USA Hockey is given this power by the US Congress. MN H is granted it through an affiliate agreement with USA Hockey. MH is a member in good standing and looked at as aleader by USA Hockey and the other affiliates across the country.hockey_is_a_choice wrote:Minnesota Hockey is political, but, from a legal perspective, there is no way that Minnesota Hockey can stop Bernie's programs. This is America folks. Capitalism built this country and anyone who has a product or service that is legal should be able to compete with another product, service or organization. Frankly, I have wondered whether Minnesota Hockey can be legitimately sued for antitrust violations or religious discrimination, especially concerning its strict limitations on whether an organization (school, church or some other entity) is allowed to become a Minnesota Hockey affiliate.
Choice Squirt League
Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)
Good for
Good for MM for filling the ice. I applaud their effort, especially in player development.
My only point is, what's stopping anyone else from doing the same thing?
Henceforth, what's stopping AAA hockey in Minnesota? Is there truly a difference in principle from what is available for players at MM vs a AAA team? Tournaments, travel...those are the only 2 missing elements. Of maybe not, anyone???
While this is great for those involved, it's really signalling big change in the future in my eyes. If an investor decided to build a rink and call it MM EAST, put it in Lake Elmo and capture the same audience from the east side and Wisconsin and then eventually roll in with Bernie into a larger East/West league...the writing is on the wall for this thing to explode into an very viable option to go against MNHOCK.
Seems a bit like it could evolve into Little League on the east coast, where now Little League is relatively a B or c market, as top end players and those who can afford it play on travel teams (not unlike AAA hockey) that go from state to state and play similiar teams.
My only point is, what's stopping anyone else from doing the same thing?
Henceforth, what's stopping AAA hockey in Minnesota? Is there truly a difference in principle from what is available for players at MM vs a AAA team? Tournaments, travel...those are the only 2 missing elements. Of maybe not, anyone???
While this is great for those involved, it's really signalling big change in the future in my eyes. If an investor decided to build a rink and call it MM EAST, put it in Lake Elmo and capture the same audience from the east side and Wisconsin and then eventually roll in with Bernie into a larger East/West league...the writing is on the wall for this thing to explode into an very viable option to go against MNHOCK.
Seems a bit like it could evolve into Little League on the east coast, where now Little League is relatively a B or c market, as top end players and those who can afford it play on travel teams (not unlike AAA hockey) that go from state to state and play similiar teams.
New England Prep School Hockey Recruiter
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O-townClown
- Posts: 4422
- Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:22 pm
- Location: Typical homeboy from the O-Town
bingo
Bravo, Mom.DMom wrote: Or maybe they were an illusion we create to deal with the fact that our kids just aren't that good.
The overwhelming majority of kids won't become college players on scholarship. In several SW suburban communities a kid can love it, work hard, and not even make the HS Varsity.
You offer up a great point.
Be kind. Rewind.
The major obstacle in this business is money. And then a customer base.
to be successful this business need association hockey or other buyers of their product.
Their product, at least what I see, is 1) ice time and 2) advanced development for elite players.
#2 is successful because of repitition. That takes ice time. How many rinks can one organizatin build?
At least for now MM exists because of associations having people that feel MM's product will make their player more successful. More successful where? Back at the association\high school? College? Pros?
Playing varsity for all the kids in MM is not going to happen. Playing college (D1) may not happen for any of them. Pros? Odds are, none.
So, MM and association hockey go hand in hand.
MM East? Possibility, but land acquisition and arena construction take big investors. The operating costs are high. And where are the other Bernie's coming from? It neeeds to be run well to attract the customers.
Let's hope that having lots of money and exceptional talent is not the prereq to playing hockey.
In the meantime, everyone needs to make sure the local assn is doing its best.
to be successful this business need association hockey or other buyers of their product.
Their product, at least what I see, is 1) ice time and 2) advanced development for elite players.
#2 is successful because of repitition. That takes ice time. How many rinks can one organizatin build?
At least for now MM exists because of associations having people that feel MM's product will make their player more successful. More successful where? Back at the association\high school? College? Pros?
Playing varsity for all the kids in MM is not going to happen. Playing college (D1) may not happen for any of them. Pros? Odds are, none.
