EastRidge HS
Moderators: Mitch Hawker, east hockey, karl(east)
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EasyRidge....
Joe....Re-read this entire thread once.....YOU even said that the girls would go back to Woodbury and PCG instead of a normal co-op with ER-Woodbury......Because someone told you that....Did that person KNOW anything?..Obviously not now that you doubt the option as being viable or at least cannot find precedent for it anywhere....That was and is my point...."They", and I'm not sure who" they" are, seem to be making the rules as we go along.....To be perfectly honest with you the whole subject will be decided the way many of these matters always have been done...The loudest mom ,or moms, win.....Still just my opinion.....
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hockeywild7 you are exactly right. It's simply about the numbers, and based on what was presented by the 3 schools staff, the numbers do not work. Including rostered players and projected U14 players who no longer have eligiblity to return to their teams base upon age limitations,hockeywild7 wrote:Whatever the decision it won't hinge on competitiveness and whether or not the talent is split equally and it shouldnt. It should go entirely by numbers. The SEC has rules about coops that have to be amended or an exception made.
the numbers are as follows:
Park 28 skaters and 3 goalies
Woodbury 17 skaters and 3 goalies
East Ridge 18 skaters and 0 goalies
Additionally, these numbers do not reflect girls that will leave to play for private schools, and girls who might leave to play elsewhere (Thoroughbreds etc...)
The best decision for all parties and what was favored by the players themselves, was a duel co-op.
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Yes you are reading this right, and no the numbers do not exclude U14 players. Based on the numbers that were presented by staff from all three schools, as well as input from directors of the girls youth programs (Park and Woodbury), these are the numbers that would be available if they went forward with teams for all three schools.FrankThom wrote:Including rostered players and projected U14 players who no longer have eligiblity to return to their teams base upon age limitations ...
Am I reading this right? Are you excluding a number of U14 players?
And like I noted before, these numbers do not take into account any girls that would leave Park or Woodbury for other teams or programs.
Additionally, both East Ridge and Woodbury would not have JV teams, which could make it difficult to schedule games, because most schools want to play teams where their JV could participate.
AND... I haven't even mentioned competitveness, BECAUSE it's about the numbers.
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On the coaches at Eastridge...they just hired now former Hastings Boys Basketball Coach/Health-Phy Ed Teacher Trent Hanson as their new Athletic Director. Trent will begin duties on June 8th...I'll bet you will find out more about the coaches of ALL of the Raptors' teams after Hanson begins his duties. Just a tidbit...
The one U14 for Woodbury is a coop with Hastings and the U19 team is a regional team with some post grads right? Anyone know the exact numbers as it relates or where they are in the above count....FrankThom wrote:What math made all the returning players off of the 7 existing teams
(2 U14, 2 JV, 2 V, 1 U19B)
PLUS
all the second year U12 players off of 4 U12 teams =
only 4 high school teams.
Sounds like "competitive" math to me.
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You are correct about the U14's, but I do not have reportable information on the U19's. The U19's were brought up at the player/parent meeting and it was noted that the team had girls from different parts of the metro, and post grads.joehockey wrote:The one U14 for Woodbury is a coop with Hastings and the U19 team is a regional team with some post grads right? Anyone know the exact numbers as it relates or where they are in the above count....FrankThom wrote:What math made all the returning players off of the 7 existing teams
(2 U14, 2 JV, 2 V, 1 U19B)
PLUS
all the second year U12 players off of 4 U12 teams =
only 4 high school teams.
Sounds like "competitive" math to me.
Here is a copy of the numbers data that was prepared by Phil Kuemmel from Park, Matt Kraft from East Ridge, and John Soma from Woodbury,
as well as the girls youth Directors from Park and Woodbury.
District 833 Girl’s Hockey Participation Data
2008-2009 rostered players at Park & Woodbury returning in 2009-2010*,
• Park 28 skaters + 3 goalies
• Woodbury 17 skaters + 2 goalies
• East Ridge 18 skaters + 0 goalies
*These numbers include projected U14 players (9th graders in 2009-
2010) not eligible to return to their team based upon age limitations.
