OT: Kyle Okposo quits Gophs mid-season to join Islanders...

[goldy313]

I find it a bit ironic that Lucia has no problem telling a kid to leave high school to go to the juniors, I hope he doesn't cry foul about Kyle leaving.

[packerboy]

Interesting blurb in the Red Star about this. According to the article, The Islanders were not happy with the way Kyle was developing and they rip Lucia for not making him better.

I have a lot of fun ripping Lucia on the bored but for the Islanders to come out and say that they pulled Okoposa because his coach sucks is a little over the top, dontcha think?

Ah, goldy, you better hope Lucia's #1 boy Gopher Blog doesnt read that. He will swear that his buddy doesnt encourage kids to go to juniors.

[flatontheice]

Interesting blurb in the Red Star about this. According to the article, The Islanders were not happy with the way Kyle was developing and they rip Lucia for not making him better.

I have a lot of fun ripping Lucia on the bored but for the Islanders to come out and say that they pulled Okoposa because his coach sucks is a little over the top, dontcha think?

Ah, goldy, you better hope Lucia's #1 boy Gopher Blog doesnt read that. He will swear that his buddy doesnt encourage kids to go to juniors.

FYI:

Garth Snow was back-up goalie, head case, and is an even worse GM. I would not get to worked up about what a guy like he says about anything. He is just frustrated because he looks like an idiot right now for drafting a player so high. He should pick up the phone and call Hirsch right now...then Okposo can look decent again.

[packerboy]

FYI:

Garth Snow was back-up goalie, head case, and is an even worse GM. I would not get to worked up about what a guy like he says about anything. He is just frustrated because he looks like an idiot right now for drafting a player so high. He should pick up the phone and call Hirsch right now...then Okposo can look decent again.

I have no doubt that Okposo will be a good pro. Whether he was drafted too high, I dont know. I think Snow got a lot of flack about this becaus he did it midseason and is trying to deflect it by ripping Lucia.

How you do in hockey can depend a lot on who you play with. Okposa is exhibit A for that.

[Gopher Blog]

I find it a bit ironic that Lucia has no problem telling a kid to leave high school to go to the juniors, I hope he doesn't cry foul about Kyle leaving.

If you ever meet a guy like Mark White (Patrick White's dad), ask him if Lucia ever pressured his son to leave Grand Rapids. His answer will be the same answer you'd get from Gopher parents in general. The decision to leave for junior hockey before a kid graduates high school is left up to the player and his parents.

[jackstraw]

wew

[hockeyknight]

All the way around it's wrong....stick with the facts and don't get hung up on the HS vs Junior thing. This is a kid that bailed on his team mid-season....and btw a team that could have, probably would have made some noise the 2nd half. It's also about a horrible deed done by the Isles whether they contacted him or he contacted them.
Do you see college football, baseball or basketball players leaving mid season???

[goldy313]

Gopher Blog, I've talked to a few kids who have been told to leave if they want to move up. Some don't want to leave for various reasons, often it's because they enjoy playing other sports. That's the issue I have, why is it ok to have a kid quit his football team or baseball team to move up but not his hockey team to advance to the next level?

The other problem I have is when his own kid left Wayzata that was ok and it was to further his deveolpment and that was his kids decision. Why isn't it ok for Okposo to leave to further his own development if that's his choice? It happens all the time where a kid leaves one team for another because of this coach or this reason. I'm not in agreement with it but that's the way hockey has become.

One last point how many kids playing NCAA football are ineligible for bowl games because they quit going to school figuring they're going to the NFL next year? Ohio St. has a couple, Florida State a bunch. At least Okposo was up front about it.

[Gopher Blog]

Gopher Blog, I've talked to a few kids who have been told to leave if they want to move up. Some don't want to leave for various reasons, often it's because they enjoy playing other sports. That's the issue I have, why is it ok to have a kid quit his football team or baseball team to move up but not his hockey team to advance to the next level?

Must not be Gopher recruits you talked to then. I have yet to have one parent of a Gopher player (whether their kid stayed at their local HS until graduation or left prior to graduating) tell me in conversation that their son was pushed to leave their local HS before graduating. Guys like White, Fischer, Barriball, Jake Youso, Aaron Ness, Taylor Matson, and others did not have to leave their HS. These kids decide with their parents what they want to do but they aren't told what to do.

