Hockey and Football overlapping

[jBlaze3000]

Champlin lost at least 3 hockey players this year at the Squirt level because the end of football season overlapped with hockey tryouts. At the traveling meeting a parent asked what could be done about the conflicting schedules and they were told that their kids would have to choose between football and hockey (basically saying that if you want to play hockey you will need to quit football 2 weeks before the end of the season).

To me it seems completely ridiculous that there would not be more coordination between the different associations. Wouldn't they WANT kids to play multiple sports (which generally produce better overall athletes) and accomodate for potential overlaps in the schedule?

How do other cities handle this?

[nahc]

Depending on the age level, our association worked with the football coaches so this was not a challenge. Unfortunately, this did not hold true for all age groups and the age director for the older kids did 0 to try and assure these types of conflicts did not occur........

[jBlaze3000]

It seems counter-productive to me to discourage kids from playing more than one sport. I guess I can kind of understand it though as kids get into high school because as kids get older the sports get more physical and demanding. If I was a high school hockey coach I definitely wouldn't want my star player playing football and risking injury.

[MnPride2]

In that situation right now,try-outs were last week,my kid is still involved in football,can`t play hockey till football is done(this Friday),missed try-outs, almost 2 weeks now the high school kids have been practicing,coach said when hockey is done he will practice and be evaluated at that time. Been told it is a school and district rule. They don`t want a starting(which my kid isn`t) football kid getting hurt during hockey try-outs,thus jeopardizing the football teams chances of winning.

[iwearmysunglassesatnight]

[quote="jBlaze3000"]Champlin lost at least 3 hockey players this year at the Squirt level because the end of football season overlapped with hockey tryouts. At the traveling meeting a parent asked what could be done about the conflicting schedules and they were told that their kids would have to choose between football and hockey (basically saying that if you want to play hockey you will need to quit football 2 weeks before the end of the season).

To me it seems completely ridiculous that there would not be more coordination between the different associations. Wouldn't they WANT kids to play multiple sports (which generally produce better overall athletes) and accomodate for potential overlaps in the schedule?

How do other cities handle this?[/quote]

NO THEY DIDN'T

[goldy313]

It seems beyond stupid to e that hockey starts in September and ends in February. You can't play baseball until mid April anyhow.

Rochester is notorious for conflicts between football and hockey tryouts. They schedule tryouts on saturday, when youth football has their games, intentionally. You have kids make a team who never tryout due to football and you have kids get cut because they're at football. It just works to favor who you are. Football has tried to work with hockey but hockey cites MN Hockey as the reason why tryouts are when they are.

[MnPride2]

"basically saying that if you want to play hockey you will need to quit football 2 weeks before the end of the season."



That`s what i told my kid to do since he doesn`t start anyways,he said he wants to play football again next and feels if he quits the team the coach will remember next year come football season...ya know what i mean.

[muckandgrind]

It seems beyond stupid to e that hockey starts in September and ends in February. You can't play baseball until mid April anyhow.

.

There are many sports that run close to year round now. Soccer, hockey, basketball and even baseball can run into late October if you play Fall Ball.

The Coordinators in our association tried to work with the Football guys to work around each other's schedules...but the football guys weren't all that receptive to it. The result? Players were skipping football to go to hockey tryouts. It's too bad that the kids are forced to choose, but unless the adults in both programs are willing to work together to coordinate, this will always be the case.

Hockey starting in September is nothing new. As long as I can remember (going back 35 years) kids have started lacing them up around the same time, give or take a week or two. Besides, it doesn't matter if hockey were to hold off until October, because football is still being played than also.

[jBlaze3000]

Champlin lost at least 3 hockey players this year at the Squirt level because the end of football season overlapped with hockey tryouts. At the traveling meeting a parent asked what could be done about the conflicting schedules and they were told that their kids would have to choose between football and hockey (basically saying that if you want to play hockey you will need to quit football 2 weeks before the end of the season).

To me it seems completely ridiculous that there would not be more coordination between the different associations. Wouldn't they WANT kids to play multiple sports (which generally produce better overall athletes) and accomodate for potential overlaps in the schedule?

How do other cities handle this?

NO THEY DIDN'T

No they didn't what? If your saying no they didn't lose 3 players you are wrong. If you are saying no they didn't say "you'll have to chose hockey or football" - I wasn't in the meeting where that was said but the parent of one of the 3 kids told me directly that's why they weren't playing hockey this year.