So, MM and association hockey go hand in hand.
MM East? Possibility, but land acquisition and arena construction take big investors. The operating costs are high. And where are the other Bernie's coming from? It neeeds to be run well to attract the customers.
Let's hope that having lots of money and exceptional talent is not the prereq to playing hockey.
In the meantime, everyone needs to make sure the local assn is doing its best.
Last edited by elliott70 on Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Good for
That would be a sad day.jancze5 wrote:Good for MM for filling the ice. I applaud their effort, especially in player development.
My only point is, what's stopping anyone else from doing the same thing?
Henceforth, what's stopping AAA hockey in Minnesota? Is there truly a difference in principle from what is available for players at MM vs a AAA team? Tournaments, travel...those are the only 2 missing elements. Of maybe not, anyone???
While this is great for those involved, it's really signalling big change in the future in my eyes. If an investor decided to build a rink and call it MM EAST, put it in Lake Elmo and capture the same audience from the east side and Wisconsin and then eventually roll in with Bernie into a larger East/West league...the writing is on the wall for this thing to explode into an very viable option to go against MNHOCK.
Seems a bit like it could evolve into Little League on the east coast, where now Little League is relatively a B or c market, as top end players and those who can afford it play on travel teams (not unlike AAA hockey) that go from state to state and play similiar teams.
The Fire is sanctioned in Wisconsin.zboni99 wrote:If there is so much admiration for the Fire why not sanction them in MN. I don't see that much difference between the Fire and MM other than MM has their own rinks. Is the Fire a loosely organized group or does someone hold the naming rights, owns, the organization?
It is a Wisconsin organization via WAHA via USA Hockey.
They are Tier I program takling kids from all over WI and other places.
There is significant difference between MM and the Fire.
MH could not sanction them.
And as it is today, would not sanction them or something similar.
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blondegirlsdad
- Posts: 163
- Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 12:30 am
For anyone whose kid can't make the one A team in a place like Edina, this is a great option. For example, in girls, there aren't C teams to place kids who aren't real committed. So for the serious 1st year 10's, 12's & 14's who aren't quite 1st year A material, they have to hope that the coach is interested enough in their development.
The best thing an association like Edina or EP or Wayzata can do to prevent mass "B" exodus, is to create more A slots. If Edina had 3 A teams at Squirt, that would be 30 fewer kids for Bernie to get.
This looks like a sound plan to eventually create that High School, but in about 5 years, when this group of "Choice" Squirts become 10th graders.
This is a fascinating development. I don't know how I feel about it...
The best thing an association like Edina or EP or Wayzata can do to prevent mass "B" exodus, is to create more A slots. If Edina had 3 A teams at Squirt, that would be 30 fewer kids for Bernie to get.
This looks like a sound plan to eventually create that High School, but in about 5 years, when this group of "Choice" Squirts become 10th graders.
This is a fascinating development. I don't know how I feel about it...
[
Why do people think MN Hockey is trying to stop MM?
It has never been on the bopard's agenda. Discussion, both casual and in committee has never spoke to that. A lot of the board members admire Bernie for doing a good job with hockey.
But association hockey was developed to bring hockey to all. No those that can afford it, not just the elite player.
MN Hockey has to do more to make local associations better at developing all players, reducing (or at leat maintaining) costs, recruiting and retaining players. To this end we have not progressed into the 21st century. We need to do better.[/quote]
Why can't the Blades keep playing RBK all year and why can't they join Tournaments like Eden prairie, Bloomington. MN blades should just stay together all year and keep playing the same AAA teams they already play.
Whats the difference? What you need to own a rink to bring down MN Hockey.
Why do they have to go back and play for the Association. I know most these kids would rather stay playing for the blades then go back to their association. So please clarify why they go back, if anyone can create a team. What took Bernie so long to figure this out?
Why do people think MN Hockey is trying to stop MM?
It has never been on the bopard's agenda. Discussion, both casual and in committee has never spoke to that. A lot of the board members admire Bernie for doing a good job with hockey.
But association hockey was developed to bring hockey to all. No those that can afford it, not just the elite player.
