empty net

[halla]

Once, when I was a Pee Wee, my team played the entire second period with the goalie pulled. We entered the period down 5-0. Who was that crazy coach??

you didnt play for hibbing pee-wee A's did you because davey johnson did that because the defense wernt helping the goalie so he let the D try doing all the work with no help from a goalie they didnt let in 1 goal the whole period

Ha. No, didn't play for Hibbing. The game I was in was actually an Edina/Duluth East matchup, qualifying round of the Duluth Pee Wee tournament.

[winger91]

I've argued with many and have yet to find anyone that supports my abstract position. No goalie= admitted defeat.The genius's say why protect a loss but I can still win a one goal game in the final seconds but cannot win the two goal game. Unless I have a huge territorial advantage I say keep my goalie on the ice.
In my opinion pulling the goalie is as overated as the slap shop.
Take your shot guys, I've had fun with this one, thanks!!

I agree. It rarely works. I also hate it when players celebrate an empty netter the way they celebrate a five hole. They look stupid.

[Can't Never Tried]

I've argued with many and have yet to find anyone that supports my abstract position. No goalie= admitted defeat.The genius's say why protect a loss but I can still win a one goal game in the final seconds but cannot win the two goal game. Unless I have a huge territorial advantage I say keep my goalie on the ice.
In my opinion pulling the goalie is as overated as the slap shop.
Take your shot guys, I've had fun with this one, thanks!!

I agree. It rarely works.

I believe you are in the minority here
Either that or a goalie on a less talented team

[winger91]

I've argued with many and have yet to find anyone that supports my abstract position. No goalie= admitted defeat.The genius's say why protect a loss but I can still win a one goal game in the final seconds but cannot win the two goal game. Unless I have a huge territorial advantage I say keep my goalie on the ice.
In my opinion pulling the goalie is as overated as the slap shop.
Take your shot guys, I've had fun with this one, thanks!!

I agree. It rarely works.

I believe you are in the minority here
Either that or a goalie on a less talented team

Being in the minority doesn't make me wrong. Show me the statistics.

[Can't Never Tried]

I believe you are in the minority here
Either that or a goalie on a less talented team

Being in the minority doesn't make me wrong. Show me the statistics.

So the fact that nearly every hockey coach will do this, right up to the pros, is not proof enough for you that it's effective enough to do??

The game is based on creating man advantages to create scoring opportunities, if you go to a 6th attacker you are automatically 1 man up and you have nothing to lose if they score again because you are already behind in score.

[winger91]

Being in the minority doesn't make me wrong. Show me the statistics.

So the fact that nearly every hockey coach will do this, right up to the pros, is not proof enough for you that it's effective enough to do??

The game is based on creating man advantages to create scoring opportunities, if you go to a 6th attacker you are automatically 1 man up and you have nothing to lose if they score again because you are already behind in score.

I know what it is based on. And maybe in the "pro's" it does work more often. BUT, at the high school level you see it when teams are on power play, and when there is still too much time on the clock. If you have one minute left and you are down, okay. But I still think it sucks to end a game two goals down rather than one, because it seldom works at this level. Geez. I am still waiting for the statistics, which actually mean more than yours or my opinion.

[Govs93]

dralr asks an interesting question... I'm sure there's nothing on the high school level, but are there numbers available at some level that give the scoring percentage with the goalie pulled? I'd hazard a guess to say that it's probably slightly better than most powerplay numbers, and if so, that would put you somewhere in the neighborhood of a 30-35% chance of scoring.

If you were to factor that against a typical game (let's say 3 goals on 30 shots) which is about a 10% chance of scoring, I'd say you'd have to pull the goalie.


I realize that these aren't two exact comparisons, and I'm sure somebody (O-Town) will shoot some holes in the exact numbers here, but in theory, it kind of makes sense to me anyway... of course, I went to public school.

[BranchesMagnum]

Keep in mind that winger is a girl. But then her position makes even less sense because in girls hockey they can't even get the puck to other end for empty netter. In girls hockey I'd pull the goalie everytime I got the puck in the offensive zone.

[AngusYoung]

Don't expect to get that here, winger. All this forum is based on is rhetoric and opinion. You pose an excellent question and get the answer back of, "that's the way it's always been done, stupid". The pulling the goalie for an extra attacker ploy was probably used first 30 years ago by a coach trying something new. Now it has become an expected tactic and who knows if the data would show that it has been very effective. Some folks around here need a paradigm shift to realize things CAN be looked @ from many different angles. The world was once thought to be flat.

AY

[winger91]

Keep in mind that winger is a girl. But then her position makes even less sense because in girls hockey they can't even get the puck to other end for empty netter. In girls hockey I'd pull the goalie everytime I got the puck in the offensive zone.

You Orono boys...what's your record again? All that talent and pretty cool guys for the most part. Except for you Reese.

[winger91]

Don't expect to get that here, winger. All this forum is based on is rhetoric and opinion. You pose an excellent question and get the answer back of, "that's the way it's always been done, stupid". The pulling the goalie for an extra attacker ploy was probably used first 30 years ago by a coach trying something new. Now it has become an expected tactic and who knows if the data would show that it has been very effective. Some folks around here need a paradigm shift to realize things CAN be looked @ from many different angles. The world was once thought to be flat.

AY

[halla]

The arguments against it puzzle me, quite frankly.

A hail mary pass rarely works. Does that mean a football team should just throw a 10-yard out when trailing at the end of the game just because this is the kind of thing you do during the entire rest of the game?

I realize it's not the exact same situation -- a hail mary pass also is very unlikely to result in any points against. But I guess I don't understand why any real competitor cares whether you lose by one or by two. You play to win. The goal of the game is to win. I don't see a closer score as any consolation prize.

[Can't Never Tried]

As usual AY offers nothing except another empty opinion...
I dug this up, it's actually about the only thing close to odds I could find.


http://www.behindthenet.ca/blog/2007/12 ... oalie.html

[winger91]

As usual AY offers nothing except another empty opinion...
I dug this up, it's actually about the only thing close to odds I could find.


http://www.behindthenet.ca/blog/2007/12 ... oalie.html

Thank you. That was really informative. Sometimes, when you've worked really hard, it is tough to lose by two rather than one, even if you know it was an empty netter. It's a risk I guess, if it works it's awesome, if not it's a bummer.