The other problem I have is when his own kid left Wayzata that was ok and it was to further his deveolpment and that was his kids decision. Why isn't it ok for Okposo to leave to further his own development if that's his choice? It happens all the time where a kid leaves one team for another because of this coach or this reason. I'm not in agreement with it but that's the way hockey has become.

It is very rare for a player to quit on his team in the middle of the season. That is the problem people have with Okposo and that is where your comparison to Tony Lucia falls way short.

They are mad at Okposo because of the timing. He bailed on his team at mid-season. Something Tony Lucia didn't do with Wayzata. Tony Lucia made his decision to play in the USHL well before the school year even began and a number of months before his HS team even played its first game of that season. He didn't bolt on Wayzata in the middle of December when they are well into their season and are counting on him.

I don't think the vast majority of people (including head coaches) fault a guy for signing an NHL contract during the off-season or moving on to the next level between seasons. They may not always agree with it but you don't see any of the anger that you do in this case with Okposo. Generally they wish them well and move on.

Fans of all college teams have generally come to accept that if their team recruits a guy that is a good pro prospect, the odds are good that he will leave before his four years of school are complete. I really don't see a lot of people angry at a guy signing a pro deal during the spring/summer. Disappointed? Sure. But mad like they are with Okposo? No.

Did you see people mad at Kessel, Goligoski, Erik Johnson, Ryan Potulny, and many others when they signed a deal with their NHL team like they are currently with Okposo? Hardly. Why? Because they did it in the off-season when it is generally accepted that it will occur.

You'll notice that the outrage at the Islanders isn't limited to Gopher backers. A lot of people from other programs and non-NCAA people have voiced disapproval over it.

[wisconsinprephockey]

I think everyone here needs to stop commenting on whats right or wrong. If you have stared a couple mil in the face and said "no thanks" feel free to say all you want. Until you have personally faced that decision you cannot say with 100% certainty what you would do.

Yea I would be upset if a Wisco player did that but I would understand and wish him the best, because he accomplished what all hockey players set out to do by making the bigs. Props to Okposo for making it...

[Gopher Blog]

I think everyone here needs to stop commenting on whats right or wrong. If you have stared a couple mil in the face and said "no thanks" feel free to say all you want. Until you have personally faced that decision you cannot say with 100% certainty what you would do.

The money would have been there in March/April after the college season. Its not as if this was his only shot to ever sign a deal. If it was his only chance, I may agree with you. But it wasn't going to be his only opportunity to sign a large contract and there are plenty of examples of guys who don't take the money and run the first chance they get.

[goldy313]

The kids I've talked to ended up at other schools not the U, they were all multiple sport athletes. Lucia never told them what to do, I don't mean to imply that. They were under the impression that that is what he wanted them to do though.

I don't know if Tony Lucia was a multiple sport athlete or not but I don't see the difference in a kid bailing on his football or baseball team to play juniors as any different than what Okposo did. There's a current Gopher who much to the coaching staff's displeasure played baseball after signing. There's a former Gopher recruit that ended up at another WCHA school that had the same issue. So it's fine to quit on 1 team but not the other? I just find it hypocritical of the Gophers to complain about the Islanders for doing what I believe is the exact same thing, tampering with a high school kid during the high school year.

Lucia's job is to win hockey games, not make sure Okposo develops into an NHL'er. I'm not sure of why the anger towards the Islanders, the NHL is a business and Okposo's rights are their property. Just like it's the Gopher recruits decison to do what they feel best why isn't it OK for Okposo? And why is it bad for him to do it now when it seems many Gophers have quit come NCAA tournament time? So it's ok then but not at Christmas. Glen Sonmor tells an interesting story about how the Gophers were in the frozen four in Duluth in 1981 where Gopher players had agents in the lobby, Limo's waiting to rush them to airports so they could get to the NHL as soon as their season ended. The game was not even secondary in many of the kids heads. Kids thinking about moving on isn't new.

Year in and year out I watch kids almost quit on their high school team knowing their team is going nowhere and knowing that the sooner their season ends the sooner they'll be at the next level. Again, Okposo was at least up front about it. I don't agree with anyone doing it but times have changed, it's not about team and we anymore it's everyman for himself.

