BLOOMINGTON TOURNEY 12/26 - 12/31

[oldtimer64]

Let's here what you think. Who's gonna win it.

[shoot to thrill]

What level is this, PW or Bantam and is it A or B?

[egf hockey1]

96 Fire are in it so it has to be PW or squirts with 1996 birthdates.

[Nobodyonya]

This is an A Peewee Tournament with the 96 Fire. Coon Rapids or Apple Valley take the Championship

[Statsman101]

This is an A Peewee Tournament with the 96 Fire. Coon Rapids or Apple Valley take the Championship

I agree with Coon Rapids or Apple Valley being the favorites. 96 fire should be playing in a Squirt Tourney.

Last Years fire lost 5-1, 5-3, 4-2 and they did beat Kennedy 2-0 to win the friendship game. I think that Bloomington made a mistake putting this team in the tournament.


95 fire are in the Edina Tourney and will be the favorite. So please don't think this is a shot at the fire. I just think that even if a Team is 1-10 in a league they are at least a registered PWA Team TRYING TO FIELD AN A-Team they are better for a Minnesota Tourney then a FIRE 96 trying to give the future Gretzky's a chance to say they beat a Peewee A team. Which they will beat some teams.

Lets say they win the tourney and the 95 fire win Edina Tourney what will that do for Minnesota Hockey. I will say that I have never seen the fire play and I can understand wanting to give your child a chance to play the best. Minnesota Hockey has to change how it is going to let these teams play in tournaments. Otherwise throw out the boundries and let Coach's pick players from any area they want. District 8 allstars vs District 6 allstars and then we will see how good these fire teams really are.

[jancze5]

Statsman..I think you're way off base with your opinion of the Fire as it seems most pure Minnesotahockey'ns are. Bottom line is these are just kids playing hockey...that's it. For whatever reason and I can guarantee you it's got nothing to do with Gretzky's or NHL'ers or anything...these kids are playing Fire rather than for their local association. If the Fire has "stolen" every great player from every organization, that would be one thing...but they don't. These are just teams that play birth year hockey and it just so happens that these birth years fall into the Minnesota hockey guidelines in one way or another. The 93 Fire has played several local association Bantam A's and has had some great hockey games...I don't hear any Bantam A parents from those associations whining that the teams are stacked against them, but rather that the games were good. They will play up in the Roseau BA tourney coming up. The 94 Fire will play in the Bloomington Bantam A tourney next week as well...with 5 kids that would be Pee Wee's and the rest first year Bantam age...no Gretzky's...just kids going to the gardens to play hockey...keep it that perspective and the sun will shine on everyone a little brighter.

Looking at the AAA Spring Summer EXPLOSION...AAA hockey and the Spring may someday become the more enjoyable season over the winter where teams like Edina play 3 games a year that they might lose and 37 no brainer double digits....

As you guys bash me and the Fire...enjoy your holiday season and I'm just happy our neighborhood rink is up and my kids are all spending at least 2 hours a day with the hord of other kids just playing hockey...

[Statsman101]

Statsman..I think you're way off base with your opinion of the Fire as it seems most pure Minnesotahockey'ns are. Bottom line is these are just kids playing hockey...that's it. For whatever reason and I can guarantee you it's got nothing to do with Gretzky's or NHL'ers or anything...these kids are playing Fire rather than for their local association. If the Fire has "stolen" every great player from every organization, that would be one thing...but they don't. These are just teams that play birth year hockey and it just so happens that these birth years fall into the Minnesota hockey guidelines in one way or another. The 93 Fire has played several local association Bantam A's and has had some great hockey games...I don't hear any Bantam A parents from those associations whining that the teams are stacked against them, but rather that the games were good. They will play up in the Roseau BA tourney coming up. The 94 Fire will play in the Bloomington Bantam A tourney next week as well...with 5 kids that would be Pee Wee's and the rest first year Bantam age...no Gretzky's...just kids going to the gardens to play hockey...keep it that perspective and the sun will shine on everyone a little brighter.

Looking at the AAA Spring Summer EXPLOSION...AAA hockey and the Spring may someday become the more enjoyable season over the winter where teams like Edina play 3 games a year that they might lose and 37 no brainer double digits....

As you guys bash me and the Fire...enjoy your holiday season and I'm just happy our neighborhood rink is up and my kids are all spending at least 2 hours a day with the hord of other kids just playing hockey...

Have the 96 fire played 1 Peewee A hockey game. Against who ?

I know some Peewee B teams that could beat some A-Teams. should they be allowed to play in pwa tournaments.

