Player vulgarity youth level

[pantherhockey2]

I realize (unfortunately) there is going to be some inappropriate language being displayed on and off the ice by players. Our District 10 A Bantam team played another District 10 team last night and 1 of there players received a retaliation penalty against 1 of our players and they both went to the penalty box. Obviously, the opponents team coach doesn't warrant retaliation penalties within his players and sat him for the rest of the period. Later in the 3rd period this same player apparently wasn't to happy with himself by missing a goal and thru out the F BOMB. We all heard it in the stands and the referee was standing right there and had a few words with this player. The player resumed his normal shifts within the game which convinces me this is an appropriate action that the coach agrees with. Is there a ruling on such behavior? The ref I believe warned him, but did not communicate this to the coach (unless he did after the game). If I were the coach I sure would not want that reputation as a team, considering the talent they have. Team Presentation should be the utmost priority because it affects the whole team not 1 player win or lose

[QuackerTracker]

Let me first say that on the ice it can be difficult with the speed of the game to identify a player using foul language. This is from the USA hockey rule book under the Zero Tolerance policy:

Players
A penalty (Zero Tolerance) shall be assessed whenever a player
(please refer to Rule 601 for appropriate penalty):

1. Openly disputes or argues any decision by an official.

2. Uses obscene or vulgar language at any time, including any
swearing, even if it is not directed at a particular person.

3. Visually demonstrates any sign of dissatisfaction with an
official’s decision.

Any time that a player persists in any of these actions, additional
penalties shall be assessed per the penalty progression established
under Rule 601.

The key word for assessing a penalty would be PERSISTS. So I would think a warning would be the first step if an official is able to identify the player.

Rule 601 Abuse of Officials and Other MIsconduct
(d) If any player is guilty of any one of the following, he shall be
assessed a misconduct penalty:

(1) Using obscene, profane or abusive language to any person
on the ice or anywhere in the rink before, during or after
the game.

Again it is open to interpretation by the official. Hope this helps answer your question.

[pantherhockey2]

Let me first say that on the ice it can be difficult with the speed of the game to identify a player using foul language. This is from the USA hockey rule book under the Zero Tolerance policy:

Players
A penalty (Zero Tolerance) shall be assessed whenever a player
(please refer to Rule 601 for appropriate penalty):

1. Openly disputes or argues any decision by an official.

2. Uses obscene or vulgar language at any time, including any
swearing, even if it is not directed at a particular person.

3. Visually demonstrates any sign of dissatisfaction with an
official’s decision.

Any time that a player persists in any of these actions, additional
penalties shall be assessed per the penalty progression established
under Rule 601.

The key word for assessing a penalty would be PERSISTS. So I would think a warning would be the first step if an official is able to identify the player.

Rule 601 Abuse of Officials and Other MIsconduct
(d) If any player is guilty of any one of the following, he shall be
assessed a misconduct penalty:

(1) Using obscene, profane or abusive language to any person
on the ice or anywhere in the rink before, during or after
the game.

Again it is open to interpretation by the official. Hope this helps answer your question.

Thanks QuackerTracker....If I am reading this correctly the player SHOULD have received a penalty based on the ZERO tolerance rule #2 and if the player persists they would have been assessed additional penalties

[inthestands]

Have any of you actually been down in the minor officials box or ice level area?

If the officials were to call penalties each time players were using profanity, there would be no players left on the ice.

Gets worse each season.. And worse yet at the high school level.

[loveitorleaveit]

I have a son in this program, but not on the team you are talking about. It is very common for the player you refer too - to drop the F-bomb all the time. I've heard it in the rink during practice. I've been told the coach doesn't allow this, but somethings missing here>....

The same player did the same thing last year. Coach last year couldn't handle it - Looks like the new coach can't handle it either. Its never the players fault, so don't blame the kid. Must be coaching.

[pantherhockey2]

Have any of you actually been down in the minor officials box or ice level area?

If the officials were to call penalties each time players were using profanity, there would be no players left on the ice.

Gets worse each season.. And worse yet at the high school level.

I have to agree with you, but most of the time in the minors official area they mutter to themselves not so where the fans can completely here what they were saying

[philip18]

So if the rule doesn't get enforced it will get better? Many years ago the then Mayor of NY proved that if you enforce all the laws crime will go down.