MN Hockey has to do more to make local associations better at developing all players, reducing (or at leat maintaining) costs, recruiting and retaining players. To this end we have not progressed into the 21st century. We need to do better.[/quote]
Why can't the Blades keep playing RBK all year and why can't they join Tournaments like Eden prairie, Bloomington. MN blades should just stay together all year and keep playing the same AAA teams they already play.
Whats the difference? What you need to own a rink to bring down MN Hockey.
Why do they have to go back and play for the Association. I know most these kids would rather stay playing for the blades then go back to their association. So please clarify why they go back, if anyone can create a team. What took Bernie so long to figure this out?
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hockey_is_a_choice
- Posts: 239
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:48 am
Elliott,
I agree that Minnesota Hockey needs to do a better job and that association hockey was developed to bring hockey to all skaters. Unfortunately, hockey has become an expensive sport. Competitive hockey is no longer a sport where kids can limit their play to outdoor pond hockey and expect to successfully compete against talented kids who are working with private coaches and paying for extra ice time.
I also agree that Minnesota Hockey has to do more to help local associations develop and recruit their players. However, unless Minnesota Hockey has the financial resources to subsidize players' fees, I don't think it is realistic to expect Minnesota Hockey to reduce (or even to maintain) costs. We are in an inflationary period and everything, not just the cost of hockey, is impacting families' discretionary incomes.
As for Minnesota Hockey's desire to retain players, I suggest that Minnesota Hockey could do more to retain and develop players if it allowed players the choice to choose where and for whom they played in-season hockey. Minnesota Hockey can learn a lesson or two from how the State of Minnesota approaches education. Our kids can select their schools and families regularly make hard financial choices so that they can send their kids to private school. The State of Minnesota doesn't attempt to limit families' educational choices by adopting a policy prohibiting private schools. Instead, the State recognizes that families, not a bureaucratic governing body, are better suited to decide where to send their kids to school.
Associations are akin to public schools and private hockey leagues or clubs (e.g., Bernie's Choice League or the Wisonsin Fire) are analogous to private schools. Associations offer reasonably priced programs available to everyone, but those programs aren't acceptable to those who want their child to participate in a different program and are willing to spend their income to procure their child's participation in that program. Why does Minnesota Hockey deprive families of a choice?
I agree that "[t]o this end [Minnesota Hockey has] not progressed into the 21st century." Because you are a Minnesota Hockey Board member, I am encouraged by your acknowledgement that "[w]e need to do better." I hope we do and soon. I also hope it starts with offering families a choice where to play in-season hockey.
I agree that Minnesota Hockey needs to do a better job and that association hockey was developed to bring hockey to all skaters. Unfortunately, hockey has become an expensive sport. Competitive hockey is no longer a sport where kids can limit their play to outdoor pond hockey and expect to successfully compete against talented kids who are working with private coaches and paying for extra ice time.
I also agree that Minnesota Hockey has to do more to help local associations develop and recruit their players. However, unless Minnesota Hockey has the financial resources to subsidize players' fees, I don't think it is realistic to expect Minnesota Hockey to reduce (or even to maintain) costs. We are in an inflationary period and everything, not just the cost of hockey, is impacting families' discretionary incomes.
As for Minnesota Hockey's desire to retain players, I suggest that Minnesota Hockey could do more to retain and develop players if it allowed players the choice to choose where and for whom they played in-season hockey. Minnesota Hockey can learn a lesson or two from how the State of Minnesota approaches education. Our kids can select their schools and families regularly make hard financial choices so that they can send their kids to private school. The State of Minnesota doesn't attempt to limit families' educational choices by adopting a policy prohibiting private schools. Instead, the State recognizes that families, not a bureaucratic governing body, are better suited to decide where to send their kids to school.
Associations are akin to public schools and private hockey leagues or clubs (e.g., Bernie's Choice League or the Wisonsin Fire) are analogous to private schools. Associations offer reasonably priced programs available to everyone, but those programs aren't acceptable to those who want their child to participate in a different program and are willing to spend their income to procure their child's participation in that program. Why does Minnesota Hockey deprive families of a choice?
I agree that "[t]o this end [Minnesota Hockey has] not progressed into the 21st century." Because you are a Minnesota Hockey Board member, I am encouraged by your acknowledgement that "[w]e need to do better." I hope we do and soon. I also hope it starts with offering families a choice where to play in-season hockey.
