MCBAIN on Channel 5 News Tonight on D6

[The Huge Hook]

I am just curious how much this lawsuit is going to cost in the end. Association fees will be paying however many lawyers will be working on this case along with court fees and anything else concerned due to one mans actions. Maybe the DD could take a look at taking the rule down for a year until he, and the board, are sure whatever lawsuit will not be lost.

Eventually McBain could sue for lost clients and cost the associations more in the end.

No one is telling anyone where they can or can not play.

Really

[oholene]

The dispute is solved, right?

MM is a business looking to expand their market share thus increase revenue.

D6 is a business looking to hold onto their top talent and stay amongst the premiere Districts.

Both are trying to protect/enhance their business. If Walmart changes its strategy to compete with Target does everyone complain? Both should have the same prices, return policies, etc?

Its a business of training kids to play hockey. One is more intent on profit and developing a small group, while the other is driving a community based environment (remember 90% of the kids in the assoc do not play A and many of them are not interested in businesses like MM) for all levels to play.

Wally World, Target, Kohls, Kmart, etc all compete and ultimately it is good for the consumer. They all plagerize each other at some point based on what their core customers want.

They each get to set their own rules and policies. If you want to follow them, shop there if not, shop somewhere else.[/quote]

I shop where I want, I shop at multiple stores, I don't have to choose between two and don't tell me I do.

[hockey_is_a_choice]

Slightly different hypothetical than the Walmart/Target example. We all know that Northwest Airlines, which was purchased recently by Delta Airlines, did not like the competition it faced from the other hometown airline, Sun County. If Northwest had implemented a policy that provided, "If you fly Sun Country, you can't fly Northwest Airlines", the Department of Justice's and Sun Country's antitrust and corporate lawyers would be in court in a flash to prevent Northwest from enforcing the policy.

Why, you might ask. People have the option to choose between Northwest or Sun Country, right? Well, Northwest has routes all over the globe. It is a dominant player in the market. In contrast, Sun Country has limited routes and, by playing hardball with Sun Country, its competitor, Northwest, can restrain competition and possibly put Sun Country out of business. This conduct is not allowed. For the record, Northwest never attempted to implement such a policy.




Greybeard, I appreciate the New York case's facts are not on all fours with the D6 situation, but the principles are the same. The Sherman and Clayton Acts do not allow another entity to unreasonably restrain competition.

Also, my understanding is that USA Hockey is a separate legal entity from Minnesota Hockey, which is a separate legal entity from District 6 Hockey, which, in turn, is a separate legal entity from each of its association members. All entities are separate 501(c)(3) entities. With respect to District 6 Hockey, my understanding is District 6 is a stand alone entity from Minnesota Hockey and is governed by Minnesota's Nonprofit Coporation Act, Minn. Ch. 317A. In a nutshell, this is currently District 6's issue, not Minnesota Hockey's or USA Hockey's issue.

[dogeatdog1]

Seek & destroy is on the right track, good work. There are many people out there who are sick and tired of “parent” run association hockey full of hidden agendas. Many associations are run and governed by parents looking to help little Jonnie and Suzie get on the right team. Many decisions (not all) are made with the beer drinkin buddies and if you don’t drink beer with them your little player doesn’t make the team. Again, not condemning all associations but you know what I am talking about.

MM has had success with the choice league because it gives players another place to play besides the poorly parent run associations. Take a look at the kids who have been playing in choice, they are from all over the metro and outlying areas. This isn’t just about D6, it’s about parent run associations and players looking for another place to play. D6 has drawn a line in the sand and has support in doing so. Just imagine the financial implications to MN Hockey on this deal.

The war has begun.

Nice thinking You would rather put your faith in a person that makes cuts at the bubble level based on checkbook loyality rather than beer drinking loyality? No matter where you go if your kid is a bubble he will be getting the shaft in your eyes... Association hockey doesn't need people that will be whining about how little Jonny got screwed by the board because he was the best player but I'm not in the "Ol boys network"... I can hear you talking to other C parents now Coaches and people that I know that get involved in the association boards want nothing but the best for the kids. I don't think that the WAR as you put it will be beginning as the market will ultimately allow for both entities to co exist.. Kids will be the ones that will be hurt by the WAR...

[justhavefun]

This whole subject seesm to prove more and more the need to switch to a AAA hockey system in the winter, for the simple reason it gives kids and families a "Choice" It seems like most players want to be given a choice of where to play, where to spend their money, ..... The Soccer world seems to survive, kids can play where ever they want in soccer. AAA, AA, A etc... status is based on Prior year performance to determine what Level you can play at.

