Hockey Camp vs AAA summer team

[InigoMontoya]

I don't understand.

Exactly.

[HockeyDad41]

I don't understand.

Exactly.

Brilliant!

[muckandgrind]

Playing other sports...

What if little Johnny dioesn't want to play other sports?

Then he probably is not a good enough athlete and will likely sit on the bench for his HS hockey team if not cut from the team ... forget the D1 scholarship - that is not in the cards.

That is PURE B.S. Many kids don't play other sports because they find them boring or whatever. It doesn't mean they aren't a good athlete. How does playing baseball make you a better hockey player? It doesn't. Playing hockey and working on hockey-related skills makes you a better hockey player.

There is nothing wrong with a kid playing summer hockey if that's what he wants to do. We encourage kids who play instruments to practice, we encourage kids who love to read to do so, we encourage kids who like to fish year round to do so, why on Earth would we discourage a kid who's main joy is playing hockey to stop practicing what they love? It's pure lunacy.

If you think your kid will get burned out, then encourage them to take a break, but don't believe for a second that all kids are the same. Some kids thrive playing hockey year round.

[MN_Hcky_Coach]

If you think your kid will get burned out, then encourage them to take a break, but don't believe for a second that all kids are the same. Some kids thrive playing hockey year round.[/quote]

You are not wrong but here is an expert's opinion and its pretty interesting:

In this article for parents, youth sports expert Brian Grasso discusses the trend in the U.S. for specializing in one sport at an early age. Brian provides invaluable insight for parents when deciding at what age to have kids specialize in one sport. Brian also looks at the trends in other countries as well as explains the theory of multilateral development and how it can help our kids.

Multilateral development is a theory that urges young athletes to participate in several sports over their childhood and adolescent periods prior to specializing in one. The basis is that varied athletic stimulus will serve to broaden the youngsters’ “warehouse” or “portfolio” of general athletic ability and develop a thorough or expansive base on which to build and eventually specialize. While the concepts are well known and the research citing success far reaching, it is still not an embraced reality within North American youth sports the reality is that pro sports are dominated by individuals who participated in more than one sport as kids. By no means am I suggesting that excelling in more than one sport is important, but actively participating in a variety of athletic endeavors as you grow physiologically and psychologically is key. These realities extend beyond just developing good athletic ability. In fact, one of the problems I’ve encountered and often explained to parents and coaches in youth-training seminars is that there is more than just a physical burn-out associated with specialized sporting endeavors.

The obvious key is that specialization will result in a decreased amount of overall athletic ability, which will inevitably become a hindrance as young athletes mature. In my experience, the athletes with the most diverse athletic history are often better equipped to learn and develop skills at the higher ends of a given sport once specialization has been determined. Above and beyond that, however, there is also a mental stimulation component to athletic development. If baseball is a 12-month sport, for example, at what point does a 9-year-old begin to lose interest?

To answer that question, just think about the average 9-year-old’s attention span in general. That’s not to say that your 9-year-old isn’t truly enjoying every second of playing hockey throughout the year, but inevitably, he will be “enjoying” the game and “focusing” on it more at certain points and less at others – that’s the nature of being a kid. It’s in these downtimes that bad and lazy habits can be developed. Keeping a youngster truly energized and excited about playing and learning new skills is a key component to athletic development that is very often overlooked.

Another overlooked feature of why multilateral development remains the best option for young people is the tactical aspects associated with sport. Even if your child engages in numerous other informal modes of athletic stimulus, he or she is only being truly challenged with the tactics and game speed of baseball. For example, baseball is a notoriously slow game, especially at the youth level. Developing optimal “quick-wittedness” and “game smarts” may best be done via participation in several sports. Although the arguments either for or against multilateral development are typically waged on the physical spectrum, in reality, the successful development of a young athlete is also heavily influenced by items such as mental and emotional perspicacity and tactical (sporting) smarts.

