So. St. Paul Concerns

ssppuck · Post by **ssppuck** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 9:59 pm

1st time poster, long time reader. I have been to alot of Packer games this year and being a former player I have some concerns about what I see going on in this program.
I know they are young but they have alot of talent. But the talent is hurting the team by taking stupid, stupid penalties. That is an issue that has to be fixed from the coaching staff. I remember when I used to play. Even if you were the best player and you did things that were controllable that has hurt the team you would sit. Not the entire game but a few shifts . I have not seen any of these kids sitting. I know if they sit these starters it will hurt the team. But nip it in the butt now so it does not continue into there future years.
Question to you as readers, Am I expecting to much these days of kids not respecting coaches who don't discipline there players for getting out of control? Have you seen players in other schools getting benched? I need to see the Pack Back, even if it is class A

rashreid20 · Post by **rashreid20** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 10:21 pm

ssppuck wrote:1st time poster, long time reader. I have been to alot of Packer games this year and being a former player I have some concerns about what I see going on in this program.
I know they are young but they have alot of talent. But the talent is hurting the team by taking stupid, stupid penalties. That is an issue that has to be fixed from the coaching staff. I remember when I used to play. Even if you were the best player and you did things that were controllable that has hurt the team you would sit. Not the entire game but a few shifts . I have not seen any of these kids sitting. I know if they sit these starters it will hurt the team. But nip it in the butt now so it does not continue into there future years.
Question to you as readers, Am I expecting to much these days of kids not respecting coaches who don't discipline there players for getting out of control? Have you seen players in other schools getting benched? I need to see the Pack Back, even if it is class A

Both of the kids that you are alluding to have been idiots since they were small. Leopards don't change their spots. I have yet to see a coach, association or AAA, be able to control these kids.

I agree. If the play is dirty, ugly, or embarrassing (like 12 minutes in unsportsmanlike conduct penalties! or a 5 minute major for injuring a kid cross checking him) the coach just needs to accept losing but doing the right thing....giving them JV time or excusing them from the team if they can't mend their ways.

Too many high school coaches are allowing their prima donnas too much ice time, which just increases the magnitude and brazenness of their conduct.

puckhouse27 · Post by **puckhouse27** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 11:48 pm

ssppuck, The Penalties where the kids say things to the ref definately need to stop period. as they say your not going to win a pissing match with a skunk and nothing you say is going to make them change there mind shut your mouth and go to the bench and serve your time end of story.Also the kids that the coaches thought have taken questionable penalties have been benched for a few shifts if you were watching you would have noticed that. But that being said it seems like the coaches hold certain players to higher standards then others. Bottom line coaches need to let everyone know what is and isnt exceptable and what the punishment will be and hold everyone to that not just a select few players. Rashreid20, good thing we are talking about people and not jungle cats right? people always have the ablilty to change or learn from things or where would the world be today? I dont think its right for players to talk back to refs at all never helps your cause but the 5 minute penalty for cross checking? the kid was going hard to the net like he should crashing the net and the defenseman pushed him trying to protect the front of the net and the goalie definately not intent to injure at all both kids just playing hard. also The players you are talking about im sure i know them are the players that play the majority of the minutes for ssp and are all very competitive players and talented players and when you play a team like st. thomas who is full of kids that are very talented it prolly get really frustrating and hard to compete when your out there the whole game and st. thomas has 3 great lines who could all be first lines pretty much on every team. Hope you guys have a good one take care.

ssppuck · Post by **ssppuck** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:48 am

The way I seen the St. Thomas game is that we got out classed. St. Thomas was just out doing there business and getting the job done, while ssp was doing all the extracurricular stuff during and after the play. They are talented but they need to stop the slash b/c they are frustrated the hook b/c they got beat or the jaring after the whistle. Just Play hockey. We have alot of pride in ssp . Younger kids look at these kids as role models, so stop being babies and play the game like we did in the 80's. I see why Private schools are so appealing, kids have more respect for the game and the Coaches. I think it has to be change from the top, fix and fix it now! You may lose Future players. I am a frustrated fan..