[High Off The Glass]

Bernie started advertising for his Mite, Choice and PW leagues months ago. Accepted payments months ago from willing families. THEN, the rules changed after these parents have written their checks.

My guess is that many of these families are now asking for refunds?

One poster wrote "how can he/they/MM prove damages". Maybe it's more cut and dry then we think?

If they already paid to play at MM then they made their "choice", and go ahead and play at MM, what's D6 have to do with it. If you are considering a lawsuit you have more of a legal stand if you sue MM in the likely event they don't refund your money. Again D6 didn't put a gun to your head to pay and play at MM.

[SWPrez]

This whole subject seesm to prove more and more the need to switch to a AAA hockey system in the winter, for the simple reason it gives kids and families a "Choice" It seems like most players want to be given a choice of where to play, where to spend their money, ..... The Soccer world seems to survive, kids can play where ever they want in soccer. AAA, AA, A etc... status is based on Prior year performance to determine what Level you can play at.

I think hockey opportunities would collapse if we went to a AAA, AA, etc. type of world in Minnesota.

Our rinks are municipally run. They typically do not make money but provide a service for their tax paying residents. As a result, we pay $175 per hour for ice rather than the $350+ you see just about everywhere else in the country. This is also the main reason why I see that it is virtually impossible for a AAA system to replace our community based association system.

Moving to a AAA system would not only cause rinks to jack their prices (as they have no loyalty to the non-community AAA teams), but also would lead to rinks being shuttered - game gets too expensive, fewer kids play, rinks don't have demand for ice, rinks close to be used as warehouse space for park and recreation departments.

Many good athletes who start late or would have been late bloomers would just bypass playing the sport - as cost and potential lack of upward opportunities would not make it worthwhile.

Out east, you write a check for $5k before you even hit the ice and then receive additional assessments as the season progresses. It is a game only for those with big bank accounts. Our hockey is expensive...but 1500 over a six month season really isn't all that bad....you would spend double or triple that on Tai Kwon Doh or Dance lessons.

I have had long discussions with outstaters regarding the setup of MN Hockey (association in winter and AAA options non-winter) and they all wish that their insanity could be replaced with our system. Granted, its not perfect and has its own doses of insanity, but it provides a wide net of opportunity to kids. Those kids and parents who want to open their checkbooks for supplemental or offseason hockey are free to do it (i've done it myself)- others can take their kid to the park for extra ice.

[oholene]

This whole subject seesm to prove more and more the need to switch to a AAA hockey system in the winter, for the simple reason it gives kids and families a "Choice" It seems like most players want to be given a choice of where to play, where to spend their money, ..... The Soccer world seems to survive, kids can play where ever they want in soccer. AAA, AA, A etc... status is based on Prior year performance to determine what Level you can play at.

I think hockey opportunities would collapse if we went to a AAA, AA, etc. type of world in Minnesota.

Our rinks are municipally run. They typically do not make money but provide a service for their tax paying residents. As a result, we pay $175 per hour for ice rather than the $350+ you see just about everywhere else in the country. This is also the main reason why I see that it is virtually impossible for a AAA system to replace our community based association system.

Moving to a AAA system would not only cause rinks to jack their prices (as they have no loyalty to the non-community AAA teams), but also would lead to rinks being shuttered - game gets too expensive, fewer kids play, rinks don't have demand for ice, rinks close to be used as warehouse space for park and recreation departments.

Many good athletes who start late or would have been late bloomers would just bypass playing the sport - as cost and potential lack of upward opportunities would not make it worthwhile.

Out east, you write a check for $5k before you even hit the ice and then receive additional assessments as the season progresses. It is a game only for those with big bank accounts. Our hockey is expensive...but 1500 over a six month season really isn't all that bad....you would spend double or triple that on Tai Kwon Doh or Dance lessons.

I have had long discussions with outstaters regarding the setup of MN Hockey (association in winter and AAA options non-winter) and they all wish that their insanity could be replaced with our system. Granted, its not perfect and has its own doses of insanity, but it provides a wide net of opportunity to kids. Those kids and parents who want to open their checkbooks for supplemental or offseason hockey are free to do it (i've done it myself)- others can take their kid to the park for extra ice.

Why not have Association and AAA in the Winter?

[JSR]

This whole subject seesm to prove more and more the need to switch to a AAA hockey system in the winter, for the simple reason it gives kids and families a "Choice" It seems like most players want to be given a choice of where to play, where to spend their money, ..... The Soccer world seems to survive, kids can play where ever they want in soccer. AAA, AA, A etc... status is based on Prior year performance to determine what Level you can play at.