Hockey_Is_A_Choice, I am not trying to be a jerk so don't take my question the wrong way because I would like to know what you are thinking or implying that Minnesota Hockey would be better by giving people a choice to as to where they can play?...I did not understand the reasoning behind your comments.
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greybeard58
- Posts: 2560
- Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2004 11:40 pm
Here are some numbers to bring into focus how poorly Minnesota born players advance after High school. One of the biggest numbers in Tier I hockey is Michigan. The numbers are for Division I and Division III mens hockey for American born players. I did not add all states but this a good look at where the players come from. I will also add that for the Chicago showcase the team that Minnesota sends for the boys, no player has a college scholarship, but the other states send their best players period and through the years this state has done very well. For those who think that association hockey(community based) is a thing of the past, these numbers do not lie.
Sorry for straying off topic a bit.
DIVISION I MENS HOCKEY DIVISION III MENS HOCKEY
STATE----2007-----%-----STATE -----2007-----%-----TOTAL-----%
MINN------211---21.44%---MINN.-----306----19.39%---517----20.18%
MICH------146---14.84%---MICH.-----101-----6.40%---247------9.64%
MASS-----110----11.18%---MASS-----293----18.57%---403----15.73%
N.Y.--------93------9.45%---N.Y.-------171----10.84%---264----10.30%
ILL.--------63------6.40%----ILL.--------57------3.61%---120-----4.68%
PA.---------37-----3.76%----PA.---------55------3.49%----92------3.59%
CAL.-------35------3.56%---CAL.--------46------2.92%----81------3.16%
CT---------26------2.64%----CT---------54------3.42%----80-------3.12%
WIS.-------29------2.95%---WIS.-------98-------6.21%---127------4.96%
N.J.--------23-------2.34%---N.J.--------59-------3.74%----82------3.20%
N.H.--------19------1.93%---N.H.--------53-------3.36%----72------2.81%
CO.--------19-------1.93%--CO.---------24-------1.52%----43------1.68%
ALASKA---31-------3.15%---ALASKA----17-------1.08%----48------1.87%
TOTALS 984 100.00% TOTALS 1578 100.00% 2562 100.00%
Sorry for straying off topic a bit.
DIVISION I MENS HOCKEY DIVISION III MENS HOCKEY
STATE----2007-----%-----STATE -----2007-----%-----TOTAL-----%
MINN------211---21.44%---MINN.-----306----19.39%---517----20.18%
MICH------146---14.84%---MICH.-----101-----6.40%---247------9.64%
MASS-----110----11.18%---MASS-----293----18.57%---403----15.73%
N.Y.--------93------9.45%---N.Y.-------171----10.84%---264----10.30%
ILL.--------63------6.40%----ILL.--------57------3.61%---120-----4.68%
PA.---------37-----3.76%----PA.---------55------3.49%----92------3.59%
CAL.-------35------3.56%---CAL.--------46------2.92%----81------3.16%
CT---------26------2.64%----CT---------54------3.42%----80-------3.12%
WIS.-------29------2.95%---WIS.-------98-------6.21%---127------4.96%
N.J.--------23-------2.34%---N.J.--------59-------3.74%----82------3.20%
N.H.--------19------1.93%---N.H.--------53-------3.36%----72------2.81%
CO.--------19-------1.93%--CO.---------24-------1.52%----43------1.68%
ALASKA---31-------3.15%---ALASKA----17-------1.08%----48------1.87%
TOTALS 984 100.00% TOTALS 1578 100.00% 2562 100.00%
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council member retired
- Posts: 283
- Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:12 pm
- Location: Nordeast Mpls
DIVISION I MENS HOCKEY DIVISION III MENS HOCKEY
STATE----2007-----%-----STATE -----2007-----%-----TOTAL-----%
MINN------211---21.44%---MINN.-----306----19.39%---517----20.18%
MICH------146---14.84%---MICH.-----101-----6.40%---247------9.64%
MASS-----110----11.18%---MASS-----293----18.57%---403----15.73%
N.Y.--------93------9.45%---N.Y.-------171----10.84%---264----10.30%
ILL.--------63------6.40%----ILL.--------57------3.61%---120-----4.68%
PA.---------37-----3.76%----PA.---------55------3.49%----92------3.59%
CAL.-------35------3.56%---CAL.--------46------2.92%----81------3.16%
CT---------26------2.64%----CT---------54------3.42%----80-------3.12%
WIS.-------29------2.95%---WIS.-------98-------6.21%---127------4.96%
N.J.--------23-------2.34%---N.J.--------59-------3.74%----82------3.20%
N.H.--------19------1.93%---N.H.--------53-------3.36%----72------2.81%
CO.--------19-------1.93%--CO.---------24-------1.52%----43------1.68%
ALASKA---31-------3.15%---ALASKA----17-------1.08%----48------1.87%
* while impressive for Minnesota... it is quite possible that Minnesota has more division 3 colleges then their counterparts... and as such not many travel too far from home when attending a division 3 school. Besides the MIAC Minnesotans could be populating much of Wisconsin schools as well.
