Two top ranked 12B teams face off next Tuesday night.
Who will win?
U12B Mahtomedi Blue vs Wayzata Blue - Two Top Teams to Play
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trojanhorsehockey
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hockey121330
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drop the puck
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Watched Mahtomedi Blue defeat Mahtomedi Gold 5 - 0 last weekend which surprised me. While Blue has only lost 1 game all season and is top ranked, I had seen a very good Mahtomedi Gold team defeat North Metro in January and decided this game offered a good chance to scout both teams and their players.
Mahtomedi Blue dominated the game out shooting Gold by about a 3:1 margin. For much of the game Mahtomedi Blue played just 3 skaters at defense and almost 3 full lines at forward. Blue player #12 was on the ice two-thirds of the game and scored four unassisted end-to-end goals. This young lady could skate for any 12A team in Minnesota.
With the exception of these four breakdowns the Gold defense and Gold goal tending was fine and not indicative of the final score. While Gold often placed the puck into the their offensive zone, they failed to launch a legitimate scoring opportunity. The Blue defense was unrelenting in their own zone and the Blue goalie was not once challenged with a difficult shot.
There is certainly enough talent on both Mahtomedi teams combined to skate 12A hockey. Both teams offer opposing 12B coaches an excellent level of competition and both teams can be defeated.
Are the coaches of the opposing teams complaining or is it the parents?
Mahtomedi Blue dominated the game out shooting Gold by about a 3:1 margin. For much of the game Mahtomedi Blue played just 3 skaters at defense and almost 3 full lines at forward. Blue player #12 was on the ice two-thirds of the game and scored four unassisted end-to-end goals. This young lady could skate for any 12A team in Minnesota.
With the exception of these four breakdowns the Gold defense and Gold goal tending was fine and not indicative of the final score. While Gold often placed the puck into the their offensive zone, they failed to launch a legitimate scoring opportunity. The Blue defense was unrelenting in their own zone and the Blue goalie was not once challenged with a difficult shot.
There is certainly enough talent on both Mahtomedi teams combined to skate 12A hockey. Both teams offer opposing 12B coaches an excellent level of competition and both teams can be defeated.
Are the coaches of the opposing teams complaining or is it the parents?
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jollyroger
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I'm not an opposing coach or parent but I'll comment about Mahtomedi's choice to field 2 B teams this year. I know that the people at Mahtomedi who made the decision did not do it so they could steamroll through the League 1 schedule or so they could win a state championship. It was almost the opposite--they were so unsure of their numbers (19 originally) and talent level that they were gun-shy about entering a 12A team, and rightly so. That makes sense since they had to raid their U10 program to fill out the 12B teams. And they did the honorable thing and made 2 'equal' teams.
And I don't think a Mahtomedi A team would have done well in the 12A League 2. They may have been competetive against 1 team, but that's it. I'm sure you've noticed that 'one-girl teams' don't do nearly as well at the A level as they do at the B level. That being said, if you really think they have 4 players who would be top-level A players (I'd say 1) then it's a shame for those girls to lose development time vs. A-level competition.
And I don't think a Mahtomedi A team would have done well in the 12A League 2. They may have been competetive against 1 team, but that's it. I'm sure you've noticed that 'one-girl teams' don't do nearly as well at the A level as they do at the B level. That being said, if you really think they have 4 players who would be top-level A players (I'd say 1) then it's a shame for those girls to lose development time vs. A-level competition.
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drop the puck
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We look forward to playing one or both Mahtomedi teams in the play-offs. The strategy to defeat each Mahtomedi team is different, but both teams will force their opponents to play their best.
How would any of these girls lose development time time by playing hockey at an A level?
In fact a team that plays through a season with one or two losses is actually the team (association) that is NOT developing their players to their highest level.
How would any of these girls lose development time time by playing hockey at an A level?
In fact a team that plays through a season with one or two losses is actually the team (association) that is NOT developing their players to their highest level.
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jollyroger
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I meant that they are losing developent time by not playing vs. A-level talent. Isn't that the way it came out? Maybe not.
But yes, I would rather have a kid play vs. A-level talent on a team with a lousy record than play in the B league and go 20-0. I assume the Mahtomedi Association has the same philosophy as most others--to have each kid play at the level that fits their development the best. But sometimes that just isn't realistic when the numbers don't fit.
But yes, I would rather have a kid play vs. A-level talent on a team with a lousy record than play in the B league and go 20-0. I assume the Mahtomedi Association has the same philosophy as most others--to have each kid play at the level that fits their development the best. But sometimes that just isn't realistic when the numbers don't fit.