I said 95 fire are the favorites to win Edina Tourney. They belong in tournament. I only said to be fair that Coach's should get to pick players from all over the area they would have some really good teams too. Why do you guys have to play in our tournaments, join a league and then I agree you belong playing against other Peewee A Teams . You can't just pick a Tournament and play up in level and justify this isn't about ego. So if you have hurt feelings. I didn't rip the fire, I just said they have an un fair advantage. If the 96 fire can beat the 95 fire then they belong in tournament if not stay out of tournament.

[jancze5]

The 96 Fire have played all Pee Wee hockey games this season, but I see your point...the 95's a legit matchup against PWA teams, the 96's should be outmanned by kids as much as 2 years older than they are. O well...guess they'll get what's coming then.

[Whatthe]

Not a smart or safe idea even if they win a game or two. Some 5th grader could get seriously hurt by a 7th or 8th grader.

I didn't think Minnesota Hockey rules allowed teams to play out of their age range even if they were AAA teams. 95's are completely within PW age range, not 96's. Is insurance an issue?

[Statsman101]

The 96 Fire have played all Pee Wee hockey games this season, but I see your point...the 95's a legit matchup against PWA teams, the 96's should be outmanned by kids as much as 2 years older than they are. O well...guess they'll get what's coming then.

Sorry Minnesota Peewee A Teams. Not teams like 96 Chicago Steel.

What will the fire give your child that your association won't. Besides allowing him/her to play teams that his age would keep him from playing. If his age says he should play Squirts then thats what he should play. Safety is a parents responsibilty, god forbid a Kid gets hurt and can never play hockey or let alone walk again. Associations worry about things like that. Fire might be looking at we can get these kids to a higher level faster, if we play them against kids faster /bigger and play them at levels they might not be ready to play at.

This isn't bashing the fire it is about rules and how they seem to get bent to allow a team to compete against tougher competition.

Would Bloomington Tournament allow Woodbury's B-team to play at the A- Level just because they entered the tournament that way. Woodbury's B-team would beat some A-teams. That doesn't mean they should be allowed to play games at that level. 95 fire beat Wayzata, Edina, Apple Valley. THAT QUALIFYS THEM. 96 FIRE have no scores against any peewee A teams from MN. I don't want what's coming to them. How many High School Teams have all freshman playing on those teams.

[blueblood]

i like chaska's bracket. They should earn a top 3 seed, a bye and a good shot at tking it all.

[fromthecrease]

As with everything on this site, my opinion on the 96' Fire is go ahead and let them play! I don't know the ages of all their players, but what their dealing with is a 50/50, half the age group is younger first year peewees and half the age group is older second year squirts. Seeing older squirts play you can tell as the season goes along that they are ready to make that next step to handle the checking and physical play that peewees offers. The transition to peewees isn't as giant a step as it once was because Minnesota Hockey has taken to enforcing the rules as they are written and attempting to reduce the physical play and focus on the skills which is a good thing. If my memory serves me right USA hockey has looked at removing checking from the peewee level at various times over the last few years.

Having seen both the 96' and 95' Fire teams play (against peewee 'A' teams), they are good skating and skilled teams, I don't know if I consider them All-Star teams, but they are good teams. My big concern is, growing up kids look up to the players in front of them, how many kids in Roseau come to game to see Ness and those guys play and try to emulate them in practice and strive to do what they did, go to a Burnsville youth practice and you'll see kids getting a chance to where a practice jersey with Barnes, Hendrickson & Perisic's name and number on them. There is a sense of community pride in places like Warroad and Roseau and Edina and Burnsville, that these kids have something bigger to strive for from year to year other than themselves, they play for their town and represent their town and people come out to watch their towns teams. You just don't get that playing on a team like the Fire, so while they get the skill development and play good competition, what picks up the other end of it? We as hockey people are very passionate about where were from and what town we play for, how do kids get that playing for the Fire? Not a knock on the Fire just a question. I just hope no matter what happens to the 96' Fire that the excuse doesn't come out again that they are playing kids older than them, if you choose to play, play and base the outcome on the ice not on a birth certificate. In high school there are some pretty damn good sophmores that skate with Seniors.

I wish both Fire teams good luck in their tournaments this upcoming week, the 96' Fire should finish second in their pool in Bloomington and a good test will be Coon Rapids, from there its on to the brackets. Who knows maybe we'll get to see Rosemount play the 96' Fire, wouldn't that be interesting.

[justanobserver]

The 96 Fire will probably surprise some of the skeptics on this forum. They
play at a high level in their Tier 1 program. Looking forward to seeing
if the PW teams can even keep up with these boys.