Something to think about
http://www.coloradoavalanchecares.com/c ... too-early/

-Coach

[EnjoyTheShow]

HockeyDad41 & MN_Hcky_Coach are Jeckyll & Hyde skating little circles between the blue lines within the boards of schizophrenia, each playing suck hole in a 1-on-1 game where the puck is in the corner.

I don't understand.

Don't try, It's far above your head!

[muckandgrind]

If you think your kid will get burned out, then encourage them to take a break, but don't believe for a second that all kids are the same. Some kids thrive playing hockey year round.

You are not wrong but here is an expert's opinion and its pretty interesting:

In this article for parents, youth sports expert Brian Grasso discusses the trend in the U.S. for specializing in one sport at an early age. Brian provides invaluable insight for parents when deciding at what age to have kids specialize in one sport. Brian also looks at the trends in other countries as well as explains the theory of multilateral development and how it can help our kids.

Multilateral development is a theory that urges young athletes to participate in several sports over their childhood and adolescent periods prior to specializing in one. The basis is that varied athletic stimulus will serve to broaden the youngsters’ “warehouse” or “portfolio” of general athletic ability and develop a thorough or expansive base on which to build and eventually specialize. While the concepts are well known and the research citing success far reaching, it is still not an embraced reality within North American youth sports the reality is that pro sports are dominated by individuals who participated in more than one sport as kids. By no means am I suggesting that excelling in more than one sport is important, but actively participating in a variety of athletic endeavors as you grow physiologically and psychologically is key. These realities extend beyond just developing good athletic ability. In fact, one of the problems I’ve encountered and often explained to parents and coaches in youth-training seminars is that there is more than just a physical burn-out associated with specialized sporting endeavors.

The obvious key is that specialization will result in a decreased amount of overall athletic ability, which will inevitably become a hindrance as young athletes mature. In my experience, the athletes with the most diverse athletic history are often better equipped to learn and develop skills at the higher ends of a given sport once specialization has been determined. Above and beyond that, however, there is also a mental stimulation component to athletic development. If baseball is a 12-month sport, for example, at what point does a 9-year-old begin to lose interest?

To answer that question, just think about the average 9-year-old’s attention span in general. That’s not to say that your 9-year-old isn’t truly enjoying every second of playing hockey throughout the year, but inevitably, he will be “enjoying” the game and “focusing” on it more at certain points and less at others – that’s the nature of being a kid. It’s in these downtimes that bad and lazy habits can be developed. Keeping a youngster truly energized and excited about playing and learning new skills is a key component to athletic development that is very often overlooked.

Another overlooked feature of why multilateral development remains the best option for young people is the tactical aspects associated with sport. Even if your child engages in numerous other informal modes of athletic stimulus, he or she is only being truly challenged with the tactics and game speed of baseball. For example, baseball is a notoriously slow game, especially at the youth level. Developing optimal “quick-wittedness” and “game smarts” may best be done via participation in several sports. Although the arguments either for or against multilateral development are typically waged on the physical spectrum, in reality, the successful development of a young athlete is also heavily influenced by items such as mental and emotional perspicacity and tactical (sporting) smarts.

Something to think about
http://www.coloradoavalanchecares.com/c ... too-early/

-Coach

[/quote]

That all sounds nice, but if a kid doesn't want to play baseball, football, volleyball, tiddly-winks or any other sport...I'm not going to force them.

Let's consider soccer...how many multi-sport athletes do you think they have in countries like Brazil? My bet is most of those star players who come from countries like Brazil play a single sport and yet, astonishly, they are the dominant players in the world.

My take is that there is no "right" or "wrong" way of doing it. I know of many "elite" level players in different sports who only played their sport; whether that be basketball, football, baseball, soccer or hockey.

I have seen no evidence of kids who play hockey in the summer, somehow falling behind those who do not. In fact, I see just the opposite. That's not to say that multi-sport athletes can't excel as well. Like I said, there is no "right" or "wrong" way.