[goldy313]

From Sunday's Strib...
http://www.startribune.com/sports/gophers/12757177.html

Another person who thinks this is more about the individual than Garth Snow or Don Lucia. As a fan of high school hockey you watch as year after year kids move to schools based soley on hockey and development. I watch peewee and bantam kids being told by their coaches which high school to go to because of coaching. There's even a poster on this fine "bored" who's heavily involved in this in my area. Garth Snow does it and it's wrong, but it happens all the time all over the state or at least the lower part of it and nobody bats an eyelash.

You have kids quitting one school for another....
You have kids give up football to play in the elite league...
You have kids go play juniors, then quit that team to go back to high school....
you have kids quit spring sports to go play juniors in the spring...
now Okposo does it and it's suddenly a why because the Gophers were supposed to be above this? This is what the kids are taught; go where you will improve.

Here's another article, this one from the New York Times Online...
http://slapshot.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/ ... he-bunker/
He takes some pretty good licks at Lucia and the Gopher criers

[Gopher Blog]

If a kid starts playing with a team (whether football, baseball, hockey, or whatever) and leaves them in the middle of their season, I don't think that is good. However, if he never starts the year with that team and never signed up to play for them, I don't see the problem. You can't "quit" (in the Okposo sense) something that you didn't start playing in the first place for that season.

For instance, if a kid played spring baseball the prior year but decides to play USHL after the HS hockey season the next year, I have no problem with it. If he never signed up or played a game for that baseball team that year, then he isn't quitting on them in my book. It is when you start playing with a team during season and then leave that makes a kid look bad.

There is no law that says you have to play HS football or HS baseball every year simply because you played it the year before. You seem to act like they have to play a sport all the way through HS if they ever played it for one season.

If he starts a season with them, then I would agree he should stick with that team and finish it out. But if he never starts a season with a team, then he has no obligation to them. That is why most college fans don't get angry when a guy signs a pro deal in the off-season. He fulfilled his obligations through the past season and that is what matters. How many times have we seen a guy sign a pro deal in spring/summer and it doesn't even register any anger? A lot.

People understand when a player leaves for the pros during the spring/summer. It goes with the territory when you recruit good pro prospects. But when a guy leaves his team mid-season, people (no matter what college team) aren't going to appreciate that. If Okposo left for the pros last summer or after this college season ended, it wouldn't have people angry like they are now.

BTW, there are plenty of non-Gopher backers that have criticized the Islanders and Okposo as well.

[breakout]

I think everyone here needs to stop commenting on whats right or wrong. If you have stared a couple mil in the face and said "no thanks" feel free to say all you want. Until you have personally faced that decision you cannot say with 100% certainty what you would do.

The money would have been there in March/April after the college season. Its not as if this was his only shot to ever sign a deal. If it was his only chance, I may agree with you. But it wasn't going to be his only opportunity to sign a large contract and there are plenty of examples of guys who don't take the money and run the first chance they get.

Was he positioned to sign a large contract? Your play would dictate that, correct? His play has been sub par.

CBA has left the signing bonus at $87K?

Kyle does not come from a poor family. He comes from an educated family.

Weird decision

[Gopher Blog]

Was he positioned to sign a large contract? Your play would dictate that, correct? His play has been sub par.

Barring something extraordinary, a top 10 NHL draft pick is going to get the max deal or something close to it.

[WayOutWest]

I find it a bit ironic that Lucia has no problem telling a kid to leave high school to go to the juniors, I hope he doesn't cry foul about Kyle leaving.

He has never told a kid to abandon his high school team in the middle of the season. End of the year..........that's a different story altogether. I am sure Lucia would have had zero problem with Kyle leaving the Gophs after the Gophs season concluded.

[jackstraw]

wew

[Gopher Blog]

Your rose, or marooned colored glasses crack me up. You seem to not want to face the fact that NHL coaches aren't at all satisfied by the way the Goph's handle their draft choices. This was an odd case because of the timing. What are Johnson's 4 year total's? It took them a couple year's to figure it out, but you won't see any high draft choices hanging around very long.

Your comments are laughable considering there is only one instance where there has been anything said and it was by a GM that was trying to cover for his own butt because of mounting criticism from people all over the college hockey landscape. Heck, he was getting criticized by NHL people as well.

If the greatest player in the NHL history lauds the Gopher program, there isn't any better of an endorsement than that.

Did you ever consider that maybe Lucia is the only college coach willing to speak out against the occasional NHL team contacting a player in the middle of the year? (That point was actually brought up by the UND beat writer by the way).

