Is Breck the best team in the state?

warriors41 · Post by **warriors41** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:32 pm

muckandgrind wrote:
moose27 wrote:
royals dad wrote: I think more make it on opportunity than ability.
Wealth inhances athletic opportunity? Of course it does if you want to do camps, private school and AAA stuff. Money goes a long way but the bottom line is you still have to be good enough to get to the next level. If you are good enough people will find you regardless of your wealth status!! A hockey player can be created out of your garage and the outdoor rink right down the street!! For some reason a lot of people have forgotten this!!
Yes, but access to superior training and coaching can help a pretty good player turn into a really good player.

Exactly Muck, growing up in Warroad I didn't know anyone who had free or reduced lunches on the hockey team. I know of some of those kids who played basketball and football but not hockey. In fact, the best athlete in our class was on free lunches, but couldn't afford to play hockey. Not with all the cost of equipment, travel, camps, and everything else. What I'm trying to say is that there aren't many poor kids who play hockey hockey, there are middle class but not people who struggle day to day a whole lot. Let's not forget that hockey is looked at as kind of a rich kid sport. Hard work goes a long way, not doubting that, but you need cash to get started.

dump and chase · Post by **dump and chase** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:04 pm

Back to the topic at hand... NO Breck is not the best team in the state..

I really wish we could have a class A champ VS the class AA champ matchup the following week of the tourney so we could finally settle this little dispute! Unfortunetly i dont see that happening anytime soon..

wblhockeyfan8 · Post by **wblhockeyfan8** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:43 pm

Holy crap guys, I posted that as I remembered seeing it when the "regardless of class" was last posted.

Those rankings were not relative to the end of the season in any way, and you'll recall Minnetonka being ranked 1st for the entire year and going into the tourney.

Edynasty, it's quite arrogant of you to write off Breck as not being able to compete with Edina or Tonka. I recall Hermantown nearly taking down EP earlier this year.
Also, how does STA not making it out of sections AT ALL justify #5 being a ludicruous ranking? Obviously it's high, but can you really say that?

I suppose EP, Wayzata and Jefferson were ranked too high then...

mulefarm · Post by **mulefarm** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 5:57 pm

wblhockeyfan8 wrote:Holy crap guys, I posted that as I remembered seeing it when the "regardless of class" was last posted.

Those rankings were not relative to the end of the season in any way, and you'll recall Minnetonka being ranked 1st for the entire year and going into the tourney.

Edynasty, it's quite arrogant of you to write off Breck as not being able to compete with Edina or Tonka. I recall Hermantown nearly taking down EP earlier this year.
Also, how does STA not making it out of sections AT ALL justify #5 being a ludicruous ranking? Obviously it's high, but can you really say that?

I suppose EP, Wayzata and Jefferson were ranked too high then...

At the end of the season Cloquet beat Hermantown. Cloquet was 8-15-2.
The EP/HT game was outdoors for Mn hockey day. Breck would have a tough time with the schedule of Tonka, Edina or Wayzata.

slapshot445 · Post by **slapshot445** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 6:40 pm

[quote="Goldy23"][quote="slapshot445"][quote="saucepass"]I think they may be better teams...but they don't have the team speed to keep up with them.

You can coach the teams to do what Hermantown did to slow them down. But if you play breck straight up, they have too much speed.

I believe that the top 6 teams in the state can beat each other on any given night.[/quote]

too bad breck isn't in the top 6, not even top 10.[/quote]

slapdick, your showing your ignorance again. Your hatred of private schools, is clouding your judgement. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the rest of the private haters will agree that even if Breck isn't the best team in the State, they certainly are a top ten team!

Now get back to watching Jersey Shore![/quote]

so now i hate private schools because I dont think Breck is the best team in state?

You're pathetic

sickflow22 · Post by **sickflow22** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:00 pm

wblhockeyfan8 wrote:
sickflow22 wrote:
moose27 wrote:
Go work on your hair buddy!! The Final Four teams in the A tournament were as a good as the final four in the AA tournament.
ya right not even close..Hill murrays, edinas, AV's, and Minnetonka 4th line JV players would dominate class A if they made up a team
You are a disgrace to humans...