I just get tired of hearing this same ol' argument every year come spring. Each parent and each player must decide what is right for them. If your little Johnny or Janie wants to take the summer off from hockey and play baseball or soccer or just go fishin'....GREAT!!! But if they prefer to play AAA hockey.....again, GREAT!!! Anything to keep them off the couch is good in my book.

[GreekChurch]

Every kid is different, but I couldn't agree more with the article that Hcky Coach references. I have seen it for years. Very good hockey players -1st year A players that also excel in other sports. That is playing sports at the highest level - AAA baseball for example. It's no coincedence that the best overall athletes are the top players in both sports. If the kid only wants to play hockey - let him play hockey - but he may be missing out on another (equally) stimulating activity. The kids I know of have a passion for at least a couple of sports, and I really think the reason is that they have skates on for 10 months a year- and love it, but here is this other sport which they love, but only get to play for about 3 months -naturally they can't wait to play it. Also, as referenced, the sports do help become better at the other - it's all about hand/eye coordination, and agility - probably why you see so many hockey players who are good golfers -IMHO

[HockeyDad41]

HockeyDad41 & MN_Hcky_Coach are Jeckyll & Hyde skating little circles between the blue lines within the boards of schizophrenia, each playing suck hole in a 1-on-1 game where the puck is in the corner.

I don't understand.

Don't try, It's far above your head!

Bravo! Good one!

[InigoMontoya]

here is this other sport which they love, but only get to play for about 3 months -naturally they can't wait to play it.

I'll stir the pot with a tangental topic: yes, they love the 3 month sport (except Muck's kid), they miss it, they can't wait to play it - but how many of them are ever very good at that summer sport? Yes, there are the freaks Mauer and Winfield that were good at everything they tried (worked very hard, mind you, but freaks non-the-less), but is that all that MN has to offer to major league baseball - 2 guys in 100+ years?

[GreekChurch]

here is this other sport which they love, but only get to play for about 3 months -naturally they can't wait to play it.

I'll stir the pot with a tangental topic: yes, they love the 3 month sport (except Muck's kid), they miss it, they can't wait to play it - but how many of them are ever very good at that summer sport? Yes, there are the freaks Mauer and Winfield that were good at everything they tried (worked very hard, mind you, but freaks non-the-less), but is that all that MN has to offer to major league baseball - 2 guys in 100+ years?

I agree, there are few that will be as good in the other sports as they are in hockey - due to the fact they are playing hockey in one way or another be it AAA or clinics for almost the whole year, but I do think it helps - physically, and probably more mentally - acting as a diversion to combat burn out in alot of kids-

[Jimbo99]

here is this other sport which they love, but only get to play for about 3 months -naturally they can't wait to play it.

I'll stir the pot with a tangental topic: yes, they love the 3 month sport (except Muck's kid), they miss it, they can't wait to play it - but how many of them are ever very good at that summer sport? Yes, there are the freaks Mauer and Winfield that were good at everything they tried (worked very hard, mind you, but freaks non-the-less), but is that all that MN has to offer to major league baseball - 2 guys in 100+ years?

Wikipedia says there have been 109 mlb players from MN. No, not all superstars, but lets at least count Molitor and Morris.

[Jimbo99]

Koosman, Hrbek, Sele,
We can even claim Roger Maris!

[BadgerBob82]

Age is part of this. Somebdoy in here said a 6 year old should play year round, HD41 says his 10 year old does, not sure muckgrind's age. I will 100% agree, many 6-10 year olds on skates 12 months a year are likely better than a 6-10 year old playing association hockey for 5 only months. At least they are better at tryouts in October. I know very few of those early under 10 year old AAA phenoms that are still "the best" players.

Maybe if their Dad made better use of the windshield time. Coach them on the way to the rink in the car. Motivate them better as the miles click away. Scream from the stands, not at your kid, but at the refs. Then rehash that meaningful AAA game all the way back home. Carry their bag for them too. Studies show kids that year round hockey players shouldn't carry their hockey bags. And, get the most expensive equipment possible. Don't worry if the skates still fit, get that new model just introduced at the Hockey Expo.

