Age change in Minnesota Hockey?

[Pioneerprideguy]

I have attended a few MN Hockey committee meetings on various issues and watched some of the "older" members speak. It is fairly obvious they are far removed from today's game and the issues involved. One guy's consistant response was,"back when my kids played....", well sir, that was decades ago and things have changed since then. When statistical data was presented, they looked like deer in headlights. People had to "dummy down" the information just to make a small point. The oldtimer's response...."well, it was never like that when my kids were playing." Consequently, very few changes have occurred.

I do applaud the time that these older members give, however, it really is time for them to step aside. I know the response will be, "if ya don't like it, then get involved"....I get that. But from what I saw, to sit on a committee with some of these old guys still present, would frustrate many to just opt out. I guess we just sit back and allow natural causes to run it's course.

[Ugottobekiddingme]

U please explain what has brought you to the conclusion above. What vote or position he has taken has in fact hurt the constituents of District 10 or has gone against the majorities wishes or is this personal?

GB...can you offer one thing that TT has done in favor of his district or for the state of Minnesota? This isn't a witch hunt but if you have been given power without majority membership approval, I'll ask the question.

[greybeard58]

U,
You did not answer the question and also by making the statement he was given power without majority approval is completely incorrect. TT has been elected twice for a 3 year term according the the by-laws of Mn Hockey and District 10 in both elections the vote was a white ballot with no nay votes.

I will start with one which was important to Champlin Park and that was the final resolve of the boundaries with Brooklyn Park, which had caused problems since the Champlin Park association was formed and also prevented an earlier attempt by many in Mn Hockey to split up District TC now 1 his first tear as DD.

I gave you 2 that benefited the District and Mn Hockey, now what is your actual problem?

[Ugottobekiddingme]

And if the current Democratic party followed MN Hock by-laws I could plan on having Obama as my fearless leader for a lifetime.

He's filling a spot and I give him credit for that....just saying he is an obstructionist and a new look might help MN Hock.

[greybeard58]

Again what is your problem?
You make statements but give no facts to back it up.
What is the specific problem?

[Ugottobekiddingme]

There is no acknowlegement of the needs of Elk River. The two positives you listed for CP and BP are outside D10, again what has been positive for members of D10?

[HockeyDad41]

Funny stuff. greybeard58 is TT.

[Ugottobekiddingme]

Funny stuff. greybeard58 is TT.

Not sure about that, I think I just saw him off Hyw 169 cutting cable internet connection. Have a great hockey season everyone....

[greybeard58]

HD 41 Cute not even close.I do not even live in the District 10 boundaries.

U CP is a District 10 member association and had they left when others before TT was elected were trying to break up District 10 it would have affected the level of competition in the league play also at the time had some in Mn Hockey got their way and switched other associations and Elk River was slated to go to District 5 the league costs and tournament fee would have had to increase.

How about holding league fees and tournament costs at a low level for many years. The addition of the C Peewees to league play, the addition of C Squirts to the District tournament. Working with the other DD's to make sure when a level has low numbers to find a place/league for the teams to play whether it be Dist.2 or 3 or 5.
Before the change in registration to allow people to come to his home to sign rosters and the same for waivers that need to be signed,just to name a few.

As for Elk River the 2nd largest association in District 10, what needs are you talking about. There were grant applications that were passed out to all associations at the summer Presidents meetings and those that did not attend had those applications were mailed out to them. Did your association apply for these grants and has your association discussed the specific problems you are concerned about with TT? Do you know for a fact your President is communicating these concerns to the District Director?

[stickdownheadup]

Any update from the meeting this weekend?

[Snowmass]

Any update from the meeting this weekend?

Bump. And when is the final vote on the age change? When do we know if it's a go for next year or it's a dead issue?

[playwithyourgrade]

Any update from the meeting this weekend?

Bump. And when is the final vote on the age change? When do we know if it's a go for next year or it's a dead issue?

A vote was taken and it resulted to keep a July 1 date.

[HM45]

As the parent of a June 98 player (who we opted to delay kindergarten entry for) I'm very disappointed in the boards vote to keep the current birthday cut-off in place. Not looking forward to him being a first year bantam in 7th grade!
btw: I have a question. Some previous posts here said that kids with summer b-days who started K late ended up not being able to play in 9th grade. I'm wondering why that is? Don't most kids (regardless of age/grade) go to JV when finished with Bantams???

[Pioneerprideguy]

Has anyone ever requested to play down and was allowed?

[greybeard58]

Yes there have been times when a player has been allowed to play down,but there are specifics that have to be followed and the final say is the Minn.Hockey District Registrar.

[elliott70]

Has anyone ever requested to play down and was allowed?

Play downs are only allowed for medical reasons. They need to be approved by USA Hockey Affiliate Registrar - was Gerry Brown, now Carol Carlson. they have strict guidelines to follow. Doctor verification is required as well as personal data of the player.
In District 16 we have had two legitimate playdowns allowed - both for kids with cancer - in the 20 years I have been involved.

[elliott70]

Play downs are not allowed because of age, size, experience.
In D16 we use our imagination, creativity to get/keep the kid involved. We do not have the numbers for C or rec hockey.