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HockeyMom5
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11111111111111111111111
Last edited by HockeyMom5 on Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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drop the puck
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Off topic buy hockeymom that player probably had a concussion and should have watched the rest of the tournament from the bench.
When symptoms of a concussion persist longer than 15 minutes post head injury it is a concussion. This level of injury warrants at least one week rest period and a visit to a doctor.
Concussions are nothing to mess with. If she would have hit her head again the outcome could have been tragic. If the parents could not make that decision, the coach should have (unless this was all hidden).
When symptoms of a concussion persist longer than 15 minutes post head injury it is a concussion. This level of injury warrants at least one week rest period and a visit to a doctor.
Concussions are nothing to mess with. If she would have hit her head again the outcome could have been tragic. If the parents could not make that decision, the coach should have (unless this was all hidden).
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HockeyMom5
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jollyroger
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HockeyMom5
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hockey121330
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My counter to this statement is that if it had only been for this year, I could maybe understand, but if my memory is correct I believe that the 12B team from last year went undefeated (21-0-1) in 12B League play and then onto the State Tournament. I also seem to remember that 2 years ago, Mahtomedi again rolled through league play and onto the State Tournament. From the outside it sure looks like Mahtomedi is enjoying its State Tournaments at the B level and are having a difficult time giving that up? While I can understand that numbers at the girls level are always up in the air year to year, I think the Zephers have played that card a few too many times. Step up and field an A team, especially at the 12 Level when you have 3-5 girls that can/would complete at the A level. If both teams are 'equally' divided then surely they could've competed at the A level and at the same time given those top players some competition to take them out of their comfort zone and make all the players play up to the competition. Look at the 12A standings, there are 4-5 teams with only a couple of wins, kudos to Mpls Storm, PAC and Hopkins, they easily could've done the same and field two B teams but chose to play one A and one B, even though both A & B teams may not have seen alot of W's but in the long run it may payoff for their programs as they get older.jollyroger wrote:I'm not an opposing coach or parent but I'll comment about Mahtomedi's choice to field 2 B teams this year. I know that the people at Mahtomedi who made the decision did not do it so they could steamroll through the League 1 schedule or so they could win a state championship. It was almost the opposite--they were so unsure of their numbers (19 originally) and talent level that they were gun-shy about entering a 12A team, and rightly so. That makes sense since they had to raid their U10 program to fill out the 12B teams. And they did the honorable thing and made 2 'equal' teams.
And I don't think a Mahtomedi A team would have done well in the 12A League 2. They may have been competetive against 1 team, but that's it. I'm sure you've noticed that 'one-girl teams' don't do nearly as well at the A level as they do at the B level. That being said, if you really think they have 4 players who would be top-level A players (I'd say 1) then it's a shame for those girls to lose development time vs. A-level competition.
[quote]My counter to this statement is that if it had only been for this year, I could maybe understand, but if my memory is correct I believe that the 12B team from last year went undefeated (21-0-1) in 12B League play and then onto the State Tournament. I also seem to remember that 2 years ago, Mahtomedi again rolled through league play and onto the State Tournament. From the outside it sure looks like Mahtomedi is enjoying its State Tournaments at the B level and are having a difficult time giving that up? [quote]
Kind of sounds like Princeton - hey HockeyMom
Kind of sounds like Princeton - hey HockeyMom
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HockeyMom5
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Go Gophers
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Not intending any disrespect to the injured girl but... backchecking is a good thing. It means hustling back on defense after an offensive rush and covering an opponent. Checking from behind is a dangerous and bad thing and that's presumably what you meant. I hope your player has recovered.HockeyMom5 wrote:When we played Wayzata Blue and got a few goals up on them, they got highly frustrated and really started playing cheap. It wasn't until one of our girls got back-checked into the boards that they settled down. I guess once one of their players had to sit out the rest of the game, the coaches settled them down. Our player had issues the rest of the tournament with light-headed-ness and being dizzy. It was a bit scary to see girls react that way at that level.
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drop the puck
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HockeyMom the incident you speak off does not appear to be an isolated incident for this team ...
Wayzata Blue lost 3 fair play points in their league play. Nearly every other U12B team playing over 500 across most districts lost no fair play points. Would ask if this is a couple girls who make poor decisions or if this is coaching
Wayzata Blue lost 3 fair play points in their league play. Nearly every other U12B team playing over 500 across most districts lost no fair play points. Would ask if this is a couple girls who make poor decisions or if this is coaching
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HockeyMom5
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drop the puck wrote: For much of the game Mahtomedi Blue played just 3 skaters at defense and almost 3 full lines at forward. Blue player #12 was on the ice two-thirds of the game and scored four unassisted end-to-end goals. This young lady could skate for any 12A team in Minnesota.
rather sad for a team that reports a 23-2 record on their web site.It appears it IS just about winning and not development for this team.