Overall girl’s participation in the Cottage Grove and Woodbury youth
hockey programs, broken down by future high school attendance
boundaries;
Woodbury 38
Park 41
East Ridge 70
-Further broken down by current grade;
8th grade Woodbury 2 Park 7 East Ridge 14
(some still eligible for U14 in 2009-2010)
7th grade Woodbury 9 Park 8 East Ridge 9
6th grade Woodbury 10 Park 5 East Ridge 17
5th grade Woodbury 9 Park 16 East Ridge 17
4th grade Woodbury 8 Park 5 East Ridge 13
The unknown here is what girls will leave for private schools, what girls from the youth programs will quit, what girls don't want to play high school hockey.
Let's be realistic, you can't pilfer and decimate the U14's and the U12's by forcing them to play HS hockey, just to get to the "numbers". The numbers don't add up.
And like I said before, I haven't even made any comments about being competitive!
Please.Let's be realistic, you can't pilfer and decimate the U14's and the U12's by forcing them to play HS hockey, just to get to the "numbers". The numbers don't add up.
So East Ridge has 32 9th through 12 graders next year and they want to combine?
That doesn't include any of next years 7th and 8th graders that may want to try to play up? Or any transfers that want to go to the brand new school?
Hahahahaha.
Name all the AA teams that have a full varsity, JV and U14 without comboing at any of level. Hardly anyone.
The parents need to get real.
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"Double Co-op"
I believe this is correct... Also - I just read what the school board minutes stated from 5/21/09:FrankThom wrote:I would suspect that the SEC AD's have to approve in addition to MSHSL. Conferences approved North Metro coop, and untied the Mayo coop, a couple years ago.
http://www.sowashco.k12.mn.us/Departmen ... 052109.pdf
Sounds like approval of MSHSL is going to be needed for the "Double Co-op" which I've never heard of before (meaning one school co-oping with two others that both field varsity level teams in the same sport)
5.3 Approval of District Cooperative Sponsored Girls Ice Hockey Teams: Phil Kuemmel (PHS Athletics/Activities Director), John Soma (WHS Athletics/Activities Director) and Matt Kraft (ERHS Assistant Principal) presented updated information on the district cooperative sponsored girls ice hockey teams. Administrators from the district’s three high schools have met frequently over the past two months with stakeholders involved in the girls hockey programs of District 833. A cooperative sponsorship became necessary as student enrollments were determined and it became apparent that
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the number of prospective girl’s hockey players could not support full teams at all three high schools. In developing the recommendation, administrators discussed options with high school head coaches and girl’s youth hockey directors from Cottage Grove and Woodbury, as well as student-athletes and parents from the district
Based on the feedback collected, district administrators are recommending that East Ridge High School enter into a Cooperative Sponsorship with both Park and Woodbury High Schools for girls hockey. The previous recommendation at the March 5th School Board workshop was for a single Cooperative Sponsorship with Woodbury and East Ridge. If approved, this “double co-op” arrangement would be in effect for the 2009-10 and 2010-11 school years, which is the maximum number of years allowed for a cooperatively sponsored activity by rules of the Minnesota State High School League. Girls’ hockey players attending ERHS will be assigned to the Park or Woodbury teams based upon the 2008-09 attendance areas. This requires approval of the School Board and the Minnesota State High School League Board of Directors. It is our belief that the girls’ hockey programs will continue to develop and that all three high schools will be able to field full teams starting with the 2011-2012 school year.
By approving the recommendation for a dual Cooperative Sponsorship, program details can be addressed with involvement of athletes, parents, coaches (the addition of an ERHS assistant on each team), and administrators. Application to the MSHSL for a cooperative sponsorship will also follow approval of the recommendation.
Vice-Chair Boyd invited audience members to speak on this topic.
• John Zavoral, district parent, would like to see more research done on the numbers provided to the School Board and feels many students will miss out on playing time if each school does not have their own team.
• Bruce Harman, district resident and President of WHS Girls Hockey Booster Club, expressed his concerns about the proposed cooperative sponsorship.
It was moved by Denise Kapler and seconded by Jim Gelbmann to approve the recommendation as presented. Motion was carried.
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I found an interesting related item about 7th/8th grader participation at the HS level in the school board minutes:FrankThom wrote:Please.Let's be realistic, you can't pilfer and decimate the U14's and the U12's by forcing them to play HS hockey, just to get to the "numbers". The numbers don't add up.