I think hockey opportunities would collapse if we went to a AAA, AA, etc. type of world in Minnesota.

Our rinks are municipally run. They typically do not make money but provide a service for their tax paying residents. As a result, we pay $175 per hour for ice rather than the $350+ you see just about everywhere else in the country. This is also the main reason why I see that it is virtually impossible for a AAA system to replace our community based association system.

Moving to a AAA system would not only cause rinks to jack their prices (as they have no loyalty to the non-community AAA teams), but also would lead to rinks being shuttered - game gets too expensive, fewer kids play, rinks don't have demand for ice, rinks close to be used as warehouse space for park and recreation departments.

Many good athletes who start late or would have been late bloomers would just bypass playing the sport - as cost and potential lack of upward opportunities would not make it worthwhile.

Out east, you write a check for $5k before you even hit the ice and then receive additional assessments as the season progresses. It is a game only for those with big bank accounts. Our hockey is expensive...but 1500 over a six month season really isn't all that bad....you would spend double or triple that on Tai Kwon Doh or Dance lessons.

I have had long discussions with outstaters regarding the setup of MN Hockey (association in winter and AAA options non-winter) and they all wish that their insanity could be replaced with our system. Granted, its not perfect and has its own doses of insanity, but it provides a wide net of opportunity to kids. Those kids and parents who want to open their checkbooks for supplemental or offseason hockey are free to do it (i've done it myself)- others can take their kid to the park for extra ice.

First off let me say that overall I love Minnesotas association based and high school base hockey system and I hope someday our system in Wisconsin can rival that of MN. However, I do want to correct a few things you mention. Here in Wisconsin we have three Tier 1 AAA Winter hockey associations (on in Green Bay, one in Milwaukee and one in Madison) it has not caused our associations to crumble nor has it caused our rink prices to go sky high. In my own commuity our rink iis privately owned (not community owned) and while our prices aren't as good as the ones that are owned by the communiies it is still no where near the prices you indicated. Depending on the day of the week in the winter you can get an hour of ice for between $200 and $220 per hour (not that much more than the $175 you mentioned) and that is peak season, in the spring, summer and fall you can get an hour of ice for $150 per hour and those prices are pretty consistant (with rare exception) through out our state. I also see a huge growth in high school hockey in our state and a huge growth in association hockey in our state. It is hardly the end of the world scenario you are describing. I personally would love to see Wisconsin embrace the greatness of AA hockey you see in Michigan along with the greatness of association and high school hockey you see in MN. I do beleive both can coexist and make for a greater hockey community. JMHO though

[hammer99]

[quote="dogeatdog1"][quote="Puposky22"]Seek & destroy is on the right track, good work. There are many people out there who are sick and tired of “parent” run association hockey full of hidden agendas. Many associations are run and governed by parents looking to help little Jonnie and Suzie get on the right team. Many decisions (not all) are made with the beer drinkin buddies and if you don’t drink beer with them your little player doesn’t make the team. Again, not condemning all associations but you know what I am talking about.

MM has had success with the choice league because it gives players another place to play besides the poorly parent run associations. Take a look at the kids who have been playing in choice, they are from all over the metro and outlying areas. This isn’t just about D6, it’s about parent run associations and players looking for another place to play. D6 has drawn a line in the sand and has support in doing so. Just imagine the financial implications to MN Hockey on this deal.

The war has begun.[/quote]

Nice thinking You would rather put your faith in a person that makes cuts at the bubble level based on checkbook loyality rather than beer drinking loyality? No matter where you go if your kid is a bubble he will be getting the shaft in your eyes... Association hockey doesn't need people that will be whining about how little Jonny got screwed by the board because he was the best player but I'm not in the "Ol boys network"... I can hear you talking to other C parents now Coaches and people that I know that get involved in the association boards want nothing but the best for the kids. I don't think that the WAR as you put it will be beginning as the market will ultimately allow for both entities to co exist.. Kids will be the ones that will be hurt by the WAR...[/quote]







Your comment does nothing but prove your ignorance of what really goes on in association hockey. The fact is that parent run boards result in nothing but parents voting on subjects with the sole purpose of benefiting their own child. For example, little johnny is a first year bantam and it appears he will be on the bubble for the one and only bantam b1 team. So what does dear old dad do? Brings up the idea that there should be two bantam b1 teams this year, to "increase the overall developmental quality" in the association.