I personally don't see why they couldn't just push back tryouts a week or two and extend the fall clinics. That way the kids that want to focus on hockey can still skate and the kids that want to do both have the opportunity to do so.

[muckandgrind]

Champlin lost at least 3 hockey players this year at the Squirt level because the end of football season overlapped with hockey tryouts. At the traveling meeting a parent asked what could be done about the conflicting schedules and they were told that their kids would have to choose between football and hockey (basically saying that if you want to play hockey you will need to quit football 2 weeks before the end of the season).

To me it seems completely ridiculous that there would not be more coordination between the different associations. Wouldn't they WANT kids to play multiple sports (which generally produce better overall athletes) and accomodate for potential overlaps in the schedule?

How do other cities handle this?

NO THEY DIDN'T

No they didn't what? If your saying no they didn't lose 3 players you are wrong. If you are saying no they didn't say "you'll have to chose hockey or football" - I wasn't in the meeting where that was said but the parent of one of the 3 kids told me directly that's why they weren't playing hockey this year.

I personally don't see why they couldn't just push back tryouts a week or two and extend the fall clinics. That way the kids that want to focus on hockey can still skate and the kids that want to do both have the opportunity to do so.

The only way to completely avoid a conflict between hockey and football is to delay the tryouts until November (because most football teams are still playing in October). So pusing them back a week or two won't make any difference.

How about the idea that football starts their season a month earlier? That way football season can end in mid-September when hockey season begins?

Like I said before, this conflict has always been there going back as far as I can recall...at least 30 years anways.

[jBlaze3000]

NO THEY DIDN'T

No they didn't what? If your saying no they didn't lose 3 players you are wrong. If you are saying no they didn't say "you'll have to chose hockey or football" - I wasn't in the meeting where that was said but the parent of one of the 3 kids told me directly that's why they weren't playing hockey this year.

I personally don't see why they couldn't just push back tryouts a week or two and extend the fall clinics. That way the kids that want to focus on hockey can still skate and the kids that want to do both have the opportunity to do so.

The only way to completely avoid a conflict between hockey and football is to delay the tryouts until November (because most football teams are still playing in October). So pusing them back a week or two won't make any difference.

How about the idea that football starts their season a month earlier? That way football season can end in mid-September when hockey season begins?

Like I said before, this conflict has always been there going back as far as I can recall...at least 30 years anways.

In Champlin the football season ended a week after hockey tryouts (the park & rec league that is). I've heard that Maple Grove doesn't start tryouts until football is over.

[whockeyguy]

Why on GODs green earth do hockey programs do this, My god even at squirts, let them get done with football in the early levels squirt and peewee, and then make the cuts, there is plenty of hockey season after mid october
This is just plain stupid at this age, and for the people that think differant then i guess your kid doesnt have to make the choice. Where is the common sense out there, , come on hockey people WAKE UP and smell the coffee

[muckandgrind]

Why on GODs green earth do hockey programs do this, My god even at squirts, let them get done with football in the early levels squirt and peewee, and then make the cuts, there is plenty of hockey season after mid october
This is just plain stupid at this age, and for the people that think differant then i guess your kid doesnt have to make the choice. Where is the common sense out there, , come on hockey people WAKE UP and smell the coffee

It's not just hockey....it's baseball, basketball and soccer too. Always has been, always will.

If football started a month earlier, we wouldn't have this problem. You can't wait until November for hockey to start skating.

[observer]

Ah, can you say Anders Lee? Or how about Joe Mauer?

The kids that play multiple sports are the best athletes.

[muckandgrind]

Ah, can you say Anders Lee? Or how about Joe Mauer?

The kids that play multiple sports are the best athletes.

Do you think it was genetics or the fact that they play(ed) multiple sports that made them great athletes? Personally, I think genetics has more to do with it than anything.

If a kid wants to play multiple sports, all the more power to him. But we aren't raising little Joe Mauer's or Sidney Crosby's. My son doesn't want to play football and is looking to give up baseball so he can do more fishing and play more hockey. I have no problem with that if that's what he wants to do.

[Bronc]

Ah, can you say Anders Lee? Or how about Joe Mauer?

The kids that play multiple sports are the best athletes.

Do you think it was genetics or the fact that they play(ed) multiple sports that made them great athletes? Personally, I think genetics has more to do with it than anything.

