Edina: not the same team?

[minnesotaice]

Dropped 2 in a row. They just looked flat out tired tonight against Centennial. Ill give props to the hornets, they took a lot of good shots on net, but Edina didnt look like the team that beat Grand Rapids 4-1 on FSN earlier in the season.
(brett larson of Centennial was stellar tonight)

In my opinion I believe the top 5 rankings have changed:
1. B. Jefferson
2. Centennial
3. Blaine
4. Edina
5. EP

[karl(east)]

I'll wait til Sunday to put out new rankings, but they sure seem to have hit a wall rather abruptly.

Details on the most recent game would be much appreciated for those of us outside the range of FSN North.

[minnesotaice]

3-1 Centenial

Two early goals by both sides. It was all Centennial after that. Pitlick to Hess on a PP goal at the very end of the 2nd period. Pitlick scored a shorthanded goal in the third.
Excellent goaltending and speed beat edina tonight. I think larson had 40some saves.

[gophermadman]

Dropped 2 in a row. They just looked flat out tired tonight against Centennial. Ill give props to the hornets, they took a lot of good shots on net, but Edina didnt look like the team that beat Grand Rapids 4-1 on FSN earlier in the season.
(brett larson of Centennial was stellar tonight)

In my opinion I believe the top 5 rankings have changed:
1. B. Jefferson
2. Centennial
3. Blaine
4. Edina
5. EP

In all fairness, Centennial is a very good team, and maybe didnt put on the shot count that Edina did, but they made their shots count. If I were to do the rankings:

1. B. Jefferson
2. Centennial
3. Edina
4. EP
5. Blaine

[scoreboard33]

Actually, I think they are pretty close to the same team that beat Grand Rapids earlier, it is just that Centennial is a lot better than Rapids.

Anyway, after the holiday classic, the hornets began to fly and started shelling pretty much everyone they played. They continued until Hopkins on Saturday, where they ran into a hot goalie and could not adjust to Hopkins' uber-agressive breakout, where they sent the away side wing early just about every time they touched the puck. They lost, but they played pretty well and got the puck to the net and had good chances on rebounds.

Today, they were playing one of the best teams in the state with a top line that could match theirs, and the top line was faster and equally willing to bang. Edina's first line got the puck to the net and looked for rebounds, but Centennial collapsed hard and blocked a ton of the shots. The shot count at the game was poorly done and Edina did not outshoot Centennial 2 to 1. It may have been 1.5 to 1, at best. Centennial really looked for a good shot on the rush, as opposed to Edina's strategy of shooting for rebounds.

Pitlick and Baker were clearly the two best players on the ice, with Everson, Gaarder, Schmitz, Lovick, Eppel and Hess a distant third through eighth, in no particular order. Centennial was willing to hit with Edina and play both the power and finesse game and that was what did Edina in. Anders Lee didn't look like the same player as he was earlier in the year and while I thought Edina's second and third lines played better than Centennial's, they are not scorers and did not convert their major chances.

Edina is not playing as well as they were earlier in January and the close game with EP may have started that trend.

Anyway, look for the Hornets to come out with a fire under their feet the next few games and hopefully carry the momentum into sections. Edina needs to realize they aren't going to blow everyone out and learn to play close games.

[karl(east)]

Thanks for the excellent analysis, scoreboard.

There was no online feed of this one, but I did see the Hopkins game. I also noticed the lack of Anders Lee in that game. They need him to step up and carry this team in the way he's capable of doing. I also find it interesting that Baker appeared to be the best player for the Hornets on the ice.

Luckily, they get a recovery game against Robbinsdale Armstrong later this week. You'd think they could use the rare respite from their difficult schedule to regroup for more tough Classic Lake competition.

As for Centennial, they proved themselves tonight. They need to use this as a springboard for the upcoming Blaine game, but can't afford to be complacent and take the rest of their competition lightly.

[Gr8]

Baker the best player on the ice? He's a great player but not only has he played better there were other guys on his team that were better than him out there.

[O-townClown]

Edina's put up about 100 shots in the two losses. Tonight's play was "all Centennial"?

[youngblood08]

Does bring up a great debate between having one of the toughest schedules in the state vs having a weaker schedule.

So if you are coaching do you schedule more cupcakes and be rested for the playoffs and state run or do you schedule tough opponents for every game to put your team in the "Big Game " mode or schedule a even amount of both.