Well tryouts come along and little johnny makes one of the two b1 teams, johnny develops better in the b1 landscape than he would have in the b2 landscape. The problem is both teams end the season below .500.

Well at the next board meeting to decide the number of teams for the next season, little johnny's dad brings up the idea of bringing the number of b1 teams back to just 1 in order to "avoid another losing season". This again benefits him because he not only knows johnny will automatically have a slot on the b1 team, due to him making b1 last year. But he also knows that if johnny gets cut from the a team he will have essentially an a2 team to fall back on. This way johnny not only played at a higher level than he originally would have both years, but his dad also helped him by preventing potential future threats in the kids a year younger than him by keeping them at the b2 level while johnny played b1 both years of bantams.


things very similar to this happen every year in association hockey, ESPECIALLY Edina. I hope you see the need to change the system that is currently in place.

[spin-o-rama]

Your comment does nothing but prove your ignorance of what really goes on in association hockey. The fact is that parent run boards result in nothing but parents voting on subjects with the sole purpose of benefiting their own child. For example, little johnny is a first year bantam and it appears he will be on the bubble for the one and only bantam b1 team. So what does dear old dad do? Brings up the idea that there should be two bantam b1 teams this year, to "increase the overall developmental quality" in the association.

Well tryouts come along and little johnny makes one of the two b1 teams, johnny develops better in the b1 landscape than he would have in the b2 landscape. The problem is both teams end the season below .500.

Well at the next board meeting to decide the number of teams for the next season, little johnny's dad brings up the idea of bringing the number of b1 teams back to just 1 in order to "avoid another losing season". This again benefits him because he not only knows johnny will automatically have a slot on the b1 team, due to him making b1 last year. But he also knows that if johnny gets cut from the a team he will have essentially an a2 team to fall back on. This way johnny not only played at a higher level than he originally would have both years, but his dad also helped him by preventing potential future threats in the kids a year younger than him by keeping them at the b2 level while johnny played b1 both years of bantams.


things very similar to this happen every year in association hockey, ESPECIALLY Edina. I hope you see the need to change the system that is currently in place.

Edina always has 2 B1 teams. But don't hold back, share your experiences with the hornets.

[HockeyDad41]

Will D6 be granting waivers to the people who want out of the district because of this?

[trippedovertheblueline]

Seek & destroy is on the right track, good work. There are many people out there who are sick and tired of “parent” run association hockey full of hidden agendas. Many associations are run and governed by parents looking to help little Jonnie and Suzie get on the right team. Many decisions (not all) are made with the beer drinkin buddies and if you don’t drink beer with them your little player doesn’t make the team. Again, not condemning all associations but you know what I am talking about.

.

Is it conspiracy season already?

[O-townClown]

Edina always has 2 B1 teams. But don't hold back, share your experiences with the hornets.

Yes, but you know one year they had A1 and A2 at Squirts and you also know how that went.

[spin-o-rama]

Edina always has 2 B1 teams. But don't hold back, share your experiences with the hornets.

Yes, but you know one year they had A1 and A2 at Squirts and you also know how that went.

I ate crow on that one. I thought they would win more than 2 games.

[dogeatdog1]

Seek & destroy is on the right track, good work. There are many people out there who are sick and tired of “parent” run association hockey full of hidden agendas. Many associations are run and governed by parents looking to help little Jonnie and Suzie get on the right team. Many decisions (not all) are made with the beer drinkin buddies and if you don’t drink beer with them your little player doesn’t make the team. Again, not condemning all associations but you know what I am talking about.

MM has had success with the choice league because it gives players another place to play besides the poorly parent run associations. Take a look at the kids who have been playing in choice, they are from all over the metro and outlying areas. This isn’t just about D6, it’s about parent run associations and players looking for another place to play. D6 has drawn a line in the sand and has support in doing so. Just imagine the financial implications to MN Hockey on this deal.

The war has begun.

Nice thinking You would rather put your faith in a person that makes cuts at the bubble level based on checkbook loyality rather than beer drinking loyality? No matter where you go if your kid is a bubble he will be getting the shaft in your eyes... Association hockey doesn't need people that will be whining about how little Jonny got screwed by the board because he was the best player but I'm not in the "Ol boys network"... I can hear you talking to other C parents now Coaches and people that I know that get involved in the association boards want nothing but the best for the kids. I don't think that the WAR as you put it will be beginning as the market will ultimately allow for both entities to co exist.. Kids will be the ones that will be hurt by the WAR...