If a kid wants to play multiple sports, all the more power to him. But we aren't raising little Joe Mauer's or Sidney Crosby's. My son doesn't want to play football and is looking to give up baseball so he can do more fishing and play more hockey. I have no problem with that if that's what he wants to do.

The more sports you play the better overall athlete you will be and it will make each sport you play better. You combine this with utilizing some different muscle groups, you reduce your odds of injury for each.

Genetics is huge, but so is being a well rounded person with multiple interest (fishing included:).

[Night Train]

Fitness and conditioning are huge factors as the teams with the best fitness frequently can win games over teams with more skill. Kids coming off a soccer or football season in the fall are often way ahead of the other hockey players, that didn't play a fall sport, with their conditioning.

I agree with the football comment because kids are taught to run full speed into other kids in football and it happens over and over in every football practice and game. You think linebackers, running backs and defensive backs make good checkers? Of course, they've hit and been hit a thousand times. Some hockey kids are scared as they've never been hit. Ever.

In giant programs they often want the kids to choose because they have enough kids and don't have to make special arrangements with particular families which can be criticized when their players, that aren't as good, don't get special arrangements. It's very unfortunate these programs can't figure out how to co-exist because the kids lose.

As a coach I always looked first at the multi-sport athlete. Kid and family are committed and the athlete is better conditioned.

[muckandgrind]

Fitness and conditioning are huge factors as the teams with the best fitness frequently can win games over teams with more skill. Kids coming off a soccer or football season in the fall are often way ahead of the other hockey players, that didn't play a fall sport, with their conditioning.

I agree with the football comment because kids are taught to run full speed into other kids in football and it happens over and over in every football practice and game. You think linebackers, running backs and defensive backs make good checkers? Of course, they've hit and been hit a thousand times. Some hockey kids are scared as they've never been hit. Ever.

In giant programs they often want the kids to choose because they have enough kids and don't have to make special arrangements with particular families which can be criticized when their players, that aren't as good, don't get special arrangements. It's very unfortunate these programs can't figure out how to co-exist because the kids lose.

As a coach I always looked first at the multi-sport athlete. Kid and family are committed and the athlete is better conditioned.

You don't need to play multiple sports to be a better conditioned athlete. You can play hockey year round and be in just as good, if not better, condition than the kid who plays baseball or football. Heck, you don't even have to play organized sports to stay in top condition, you can do that on your own through rigorous excercise such as playing football at the park with buddies, jogging or just running around being a kid.

Again, there is nothing stopping the football programs from starting up a month sooner. If they started in July rather than August, the season would be over by the end of September when most associations hold their tryouts. It's a win-win for everyone. The solution is incredibly simple. Instead of pointing the finger at hockey, maybe people should be questioning football. Hockey season starts in September, always has and always will.

[goldy313]

It's tough to start football earlier than they do now. You can't put kids out in equipment in that type of heat. If all coaches were trained to monitor kids for heat injuries then maybe you could but I still wouldn't want my kid out under those conditions. The risk isn't worth it.

Hockey used to never start until November, most rinks didn't even put ice in until nearly Halloween. Many rinks still don't go in until early October, the increased cost of putting rinks in early has a drastic effect on the increased cost of hockey, but that's another topic.

[muckandgrind]

It's tough to start football earlier than they do now. You can't put kids out in equipment in that type of heat. If all coaches were trained to monitor kids for heat injuries then maybe you could but I still wouldn't want my kid out under those conditions. The risk isn't worth it.

Hockey used to never start until November, most rinks didn't even put ice in until nearly Halloween. Many rinks still don't go in until early October, the increased cost of putting rinks in early has a drastic effect on the increased cost of hockey, but that's another topic.

You don't think it's hot in Texas, Florida or Alabama even in September? Of course it is. Yet, they don't seem to have an issue with it.

And yes, hockey has generally started in September for as long as I can remember (and as long as there were indoor rinks). People seem to think the seson gets longer and longer every season, it doesn't. If you don't believe me, stroll over to Phalen Arena is St. Paul and look at the photo of the 1982-1983 Johnson A Bantam Team. Their record that season was 75-5-1. If they didn't start skating until November, their season would have went unto May or June. I played youth hockey in the early and mid 70's and we started skating in mid to late September every year, and there were the same conflicts with football even back then. This is nothing new.