[Statsman101]

As with everything on this site, my opinion on the 96' Fire is go ahead and let them play! I don't know the ages of all their players, but what their dealing with is a 50/50, half the age group is younger first year peewees and half the age group is older second year squirts. Seeing older squirts play you can tell as the season goes along that they are ready to make that next step to handle the checking and physical play that peewees offers. The transition to peewees isn't as giant a step as it once was because Minnesota Hockey has taken to enforcing the rules as they are written and attempting to reduce the physical play and focus on the skills which is a good thing. If my memory serves me right USA hockey has looked at removing checking from the peewee level at various times over the last few years.

Having seen both the 96' and 95' Fire teams play (against peewee 'A' teams), they are good skating and skilled teams, I don't know if I consider them All-Star teams, but they are good teams. My big concern is, growing up kids look up to the players in front of them, how many kids in Roseau come to game to see Ness and those guys play and try to emulate them in practice and strive to do what they did, go to a Burnsville youth practice and you'll see kids getting a chance to where a practice jersey with Barnes, Hendrickson & Perisic's name and number on them. There is a sense of community pride in places like Warroad and Roseau and Edina and Burnsville, that these kids have something bigger to strive for from year to year other than themselves, they play for their town and represent their town and people come out to watch their towns teams. You just don't get that playing on a team like the Fire, so while they get the skill development and play good competition, what picks up the other end of it? We as hockey people are very passionate about where were from and what town we play for, how do kids get that playing for the Fire? Not a knock on the Fire just a question. I just hope no matter what happens to the 96' Fire that the excuse doesn't come out again that they are playing kids older than them, if you choose to play, play and base the outcome on the ice not on a birth certificate. In high school there are some pretty damn good sophmores that skate with Seniors.

I wish both Fire teams good luck in their tournaments this upcoming week, the 96' Fire should finish second in their pool in Bloomington and a good test will be Coon Rapids, from there its on to the brackets. Who knows maybe we'll get to see Rosemount play the 96' Fire, wouldn't that
be interesting.

I couldn't agree with you more. The 50/50 age issue is what I was discussing on here. Associations are not allowed to move up all the squirts to fill an A-TEAM ONLY C-TEAMS. Why should the rules be any different for them. If one of the younger players gets hurt then they might change the rule for the Bloomington Tournament. I just thought it is crazy to bend some rules for a Team that is clearly against Minnesota Hockey rules. Game Limits, travel & amount of tournaments entered each year. Amount of playing time each kid gets. residency?

Playing for your town is special and I know some kids get a bad deal and they leave the association to play for a team that does want them. I get that. 96 fire belong in tournament based on skill not based on if they are allowed to play at level of the kids ages. So it will be interesting to see them play Coon Rapids they are the ranked team not Rosemount. Just don't want to here them telling the kids after the games well you guys are 2 years younger then most kids on that team. So really when they lose they some how discredit the teams that beat them. Then win they win they really can rub it in that they beat kids 2 years older then them. So yeah its a no lose situation. Good Luck 96 fire

[Nobodyonya]

justanobserver....you may be right that the 96 Fire may surprise some people, but your comment whether or not the opponent can keep up them I question. It goes back again to the size and physical contact. I have seen Coon Rapids, Apple Valley, Jefferson play and if they show up and play physical like I've seen, I don't know how the 96 Fire will accept the challenge when some of these players have the size differential and pound them in the boards

[jancze5]

The 96 Fire are Minnesota Pee Wee age players....like every Fire team, they have no interest in rubbing anything in anyones face. Although they do have one parent I know of that seems to think his kid is already penciled in for the U class of 2015, which is laughable...The Fire teams are not loaded with the top kids from the top programs, it's filled with kids who want to play a different level aspect of hockey...it's not the right or wrong way to roster levels....49 states in the USA play with birth year hockey, Minnesota is special and will remain that way in it's multi year system. Again, this and every Fire team that's playing, are just kids playing hockey like everyone else. I have a 96 player that's a Squirt in association hockey and he/we love it...our Bantam playing Fire loves his team, he says it's the funnest year of hockey he's played. Would he have the same feeling if he were on the local Bantam B1 or B2 team where he likely would have fell, definately...it's all in a personal perspective. I believe our 94 group has at least 10 little brothers and sisters that play association hockey and 5 dads that coach/volunteer with those associations..but for whatever reason we're here..

Is this a bad time to post a recruiting add for 94's for next year? (come on, you guys have to laugh!)