Everyone has wanted a piece of Edina the past 2 years, as they are all you hear about. So is it good or bad to be a target?

[WayOutWest]

Edina's put up about 100 shots in the two losses. Tonight's play was "all Centennial"?

Yeah, I didn't get that, either.
Edina's winning streak was going to end at some point. So, they dropped two games in a row. They still have probably the most talented line in the state, and they will continue to play very well.
I'd easily take Edina if they were to hold a rematch again tonight.

[tuffpucker]

Everson and Hess were the two best forwards and Baker Schmitz were the two best defencemen. Larson was the best goalie. Best game to watch on TV this year.

[breakout]

Edina's put up about 100 shots in the two losses. Tonight's play was "all Centennial"?

Yeah, I didn't get that, either.
Edina's winning streak was going to end at some point. So, they dropped two games in a row. They still have probably the most talented line in the state, and they will continue to play very well.
I'd easily take Edina if they were to hold a rematch again tonight.

Centennial fans may not agree with your assessment as to which team has the best first line.

[flatontheice]

Actually, I think they are pretty close to the same team that beat Grand Rapids earlier, it is just that Centennial is a lot better than Rapids.

Anyway, after the holiday classic, the hornets began to fly and started shelling pretty much everyone they played. They continued until Hopkins on Saturday, where they ran into a hot goalie and could not adjust to Hopkins' uber-agressive breakout, where they sent the away side wing early just about every time they touched the puck. They lost, but they played pretty well and got the puck to the net and had good chances on rebounds.

Today, they were playing one of the best teams in the state with a top line that could match theirs, and the top line was faster and equally willing to bang. Edina's first line got the puck to the net and looked for rebounds, but Centennial collapsed hard and blocked a ton of the shots. The shot count at the game was poorly done and Edina did not outshoot Centennial 2 to 1. It may have been 1.5 to 1, at best. Centennial really looked for a good shot on the rush, as opposed to Edina's strategy of shooting for rebounds.

Pitlick and Baker were clearly the two best players on the ice, with Everson, Gaarder, Schmitz, Lovick, Eppel and Hess a distant third through eighth, in no particular order. Centennial was willing to hit with Edina and play both the power and finesse game and that was what did Edina in. Anders Lee didn't look like the same player as he was earlier in the year and while I thought Edina's second and third lines played better than Centennial's, they are not scorers and did not convert their major chances.

Edina is not playing as well as they were earlier in January and the close game with EP may have started that trend.

Anyway, look for the Hornets to come out with a fire under their feet the next few games and hopefully carry the momentum into sections. Edina needs to realize they aren't going to blow everyone out and learn to play close games.

The game came down to one simple thing. Giles was outcoached. IF he continues to play his top line that much and rely only on his top line for everything, they are going to get easier and easier to beat.

[breakout]

Didn't Centennial and Edina meet for the Bantam A State Championship almost three years ago? Edina up 3 to 0, Centennial came back to win 5 to 3 and capture the state title. Lee was at STA, Budish was on the first line.

Talked to some folks that were at the game. One said that the Lee and Everson were taking two minute shifts. Signs of frustration?

Edina's two losses illustrate the value of good goaltending. Goalie is the most important position on the team. Ankeny is a good goalie. Hopkin's and Centennial's goalies played better.

[breakout]

Actually, I think they are pretty close to the same team that beat Grand Rapids earlier, it is just that Centennial is a lot better than Rapids.

Anyway, after the holiday classic, the hornets began to fly and started shelling pretty much everyone they played. They continued until Hopkins on Saturday, where they ran into a hot goalie and could not adjust to Hopkins' uber-agressive breakout, where they sent the away side wing early just about every time they touched the puck. They lost, but they played pretty well and got the puck to the net and had good chances on rebounds.

Today, they were playing one of the best teams in the state with a top line that could match theirs, and the top line was faster and equally willing to bang. Edina's first line got the puck to the net and looked for rebounds, but Centennial collapsed hard and blocked a ton of the shots. The shot count at the game was poorly done and Edina did not outshoot Centennial 2 to 1. It may have been 1.5 to 1, at best. Centennial really looked for a good shot on the rush, as opposed to Edina's strategy of shooting for rebounds.

Pitlick and Baker were clearly the two best players on the ice, with Everson, Gaarder, Schmitz, Lovick, Eppel and Hess a distant third through eighth, in no particular order. Centennial was willing to hit with Edina and play both the power and finesse game and that was what did Edina in. Anders Lee didn't look like the same player as he was earlier in the year and while I thought Edina's second and third lines played better than Centennial's, they are not scorers and did not convert their major chances.