[play4fun]

Have any of you actually been down in the minor officials box or ice level area?

If the officials were to call penalties each time players were using profanity, there would be no players left on the ice.

Gets worse each season.. And worse yet at the high school level.

Enforcement = change in behavior. Seat belt use has gone up with increased enforcement.

Why not enforce a rule that's already on the books? It must be there for a reason. Or, is this just another sign of decline in the number of adults who are able to set appropriate expectations for our youth? I'd like the refs out there to provide their take. Is it just not worth the trouble?

For the coaches, if you don't tolerate fighting (wink, wink), why should this be any different. You set the tone?

And, isn't it ironic that another thread is about whether or not elementary aged kids should wear shirts and ties to games. Something about respect for the game... others... themselves...

A safe weekend to all the hunters out there. Good luck.

[pantherhockey2]

I have a son in this program, but not on the team you are talking about. It is very common for the player you refer too - to drop the F-bomb all the time. I've heard it in the rink during practice. I've been told the coach doesn't allow this, but somethings missing here>....

The same player did the same thing last year. Coach last year couldn't handle it - Looks like the new coach can't handle it either. Its never the players fault, so don't blame the kid. Must be coaching.

No, I say it's parenting. I guess next time we play them just aggravate the heck out of him creating power plays for us.

[inthestands]

Have any of you actually been down in the minor officials box or ice level area?

If the officials were to call penalties each time players were using profanity, there would be no players left on the ice.

Gets worse each season.. And worse yet at the high school level.

Enforcement = change in behavior. Seat belt use has gone up with increased enforcement.

Why not enforce a rule that's already on the books? It must be there for a reason. Or, is this just another sign of decline in the number of adults who are able to set appropriate expectations for our youth? I'd like the refs out there to provide their take. Is it just not worth the trouble?

For the coaches, if you don't tolerate fighting (wink, wink), why should this be any different. You set the tone?

And, isn't it ironic that another thread is about whether or not elementary aged kids should wear shirts and ties to games. Something about respect for the game... others... themselves...

A safe weekend to all the hunters out there. Good luck.

I tend to agree with your line of thinking, but as I've been ridiculed in the past for saying -- It starts at home. If the kids get away with it outside the arena, no coach, ref or zamboni driver will have much of an impact.

Although the rule is in the book, and most all officials tend to call them as they see "hear" them, its pretty difficult to get everyone in the box that swears.

[loveitorleaveit]

Have any of you actually been down in the minor officials box or ice level area?

If the officials were to call penalties each time players were using profanity, there would be no players left on the ice.

Gets worse each season.. And worse yet at the high school level.

Enforcement = change in behavior. Seat belt use has gone up with increased enforcement.

Why not enforce a rule that's already on the books? It must be there for a reason. Or, is this just another sign of decline in the number of adults who are able to set appropriate expectations for our youth? I'd like the refs out there to provide their take. Is it just not worth the trouble?

For the coaches, if you don't tolerate fighting (wink, wink), why should this be any different. You set the tone?

And, isn't it ironic that another thread is about whether or not elementary aged kids should wear shirts and ties to games. Something about respect for the game... others... themselves...

A safe weekend to all the hunters out there. Good luck.

In all due respect:

I don't put a seatbelt on because I could get a ticket. I don't drink and drive because I don't want a DUI.

I put a seatbelt on because it COULD save my life. I don't drink and drive because it COULD save my life or someone else.

I don't think enforcement = change in behavior - I think change in behavior = change in behavior.

[loveitorleaveit]

I tend to agree with your line of thinking, but as I've been ridiculed in the past for saying -- It starts at home. If the kids get away with it outside the arena, no coach, ref or zamboni driver will have much of an impact.

Although the rule is in the book, and most all officials tend to call them as they see "hear" them, its pretty difficult to get everyone in the box that swears.


I also agree - and having been around the parents of this player in question - it must be OK - or they would have done something about it by now.