[BobbyOrrFraud]

Hey Statsman101,

Doesn't the '95 Fire have a Rosemount goalie. Is this why you have a problem with the Fire program? I'm not trying to start anything with you statsman101 just asking a question.

[BoogeyMan]

The 96 Fire are Minnesota Pee Wee age players....like every Fire team, they have no interest in rubbing anything in anyones face. Although they do have one parent I know of that seems to think his kid is already penciled in for the U class of 2015, which is laughable...The Fire teams are not loaded with the top kids from the top programs, it's filled with kids who want to play a different level aspect of hockey...it's not the right or wrong way to roster levels....49 states in the USA play with birth year hockey, Minnesota is special and will remain that way in it's multi year system. Again, this and every Fire team that's playing, are just kids playing hockey like everyone else. I have a 96 player that's a Squirt in association hockey and he/we love it...our Bantam playing Fire loves his team, he says it's the funnest year of hockey he's played. Would he have the same feeling if he were on the local Bantam B1 or B2 team where he likely would have fell, definately...it's all in a personal perspective. I believe our 94 group has at least 10 little brothers and sisters that play association hockey and 5 dads that coach/volunteer with those associations..but for whatever reason we're here..

Is this a bad time to post a recruiting add for 94's for next year? (come on, you guys have to laugh!)

If there are 49 other states that play by birth year. Why doesn't Minnesota?
Since Minnesota has more registered players with USA hockey than any other state. Would it make sense to play by birth year?

[jancze5]

Boogey...I believe that ELLIOTT has commented on this in the past from a MINNHOCK perspective. Minnesota is unique in that it feeds into the high school. They (Minnhock) want kids basically groomed together as a school class, playing together growing up, rather than a birth year class. For Minnesota this works.

BUT: IMO keep in mind this, how many kids from an assocation play Varsity as Juniors/Seniors...8 or 9 maybe, 10-12 in a small area. So consider an association that has say 75 squirt players that are all 4th graders, out of that 75, max 12 are still playing together as 17 year olds. BUt that's what we're groomed for...

Personally, I prefer birth year hockey. It closes the talent gap on the ice to a single year, not more than 2. You don't see the 96 Fire vs PWA argument, because 96's simply won't play against 94's.

I liked one model I saw in Colorado once....2 A teams through Bantams, both birth year. So for example they had a PW92 A and a PW93A. Then the B teams were mixed for the age group. It offered 34 kids an "A" level experience as opposed to 17...kids that played B strived to make their birth year A team the next season.

There is no right or wrong way, the only way is to simply play hockey..hopefully you have a dang good coach along the way.
Good coaching accompanied by hard work ethic and some godgiven athletic talent go a long long way in any sport.

[Statsman101]

Hey Statsman101,

Doesn't the '95 Fire have a Rosemount goalie. Is this why you have a problem with the Fire program? I'm not trying to start anything with you statsman101 just asking a question.

Yes the fire have our goalie from last year.

I still talk to the family. I understand why they left. I think if the Kid stayed he would have developed better here. Nobody could give a goalie more shots then us. LOL

my favorite player growing up was Neal Broten. He played in the state tournament, then for the Gophers, Olympics and then on to the North stars. He won Championships at all levels. Most people think that he played for Roseau , What they fail to realize is he didn't need to go play for a team like the Fire. If He did he would have never accomplished these things.

Now that we have teams like the Fire. Kids are told if they want to get to the next level they will have to leave High School and then College or just start now by leaving your ASSOCIATION. Practice 6 days a week and play Hockey all year round. AAA Hockey should stay only Spring/summer. Then the Kids can still play for the Association they started with.

I don't have any anger towards the fire for how they want to run a program. I just don't like Edina & Bloomington letting teams like the fire in our tournaments. They have different Rules then our teams do .They can pick kids from Burnsville to Chaska to Blaine. I think if we took Kids off of AV , Eagan & Woodbury we would beat teams like the Fire. But until then they have an advantage. So no I don't think they have anything special over there.

Associations have rules on Playing Time, age , Residency. They have to develope the lower levels to add an extra Player. If a B-player isn't ready to play at A-Level. They have no choice but to throw that kid out there. Fire can just keep holding tryouts until they find that special player. Big Advantage.

My biggest cocern is 95 fire win Eden Prarie tourney and worst fear is 96 fire win Bloomington Tourney. These kids will be playing most Kids 2 years older then these kids. Some parent is going to be at that tournament and think I need to get my kid to the Next Fire tryout if kids 96 bith year are beating 94 & 95 year old kids then they must be what my kid needs to get to the next level. Then more teams like the Fire start popping up.