STATE----2007-----%-----STATE -----2007-----%-----TOTAL-----%
MINN------211---21.44%---MINN.-----306----19.39%---517----20.18%
MICH------146---14.84%---MICH.-----101-----6.40%---247------9.64%
MASS-----110----11.18%---MASS-----293----18.57%---403----15.73%
N.Y.--------93------9.45%---N.Y.-------171----10.84%---264----10.30%
ILL.--------63------6.40%----ILL.--------57------3.61%---120-----4.68%
PA.---------37-----3.76%----PA.---------55------3.49%----92------3.59%
CAL.-------35------3.56%---CAL.--------46------2.92%----81------3.16%
CT---------26------2.64%----CT---------54------3.42%----80-------3.12%
WIS.-------29------2.95%---WIS.-------98-------6.21%---127------4.96%
N.J.--------23-------2.34%---N.J.--------59-------3.74%----82------3.20%
N.H.--------19------1.93%---N.H.--------53-------3.36%----72------2.81%
CO.--------19-------1.93%--CO.---------24-------1.52%----43------1.68%
ALASKA---31-------3.15%---ALASKA----17-------1.08%----48------1.87%
* while impressive for Minnesota... it is quite possible that Minnesota has more division 3 colleges then their counterparts... and as such not many travel too far from home when attending a division 3 school. Besides the MIAC Minnesotans could be populating much of Wisconsin schools as well.
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greybeard58
- Posts: 2560
- Joined: Sat Aug 21, 2004 11:40 pm
Here are the D III schools by conference:
SCHOOL--------CONF.
NORWICH ------ECAC E.
BABSON
CASTLETON
N.E. COLLEGE
SALEM STATE
SOUTHERN MAINE
ST ANSELM
U MASS BOSTON
ST MICHAELS
SKIDMORE
HAMLINE --------MIAC
BETHEL
ST THOMAS
GUSTAVAS AD
ST JOHNS
ST OLAF
ST MARYS
AUGSBURG
CONCORDIA
ST NORBERT---------NCHA
WIS-RIVER FALLS
WIS-STOUT
WIS-SUPERIOR
WIS-EAU CLAIRE
WIS-STEVENS POINT
ST SCHOLASTICA
LAKE FORREST
PLATTSBURG--------SUNYAC
OSWEGO
FREDONIA
POTSDAM
BUFFALO STATE
CORTLAND
GENESO
BROCKPORT
MORRISVILLE
COLBY-----------NESCAC
BOWDOIN
MIDDLEBURY
AMHERST
CONN.COLLEGE
TRINITY
WILLIAMS
WESLEYAN
HAMILTON
TUFTS
ADRIAN----------MCHA
MARIAN
FINLANDIA
MIL.SC OF ENG
LAWRENCE
MINN-CROOKSTON
NORTHLAND
CONCORDIA,WIS
ELMIRA--------------ECAC W.
MANHATTENVILLE
UTICA
HOBART
NEUMANN
LEBANON
CURRY-------------ECAC NE
MASS-DARTMOUTH
NICHOLS
WENTWORTH
SUFFOLK
BECKER
FITCHBURG
SALVE REGINA
PLYMOUTH STATE
JOHNSON-WHALES
WESTERN NE
WORCESTER ST
FRAMINGHAM STATE
SCHOOL--------CONF.