[forecheckbcpc]

Loveitorleaveit. Man, you got way too much time on your hands and the Mommy from D10 all hot and bothered about little johnny with the potty mouth, get a clue! Profanity has been part of sports from the beginning of sports and has no real outcome on the skill level or outcome of a competitive game. A coach is to blame for a kid who swears, NO, the 15 years of life and his personal environment YES. You said the kid sat a period for his actions and then did it again? Chances are the kid will pay again and will have to obstain or pay. Point being, there are more important things to get all hot and bothered about. For example, since you two are so Holy, chances are you kids will be in the Priesthood in a couple of years. You two better start teaching your kids what the meaning of "Father Nelson" really means.

[elliott70]

I have been in the box from squirt to college games.
Swearing is not tolerated.
As the off-ice official, you put a top to it.

You don't have to be prud but if it is out of hand, directed at the ref, other team etc....
Tell the player to shut up, tell the ref and let him sit longer....
But use your head...

Sometimes a kid will come in and say I really f...ed that up....
well, that's just being in the game
He comes in banging his stick and says I am going to get that f...er when I get back out there....
then tell him to sit down and shut-up.
If he won't; take the appropriate action.

[greybeard58]

Many years ago when I did officiate, I had a standard that if a player got frustrated and swore and only I could hear it,I would tell him to watch the language. If they swore loud enough for others to hear,they got the penalty. I didn't follow the rule to the letter but I felt I followed the intent.

[HomerPigmeyer]

The part I don't like is when the game is over, they line up to shake hands and the winning team skates through and says, "Nice game, F*g." Recently scrimmaged Lakeville South, they thumped us pretty good and that's what my kid came off the ice with...

[inthestands]

The part I don't like is when the game is over, they line up to shake hands and the winning team skates through and says, "Nice game, F*g." Recently scrimmaged Lakeville South, they thumped us pretty good and that's what my kid came off the ice with...

Once more, this is the kind of thing that has to dealt with at the rink but more importantly away from the rink.

If the kids don't learn it from little on, it's tuff to teach them through penalties and sitting on the bench. Those things help, but don't get the full impact needed for change.

[CoachJ]

Loveitorleaveit. Man, you got way too much time on your hands and the Mommy from D10 all hot and bothered about little johnny with the potty mouth, get a clue! Profanity has been part of sports from the beginning of sports and has no real outcome on the skill level or outcome of a competitive game. A coach is to blame for a kid who swears, NO, the 15 years of life and his personal environment YES. You said the kid sat a period for his actions and then did it again? Chances are the kid will pay again and will have to obstain or pay. Point being, there are more important things to get all hot and bothered about. For example, since you two are so Holy, chances are you kids will be in the Priesthood in a couple of years. You two better start teaching your kids what the meaning of "Father Nelson" really means.

Teams take on personality of the coach. If Coach is swearing at refs then players will follow. So yes coach can take some of the blame, if I keep playing a kid that continues to swear on the ice. I would be telling the young man that this is ok.

Don't Drink, Smoke or Swear in front of children and I think you are doing a great job as a coach. I don't care what your record is. We all are role models.

Forecheck you are right the outcome on the ice isn't the issue. Maybe this child is missing a father or mother and looks to you as someone to lead them. Do kids even get grounded anymore? I have never heard I can't hang out this weekend. Why? Grounded

[QuackerTracker]

Have any of you actually been down in the minor officials box or ice level area?

If the officials were to call penalties each time players were using profanity, there would be no players left on the ice.

Gets worse each season.. And worse yet at the high school level.

Enforcement = change in behavior. Seat belt use has gone up with increased enforcement.

Why not enforce a rule that's already on the books? It must be there for a reason. Or, is this just another sign of decline in the number of adults who are able to set appropriate expectations for our youth? I'd like the refs out there to provide their take. Is it just not worth the trouble?

For the coaches, if you don't tolerate fighting (wink, wink), why should this be any different. You set the tone?

And, isn't it ironic that another thread is about whether or not elementary aged kids should wear shirts and ties to games. Something about respect for the game... others... themselves...

A safe weekend to all the hunters out there. Good luck.

Isn't that why everyone hates D6 refs, enforcement? People complain about mouthgaurd rules being called to the letter of the law and then they want other things enforced. You do have to make up your mind people.

[mghockey18]

Wait until High Schol and Junior hockey..

