White Bear

thetender30 · Post by **thetender30** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:15 pm

villinuve, desmidt, and lernatson paintballed the assist coaches house...thats why they are off the team..i heard they can't play next year also

Neutron 14 · Post by **Neutron 14** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:17 pm

SEC Scotty wrote:The fact that people are pointing the finger at Tim Sager and the White Bear Hockey program for having a lack of discipline is ridiculous. You want to point fingers start with the kids themselves, and then their parents. Sager gave the players in question every opportunity to straighten up and fly right. A hockey coach can only control what a kid does on the ice.

I think the fact that Sager (and Butters before him) have "accepted" kids that were kicked off other programs hasn't helped the environment Scotty. IMO there appears to be plenty of blame to go around, and Sager deserves his share.

SEC Scotty · Post by **SEC Scotty** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:17 pm

wbmd wrote:
Mr.Penalty wrote:but on top of all this confusion about "V" "D" and "L"...what about
WBL's dissapointing loss to Park?
Over confidence possibly? It was also Park's first win of the season.

White Bear outplayed Park the entire game. The difference was Josh Stewart for Park. He was phenomenal. Trevor Leonard had a great game for the Wolfpack as well. On the flipside Owen Colette was brutal.

wxbxl04 · Post by **wxbxl04** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:24 pm

wbmd wrote: Over confidence possibly? It was also Park's first win of the season.

completely agree

SEC Scotty · Post by **SEC Scotty** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:24 pm

Neutron 14 wrote:
SEC Scotty wrote:The fact that people are pointing the finger at Tim Sager and the White Bear Hockey program for having a lack of discipline is ridiculous. You want to point fingers start with the kids themselves, and then their parents. Sager gave the players in question every opportunity to straighten up and fly right. A hockey coach can only control what a kid does on the ice.
I think the fact that Sager (and Butters before him) have "accepted" kids that were kicked off other programs hasn't helped the environment Scotty. IMO there appears to be plenty of blame to go around, and Sager deserves his share.

Teenage boys are also not saints and sometimes a kid needs a second chance. I agree Sager should shoulder some of the blame, but shouldn't be the focal point.

wbmd · Post by **wbmd** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:27 pm

thetender30 wrote:villinuve, desmidt, and lernatson paintballed the assist coaches house...thats why they are off the team..i heard they can't play next year also

So what was it? The assistant coaches house or a teammates house as mentioned in another thread??

SEC Scotty · Post by **SEC Scotty** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:29 pm

wbmd wrote:
thetender30 wrote:villinuve, desmidt, and lernatson paintballed the assist coaches house...thats why they are off the team..i heard they can't play next year also
So what was it? The assistant coaches house or a teammates house as mentioned in another thread??

You writing a book or something? Why don't you mind your own business pal.

wbmd · Post by **wbmd** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:31 pm

SEC Scotty wrote:
wbmd wrote:
thetender30 wrote:villinuve, desmidt, and lernatson paintballed the assist coaches house...thats why they are off the team..i heard they can't play next year also
So what was it? The assistant coaches house or a teammates house as mentioned in another thread??
You writing a book or something? Why don't you mind your own business pal.

NO and NO

formerlybackofnet · Post by **formerlybackofnet** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:51 pm

Sager players have always showed a lack of disipline penalty wise, but these kids made thier own bed! Also, WBL missed lots of open nets and hit 3 pipes, the score easily could have been 6-3 in favor of WBL. They will rebound, Maybe not agianst Hill though.

packerboy · Post by **packerboy** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:51 pm

SEC Scotty wrote:The fact that people are pointing the finger at Tim Sager and the White Bear Hockey program for having a lack of discipline is ridiculous. You want to point fingers start with the kids themselves, and then their parents. Sager gave the players in question every opportunity to straighten up and fly right. A hockey coach can only control what a kid does on the ice.

Amen to that.

But blaming the coach is why we have a lot of the problems we do. People send their kids to school for parenting while they are busy with something else. Then if the kid screws up, its the schools fault.

Insanity.

It sounds like these boys wanted to get thrown off the team.

formerlybackofnet · Post by **formerlybackofnet** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:05 pm

My understanding is that the WBL team members went to Sager and asked to have the 2 players in question removed frem the team. They had enough, and V and D's conduct was hurting the whole team.

wbmd · Post by **wbmd** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:18 pm

formerlybackofnet wrote:My understanding is that the WBL team members went to Sager and asked to have the 2 players in question removed frem the team. They had enough, and V and D's conduct was hurting the whole team.

Good decision by the team members if it is true.

chillout · Post by **chillout** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:21 pm

To clear things up about the story...

Everything I have heard (which I suppose might not be true) is that they paintballed a former JV coach's house, who is a neighbor of a teammate. The former coach did not let them play on the pond he takes care of and they were mad about it and decided to cause some trouble because of it. Now I have heard this from quite a few different people, leading me to believe that it's the correct information.

It's so stupid. Honestly, did they think the guy wouldn't think it was them after he had just made them mad for not letting them play on the pond?

wbl65 · Post by **wbl65** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 7:01 pm

adding on to what chiilout said; it was the nextdoor neighbor of a wbl player and yes the person who was paintballed also happened to be an ex jv coach as well.[/quote]

WBLhockey14 · Post by **WBLhockey14** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:44 am

WBLhockey14 wrote:Not sure, but this will hurt the team "V" is a hustler, I never thought to much of "D"; and I think nothing of "L".