So East Ridge has 32 9th through 12 graders next year and they want to combine?
That doesn't include any of next years 7th and 8th graders that may want to try to play up? Or any transfers that want to go to the brand new school?
Hahahahaha.
Name all the AA teams that have a full varsity, JV and U14 without comboing at any of level. Hardly anyone.
The parents need to get real.
http://www.sowashco.k12.mn.us/Departmen ... 042309.pdf
Did the district not allow 7th & 8th graders to participate at the HS level before???
5.0 Action Items. 5.1 Approval of Revisions to Policy 510.1, Athletic & Activity Participation:
Randy Zipf, Assistant Superintendent for Secondary Education, presented recommended revisions to
Board Policy 510.1, Athletic and Activity Participation. Administration at our high schools request that
this policy be revised to clarify for 7th and 8th grade students, families and staff, the criteria for
participation in varsity high school athletic activities. By this revision, student athletes in 7th and 8th
grade would be allowed to participate in varsity athletics at their assigned attendance boundary high
school. Administration feels that this policy revision supports student athletes, families and programs
by providing a consistent progression and communication for athletes and families. This revision is
also consistent with the current high school transfer policy and will place the same expectations on
middle school students competing in high school athletics that are now in place for all high school
students.
It was moved by Jim Gelbmann and seconded by Tracy Brunnette to approve the recommendation as
presented. Motion was carried.
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It was allowed but not recommended. They strongly encouraged 7th and 8th graders to play youth hockey.ghshockeyfan wrote:I found an interesting related item about 7th/8th grader participation at the HS level in the school board minutes:FrankThom wrote:Please.Let's be realistic, you can't pilfer and decimate the U14's and the U12's by forcing them to play HS hockey, just to get to the "numbers". The numbers don't add up.
So East Ridge has 32 9th through 12 graders next year and they want to combine?
That doesn't include any of next years 7th and 8th graders that may want to try to play up? Or any transfers that want to go to the brand new school?
Hahahahaha.
Name all the AA teams that have a full varsity, JV and U14 without comboing at any of level. Hardly anyone.
The parents need to get real.
http://www.sowashco.k12.mn.us/Departmen ... 042309.pdf
Did the district not allow 7th & 8th graders to participate at the HS level before???
5.0 Action Items. 5.1 Approval of Revisions to Policy 510.1, Athletic & Activity Participation:
Randy Zipf, Assistant Superintendent for Secondary Education, presented recommended revisions to
Board Policy 510.1, Athletic and Activity Participation. Administration at our high schools request that
this policy be revised to clarify for 7th and 8th grade students, families and staff, the criteria for
participation in varsity high school athletic activities. By this revision, student athletes in 7th and 8th
grade would be allowed to participate in varsity athletics at their assigned attendance boundary high
school. Administration feels that this policy revision supports student athletes, families and programs
by providing a consistent progression and communication for athletes and families. This revision is
also consistent with the current high school transfer policy and will place the same expectations on
middle school students competing in high school athletics that are now in place for all high school
students.
It was moved by Jim Gelbmann and seconded by Tracy Brunnette to approve the recommendation as
presented. Motion was carried.
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That makes sense... Especially if they have had the numbers to field age/ability appropriate youth teams as well as HS JV/V... Which it appears is the case...ROYALmoose25 wrote:It was allowed but not recommended. They strongly encouraged 7th and 8th graders to play youth hockey.ghshockeyfan wrote:I found an interesting related item about 7th/8th grader participation at the HS level in the school board minutes:FrankThom wrote: Please.
So East Ridge has 32 9th through 12 graders next year and they want to combine?
That doesn't include any of next years 7th and 8th graders that may want to try to play up? Or any transfers that want to go to the brand new school?
Hahahahaha.
Name all the AA teams that have a full varsity, JV and U14 without comboing at any of level. Hardly anyone.
The parents need to get real.
http://www.sowashco.k12.mn.us/Departmen ... 042309.pdf
Did the district not allow 7th & 8th graders to participate at the HS level before???