Your comment does nothing but prove your ignorance of what really goes on in association hockey. The fact is that parent run boards result in nothing but parents voting on subjects with the sole purpose of benefiting their own child. For example, little johnny is a first year bantam and it appears he will be on the bubble for the one and only bantam b1 team. So what does dear old dad do? Brings up the idea that there should be two bantam b1 teams this year, to "increase the overall developmental quality" in the association.

Well tryouts come along and little johnny makes one of the two b1 teams, johnny develops better in the b1 landscape than he would have in the b2 landscape. The problem is both teams end the season below .500.

Well at the next board meeting to decide the number of teams for the next season, little johnny's dad brings up the idea of bringing the number of b1 teams back to just 1 in order to "avoid another losing season". This again benefits him because he not only knows johnny will automatically have a slot on the b1 team, due to him making b1 last year. But he also knows that if johnny gets cut from the a team he will have essentially an a2 team to fall back on. This way johnny not only played at a higher level than he originally would have both years, but his dad also helped him by preventing potential future threats in the kids a year younger than him by keeping them at the b2 level while johnny played b1 both years of bantams.


things very similar to this happen every year in association hockey, ESPECIALLY Edina. I hope you see the need to change the system that is currently in place.

For an association that has the ol boys network going Edina is pretty successful. You would think that if all the dads and drunks on the board were submarining the program to the benefit of their kid they wouldn't win so many regional and state tourneys... sounds again like bubble kid sour grapes.. Send your kid to MM so he can improve and make an A team... or maybe shoot pucks in the garage,,, both will help improve his chances more than your whining about the association and the politics behind it. Just my two cents

[hammer99]

Nice thinking You would rather put your faith in a person that makes cuts at the bubble level based on checkbook loyality rather than beer drinking loyality? No matter where you go if your kid is a bubble he will be getting the shaft in your eyes... Association hockey doesn't need people that will be whining about how little Jonny got screwed by the board because he was the best player but I'm not in the "Ol boys network"... I can hear you talking to other C parents now Coaches and people that I know that get involved in the association boards want nothing but the best for the kids. I don't think that the WAR as you put it will be beginning as the market will ultimately allow for both entities to co exist.. Kids will be the ones that will be hurt by the WAR...

Your comment does nothing but prove your ignorance of what really goes on in association hockey. The fact is that parent run boards result in nothing but parents voting on subjects with the sole purpose of benefiting their own child. For example, little johnny is a first year bantam and it appears he will be on the bubble for the one and only bantam b1 team. So what does dear old dad do? Brings up the idea that there should be two bantam b1 teams this year, to "increase the overall developmental quality" in the association.

Well tryouts come along and little johnny makes one of the two b1 teams, johnny develops better in the b1 landscape than he would have in the b2 landscape. The problem is both teams end the season below .500.

Well at the next board meeting to decide the number of teams for the next season, little johnny's dad brings up the idea of bringing the number of b1 teams back to just 1 in order to "avoid another losing season". This again benefits him because he not only knows johnny will automatically have a slot on the b1 team, due to him making b1 last year. But he also knows that if johnny gets cut from the a team he will have essentially an a2 team to fall back on. This way johnny not only played at a higher level than he originally would have both years, but his dad also helped him by preventing potential future threats in the kids a year younger than him by keeping them at the b2 level while johnny played b1 both years of bantams.


things very similar to this happen every year in association hockey, ESPECIALLY Edina. I hope you see the need to change the system that is currently in place.

For an association that has the ol boys network going Edina is pretty successful. You would think that if all the dads and drunks on the board were submarining the program to the benefit of their kid they wouldn't win so many regional and state tourneys... sounds again like bubble kid sour grapes.. Send your kid to MM so he can improve and make an A team... or maybe shoot pucks in the garage,,, both will help improve his chances more than your whining about the association and the politics behind it. Just my two cents

When did I ever refer to Edina as a program that doesn't win? The association is the best in state in terms of winning, but in terms of overall development for ALL of the players, it is far far behind many rival associations.

[spin-o-rama]

When did I ever refer to Edina as a program that doesn't win? The association is the best in state in terms of winning, but in terms of overall development for ALL of the players, it is far far behind many rival associations.

Please expound on this, you'll gain lots of friends. Everybody loves a hornet hater.
Their HS program is tops despite probably losing the most kids to privates of any other association. This and all the youth championships speaks to high level.
Their percentage of the population playing hockey is probably the highest of any MN community outside of Roseau. This speaks to overall satisfaction.