NORWICH ------ECAC E.
BABSON
CASTLETON
N.E. COLLEGE
SALEM STATE
SOUTHERN MAINE
ST ANSELM
U MASS BOSTON
ST MICHAELS
SKIDMORE
HAMLINE --------MIAC
BETHEL
ST THOMAS
GUSTAVAS AD
ST JOHNS
ST OLAF
ST MARYS
AUGSBURG
CONCORDIA
ST NORBERT---------NCHA
WIS-RIVER FALLS
WIS-STOUT
WIS-SUPERIOR
WIS-EAU CLAIRE
WIS-STEVENS POINT
ST SCHOLASTICA
LAKE FORREST
PLATTSBURG--------SUNYAC
OSWEGO
FREDONIA
POTSDAM
BUFFALO STATE
CORTLAND
GENESO
BROCKPORT
MORRISVILLE
COLBY-----------NESCAC
BOWDOIN
MIDDLEBURY
AMHERST
CONN.COLLEGE
TRINITY
WILLIAMS
WESLEYAN
HAMILTON
TUFTS
ADRIAN----------MCHA
MARIAN
FINLANDIA
MIL.SC OF ENG
LAWRENCE
MINN-CROOKSTON
NORTHLAND
CONCORDIA,WIS
ELMIRA--------------ECAC W.
MANHATTENVILLE
UTICA
HOBART
NEUMANN
LEBANON
CURRY-------------ECAC NE
MASS-DARTMOUTH
NICHOLS
WENTWORTH
SUFFOLK
BECKER
FITCHBURG
SALVE REGINA
PLYMOUTH STATE
JOHNSON-WHALES
WESTERN NE
WORCESTER ST
FRAMINGHAM STATE
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Lily Braden
- Posts: 135
- Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:45 pm
My question has to do with the timing of tryouts.
Will they be before or after association tryouts?
I'm not against MM....I think if families can afford it and want to go that way, that's their choice. What would be a bummer, however, would be if our association had its tryouts, all the kids went thru the draft and the teams were formed...and the top B players, INCLUDING GOALIES, then bailed to go to MM after they tried out for those teams.
That would kind of stink.
Will they be before or after association tryouts?
I'm not against MM....I think if families can afford it and want to go that way, that's their choice. What would be a bummer, however, would be if our association had its tryouts, all the kids went thru the draft and the teams were formed...and the top B players, INCLUDING GOALIES, then bailed to go to MM after they tried out for those teams.
That would kind of stink.
Soccer resolved this problem by a non-refundable tryout fee. If you want to club hop/shop go right ahead but there should be something tied to you commitment to play where you try out.Lily Braden wrote:My question has to do with the timing of tryouts.
Will they be before or after association tryouts?
I'm not against MM....I think if families can afford it and want to go that way, that's their choice. What would be a bummer, however, would be if our association had its tryouts, all the kids went thru the draft and the teams were formed...and the top B players, INCLUDING GOALIES, then bailed to go to MM after they tried out for those teams.
That would kind of stink.
fighting all who rob or plunder
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Tenoverpar
- Posts: 514
- Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:40 pm
s
When the tryouts are is irrelevant as all of these kids can play association and play MM. Looking at Elliott's response somewhere in here, he's right on with the concept that this league is no different than any other hockey training product that is available to any player, such as FHIT or TGC or whatever.
If everyone just looked at MM as simply a training outlet I think the perception would be alot better.
Hooray BEER!!
If everyone just looked at MM as simply a training outlet I think the perception would be alot better.
Hooray BEER!!
Re: s
[quote="Tenoverpar"]When the tryouts are is irrelevant as all of these kids can play association and play MM. Looking at Elliott's response somewhere in here, he's right on with the concept that this league is no different than any other hockey training product that is available to any player, such as FHIT or TGC or whatever.
In theory, true; in reality, not so much.
How many families can afford the cost and time of both association hockey and MM program (plus all the extra optional-but strongly suggested-training that comes w/MM).
FHIT/TGC, etc. sets up flexible times to work in conjunction w/association hockey. How understanding do you think Bernie and his minions will be when Johnnie's momma calls to tell him that Johnnie wants to play in the Squirt B Green v. Squirt B White game and is going to miss his Choice practice on Sunday afternoon?