And most importantly, get a new credit card right at the start of the AAA season, very embarssing having that final $600 payment get bounced being over the card limit.

[dogeatdog1]

Koosman, Hrbek, Sele,
We can even claim Roger Maris!

I can see it now.. HD41's kid sitting at HRBEK field dad saying lets get out of here to go see Bernie.... forward 12 years he is still 6'3 but now 270 and back at Firemans tourney (Bloomingon)playing Softball looking at the beautiful little league diamonds saying "man I can hit a softball 350 feet if I only would have stuck with my sport I was good at.. (inserd PSTTT Beer can opening)Hey dad! What time is our no check game tonite?"

[HockeyDad41]

Koosman, Hrbek, Sele,
We can even claim Roger Maris!

I can see it now.. HD41's kid sitting at HRBEK field dad saying lets get out of here to go see Bernie.... forward 12 years he is still 6'3 but now 270 and back at Firemans tourney (Bloomingon)playing Softball looking at the beautiful little league diamonds saying "man I can hit a softball 350 feet if I only would have stuck with my sport I was good at.. (inserd PSTTT Beer can opening)Hey dad! What time is our no check game tonite?"

Huh? Can you work on your insults a little bit? I don't really seem to be getting this one.

Are you saying that in 12 years my kid will be playing in some softball tournament and drinking beer and then after we will have a no check hockey game? Is that it?

[muckandgrind]

Age is part of this. Somebdoy in here said a 6 year old should play year round, HD41 says his 10 year old does, not sure muckgrind's age. I will 100% agree, many 6-10 year olds on skates 12 months a year are likely better than a 6-10 year old playing association hockey for 5 only months. At least they are better at tryouts in October. I know very few of those early under 10 year old AAA phenoms that are still "the best" players.

Maybe if their Dad made better use of the windshield time. Coach them on the way to the rink in the car. Motivate them better as the miles click away. Scream from the stands, not at your kid, but at the refs. Then rehash that meaningful AAA game all the way back home. Carry their bag for them too. Studies show kids that year round hockey players shouldn't carry their hockey bags. And, get the most expensive equipment possible. Don't worry if the skates still fit, get that new model just introduced at the Hockey Expo.

And most importantly, get a new credit card right at the start of the AAA season, very embarssing having that final $600 payment get bounced being over the card limit.

I'm 46 years old. I have three boys playing hockey: the oldest in high school. The youngest is 11.

All three have tried other sports to some degree, whether that be baseball or football. My middle son still plays football. All three kids quit playing baseball for the same reason: too boring. But all three of them play (or have played) hockey in the offseason as well...whether that be a camp, clinic or AAA. None of them have ever experienced "burn out" and have gone through periods where they look forward more to AAA hockey than they do association hockey...probably because the association they play(ed) for is small and are not generally competitive, while their AAA teams have all been pretty competitive.

Again, I'm not suggesting I'm "right" and anyone else is "wrong". This is our experience and the kids have had a good time playing hockey. None of them are likely to ever suit up for a D-1 or NHL team, but none of us care about that, either. Hockey is fun, and they like to play as much as possible. Like I said before, I just get annoyed when people come around here claiming they know what is right for my kid and others.

One thing people need to consider when talking about the "multi-sport" athlete. Is it a requirement that the other sports be organized? Because I know that my kids like to go to the park in the summer, throw the football around, shoot some hoops (and pucks) and otherwise just goof around. Is that also not enough? Or is the only way one can be considered a "multi-sport athlete" is if they sign up for a league and wear the same color uniforms?

On a side note: When the Adv 15, 16, 17 rosters are released...we should make it an excercise to determine how many of those players don't play AAA in the summer. My bet is the number that don't will be extremely small. Just a hunch.