5.0 Action Items. 5.1 Approval of Revisions to Policy 510.1, Athletic & Activity Participation:
Randy Zipf, Assistant Superintendent for Secondary Education, presented recommended revisions to
Board Policy 510.1, Athletic and Activity Participation. Administration at our high schools request that
this policy be revised to clarify for 7th and 8th grade students, families and staff, the criteria for
participation in varsity high school athletic activities. By this revision, student athletes in 7th and 8th
grade would be allowed to participate in varsity athletics at their assigned attendance boundary high
school. Administration feels that this policy revision supports student athletes, families and programs
by providing a consistent progression and communication for athletes and families. This revision is
also consistent with the current high school transfer policy and will place the same expectations on
middle school students competing in high school athletics that are now in place for all high school
students.
It was moved by Jim Gelbmann and seconded by Tracy Brunnette to approve the recommendation as
presented. Motion was carried.
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Re: "Double Co-op"
ghshockeyfan wrote:I believe this is correct... Also - I just read what the school board minutes stated from 5/21/09:FrankThom wrote:I would suspect that the SEC AD's have to approve in addition to MSHSL. Conferences approved North Metro coop, and untied the Mayo coop, a couple years ago.
http://www.sowashco.k12.mn.us/Departmen ... 052109.pdf
Sounds like approval of MSHSL is going to be needed for the "Double Co-op" which I've never heard of before (meaning one school co-oping with two others that both field varsity level teams in the same sport)
5.3 Approval of District Cooperative Sponsored Girls Ice Hockey Teams: Phil Kuemmel (PHS Athletics/Activities Director), John Soma (WHS Athletics/Activities Director) and Matt Kraft (ERHS Assistant Principal) presented updated information on the district cooperative sponsored girls ice hockey teams. Administrators from the district’s three high schools have met frequently over the past two months with stakeholders involved in the girls hockey programs of District 833. A cooperative sponsorship became necessary as student enrollments were determined and it became apparent that
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the number of prospective girl’s hockey players could not support full teams at all three high schools. In developing the recommendation, administrators discussed options with high school head coaches and girl’s youth hockey directors from Cottage Grove and Woodbury, as well as student-athletes and parents from the district
Based on the feedback collected, district administrators are recommending that East Ridge High School enter into a Cooperative Sponsorship with both Park and Woodbury High Schools for girls hockey. The previous recommendation at the March 5th School Board workshop was for a single Cooperative Sponsorship with Woodbury and East Ridge. If approved, this “double co-op” arrangement would be in effect for the 2009-10 and 2010-11 school years, which is the maximum number of years allowed for a cooperatively sponsored activity by rules of the Minnesota State High School League. Girls’ hockey players attending ERHS will be assigned to the Park or Woodbury teams based upon the 2008-09 attendance areas. This requires approval of the School Board and the Minnesota State High School League Board of Directors. It is our belief that the girls’ hockey programs will continue to develop and that all three high schools will be able to field full teams starting with the 2011-2012 school year.
By approving the recommendation for a dual Cooperative Sponsorship, program details can be addressed with involvement of athletes, parents, coaches (the addition of an ERHS assistant on each team), and administrators. Application to the MSHSL for a cooperative sponsorship will also follow approval of the recommendation.
Vice-Chair Boyd invited audience members to speak on this topic.
• John Zavoral, district parent, would like to see more research done on the numbers provided to the School Board and feels many students will miss out on playing time if each school does not have their own team.
• Bruce Harman, district resident and President of WHS Girls Hockey Booster Club, expressed his concerns about the proposed cooperative sponsorship.
It was moved by Denise Kapler and seconded by Jim Gelbmann to approve the recommendation as presented. Motion was carried.
It sounds like what the "Double Co-op" essentially amounts to is how the MSHSL currently handles charter schools that ARE allowed to co-op with multiple public schools for the same sport... I would imagine that MSHSL would have to approve this as I assume it's unique to have a AA school requesting such an agreement with other AA schools...
See section 403 of:
http://www.mshsl.org/mshsl/Publications ... s.doc?ne=2
BYLAW 403.00 COOPERATIVE SPONSORSHIP OF AN
ACTIVITY BY TWO OR MORE MEMBER SCHOOLS
Cooperative sponsorship of an activity by two or more member schools will be considered under the following conditions. Class A and Class AA refers to the school size for placement into Administrative Regions and does not refer to the tournament classification to which a school may be assigned for a particular sport. For purposes of administering this bylaw, the largest 124 schools shall be Class AA, and the rest of the schools shall be Class A.