Here's how I see it.

No discipline + No authority = Trouble
No disipline + No guidance = Trouble
No discipline + Wrong friends = Trouble
No discipline + No respect = Trouble

With a capitol "T" So what does it sound like to you???????

There's 1 way out. GET IT TOGETHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

When I brought this up earlier in the post, it had very little to do with the coaches, I blame the parents! So I hope that nobody misconstrued it differently.

Do I think that Sager should have more discipline on the ice? " Absolutely " But do I blame him for the mistakes the kids make off the ice. "No Way"

Let's get to the facts.

FACT; The boys did not get removed from the team because of the paint ball incident. They got a 1 game suspension. And because the X JV coach was compassionate, he realized kids are kids and are going to make mistakes and left the discipline up to Sager. I don't think he wanted to be the reason the kids got kicked off the team. I don't blame him for that.

FACT; They got kicked off of the team for breaking into the locker room to get there skates. Which was the last straw of many things that led up to this. I believe the line has to be drawn somewhere.

Hanson and Hartzell should be commended not ripped on 3 years later. You might think I am nuts, but think about it.

They made a mistake, owned up to it learned from it and have become fine young men since than.

Why should they be commended? because they have proven that people can change and do the right thing.

Now I am not saying that they haven't probably made some mistakes since than, or won't in the future. But I am pretty sure the mistakes they make will not even come close to the one 3 years ago.

We "ALL" have made bad decisions and will continue to do so, some of us learn from our mistakes others don't. Have any of you heard the old saying about throwing stone's. "Think about it"

packerboy · Post by **packerboy** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 11:14 am

Kids do make mistakes and I dont like it when we punish them by kicking them off the team.

Take away their cars and Ipods. Ground them, forbid their attendence at dances and other sporting events. Take away their life as they know it for a long period of time.

But keep them playing sports. What are they going to do after school now?

Bearhockey13 · Post by **Bearhockey13** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 11:42 am

My question is? When do you draw the line, taking an IPOD, or car or grounding them does not work, at least it didn't for me.

If that were my kid, they wouldn't have had to worry about the coaches suspending them, I would have dragged them off the ice myself.

People have to learn to take responsibility for there actions. That is the problem with this world, the blame is always on someone else. Taking away the one thing they love should be an eye opener! It will make them straighten up or send them further down the wrong path. That is completely up to the individual to make that decision.

Why should the coaches have to put up with that type of discipline problem? The Varsity team signs a code of conduct, Although I believe that the code should be enforced to every player. Playing varsity hockey is nothing short of a PRIVILEGE, it's not a right.

With that said, I do believe that kids should get a second chance. But I believe it should be handled in a different manner. For instance; at the beginning of the season the coaches know the kids who have had a shaky history.

Sit down with those kids and tell them what is expected of them on and off the ice, in the classroom and at home. Be firm about it and if the rules are broken be firm about the punishment.

If they love the game that much they will straighten out, but it is there decision and know one elses.

The bottom line is, that's the bottom line!!

formerlybackofnet · Post by **formerlybackofnet** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:49 pm

Let's not forget, It was not Sagers decision to kick them off the team, the rest of their teammates asked to have them removed. Too Harsh?, I don't thik so, team comes first.

wbmd · Post by **wbmd** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:01 pm

formerlybackofnet wrote:Let's not forget, It was not Sagers decision to kick them off the team, the rest of their teammates asked to have them removed. Too Harsh?, I don't thik so, team comes first.

Smart choice at that too.

gophs12 · Post by **gophs12** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:12 pm

from what i heard is that the coaches did sit them down, all three together and told them after they paintballed the house that this was there last chance. then "V" and "D" broke into the lockerroom. so i agree they should be off the team.

RBKhockey0099 · Post by **RBKhockey0099** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:19 pm

I think it's funny how some of you say this is Sagers Fault because he doesn't give a second chance.

-Paintballing whoever's house. (Stupid)
-While walking on thin ice lets break into the lockerroom. (hmm.)
(Let me guess they think Tarrell Owens is a good team player too)

Let's blame Coach Sager for trying to turn the program around with DECENT kids.

Charliedog · Post by **Charliedog** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:01 pm

I suppose they needed their skates in order to try once again to skate on the JV coaches pond.

I don't know the whole story and I certainly don't know these kids. But hypothetically when a kids behavior is overlooked his whole hockey career because he is a great player then why should he expect this discipline to be any different. Parents need to catch this issue early on or the kids will have trouble their whole lives.

sicknasty7722 · Post by **sicknasty7722** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:06 pm

Charliedog wrote:I suppose they needed their skates in order to try once again to skate on the JV coaches pond.

I don't know the whole story and I certainly don't know these kids. But hypothetically when a kids behavior is overlooked his whole hockey career because he is a great player then why should he expect this discipline to be any different. Parents need to catch this issue early on or the kids will have trouble their whole lives.

That area doesn't help much either. As I understand it, his dad was in and out of jail when he was younger and he was kicked out of his house this past summer.

avery · Post by **avery** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:57 am

They should have asked for their skates- instead of breaking and entering. How many chances do you give kids-they don't seem to have learned. Any idea why he was kicked out of his own house last summer?

Jans22 · Post by **Jans22** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:19 am

avery- i want to know how you thought that they broke in??? if you check the facts they jumped over a wall... get it right, there is no information on them breaking anything to get in.