[HockeyDad41]

Age is part of this. Somebdoy in here said a 6 year old should play year round, HD41 says his 10 year old does, not sure muckgrind's age. I will 100% agree, many 6-10 year olds on skates 12 months a year are likely better than a 6-10 year old playing association hockey for 5 only months. At least they are better at tryouts in October. I know very few of those early under 10 year old AAA phenoms that are still "the best" players.

Maybe if their Dad made better use of the windshield time. Coach them on the way to the rink in the car. Motivate them better as the miles click away. Scream from the stands, not at your kid, but at the refs. Then rehash that meaningful AAA game all the way back home. Carry their bag for them too. Studies show kids that year round hockey players shouldn't carry their hockey bags. And, get the most expensive equipment possible. Don't worry if the skates still fit, get that new model just introduced at the Hockey Expo.

And most importantly, get a new credit card right at the start of the AAA season, very embarssing having that final $600 payment get bounced being over the card limit.

I'd suggest paying by check. I think most of these places charge 2-3% extra if you pay with a credit card.

[InigoMontoya]

On a side note: When the Adv 15, 16, 17 rosters are released...we should make it an excercise to determine how many of those players don't play AAA in the summer. My bet is the number that don't will be extremely small. Just a hunch.

We'll put Dmom in charge of that list.

Koosman, Hrbek, Sele,
We can even claim Roger Maris!

I'll agree. That makes 8; I'll even concede 2 more to round it off at 10 players of note over 100 years; 109 overall. So Minnesota averages 1 kid a year making it to MLB; 1 kid every 10 years that anyone outside their immediate family would be able to name. I think all would agree that the numbers are substantially higher in the NHL. I also would say there are many times more kids playing baseball in MN than hockey - our community had 33 9 & 10 year olds playing hockey; over 100 played baseball - throw in all the communities that don't have hockey at all, but do have baseball and that number is probably 10 times as many kids playing baseball as playing hockey. Very, very few of those kids play baseball 10 months per year. It is certainly not a scientific study, but it looks like there may be a correlation between hours of productive practice and success.

Before MN_Hcky_Coach tosses us another Lucia quote out there, please name a kid that he's coached that hung up his skates in March and didn't take them off the hook until November. Please also feel free to drag Jack Parker at BU into this, as well.

[BadgerBob82]

Point well taken muckgrind! I know there are many like you out there, but my experience is more like HockeyDad41.

You bring up a good point relating to "organized" sports. I guess my point is not so much that the skates aren't hung up, it is the level of organization, cost and intensity level. The way most of these programs are run, it is as crueling of a schedule as the regular season. In many cases more so. Advertising 3-4 hours of intensive practice per week and 3-5 tournaments. I have seen the zombie like stares of these AAA kids come January-February. That's the time of the season I want my players at their best, not worn down since they haven't had a break since July.

Your point is well taken that the advanced 15-17 probably do skate all summer. The ones play baseball, lacrosse, golf or track don't try out. Also, my point would be to track how many of them were 12 month AAA players under age 10.

[Penalty Box]

I wonder if perhaps the folks that discourage or downplay kids' participation in mulitple sports do so to make themselves feel better, because either they, or their kids, were/are simply not good at more than one sport. And that's fine, in fact, it is probably more of a norm than genuine success at more than one sport is. However, you should not pretend to know what is best for everyone, or assume that there is no way other kids can't be top-level athletes in more than one sport, just because you/your child are not.

My son is a three-sport athlete and is incredibly successful at all three sports he participates in. He was a starter on his football team, has played top level travel baseball for three years (he is even a switch hitter), has been on the A hockey team in his association every year, and plays for one of the "top 3" AAA teams in the summer. His favorite sport is generally the one that is "in season," and he truly looks forward to being in every sport he can. And before you bother saying "his hockey association is probably weak," or "define top level baseball," let me say that his PW team came one goal from going to State this year, and his baseball team was in the State Tournament last year and was ranked in the top 10 in the State. So he is by no means the best of an adequate or underachieving bunch.