Whoever said that the decision for Mahtomedi to make 2 B teams was very touch and go because of their numbers...That is a silly statement. They had over 40 girls to make 3 teams. Not a problem anywhere else.
Lets talk about numbers. Last year they had a 12uB team that was 23-0-1 and the u10s were almost the same. Seems to me like they have enough talent.
The Blue team has outscored their opponents 98-26 on the season
They skated 3 D and 3 lines against a team they were beating 5-0?????
Hmmmmm
Someone likes crushing their opponents! What is going to happen when these girls get to High School and can't keep up because they skated B's their whole life.
Even though the Gold team was beat 5-0 they appear to be one of the better teams in the district at 10-5-1.
It certainly looks like Mahtomedi should have had an A team.
Lets talk about numbers. Last year they had a 12uB team that was 23-0-1 and the u10s were almost the same. Seems to me like they have enough talent.
The Blue team has outscored their opponents 98-26 on the season
They skated 3 D and 3 lines against a team they were beating 5-0?????
Hmmmmm
Someone likes crushing their opponents! What is going to happen when these girls get to High School and can't keep up because they skated B's their whole life.
Even though the Gold team was beat 5-0 they appear to be one of the better teams in the district at 10-5-1.
It certainly looks like Mahtomedi should have had an A team.
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HockeyMom5
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JohnnyBuck
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wheels wrote:Whoever said that the decision for Mahtomedi to make 2 B teams was very touch and go because of their numbers...That is a silly statement. They had over 40 girls to make 3 teams. Not a problem anywhere else.
Lets talk about numbers. Last year they had a 12uB team that was 23-0-1 and the u10s were almost the same. Seems to me like they have enough talent.
The Blue team has outscored their opponents 98-26 on the season
They skated 3 D and 3 lines against a team they were beating 5-0?????
Hmmmmm
Someone likes crushing their opponents! What is going to happen when these girls get to High School and can't keep up because they skated B's their whole life.
Even though the Gold team was beat 5-0 they appear to be one of the better teams in the district at 10-5-1.
It certainly looks like Mahtomedi should have had an A team.
What's wrong with B hockey? Are you saying that the girls that skate B "their whole life" can't compete at the high school level? Seems like a silly statement to me.
Mahtomedi masters of the B level
I think the critisism of Mahtomedi choosing to dominate at the B level rather than risk taking some lumps at the A level is deserved.
I dont know about there numbers year to year, but my daughter played 2 years of 12b then moved to 14b, and faced Mahtomedi several times a year. They always have several A quality girls, meaning they would be A level in every association in the state. They always played those girls way more than the rest of the team, especially in close games. We usually played them tough but a true B team cant be expected to skate with a stacked B team.
Last year they had three or four girls from Mounds View join their 14b team (2nd place finish at state). I was told by some fairly reliable source that these families chose Mahtomedi over WBL because they were planning on playing A. Only to play B at the last minute. These girls from MV were all A caliber.
If they have the numbers and they keep dominating at the B level w/ 2 teams maybe the district or Minnesota hockey should step in.
On the flip side I recall 2 years ago SSP chose to take their u12 team and play A, because they had 5-6 A level players, and they figured the rest would develop that much faster at the A level. Rather than have the A players get bored playing a weaker B schedule, which wouldn't help their development
I dont know about there numbers year to year, but my daughter played 2 years of 12b then moved to 14b, and faced Mahtomedi several times a year. They always have several A quality girls, meaning they would be A level in every association in the state. They always played those girls way more than the rest of the team, especially in close games. We usually played them tough but a true B team cant be expected to skate with a stacked B team.
Last year they had three or four girls from Mounds View join their 14b team (2nd place finish at state). I was told by some fairly reliable source that these families chose Mahtomedi over WBL because they were planning on playing A. Only to play B at the last minute. These girls from MV were all A caliber.
If they have the numbers and they keep dominating at the B level w/ 2 teams maybe the district or Minnesota hockey should step in.
On the flip side I recall 2 years ago SSP chose to take their u12 team and play A, because they had 5-6 A level players, and they figured the rest would develop that much faster at the A level. Rather than have the A players get bored playing a weaker B schedule, which wouldn't help their development