Class A is a disgrace to all living things

warriors41 · Post by **warriors41** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:09 pm

sickflow22 wrote:
wblhockeyfan8 wrote:
sickflow22 wrote: ya right not even close..Hill murrays, edinas, AV's, and Minnetonka 4th line JV players would dominate class A if they made up a team
You are a disgrace to humans...
Class A is a disgrace to all living things

You're right. Players like T.J. Oshie, Adam Krause, Blake Wheeler, Brock Nelson, wouldn't even make the jv teams of top end AA schools. That makes perfect sense to me. Yup. In 2005 #1 ranked, class A Warroad tied #1 ranked class AA Moorhead but they still suck. They should be ashamed of themselves. Let go of your ignorance and use some logic

sickflow22 · Post by **sickflow22** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:13 pm

warriors41 wrote:
sickflow22 wrote:
wblhockeyfan8 wrote: You are a disgrace to humans...
Class A is a disgrace to all living things
were talking about 4th line JVers beating class A teams.. Not T.J Oshie being from a class A school... A school can still suck having a good player, one player doesn't make up for a sh***y team

You're right. Players like T.J. Oshie, Adam Krause, Blake Wheeler, Brock Nelson, wouldn't even make the jv teams of top end AA schools. That makes perfect sense to me. Yup. In 2005 #1 ranked, class A Warroad tied #1 ranked class AA Moorhead but they still suck. They should be ashamed of themselves. Let go of your ignorance and use some logic

warriors41 · Post by **warriors41** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:20 pm

sickflow22 wrote:
warriors41 wrote:
sickflow22 wrote: Class A is a disgrace to all living things
were talking about 4th line JVers beating class A teams.. Not T.J Oshie being from a class A school... A school can still suck having a good player, one player doesn't make up for a sh***y team

You're right. Players like T.J. Oshie, Adam Krause, Blake Wheeler, Brock Nelson, wouldn't even make the jv teams of top end AA schools. That makes perfect sense to me. Yup. In 2005 #1 ranked, class A Warroad tied #1 ranked class AA Moorhead but they still suck. They should be ashamed of themselves. Let go of your ignorance and use some logic

Ok, but if #1 Moorhead couldn't beat Warroad and could only muster a tie, what makes you think that the jv team of Hill Murray could beat any top Class A school. Hill Murray almost lost to Moorhead this year and Warroad spanked that same team. You're an absolute idiot.

sickflow22 · Post by **sickflow22** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:24 pm

warriors41 wrote:
sickflow22 wrote:
warriors41 wrote: were talking about 4th line JVers beating class A teams.. Not T.J Oshie being from a class A school... A school can still suck having a good player, one player doesn't make up for a sh***y team

You're right. Players like T.J. Oshie, Adam Krause, Blake Wheeler, Brock Nelson, wouldn't even make the jv teams of top end AA schools. That makes perfect sense to me. Yup. In 2005 #1 ranked, class A Warroad tied #1 ranked class AA Moorhead but they still suck. They should be ashamed of themselves. Let go of your ignorance and use some logic
Ok, but if #1 Moorhead couldn't beat Warroad and could only muster a tie, what makes you think that the jv team of Hill Murray could beat any top Class A school. Hill Murray almost lost to Moorhead this year and Warroad spanked that same team. You're an absolute idiot.

Stop degrading me. im not an idiot ok. im rattled.......not. your probably a terrible player who has to sit on here and talk smart to make yourself feel better........ class A=j.v tourney

mn miracle man · Post by **mn miracle man** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:43 pm

Well sickflow22, judging by your comments about your loyalty to 206/216, it sounds as though you are the terrible player who either a) lost to a "jv" team playing in the A state tournament b) play on a terrible AA team where your only justification for losing all the time is "at least were not A" c) or are now done with your season, jr gold has been done for a while havent they? yet go to the tourney to "chirp" the kids playing at the highest stage of the high school hockey scene

sickflow22 · Post by **sickflow22** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:01 pm

mn miracle man wrote:Well sickflow22, judging by your comments about your loyalty to 206/216, it sounds as though you are the terrible player who either a) lost to a "jv" team playing in the A state tournament b) play on a terrible AA team where your only justification for losing all the time is "at least were not A" c) or are now done with your season, jr gold has been done for a while havent they? yet go to the tourney to "chirp" the kids playing at the highest stage of the high school hockey scene

you got me

wblhockeyfan8 · Post by **wblhockeyfan8** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:23 pm

mulefarm wrote:
wblhockeyfan8 wrote:Holy crap guys, I posted that as I remembered seeing it when the "regardless of class" was last posted.

Those rankings were not relative to the end of the season in any way, and you'll recall Minnetonka being ranked 1st for the entire year and going into the tourney.