puckhouse27 · Post by **puckhouse27** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 9:13 am

ssppuck, lets be honest here ssp will never be what they were in the 80's so be realistic. The youth hockey numbers are down and thats where the highschool team feeds from. I wouldnt say that ssp was outclassed more like very outmatched because of the depth st.thomas has from top to bottom a much more talented team obviously ssp has 5 or 6 nice players who can compete with st.thomas but thats just one line and st.thomas has 4 very good lines which creates alot of miss matches. Yes private schools are very appealing you have a good education, good coaching, and you get to play with a bunch of good players whats not to like.

Pioneerprideguy · Post by **Pioneerprideguy** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 9:15 am

Is Wilcox planning on coming back next year?

puckhouse27 · Post by **puckhouse27** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 9:23 am

Adam wilcox is very loyal to ssp but even with that being said i think he needs to play in greeen bay next season so he will get pushed everyday in practice and play alot more games then in high school so he is ready to play at the U when they need him.

ssppuck · Post by **ssppuck** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:35 pm

Rumor has it he is still undecided. It may depend on wht Kangas does. Lets hope he stays. With only 4 forwards leaving and all defensmen coming back. Who knows. I also heard that there are a couple 8th graders that could contribute as freshman next year. The Pack is Back

Pioneerprideguy wrote:Is Wilcox planning on coming back next year?

thiscrazygame · Post by **thiscrazygame** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 7:20 pm

How did Wilcox play against STA?

puckhouse27 · Post by **puckhouse27** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 7:42 pm

wilcox played solid. alot of st.thomas goals were on i power play i believe 3 and there power play is one of the best ive seen so far this season very good puck movement got alot of screens infront of him where it seemed like he didnt see a few shots that went in. I heard the river heights bantam team is having a nice season but from watching them i really dont think anyone from that team steps in and makes an impact for atleast there sophmore seasons, ive also heard the most talented player on that team will be going to hill? so we will see if the pack will be back or not either way they will have some nice d coming back for a couple years and a few solid forwards but its hard to win with only one line. if wilcoxs leaves there in trouble.

DubCHAGuy · Post by **DubCHAGuy** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 9:32 pm

ssppuck wrote:Rumor has it he is still undecided. It may depend on wht Kangas does. Lets hope he stays. With only 4 forwards leaving and all defensmen coming back. Who knows. I also heard that there are a couple 8th graders that could contribute as freshman next year. The Pack is Back

Pioneerprideguy wrote:Is Wilcox planning on coming back next year?

Kangas is a senior next year. If he leaves after this year, Wilcox wont be his replacement. I'd assume The Don would prefer he plays somewhere other than HS next year if he's coming in for 2011-2012 season, which I believe is the plan.

HappyHockeyFan · Post by **HappyHockeyFan** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 1:23 am

Like I have said in other threads related to SSP hockey, the coaching is poor. Has been since the day he took over...nuff said

thiscrazygame · Post by **thiscrazygame** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 2:49 pm

DubCHAGuy wrote:
ssppuck wrote:Rumor has it he is still undecided. It may depend on wht Kangas does. Lets hope he stays. With only 4 forwards leaving and all defensmen coming back. Who knows. I also heard that there are a couple 8th graders that could contribute as freshman next year. The Pack is Back

Pioneerprideguy wrote:Is Wilcox planning on coming back next year?
Kangas is a senior next year. If he leaves after this year, Wilcox wont be his replacement. I'd assume The Don would prefer he plays somewhere other than HS next year if he's coming in for 2011-2012 season, which I believe is the plan.