Edina is not playing as well as they were earlier in January and the close game with EP may have started that trend.

Anyway, look for the Hornets to come out with a fire under their feet the next few games and hopefully carry the momentum into sections. Edina needs to realize they aren't going to blow everyone out and learn to play close games.

The game came down to one simple thing. Giles was outcoached. IF he continues to play his top line that much and rely only on his top line for everything, they are going to get easier and easier to beat.

Got to have faith in your second and third lines. Giles should have learned that lesson in the State Tournament last year.

[karl(east)]

Got to have faith in your second and third lines. Giles should have learned that lesson in the State Tournament last year.

Very true, and it looked like he had this figured out around the Schwan Cup or so. I was very impressed by all 3 lines at that point.

It may have gotten to the point where when other teams see Edina overusing that first line, they smell blood. They realize it's a sign of desperation, and one that really isn't necessary, given the talent at hand.

There's also the schedule worry here. I'm always a big advocate of scheduling lots of good competition. But there's always a point where a team needs a cupcake game to recover and rest up. If you play too many hard teams in a row, the top lines are going to start to get worn out. Also, I'd think it would start to get hard to get up for big games when you play so many...and there's no doubt the opposition does, since Edina has such a big target on its back.

Fortunately for Edina, they do have an easier game against Armstrong this week, and if they do it right they can use that to get things back in sync for the bigger games next week.

[eagle4life9]

I thought Pitlick was the best player on the ice in the second half of the game but during the first period and beginning of the second he was pretty much invisible.

[halla]

Didn't get to watch the game. When I saw the result, I thought to myself, "Giles probably panicked and went overboard with his 1st line again." Comments in this thread seem to indicate that was the case.

It kind of brings to mind some Vikings' games from Tice's last year or two. They had a good passing attack but struggled to run the ball. And it seemed anytime things weren't going great, they would just abandon the run and then it was all over because they couldn't keep defenses honest. It is the head coach's job to make sure your team doesn't become 1-dimensional, especially when it doesn't have to be. I understand that Lee, Everson, and Gaarder are still good players even when they're tired, but I definitely feel Edina is a better team when they are getting more rest.

My personal take on coaching is that your players will become the kind of players you expect them to be. If you expect them to be significant contributors, they will grow into that expectation. If you expect them to just get on and off the ice without imploding just long enough to give other guys a breather, then that is the kind of players they will become. Put more faith in all of your players, Giles!

If Giles continues this approach, I think Edina will need to get quite lucky to win a championship.

[halla]

Here's one question: Is Van Voorhis back in the lineup for Edina? If not, that's rather a big loss on the blue line IMO.

[northwoods oldtimer]

The game came down to one simple thing. Giles was outcoached. IF he continues to play his top line that much and rely only on his top line for everything, they are going to get easier and easier to beat.

flatontheice is correct Jefferson will work this team in playoffs with those solid 3 lines.

[O-townClown]

Most accounts have Edina with solid second and third lines. They aren't scoring much, but other teams aren't doing much against them either.

It definitely looks like Jefferson will earn the #1 seed in the Section. That gives them Burnsville while Edina and Holy Angels meet in the other semi?

[hornetsnest]

Got to have faith in your second and third lines. Giles should have learned that lesson in the State Tournament last year.

Very true, and it looked like he had this figured out around the Schwan Cup or so. I was very impressed by all 3 lines at that point.

It may have gotten to the point where when other teams see Edina overusing that first line, they smell blood. They realize it's a sign of desperation, and one that really isn't necessary, given the talent at hand.

There's also the schedule worry here. I'm always a big advocate of scheduling lots of good competition. But there's always a point where a team needs a cupcake game to recover and rest up. If you play too many hard teams in a row, the top lines are going to start to get worn out. Also, I'd think it would start to get hard to get up for big games when you play so many...and there's no doubt the opposition does, since Edina has such a big target on its back.

Fortunately for Edina, they do have an easier game against Armstrong this week, and if they do it right they can use that to get things back in sync for the bigger games next week.

As an Edina hockey fan and follower of HS hockey here are a couple of interesting side notes to the comments made about this current edition of Hornet hockey. In Edina everyone is an expert on hockey and many are quick to critisize either the coach or players for any loss the Hornets may have. Having been at the majority of the games this year and in the past, I can make a few observations about this team.

