like a poor job. Did they explain the reason why the goal was waived off to your coach? They should have done that for sure.

Finally - Phisical Play is not against the rules.

ohMY · Post by **ohMY** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:02 pm

Quacker - thanks for the terminology correction. Greatly appreciated. The penalty assessed was slashing - no penalty was called at the time of the incident - delayed or otherwise. Play continued on without any indication for nearly sixty seconds. At the next stoppage of play, the LINESMEN conferenced with the REFEREE and collectively decided that the incident actually DID require a call. If the LINESMAN felt that a call was warranted at the time of the incident, should the call not have been made then? If, at the time of the incident a call is not made should that not be the end of it? I am unaware of a procedure that allows for review of infractions via OFFICIAL conference well after play has proceeded on.

QuackerTracker · Post by **QuackerTracker** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:16 pm

Not the linesman can not stop play for a penalty. This is strait from the USA Hockey Rulebook which is avaliable on USAHOCKEY.com under the officials section. Before you try and rip on refs again I think you should read it cause it is obvious you don't have a clue:
Rule 503
(c) He shall, when requested to do so by the Referee, give his version of any incident that may have taken place during the playing of the game.
(d) He shall not stop play to report any penalty except any violation of Rule 205(a) and (c), Change of Players (too many players on the ice) and any violation of Rules 601(c.2) and 601(h.3) (articles thrown on the ice from vicinity of players’ or penalty bench), and he shall report such violation to the Referee who shall impose a bench minor penalty against the offending team. He shall report immediately to the Referee his version of the circumstances with respect to Rule 609(c) (delaying the
game by deliberately displacing the goal post from its normal position).
He shall report to the Referee at the next stoppage of play his version of any infraction of the rules that he believes constitutes a bench minor, major, match, misconduct, game misconduct or penalty shot under these rules, or any Injury Potential Penalty (See Glossary) that occurs behind the play and is not observed by the Referee. The Referee, at his
discretion, may assess a penalty for such infractions.

omg4 · Post by **omg4** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:40 pm

Yes it was a 2 man crew. When they both pointed without making a call signals a goal. As I said they were both headed for the faceoff when the coach called them over. The explanation was "I thought I saw something out of the corner of my eye", which of course I wasn't there to hear it.
Whether our skater was offsides is really insignificant as a call, goal, was made. It was on the board and had to be taken off. It wasn't the physical play that concerned me as much as the one sidedness. We had seven to there 0. They lost complete control of the game. Had you been there you would have seen that they were much more physical than we were. Anytime a kid can throw a haymaker, connect, right in front of the ref and not get a penalty there is someting wrong. They did eventually "warn" the kid towards the end of the game as he seemed to be in the mix of it and was doing alot of talking. They out played us the whole game so I tip my hat to them but the outcome should've been different.
They outshot, out hustled us the whole game but our goalie was standing on his head which made the difference. They are a good team and hopefully we will get another crack at them down the road.

ohMY · Post by **ohMY** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:43 pm

Quack - that's very helpful. Thank you for the explaination. I was clearly clueless on the matter and I am now informed. Having never witnessed it before in 20 years of watching hockey, it was a new experience. It would appear based on the rules you shared that the intent to injure clause was evoked.

As you are on a roll - I have another question...perhaps clueless but a question nonetheless. What would your take be on the following: At the conclusion of a game and post game handshakes between players, if several members (non-capatins) of the winning team skated by a linesman and exhanged congratulatory "fist" (you know the kind shared by athletes, etc). Normal, abnormal? Not a rip, Quack - just a question as to your take...

QuackerTracker · Post by **QuackerTracker** » Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:49 pm

It is very common for several players to shake hands with the officials. I guess I thought the "fist bump" went out in 1995 but I guess kids are bringing it back. I am not sure of this situation but a ref is not going to pull there hand back and say no to a kid. Sounds like you are making something out of nothing to me.

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