Do I think he will be a professional athlete? No. Do I realistically think he will get a D1 scholarship? Not so much. But does he work hard in practice and on his own, and does he strive for both? Yep. And that's why he is good, and why he enjoys it all. Because he is chasing his own dreams, not mine, and not the ones you all think are appropriate to chase. Your kids would probably be better off if you would just be quiet and drive.

[muckandgrind]

I wonder if perhaps the folks that discourage or downplay kids' participation in mulitple sports do so to make themselves feel better, because either they, or their kids, were/are simply not good at more than one sport. And that's fine, in fact, it is probably more of a norm than genuine success at more than one sport is. However, you should not pretend to know what is best for everyone, or assume that there is no way other kids can't be top-level athletes in more than one sport, just because you/your child are not.

My son is a three-sport athlete and is incredibly successful at all three sports he participates in. He was a starter on his football team, has played top level travel baseball for three years (he is even a switch hitter), has been on the A hockey team in his association every year, and plays for one of the "top 3" AAA teams in the summer. His favorite sport is generally the one that is "in season," and he truly looks forward to being in every sport he can. And before you bother saying "his hockey association is probably weak," or "define top level baseball," let me say that his PW team came one goal from going to State this year, and his baseball team was in the State Tournament last year and was ranked in the top 10 in the State. So he is by no means the best of an adequate or underachieving bunch.

Do I think he will be a professional athlete? No. Do I realistically think he will get a D1 scholarship? Not so much. But does he work hard in practice and on his own, and does he strive for both? Yep. And that's why he is good, and why he enjoys it all. Because he is chasing his own dreams, not mine, and not the ones you all think are appropriate to chase. Your kids would probably be better off if you would just be quiet and drive.

Good for YOU!! That's great!

My sons were pretty good at baseball also...but they all quit because they didn't like the pace of the game....and I didn't protest, because that meant we get to spend those nice early summer evenings doing something else like fishing.

[InigoMontoya]

That was as uninformed and condescending a post as I've read in a long time. I'm surprised you had time to come down from the mountain top to grace us with your wisdom. I don’t see anybody telling you what to do with your kid; if you were interested in bragging him up then just start a thread called “Braggin’ my kid up”, then you could actually include the baseball, hockey, and football teams the boy plays for. It is also unclear to whom your post is addressed; to those that don’t think kids should skate AAA (because your kid does), or to Muck who has a kid that doesn’t care for organized baseball (because he’s not telling you to yank your kid off the ball field)? Feel free to do whatever you choose with “the best” 12-year old, but (and I don’t want to speak for everyone else) you can keep that final statement to yourself.

[Goalie Dude]

You guys all have way to much time on your hands. This post has been giong on and on over a bunch of opinions that should be made by each family, not on this forum. I respect the question being asked, but I think it's clear that you'll never get everyone to agree on this topic.
Play AAA, or don't play AAA. Be in 3 sports, or don't be. To each there own and kids should make the choice with their parents. Respect what each kid wants to do and support them. They grow up so fast, do what's right for your family, not what this forum told you was the "right" thing to do.

[spin-o-rama]

Before MN_Hcky_Coach tosses us another Lucia quote out there, please name a kid that he's coached that hung up his skates in March and didn't take them off the hook until November. Please also feel free to drag Jack Parker at BU into this, as well.

Okposo took a year off from hockey. I believe around 8th grade?

Lots of ex-D1 and ex-NHLers that preach kids should take time out from skating, yet those same guys have their kids out skating 365. There's a lot of pressure to keep up with the Jones.

[Puck Whisperer]

HockeyDad41 & MN_Hcky_Coach are Jeckyll & Hyde skating little circles between the blue lines within the boards of schizophrenia, each playing suck hole in a 1-on-1 game where the puck is in the corner.

I don't understand.

This made me laugh - it's a funny way of saying that both your views are (extreme) polar opposite. I apologize IM if I interepreted this incorrectly!