With regard to pros and cons of loading up that first line, I can make these factual statements to the fall-off in production from the first and second lines.

These are the line-ups and and production totals from the first 6 games this year from the hornets top two lines in an intitial attempt to have a balance dual line scoring attack.

(Taft-7 pts. Lee-15 pts. Sit-9 pts.) Total 31pts.
(Eppel-7 pts. Gaarder-12 pts. Everson-11pts.) Total 30pts.

This averages out to 10.16 pts per/game for these two lines.


Here are their production totals the last 12 games since the line shuffle

(Gaarder-22-pts. Lee 32-pts. Everson 33-pts) Total 87 pts.
(Sit-6pts Taft-6 pts. Eppel 1-pts/Chapman 3-pts) Total 16pts.

This averages out to 7.9 pts per/game over the last 12.

The differential is dramatic, Taft and Sit are very talented players, but have seen their production plummet since removing Lee from centering that line. This is becoming a more glaring concern as the Hornets near the section play-offs. Here are each of these players ppg/average before and after.

First 6 Games PPG - Last 12 Games PPG
Gaarder 2 - 2
Everson 1.83 - 2.75
Eppel 1.16 - .08

Sit - 1.5 - - .5
Lee - 2.5 - - 2.66
Taft - 1.16 - .5

Lee and Gaarders total have remained consistent or slightly higher. Everson is the only player to have seen a real increase in production with Gaarder unchanged and Lee a slight increase. The drop-off for Sit, Taft and Eppel is dramatic. This clearly allows teams to match-up against one line vs. two. For 90% of Edina's schedule this may fly but clearly, against the top 5 in the state, this will be an issue of concern.

Without Budish, Lee has taken on the work load of setting-up Everson, who will need to continue to finish but will also have to learn to make plays in situations where forcing a shot on a bad angle is not the play. Until he learns to make plays as well as putting away goals his over-all game and potential will be questioned. With the luxury of playing with Budish and Lee as set-up players, his game has become too dependent on back-door goals. By removing lee at center and creating two scoring lines, Everson's totals may likely drop but the team may actually go deeper in the play-offs.

Scoreboard33, I was at the game last night and watched the third period at home, and with regard to the shots, Gorg even replayed a shot flury by Edina that understated how many shots Edina had. Your take on the game is interesting and also inaccurate. Centennial had far fewer scoring chances but captialized on the few they had. You also mentioned Baker and Everson as your stars of the game, Baker was on the ice for 2 of the 3 Centenial goals and made a key error on their third goal when his stick broke, he left the play before Jarret could clear the zone and allowed Hess unattended to make an easy pass to pitlick who one-timed it. Everson was set-up numerous times but could not convert and did not handle the puck especially well in passing situations.

In the end what may doom this Edina team is chemistry. Talent is a non-issue here. They have some of the most experienced players and blend of young talent out there. The concept of un-selfish team play has been an issue for much of this year. This was evident agaisnt HM early in the year who clearly moved the puck better and were in better position. Until Edina finds away to come together with better balance and play as a team, question marks will remain against the very top competition.

[captaincrunch]

putting up 100 shots in 2 games? they just ran into some good goalies who were ready to play...they dominated both hopkins and centennial its hockey those 2 loses happen. Edina was a better team then centennial

[backrinkrat]

Edina has and will be a target, don't panic hornets good teams need to loose once in a while. See you at the Excel Center.

[Westsidefan]

After watching the game on TV last night, my take was that while Edina's first line was almost dominant during the first two periods on the offensive end, there wasn't much backchecking going on and Edina's defenders got worked more than a few times by Centennial's speed.

Edina's second and third lines didn't seem to generate much on the offensive end and even had trouble breaking out. The second line is a truly different animal without Lee centering it.

I was sort of unimpressed by Edina's defense, as they seemed out of position a lot and slow. The speed of Centennial exposed them repeatedly, and a busted stick at an inopportune moment led to a breakdown and goal while another stick was obtained from the bench. Couple of turnovers and/or failures to clear (although I don't recall if they were defensemen or forwards turning it over) also hurt against a good team.

That being said, Edina could have had 4-5 goals easily had a puck been lifted or a rebound knocked in. Hot goalie sure makes a difference, but who knows what would happen again on a 40+ shot night.