You want to talk about glasses? You may want to take your Gopher hating ones off so you can see some reality.

[WayOutWest]

Your rose, or marooned colored glasses crack me up. You seem to not want to face the fact that NHL coaches aren't at all satisfied by the way the Goph's handle their draft choices. This was an odd case because of the timing. What are Johnson's 4 year total's? It took them a couple year's to figure it out, but you won't see any high draft choices hanging around very long.

Methinks somebody is not only completely incorrect, but has a VERY odd way of looking at things.
I certainly don't agree with you, in saying that Lucia mishandled ANYONE. I think that is absolutely as baseless a statement as you could have made up.
What's even more astounding to me is that you seem to believe (and maybe Snow does too?) that the "job" of a college hockey coach is to prep his players for NHL play. Uh.........no. There is no affiliation between college hockey programs and the NHL, at all. College coaches are tasked with putting as competitive a program on the ice as they can, to represent the school only.........that's it. Sure, any coach is also tasked with player development, but from THEIR program's perspective, for the benefit of their program, not that of the player's targeted NHL team.
Lucia shouldn't give a rip what Snow's assessment was. If Snow wanted his player out of the program, take him out, but have the personal integrity to do so in an appropriate fashion. Same goes for Okposo. Lucia is getting kicked around over this incident, and the program is not having a good year. But it would be ludicrous to contend that Lucia and the program is deficient in any way. The Gophs will be back, and stronger than ever. Give it time, Goober.

[jackstraw]

You are right.

[wisconsinprephockey]

The money would have been there in March/April after the college season. Its not as if this was his only shot to ever sign a deal. If it was his only chance, I may agree with you. But it wasn't going to be his only opportunity to sign a large contract and there are plenty of examples of guys who don't take the money and run the first chance they get.

The money may not have been there, injuries happen. The type that will keep you down for serious amounts of time are rare but they still happen. I don't care what the odds are, I'm not gambling with a million bucks (no matter how good my odds are of getting it back) especially if its a bet that I stand nothing to gain from.

Bottom line, he had nothing to gain and everything to lose.

[Gopher Blog]

The money may not have been there, injuries happen. The type that will keep you down for serious amounts of time are rare but they still happen. I don't care what the odds are, I'm not gambling with a million bucks (no matter how good my odds are of getting it back) especially if its a bet that I stand nothing to gain from.

That's why they have insurance policies for those kinds of players (its not uncommon in college sports for a guy with a big future pay day to have such coverage).

If every high draft pick were worried about that stuff, none of them would play another minute of college hockey after they are drafted.

[wisconsinprephockey]

That's why they have insurance policies for those kinds of players (its not uncommon in college sports for a guy with a big future pay day to have such coverage).

If every high draft pick were worried about that stuff, none of them would play another minute of college hockey after they are drafted.

True story, I didnt think about the insurance policy.

I would also like to reiterate that I am not 100% supporting his decision as I dont believe it is right to leave your teammates and all, and I hope (if I were in his shoes) I would stay for the sake of the team and the experience, but I believe that those of us that have never faced such a decision should not rush to judge...

[Observer85]

The money may not have been there, injuries happen. The type that will keep you down for serious amounts of time are rare but they still happen. I don't care what the odds are, I'm not gambling with a million bucks (no matter how good my odds are of getting it back) especially if its a bet that I stand nothing to gain from.

That's why they have insurance policies for those kinds of players (its not uncommon in college sports for a guy with a big future pay day to have such coverage).

If every high draft pick were worried about that stuff, none of them would play another minute of college hockey after they are drafted.

Speaking with some experience on this insurance policy issue. This not what it is made out to be. I was told that you have to insure for a specific injury (if you insure for all, then it gets really pricey). So lets say you go for the most common injury, say a knee like what Stoa suffered (hopefully it is not career ending) and end up with a shoulder injury (like maybe Hagemo suffered) and your career basically ends, no insurance money.

I agree with many that the timing is not the best, middle of the season and all but have to believe Okposo saw what Mueller, Johnson, Gagner (he played against him in the USHL the year he was Player of the Year), Toews and Kane were making and figured it was time to go. Plus, does anyone even know if he was on a full ride or not. Again, speaking from experience, not many at the U get full ride scholarship money. If he (or his parents, or his student loans) was paying to go to school, then at least he finished the semester so it would not count against the school's academic scoring system.