[defense]

I realize (unfortunately) there is going to be some inappropriate language being displayed on and off the ice by players. Our District 10 A Bantam team played another District 10 team last night and 1 of there players received a retaliation penalty against 1 of our players and they both went to the penalty box. Obviously, the opponents team coach doesn't warrant retaliation penalties within his players and sat him for the rest of the period. Later in the 3rd period this same player apparently wasn't to happy with himself by missing a goal and thru out the F BOMB. We all heard it in the stands and the referee was standing right there and had a few words with this player. The player resumed his normal shifts within the game which convinces me this is an appropriate action that the coach agrees with. Is there a ruling on such behavior? The ref I believe warned him, but did not communicate this to the coach (unless he did after the game). If I were the coach I sure would not want that reputation as a team, considering the talent they have. Team Presentation should be the utmost priority because it affects the whole team not 1 player win or lose

Honestly, boys will be boys, and boys swear sometime. I am not saying that all of the boys should be cussing and swearing, but give it a rest. This is hockey, not gymnastics. If it is a huge problem, the boy will likely regret it at some point......

[QuackerTracker]

I realize (unfortunately) there is going to be some inappropriate language being displayed on and off the ice by players. Our District 10 A Bantam team played another District 10 team last night and 1 of there players received a retaliation penalty against 1 of our players and they both went to the penalty box. Obviously, the opponents team coach doesn't warrant retaliation penalties within his players and sat him for the rest of the period. Later in the 3rd period this same player apparently wasn't to happy with himself by missing a goal and thru out the F BOMB. We all heard it in the stands and the referee was standing right there and had a few words with this player. The player resumed his normal shifts within the game which convinces me this is an appropriate action that the coach agrees with. Is there a ruling on such behavior? The ref I believe warned him, but did not communicate this to the coach (unless he did after the game). If I were the coach I sure would not want that reputation as a team, considering the talent they have. Team Presentation should be the utmost priority because it affects the whole team not 1 player win or lose

Honestly, boys will be boys, and boys swear sometime. I am not saying that all of the boys should be cussing and swearing, but give it a rest. This is hockey, not gymnastics. If it is a huge problem, the boy will likely regret it at some point......

If you think the boys dropping an F-bomb is bad you should hear what high level (college and pro) women say to eachother on the ice. It's enought to make a grown man cry (from laughing) sometimes.

[blueliner5]

I realize (unfortunately) there is going to be some inappropriate language being displayed on and off the ice by players. Our District 10 A Bantam team played another District 10 team last night and 1 of there players received a retaliation penalty against 1 of our players and they both went to the penalty box. Obviously, the opponents team coach doesn't warrant retaliation penalties within his players and sat him for the rest of the period. Later in the 3rd period this same player apparently wasn't to happy with himself by missing a goal and thru out the F BOMB. We all heard it in the stands and the referee was standing right there and had a few words with this player. The player resumed his normal shifts within the game which convinces me this is an appropriate action that the coach agrees with. Is there a ruling on such behavior? The ref I believe warned him, but did not communicate this to the coach (unless he did after the game). If I were the coach I sure would not want that reputation as a team, considering the talent they have. Team Presentation should be the utmost priority because it affects the whole team not 1 player win or lose

Honestly, boys will be boys, and boys swear sometime. I am not saying that all of the boys should be cussing and swearing, but give it a rest. This is hockey, not gymnastics. If it is a huge problem, the boy will likely regret it at some point......

If you think the boys dropping an F-bomb is bad you should hear what high level (college and pro) women say to eachother on the ice. It's enought to make a grown man cry (from laughing) sometimes.

Quackertracker, I think most of us know that this type of behavior is happening within the higher level, but back on the topic this is relating to the youth program to where the obscenities are being heard in the stands during a youth game. Just from reading the previous posts it sounds like this has been going on from years past with this known player. If, the coaches keep ignoring the issue and there are no consequences why wouldn't it continue, but until then kids at this age will keep pushing the buttons so to speak.

[Faceguard79]

Listen to the coaches, that's where it starts in my experience.

[Faceguard79]

Listen to the coaches, that's where it starts in my experience. If the coach is foul mouthed, the players pick it up.

You would be shocked to hear some of these coaches, even at the PeeWee level.