Edynasty, it's quite arrogant of you to write off Breck as not being able to compete with Edina or Tonka. I recall Hermantown nearly taking down EP earlier this year.
Also, how does STA not making it out of sections AT ALL justify #5 being a ludicruous ranking? Obviously it's high, but can you really say that?

I suppose EP, Wayzata and Jefferson were ranked too high then...
At the end of the season Cloquet beat Hermantown. Cloquet was 8-15-2.
The EP/HT game was outdoors for Mn hockey day. Breck would have a tough time with the schedule of Tonka, Edina or Wayzata.

Cloquet's coaching staff puts together really tough teams near the end of the season. They nearly beat Duluth East and Andover.

As for Sickflow it's obvious that once he has no further insults to dish out to class A teams, he resorts to 3 word sentences.

slapshot445 · Post by **slapshot445** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:47 pm

some teams just have other teams' number, it happens. you're only sharing one example, how about someone posts the scores of every game that has been played between the current number ones in class a or class aa. my guess is you'll an overwhelming advantage for aa. class a is decent hockey, but it's just not what aa is. anyone with half a brain knows that. just look at the attendances at the state tourney

warriors41 · Post by **warriors41** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:58 pm

slapshot445 wrote:some teams just have other teams' number, it happens. you're only sharing one example, how about someone posts the scores of every game that has been played between the current number ones in class a or class aa. my guess is you'll an overwhelming advantage for aa. class a is decent hockey, but it's just not what aa is. anyone with half a brain knows that. just look at the attendances at the state tourney

I completely agree with you that most of the years the top AA team will be better the top A team. However, I don't think its because the top end talent in AA is better. I believe that AA teams are usually just deeper. By that I mean they have the ability to roll at least three lines effectively. If a class A team is able to roll 3 lines, they have a good shot at going to state and can make a deep run. But to say that a team of fourth line players from a AA schools jv team could easily beat any class A team is a foolish statement.

Also, I have my own theories as to why the AA tourny has more attendance. Here's a hypothetical. Let's say Warroad plays Hermantown. If both towns complete population shows up there would be about 10,000 people in the stands. Obviously that would never happen. Most schools that play class A are from the outstate and have to travel further than most of the AA schools. Plus the schedule of the games is meant to get more people to watch the AA games. Teams that play AA typically have more people in their towns and schools so they have more supporters to come and cheer them on. also can't deny that the AA tournament is perceived to be better so more people go to it. I just debate that last reason.

Goldy Gopher · Post by **Goldy Gopher** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:03 pm

sickflow22 wrote:
warriors41 wrote:
sickflow22 wrote:
Ok, but if #1 Moorhead couldn't beat Warroad and could only muster a tie, what makes you think that the jv team of Hill Murray could beat any top Class A school. Hill Murray almost lost to Moorhead this year and Warroad spanked that same team. You're an absolute idiot.
Stop degrading me. im not an idiot ok. im rattled.......not. your probably a terrible player who has to sit on here and talk smart to make yourself feel better........ class A=j.v tourney

You had all of us fooled.

Blackberry · Post by **Blackberry** » Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:22 pm

Edynasty........you're top 10 is a joke. I'm glad you brought up Totino-Grace football up, because that is very comparable to a program like STA hockey. A smaller tier school, but CONSISTENTLY one of the top 5 programs in the state.

Someone forgot to tell players like Matt Niskanen, Blake Wheeler, TJ Oshie and Jordan Schroeder that the SINGLE A state tourney is JV. I'm sure they would be interested by that.

BodyShots · Post by **BodyShots** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 9:08 am

Major League - Minor League
NFL - USFL
Class AAAAA - Class AAAA - Class AAA - Class AA - Class A
Tier I - Tier II
Class AA - Class A
Varsity - JV

Get over it people, there are differences.

Goldy Gopher · Post by **Goldy Gopher** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:51 am

BodyShots wrote:Major League - Minor League
NFL - USFL
Class AAAAA - Class AAAA - Class AAA - Class AA - Class A
Tier I - Tier II
Class AA - Class A
Varsity - JV

Get over it people, there are differences.