In theory, true; in reality, not so much.
How many families can afford the cost and time of both association hockey and MM program (plus all the extra optional-but strongly suggested-training that comes w/MM).
FHIT/TGC, etc. sets up flexible times to work in conjunction w/association hockey. How understanding do you think Bernie and his minions will be when Johnnie's momma calls to tell him that Johnnie wants to play in the Squirt B Green v. Squirt B White game and is going to miss his Choice practice on Sunday afternoon?
I agree a non-refundable tryout/registration fee is one way to stop this. It has to make the process less painful on the teasmmates that stay with association. I believe our association would not fill the spot but would apply the registration fees and ice bill downpayment(and the raffle tickets will be pre-paid upfront at registration, on the team's ice bill. The players who stay will get more ice time and not have to pay the full bill for the team.
I do agree with Elliott that it should be viewed like Acceleration or Dzeidzic's (sp?) 3 on 3 league, BUT I have a kid who is squirt age and he is currently playing on two teams, (one Showcase AAA for games and one for skating development-totally his choice). Between the two teams he is skating almost every night and playing traveling baseball (thanks to the weather there haven't been too many conflicts and showcase ends soon). I will tell you he is a very tired hockey player. How do you choose which team's games you go to? practices? To have a squirt player play association and choice league is asking for burnout. how many games is that? and practices? not to mention you are talking over $2500 hundred dollars for winter hockey. when do they do their homework, mine is a straight A student, and thanks to the wonderful Minnesota public school testing requirements he hasn't had a lot of homework lately but is being tested almost daily at school. he's hanging in there, BUT he is very emotional and crabby. Crying on a daily basis, believe me this is not usual behavior and as his parents we have already informed him he will have to make a choice next spring.
He's not even ten yet, and we knew better but we let him talk us into it. We wrote the checks and we will stay committed this year, but it won't happen again. Our oldest played for two teams last year (for more checking practice) and was fine, but he was two years older and he choose not to do the same thing this year.
It's always hard for them to give up skating with friends, but as parents we have a responsibility to do the right thing.
I do agree with Elliott that it should be viewed like Acceleration or Dzeidzic's (sp?) 3 on 3 league, BUT I have a kid who is squirt age and he is currently playing on two teams, (one Showcase AAA for games and one for skating development-totally his choice). Between the two teams he is skating almost every night and playing traveling baseball (thanks to the weather there haven't been too many conflicts and showcase ends soon). I will tell you he is a very tired hockey player. How do you choose which team's games you go to? practices? To have a squirt player play association and choice league is asking for burnout. how many games is that? and practices? not to mention you are talking over $2500 hundred dollars for winter hockey. when do they do their homework, mine is a straight A student, and thanks to the wonderful Minnesota public school testing requirements he hasn't had a lot of homework lately but is being tested almost daily at school. he's hanging in there, BUT he is very emotional and crabby. Crying on a daily basis, believe me this is not usual behavior and as his parents we have already informed him he will have to make a choice next spring.
He's not even ten yet, and we knew better but we let him talk us into it. We wrote the checks and we will stay committed this year, but it won't happen again. Our oldest played for two teams last year (for more checking practice) and was fine, but he was two years older and he choose not to do the same thing this year.
It's always hard for them to give up skating with friends, but as parents we have a responsibility to do the right thing.
Re: s
[quote="AimHighIn theory, true; in reality, not so much.
How many families can afford the cost and time of both association hockey and MM program (plus all the extra optional-but strongly suggested-training that comes w/MM).
FHIT/TGC, etc. sets up flexible times to work in conjunction w/association hockey. How understanding do you think Bernie and his minions will be when Johnnie's momma calls to tell him that Johnnie wants to play in the Squirt B Green v. Squirt B White game and is going to miss his Choice practice on Sunday afternoon?[/quote]
Cost is always a factor for almost all of us.
When I was a kid, a classmate always had his own football gear and went to a camp in the summer, this is at age 10, 11, 12 along time ago.
I asked my Dad if I could do the same. He sent me downtown to see Tony Rizzo. Tony owned a shoe repair shop among other things and was a big local sports supporter. Tony helped kids find odd jobs around town.