This is not an Option if Tournaments in MN STOP BENDING THE RULES letting teams like the Fire play in our Tournaments or scrimmage them at all. Pretty soon if your Kid doesn't make one of Bernies Mite league teams, They will not be allowed to play Hockey anymore career Over at the age of 6. The kid doesn't have it , to small. Sorry no more Neal Broten's to cheer for. Merry X-mas

[Nobodyonya]

Amen, Stratsman!!! Our District will not let any outside AAA team enter any of our tournaments. If, any team within our district does so, there are peanlties to be handed out. No ifs ands or butts about it

[skatehardordie]

To each his own, but i like to see my sons' association teams play the best competition as often as possible (barring a 10-0 running time fiasco). i dont care how old they are, association or not, in-state or not. better to lose a competitive game to a better team than mop up on some cupcake and get all warm and fuzzy over some hunk of metal and plastic. but that's me.

[jancze5]

To say Now that we have teams like the Fire. Kids are told if they want to get to the next level they will have to leave High School and then College or just start now by leaving your ASSOCIATION. Practice 6 days a week and play Hockey all year round. AAA Hockey should stay only Spring/summer is just an uneducated rant. The statement in itself shows how little you know about the Fire program, the kids that play in it and the movement of it's players; not to mention your apparant lack of knowledge of how many Fire players that play local AAA summer/spring in Minnesota, not of Fire teams that start practicing in September 3x's a week and are done in early March...go figure

This is a single entity that is NOT trying to take over the hockey world of Minnesota. It doesn't go out stealing kids and selling promises of gold at the end of the rainbow. It's just another avenue for kids to play on. That's it. Period. Why can't you or anyone else see that?

[Statsman101]

To each his own, but i like to see my sons' association teams play the best competition as often as possible (barring a 10-0 running time fiasco). i dont care how old they are, association or not, in-state or not. better to lose a competitive game to a better team than mop up on some cupcake and get all warm and fuzzy over some hunk of metal and plastic. but that's me.

This isn't about a Trophy. Its about one team gets a different set of rules on how they can pick there teams.

I think you are from a Big Association like Edina and have 200 kids to pick from so it is easier to compete against the Allstar teams. When you say better teams do you mean that you don't get 40 games against good competition. I could pick 20 teams and schedule you 2 games vs all them and Edina would still win 90% of the games.

Maybe your teams should add another A-TEAM OR 2 and spread the talent out to 45 skaters instead of 15. Instead of looking for Teams that can take on the 15 greatest players Edina Has to offer.

Maybe those 30 kids that got put on B-Team would like to compete against better competition instead of playing at B-level even though they would be on an A-TEAM FOR most teams in the State. They might not Win as many games but they will develope at faster pace and will be Challenged in more games then playing a schedule that they will most likely win many games 10-0 and never be pushed. So I think the Argument you posed is Valid at Pwa level & ( Edina Pwb is just as much effected by this) I think Woodbury is Available to play in Tournament maybe the Fire took the spot of a team Like them. They are ranked 2nd in state. So I think their are teams out there that can give Edina a game. My POINT WAS IF YOU DON'T ALLOW SCRIMMAGES/ TOURNAMENTS VS AAA TEAMS. MAYBE MORE KIDS WOULD STICK WITH THE ASSOCIATION THEY STARTED WITH. THATS IT NOT ABOUT THEY ARE BETTER AND THEY STEAL OUR TROPHYS.

[Statsman101]

To say

This is a single entity that is NOT trying to take over the hockey world of Minnesota. It doesn't go out stealing kids and selling promises of gold at the end of the rainbow. It's just another avenue for kids to play on. That's it. Period. Why can't you or anyone else see that?

I agree with you. I didn't say you steal our players. I said you give them an option if they don't like the association they play for.

If my kid played for EDINA and was put on B-team and I felt he was good enough to play A Hockey. I would consider giving the fire a shot. If my kid didn't make fire then I would have 2 tryouts telling me my Kid belongs playing B-team. So again stop being so sensitive. I said some parent might think that if the Fire can Win a Tournament with the Top teams in the state. They must be able to get my Kid to the next level. I didn't say the Fire are Hiding behind the bleachers and grabbing kids and brainwashing them into playing for them. I just like History of the Town teams and I think that AAA HOCKEY TEAMS WILL REPLACE THE ASSOCIATIONS.. So sorry for using a Hockey Forum to state my opinion on this matter.

I'am done talking on this Forum. Go Fire