I think you're onto something here. I remember reading about those class A kids that got called up to their AA affiliate.

moose27 · Post by **moose27** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:00 am

[quote="BodyShots"]Major League - Minor League
NFL - USFL
Class AAAAA - Class AAAA - Class AAA - Class AA - Class A
Tier I - Tier II
Class AA - Class A
Varsity - JV

Get over it people, there are differences. :roll:[/quote]

Thanks for pointing out the obvious!! The depth in AA is obviously deeper than A. However, I will say it again that the final four in A were as every bit as good as the final four in AA. Hermantown, Breck, Warroad, and Mahtomedi can compete and beat anyone in the state on any given night. If you don't think this is true you obviously didn't watch any of the A tournament this year!!

muckandgrind · Post by **muckandgrind** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:23 am

moose27 wrote:
BodyShots wrote:Major League - Minor League
NFL - USFL
Class AAAAA - Class AAAA - Class AAA - Class AA - Class A
Tier I - Tier II
Class AA - Class A
Varsity - JV

Get over it people, there are differences.

Thanks for pointing out the obvious!! The depth in AA is obviously deeper than A. However, I will say it again that the final four in A were as every bit as good as the final four in AA. Hermantown, Breck, Warroad, and Mahtomedi can compete and beat anyone in the state on any given night. If you don't think this is true you obviously didn't watch any of the A tournament this year!!

If Hermantown, Breck or Warroad each play Edina, Minnetonka, and Hill-Murray 10 times. The AA schools win 7-8 of those games, at a minimum.

starmvp · Post by **starmvp** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:25 am

muckandgrind wrote:
moose27 wrote:
BodyShots wrote:Major League - Minor League
NFL - USFL
Class AAAAA - Class AAAA - Class AAA - Class AA - Class A
Tier I - Tier II
Class AA - Class A
Varsity - JV

Get over it people, there are differences.

Thanks for pointing out the obvious!! The depth in AA is obviously deeper than A. However, I will say it again that the final four in A were as every bit as good as the final four in AA. Hermantown, Breck, Warroad, and Mahtomedi can compete and beat anyone in the state on any given night. If you don't think this is true you obviously didn't watch any of the A tournament this year!!
If Hermantown, Breck or Warroad each play Edina, Minnetonka, and Hill-Murray 10 times. The AA schools win 7-8 of those games, at a minimum.

Exactly, Breck would have the best chance out of those teams and they still wouldn't put up that many wins.

BBB · Post by **BBB** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 12:59 pm

It's interesting how the A guys argument includes a Hermantown loss to EP in a hockey/boothockey game on outdoor ice. Hermantown finished with a runner up in A and EP was runner up in 6AA and blown out by AA runner-up Tonka.
The Breck guys keep pointing to meaningless game with Shattuck that they lost 4-1 as a reason they should be considered the best in the state. huh?
The only good comparison we had throughout the season was when #1 Mtka and #1 STA met twice and AA won 5-2 each time. Now that we have new #1's I would take Edina over breck by a score of????????? 5-2.
As for the other big 4. I'll take Tonka over Hermantown 9 of 10. Hill over Warroad 9 of 10 and I'll thrown Blaine or DE in the #4 spot and take them over Mahtomedi. I know some guys were saying A was just as deep as AA this yr on another thread but I'll choose not to comment on that one.

StayAtHomeD · Post by **StayAtHomeD** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:15 pm

The right thing for Breck and STA to do is to go AA but their hockey parents and boosters just don't have the courage.

That's what it comes down to, they would rather have a really good shot at the 2nd best trophy then go all or nothing for the top.

Is that the kind example they want to set for their young people? I guess so.....

Imagine the pride those Roseau kids must feel, even if they fall short of their ultimate goal. Pride, that is what hockey is all about.

eastsideguy · Post by **eastsideguy** » Wed Mar 17, 2010 1:27 pm

BBB wrote:It's interesting how the A guys argument includes a Hermantown loss to EP in a hockey/boothockey game on outdoor ice. Hermantown finished with a runner up in A and EP was runner up in 6AA and blown out by AA runner-up Tonka.
The Breck guys keep pointing to meaningless game with Shattuck that they lost 4-1 as a reason they should be considered the best in the state. huh?
The only good comparison we had throughout the season was when #1 Mtka and #1 STA met twice and AA won 5-2 each time. Now that we have new #1's I would take Edina over breck by a score of????????? 5-2.
As for the other big 4. I'll take Tonka over Hermantown 9 of 10. Hill over Warroad 9 of 10 and I'll thrown Blaine or DE in the #4 spot and take them over Mahtomedi. I know some guys were saying A was just as deep as AA this yr on another thread but I'll choose not to comment on that one.

I think your missing the Hill-STA comparison, they met twice and split, with STA dominating the second game. STA didn't even make the tourney, doesn't do much for your argument. A lot of good teams out there not sure there is much difference on any given night.