1. Cooperative sponsorship between two or more Class A schools:
A. Team and/or Non-lifelong Activities
When Class A schools cooperatively sponsor a team and/or non-lifelong activity, the total enrollments of each school shall be combined to determine the appropriate competitive classification.
Badminton, Girls
Baseball
Basketball
Floor Hockey, Adapted
Football
Hockey
Lacrosse
Soccer
Soccer, Adapted
Softball, Adapted
Softball, Girls Fast-Pitch
Track and Field
Volleyball, Girls
Wrestling
Continued on Page 53
Continued from Page 52
B. Team/Individual and/or Lifelong Activities:
If a Class A school with an enrollment of 200 or less in the top four grades requests a larger Class A school to join in a cooperative sponsorship of a team/individual and/or lifelong activity listed below, 80 percent of the combined schools' total enrollments shall be used to determine A or AA status.
Bowling, Adapted
Cross Country Running
Debate
Dance Team, Girls
Golf
Gymnastics, Girls
Music
One Act Play
Skiing, Alpine
Skiing, Nordic Ski Racing
Speech
Swimming and Diving
Synchronized Swimming, Girls
Tennis
Visual Arts
2. Cooperative sponsorship between two or more Class AA schools:
A. Team/Non-lifelong Activities:
Approval will NOT be granted for ANY cooperative sponsorship of Class AA member schools in any League team activity. (NOTE: See exceptions in “B” below.)
Badminton, Girls
Baseball
Basketball
Floor Hockey, Adapted
Football
Hockey
Lacrosse
Soccer
Soccer, Adapted
Softball, Adapted
Softball, Girls Fast-Pitch
Track and Field
Volleyball, Girls
Wrestling
B. Team/Individual and/or Lifelong Activities:
Application may be made for a cooperative sponsorship between Class AA schools in team/individual and/or lifelong activities for regular season competition ONLY.
Bowling, Adapted
Cross Country Running
Debate
Dance Team, Girls
Golf
Gymnastics, Girls
Music
One Act Play
Skiing, Alpine
Skiing, Nordic Ski Racing
Speech
Swimming and Diving
Synchronized Swimming, Girls
Tennis
Visual Arts
C. Class AA Exception Procedure:
Class AA schools who wish to cooperatively sponsor a team activity may appeal to the Board for an exception to the Cooperative Sponsorship Bylaw on an annual basis. The appeal must include, but shall not be limited to, the following documentation from each of the applying schools:
1) Identify and document the reasons for the appeal.
2) Provide a summary of what each of the applying schools has done to promote participation in the activity in their school.
3) Provide a written review and comment regarding the proposed coop from
a) the Competitive Section schools
b) the Competitive Subsection schools, and
c) the Conference member schools.
4) Document student interest in the activity (grades 7-12) from the most recent Student Interest Survey required by the Department of Education.
5) Provide other information as may be deemed necessary by the Board of Directors.
D. Cooperatively Sponsored Team Participation in League-Sponsored Tournament Series:
1) Each member school in a team/individual cooperative may have a TEAM entry at the first level tournaments providing it can fulfill the rule book definition of a team.
2) Students from EACH member school in a team/individual cooperative will have the opportunity to participate as an individual at the FIRST LEVEL tournament in ANY of the listed activities.
Appeal: The League Board of Directors will conduct a hearing for any member school requesting an exception to 403.2. The request for a hearing shall be in writing and directed to the Executive Director of the Minnesota State High School League prior to the first day of that sport season.
E. Cooperative Sponsorship with Charter Schools (Non-Exclusive Cooperative Sponsorship)
Charter schools who are members of the Minnesota State High School League and who are organized as prescribed by M.S. 124D.10 may have multiple non-exclusive cooperative sponsorships in the same League-sponsored activity with public schools provided that:
1) the Charter School does not have its own team in that activity.
Continued on Page 54
Continued from Page 53
2) the Charter School student(s) returns to the attendance area of the public school where the student(s) officially resides with his/her parent(s) or guardian(s).
3) the Charter schools, on behalf of the student(s) officially enrolled in the Charter School, comply with all of the eligibility
and financial requirements prescribed by the public school in the attendance area where the student(s) officially resides with his/her parent(s) or guardian(s).