[The Huge Hook]

The association is the best in state in terms of winning, but in terms of overall development for ALL of the players, it is far far behind many rival associations.

FAR, FAR behind which rival associations????? I think you might want to back-track on this one

[dogeatdog1]

When did I ever refer to Edina as a program that doesn't win? The association is the best in state in terms of winning, but in terms of overall development for ALL of the players, it is far far behind many rival associations.

Please expound on this, you'll gain lots of friends. Everybody loves a hornet hater.
Their HS program is tops despite probably losing the most kids to privates of any other association. This and all the youth championships speaks to high level.
Their percentage of the population playing hockey is probably the highest of any MN community outside of Roseau. This speaks to overall satisfaction.

Yeah I cannot even believe that I am pumping up Edina .... I must be getting old and soft in my posts.... Like I told the Gretter wanna be 99? He should have his kid practice and get off the bubble and he would have a different outlook on life, Probably be more happy and make friends on this board.

[BlackTape]

I heard that Bernie has rules for his Machine Players as well? I believe he has a rule that doesn't allow any of his machine players to play any other sports in the summer? Is this true?

If it is true, why isn't this the same as D6's limitations?

[buttend]

I heard that Bernie has rules for his Machine Players as well? I believe he has a rule that doesn't allow any of his machine players to play any other sports in the summer? Is this true?

If it is true, why isn't this the same as D6's limitations?

Minnesota Made teams have always told the parents upfront what the commitment expectations are before the season starts.

With that in mind I assume District 6 will be drafting a "new" uniform participation policy and the commitment level expected for Mites! ( 5-8 years olds)

A this new policy sits today District 6 references the desire to have more commitment at the Mite level but has no District Policy. Instead they draft the "Minnesota Made" rule.

You can miss hockey for..

Church
Boy Scouts
Illness
School
Skiing
Snowboarding
Indoor Soccer
Indoor Baseball
but not for MM.....

You can "register" for MN Blades Mite Program and be eligible to play Mite hockey in D6 but you can register for MM Mite Choice!.

What you have here is a Non profit MN Youth Hockey Monolopy that is telling its members that they cannot patronize a certain business or business program under the penalty of not being able to pay in their league,nor can they go to any other MN hockey program with out a "waiver" I would think a lawyer would have a hay day with this!

[council member retired]

[quote="buttend"][quote="BlackTape"]I heard that Bernie has rules for his Machine Players as well? I believe he has a rule that doesn't allow any of his machine players to play any other sports in the summer? Is this true?

If it is true, why isn't this the same as D6's limitations?[/quote]

Minnesota Made teams have always told the parents upfront what the commitment expectations are before the season starts.

With that in mind I assume District 6 will be drafting a "new" uniform participation policy and the commitment level expected for Mites! ( 5-8 years olds)

A this new policy sits today District 6 references the desire to have more commitment at the Mite level but has no District Policy. Instead they draft the "Minnesota Made" rule.

You can miss hockey for..

Church
Boy Scouts
Illness
School
Skiing
Snowboarding
Indoor Soccer
Indoor Baseball
but not for MM.....

You can "register" for MN Blades Mite Program and be eligible to play Mite hockey in D6 but you can register for MM Mite Choice!.

What you have here is a Non profit MN Youth Hockey Monolopy that is telling its members that they cannot patronize a certain business or business program under the penalty of not being able to pay in their league,nor can they go to any other MN hockey program with out a "waiver" I would think a lawyer would have a hay day with this![/quote]

or perhaps start another youth hockey organization?

[hockeyover40]

Sounds like MNHockey is doing something very similar.

Can play in another state (for the fire) but must sit out for a year when you come back. Go ahead and play, but be prepared to be punished if you do. Instead of giving your members other options within Mn., penalize them if they choose to play where they believe offers a better opportunity for themselves.

Sounds a lot like Dist 6

[trippedovertheblueline]

Sounds like MNHockey is doing something very similar.

Can play in another state (for the fire) but must sit out for a year when you come back. Go ahead and play, but be prepared to be punished if you do. Instead of giving your members other options within Mn., penalize them if they choose to play where they believe offers a better opportunity for themselves.

Sounds a lot like Dist 6

what do these two organizations have currently in common?
-Perhaps MN Hockey is trying to eliminate in their eyes the "axis of evil"
of both organizations. It seems obvious they have discussed a plan to eliminate it. So what if the "axis" came to them from the beginning looking for approval? Would that have helped moving forward? Or do you root for the independent to make it up the hill?