There was a quote from Lucia in the tribune on Friday that said they had an out state goalie coming in over the weekend. Obviously doesn't mean this goalie would be coming here but, looks like they are looking for another goalie.

packerpuck19 · Post by **packerpuck19** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 3:01 pm

As far as Wilcox's future. I would be very surprised to see him come back next year. The only reason I think he ever would is for the opportunity to play football for one more year. Seeing as though Al Stalock (Wilcox's cousin) surpassed his senior year to go to juniors, the family is looking at that decision and seeing that it worked out pretty well for Al, so I would definitely say if his focus is 100% hockey that he will not be back next year.

As far as all the concerns of SSP hockey, it seems to me that there are alot of different factors that go into it. For one thing the Pack have been struck with injuries this year. I dont believe they have had a full roster since there first game of the season. Secondly, they take FAR too many penalties. I mean when I watch these guys play 5 on 5 they are a strong team that works hard and can sustain a solid forecheck. The trouble is that they keep killing themselves with penalties that seem to come at the worst times of the game, if not all game long. With that said, they will give away all momentum built every time a maroon and white jersey goes to the penalty box, and that can really turn the tide of a hockey game. it seems to happen every game, time after time.

All of this said, as far as the coaching goes, I think that the style and abilities of the coaching staff are very average and run of the mill. I believe that they try very hard, and give those kids everything they have, but everything that is done is very standard, and by the book it seems. With that said, there are probably 85% of the coaches in the state of MN that run there teams the exact same way. When they are granted with a group of highly talented kids, they might go really far, but if its not there, it seems that they are not going to ever pull any kind of rabbit out of there hats, and overachieve. It takes a dynamic coach to really take kids to the next level. I believe that SSP has been blessed with a few of them (Doug Woog, and Russ Welch come to mind). Ken Pauly was supposed to come to SSP, and ended up in Minnetonka instead, and is currently with Benilde. Looks like he made the right choice. By no means am I saying that SSP is a poor place to headman a program, but you are probably not going to get a real dynamic coach around SSP. Just a sign of the times I guess.

As far as the "problem kids" that have been talked about in this subject, I believe that they are going to be who they are until they receive a different coaching staff. (College, or Juniors) I believe that your mentality, and boundaries as a coach have to be established right away, and if this is not done kids form there own boundary that is very tough to change later in the game.

observer · Post by **observer** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 3:42 pm

The goal has to be zero penalties. You cannot beat a better team shorthanded.

ssppuck · Post by **ssppuck** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 8:43 pm

With that being said, when should a program find a different coach. SSP coach I believe has been around 13 years. Is that long enough? I have not looked up his win%. But do you think it is time.

HappyHockeyFan wrote:Like I have said in other threads related to SSP hockey, the coaching is poor. Has been since the day he took over...nuff said

youngblood08 · Post by **youngblood08** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:05 pm

Couple of funny thing I have read on here.

First off if you weren't getting kids from IGH to come over SSP would have dried up years ago. Got sick of losing at the bantam level , oh lets just join with IGH we both suck and have no numbers. Your community is old and the people moving in don't play hockey!

Second funny how one guy praises the coaching of Welch, meanwhile Hastings is calling for him to be run out of town?? Niether town can read the writing on the wall if you ask me.

puckhouse27 · Post by **puckhouse27** » Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:52 pm

The south st. paul coaches are all great guys, but average coaches at best if you ever watch the bench during the game it is very rare that you will ever see the coaching staff talk to a player after it is obvious he had a bad turnover, penalty etc.. how is a kid suppose to grow as a player learn from his mistakes if he is never held accountable for them? The coaches seem like they show up sit on the bench with there arms crossed and never say a word to the players, SHOW SOME EMOTION help the kids learn! I know for a fact South St. Paul has some top end players that play the majority of the mintues for them so by the middle of the 2nd period through the 3rd period is where you are seeing alot of penalties being taken because these players seem to be wearing down near the end. DEPTH is what is killing the packers they always rely on 5 to 6 players its been that way for the past few years you need to develope players through skill based practices to improve the players overall skill set not just do you run of the mill practice. I am will to bet if a coach incorporates drills that focus on individual skills they will also see players that can make more plays and work better as a team.

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So. St. Paul Concerns

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