4) The Boards of Education of the Public School(s) and the Charter School agree to cooperatively sponsor the activity and complete the required League cooperative sponsorship form(s).
F. Application Procedure:
1) Each member school participating in a cooperative sponsorship must register and pay as an individual school to participate in each cooperatively sponsored activity.
2) The governing boards of participating member schools must jointly make the application to the League Board of Directors.
a) The request must include a resolution adopted by each board of education stating the purpose for sponsoring a joint team or activity.
b) Each application for a cooperative sponsorship shall include a review and comments from the conference(s) of which the schools are members.
c) Deadline for Application: Requests for cooperative sponsorship must be submitted to the League not later than the first day of practice for that sport season to be considered for that sport season. Decisions for applications for cooperative sponsorship activities will be determined by the League at the next Board of Directors meeting.
3) Cooperative sponsorship agreements must be for a minimum of two years. Cooperative sponsorship agreements will be continuous following the first two-year agreement unless an application for dissolution is submitted as outlined in 403.5.
3. Home Schools and Charter Schools
Home schools and Charter schools joining the League and entering into cooperative sponsorship agreements after September 1 will be allowed a late registration provided they can show evidence from their local school administration that they had no knowledge of the League deadline dates, process, etc.
4. Identification of Cooperatively Sponsored Teams
The official school identification in tournament programs and press releases for cooperatively sponsored teams will be listed as indicated on the cooperative sponsorship resolutions submitted by the schools.
5. Transfers Between Schools with Cooperative Programs
When a student transfers from one school to another school that cooperatively sponsor a program or programs the student shall remain fully eligible in all programs that are cooperatively sponsored. Bylaw 111—Transfer and Residence, shall be used to determine the student’s eligibility for the programs that are not cooperatively sponsored
6. Reviewing, Amending, Dissolving a Cooperative Sponsorship:
A. Cooperative Sponsorship agreements must be reviewed by representatives from all schools involved every two years. Amendments to the cooperative sponsorship may not be unreasonably denied by the participating schools.
B. If either or any of the schools involved in the cooperative sponsorship wish to dissolve the agreement, they may do so provided a minimum of one year's notice is given to the other school(s) unless the schools involved mutually agree to discontinue the cooperative sponsorship agreement.
C. Requests to dissolve the cooperative sponsorship must be submitted to the League not later than the first day of practice for that sport season. Decisions on all applications will be determined by the League at the next Board of Directors meeting.
D. The dissolution request must include a resolution stating the purpose for dissolving the cooperative sponsorship.
E. The Board of Directors may establish a committee to review all requests.
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Here is an article summing up the current state of affairs:
http://www.woodburybulletin.com/article ... erty_id=20
http://www.woodburybulletin.com/article ... erty_id=20
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Sounds like it comes down to mshsl approval... As is the case with all co-ops... But I'd say this is a special request based on the non-exclusive or "double co-op" setup for a public class AA school...MNHockeyFan wrote:Here is an article summing up the current state of affairs:
http://www.woodburybulletin.com/article ... erty_id=20
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Former NSP assistant Stacy Anderson is the new head coach at Woodbury! Congrats to Stacy and the Woodbury program as she is outstanding and works with the fhit program ( http://www.fhitplayers.com/ )!ghshockeyfan wrote:When I see the numbers mention goalies it seems that this is where the Eastridge group may be lacking? Do they have any?
That aside, my understanding is that Eastridge isn't hiring a coach but there is an opening at Woodbury that either may already be filled or is in process.
Also - Woodbury is looking for an assistant coach:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Title: Assistant Girls Hockey Coach
School: Woodbury High School
Send Resumes to:
Stacy Anderson- Head Girls Hockey Coach
2665 Woodlane Drive
Woodbury, MN 55125-2922 For More Info:
Stacy Anderson
651-768-4420
stacy@fhitplayers.com
Deadline: June 15th or when filled Start: October 15th
Description: Help lead and direct a competitive high school program. Provide leadership and direction to team and players.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------[/url]
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EastRidge .....
Well, has anyone heard anything about the decision affecting girls' hockey at Woodbury, Park, and EastRidge highschools? .... It's already mid August, summer camps are finished, there is only about 3 months till the first game .... What could be holding up the answer? ..... Bureacracy, what an invention .....
Stupidity never takes a day off ....