I made a few bucks, but then decided to use it for Christmas presents for my parents.
Moral: We all have to learn to work for what we want. And what we wnat may change after we have learned how to work.
For those that cannot afford MM, there are plenty of other ways to get what you want.
Wax on, wax off, Grasshopper.
How many families can afford the cost and time of both association hockey and MM program (plus all the extra optional-but strongly suggested-training that comes w/MM).
FHIT/TGC, etc. sets up flexible times to work in conjunction w/association hockey. How understanding do you think Bernie and his minions will be when Johnnie's momma calls to tell him that Johnnie wants to play in the Squirt B Green v. Squirt B White game and is going to miss his Choice practice on Sunday afternoon?[/quote]
Cost is always a factor for almost all of us.
When I was a kid, a classmate always had his own football gear and went to a camp in the summer, this is at age 10, 11, 12 along time ago.
I asked my Dad if I could do the same. He sent me downtown to see Tony Rizzo. Tony owned a shoe repair shop among other things and was a big local sports supporter. Tony helped kids find odd jobs around town.
I made a few bucks, but then decided to use it for Christmas presents for my parents.
Moral: We all have to learn to work for what we want. And what we wnat may change after we have learned how to work.
For those that cannot afford MM, there are plenty of other ways to get what you want.
Wax on, wax off, Grasshopper.
Re: s
Its a business, hard to sell something extra to a customer if they are not in the store.AimHigh wrote: In theory, true; in reality, not so much.
FHIT/TGC, etc. sets up flexible times to work in conjunction w/association hockey. How understanding do you think Bernie and his minions will be when Johnnie's momma calls to tell him that Johnnie wants to play in the Squirt B Green v. Squirt B White game and is going to miss his Choice practice on Sunday afternoon?
The Squirt teams will be full and practicing long before the associations hold their tryouts. Last Fall the Mite League was up and runing the first weekend of October.Lily Braden wrote:My question has to do with the timing of tryouts.
Will they be before or after association tryouts?
I'm not against MM....I think if families can afford it and want to go that way, that's their choice. What would be a bummer, however, would be if our association had its tryouts, all the kids went thru the draft and the teams were formed...and the top B players, INCLUDING GOALIES, then bailed to go to MM after they tried out for those teams.
That would kind of stink.
Great point, DMOM. Parents need to keep things in perspective because for little Johnny, this is THE THING. As the parent we should know better and not get caught up in things.DMom wrote:I agree a non-refundable tryout/registration fee is one way to stop this. It has to make the process less painful on the teasmmates that stay with association. I believe our association would not fill the spot but would apply the registration fees and ice bill downpayment(and the raffle tickets will be pre-paid upfront at registration, on the team's ice bill. The players who stay will get more ice time and not have to pay the full bill for the team.
I do agree with Elliott that it should be viewed like Acceleration or Dzeidzic's (sp?) 3 on 3 league, BUT I have a kid who is squirt age and he is currently playing on two teams, (one Showcase AAA for games and one for skating development-totally his choice). Between the two teams he is skating almost every night and playing traveling baseball (thanks to the weather there haven't been too many conflicts and showcase ends soon). I will tell you he is a very tired hockey player. How do you choose which team's games you go to? practices? To have a squirt player play association and choice league is asking for burnout. how many games is that? and practices? not to mention you are talking over $2500 hundred dollars for winter hockey. when do they do their homework, mine is a straight A student, and thanks to the wonderful Minnesota public school testing requirements he hasn't had a lot of homework lately but is being tested almost daily at school. he's hanging in there, BUT he is very emotional and crabby. Crying on a daily basis, believe me this is not usual behavior and as his parents we have already informed him he will have to make a choice next spring.
He's not even ten yet, and we knew better but we let him talk us into it. We wrote the checks and we will stay committed this year, but it won't happen again. Our oldest played for two teams last year (for more checking practice) and was fine, but he was two years older and he choose not to do the same thing this year.
It's always hard for them to give up skating with friends, but as parents we have a responsibility to do the right thing.
Difficult to do, but necessary.
Again, not that the kid should not do MM or AAA summer, but we need to help them enjoy being kids. It goes fast.