[jBlaze3000]

I don't think anyone is blaming hockey in particular. I think there needs to be better coordination between all the youth associations. Some may choose to play one sport year round but the option should be there for those that want to play multiple sports.

[goldy313]

Arizona doesn't start football in July either.

My oldest graduated from high school 9 years ago, his last bantam tryout was in 1995. That tryout was over MEA weekend which is in October. You couldn't play any games until November, we didn't play any games until the weekend before Thanksgiving, that team played roughly 50 games by the end of February, probably close to 60 by the end of the season. Back then you could play back to back games if you wanted to, we often played 4 or 5 district games in 2 days, they played 4-5 games a week most of the season, sometimes more sometimes less. Your putting the current rules in a context where they didn't exist.

This season Bantams had their tryouts the second weekend in September. It won't be too many years and they'll be in August at the rate they're going.

If you want kids to just play hockey, as you post, that's fine, but don't expect everybody to bend over backwards for you. As hockey numbers continues to fall behind in most areas you have to take that as an indictment on your way of thinking. When you force kids (parents) to choose between sports hockey will lose much of the time because you're forcing out kids. Less kids means a smaller talent pool, a smaller talent pool means less quality kids. Funny thing is the best kids are still the multi sport kids no matter what people try to do to drive them out.

[muckandgrind]

Arizona doesn't start football in July either.

My oldest graduated from high school 9 years ago, his last bantam tryout was in 1995. That tryout was over MEA weekend which is in October. You couldn't play any games until November, we didn't play any games until the weekend before Thanksgiving, that team played roughly 50 games by the end of February, probably close to 60 by the end of the season. Back then you could play back to back games if you wanted to, we often played 4 or 5 district games in 2 days, they played 4-5 games a week most of the season, sometimes more sometimes less. Your putting the current rules in a context where they didn't exist.

This season Bantams had their tryouts the second weekend in September. It won't be too many years and they'll be in August at the rate they're going.

If you want kids to just play hockey, as you post, that's fine, but don't expect everybody to bend over backwards for you. As hockey numbers continues to fall behind in most areas you have to take that as an indictment on your way of thinking. When you force kids (parents) to choose between sports hockey will lose much of the time because you're forcing out kids. Less kids means a smaller talent pool, a smaller talent pool means less quality kids. Funny thing is the best kids are still the multi sport kids no matter what people try to do to drive them out.

Not sure if you're referring to me because that's not what I posted.

Arizona may not start football in July, but to say we can't start in July due to the heat is ludicrous when August in Texas or Arizona is just as hot (maybe hotter) than July in Minnesota. That's my point. There's not a single reason why football couldn't start sooner. Little League playoffs are usually completed by the 1st or 2nd week of July, there should be very little conflicts there.

Which Bantam program has their tryout the 2nd weekend of September? Most programs I know of start the tryouts the last week of September and finish up the 1st week of October.

Nobody is asking anyone to bend over backwards for them except for the football folks. In our association, we are talking MAYBE 1 or 2 kids per team. Our Boys Coordinator sent the tryout schedule to the Football coordinator in July, yet the football guy decided not to accomodate. Who's fault is that?

[whockeyguy]

Yes they can start skating in sept and early oct, but most districts dont start play untill November so just hold off in picking the team till later, which will allow those playing football a chance they deserve,why do we punish these kids

[WayOutWest]

And yes, hockey has generally started in September for as long as I can remember (and as long as there were indoor rinks). People seem to think the seson gets longer and longer every season, it doesn't. If you don't believe me, stroll over to Phalen Arena is St. Paul and look at the photo of the 1982-1983 Johnson A Bantam Team. Their record that season was 75-5-1. If they didn't start skating until November, their season would have went unto May or June. I played youth hockey in the early and mid 70's and we started skating in mid to late September every year, and there were the same conflicts with football even back then. This is nothing new.

I think you just illustrated the problem, quite well, Muck.
Perhaps Bantam's shouldn't be playing 81 freaking games, on the season!!??
High schools typically don't start skating, as a team, until November. Why should Bantams be any different?
Overlaps seem to be occuring more and more, between seasons, across most sports. It is really too bad that some kids have to choose between sports to accomodate this.
There is little to no coordination, anywhere, between associations, schools, and park and rec administrations, to help mitigate these issues. Each one of them seems to believe they take priority.