[elliott70]

As the parent of a June 98 player (who we opted to delay kindergarten entry for) I'm very disappointed in the boards vote to keep the current birthday cut-off in place. Not looking forward to him being a first year bantam in 7th grade!
btw: I have a question. Some previous posts here said that kids with summer b-days who started K late ended up not being able to play in 9th grade. I'm wondering why that is? Don't most kids (regardless of age/grade) go to JV when finished with Bantams???

The usual pattern is pee wee for 2 years, 6 & 7 grade.
Bantams for 8 & 9 grades.
Hold your kid back and he will finish bantams in 8th grade.
Since a lot of boys are being held back (perfectly legitimate with the schools) with August-July birthdates, they play bantams earlier.
The stats show more June birthdates, especially for boys, are being started a year later in school.
Some how this was not relevant when the vote was taken in Sept.
I have my opinions, but I will keep them to myself.

[elliott70]

I know TT and greybeard.
They are not the same person.

[elliott70]

I have attended a few MN Hockey committee meetings on various issues and watched some of the "older" members speak. It is fairly obvious they are far removed from today's game and the issues involved. One guy's consistant response was,"back when my kids played....", well sir, that was decades ago and things have changed since then. When statistical data was presented, they looked like deer in headlights. People had to "dummy down" the information just to make a small point. The oldtimer's response...."well, it was never like that when my kids were playing." Consequently, very few changes have occurred.

I do applaud the time that these older members give, however, it really is time for them to step aside. I know the response will be, "if ya don't like it, then get involved"....I get that. But from what I saw, to sit on a committee with some of these old guys still present, would frustrate many to just opt out. I guess we just sit back and allow natural causes to run it's course.

Being the second longest serving District Director on the MH board I have to take exception to this statement.
I do not think it is the age of the rep but the effort he /she puts into teh job they have been given.
I put in alot of time at the rinks and talking to people with players and to talking to coaches and players and refs.
And I try and keep an open mind.

Mark Elliott
District 16 director
Bemidji, MN

[Ugottobekiddingme]

I have attended a few MN Hockey committee meetings on various issues and watched some of the "older" members speak. It is fairly obvious they are far removed from today's game and the issues involved. One guy's consistant response was,"back when my kids played....", well sir, that was decades ago and things have changed since then. When statistical data was presented, they looked like deer in headlights. People had to "dummy down" the information just to make a small point. The oldtimer's response...."well, it was never like that when my kids were playing." Consequently, very few changes have occurred.

I do applaud the time that these older members give, however, it really is time for them to step aside. I know the response will be, "if ya don't like it, then get involved"....I get that. But from what I saw, to sit on a committee with some of these old guys still present, would frustrate many to just opt out. I guess we just sit back and allow natural causes to run it's course.

Being the second longest serving District Director on the MH board I have to take exception to this statement.
I do not think it is the age of the rep but the effort he /she puts into teh job they have been given.
I put in alot of time at the rinks and talking to people with players and to talking to coaches and players and refs.
And I try and keep an open mind.

Mark Elliott
District 16 director
Bemidji, MN

Mr. Elliott...you need not take exception towards an opinion and I don't think Pioneerguy was directing it at you. You have served the MN Hock board many years and should be recognized for your service to Minnesota Hockey. But let's be "frank" here, on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most productive...how would you rate your ability to successfully drive hockey initiatives within MN Hock and what has prevented you from accomplishing goals...if any? Ultimately...why was the age date change prevented and the "internal" reasoning behind it?

[elliott70]

I have attended a few MN Hockey committee meetings on various issues and watched some of the "older" members speak. It is fairly obvious they are far removed from today's game and the issues involved. One guy's consistant response was,"back when my kids played....", well sir, that was decades ago and things have changed since then. When statistical data was presented, they looked like deer in headlights. People had to "dummy down" the information just to make a small point. The oldtimer's response...."well, it was never like that when my kids were playing." Consequently, very few changes have occurred.

I do applaud the time that these older members give, however, it really is time for them to step aside. I know the response will be, "if ya don't like it, then get involved"....I get that. But from what I saw, to sit on a committee with some of these old guys still present, would frustrate many to just opt out. I guess we just sit back and allow natural causes to run it's course.

Being the second longest serving District Director on the MH board I have to take exception to this statement.
I do not think it is the age of the rep but the effort he /she puts into teh job they have been given.
I put in alot of time at the rinks and talking to people with players and to talking to coaches and players and refs.
And I try and keep an open mind.

Mark Elliott
District 16 director
Bemidji, MN

Mr. Elliott...you need not take exception towards an opinion and I don't think Pioneerguy was directing it at you. You have served the MN Hock board many years and should be recognized for your service to Minnesota Hockey. But let's be "frank" here, on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most productive...how would you rate your ability to successfully drive hockey initiatives within MN Hock and what has prevented you from accomplishing goals...if any? Ultimately...why was the age date change prevented and the "internal" reasoning behind it?

Being from the most remote area of MH is the biggest issue from my being a driving force. Being a director instead of a VP also is a negative. Being outside of the 'inner circle' - a loose canon perhaps - a vocal opponent to the admin against things that are bad for kids, coaches, local associations.
As far as being productive, stopping the one-site state tourney, stopping blue pucks from being mandatory, stopping a fixed monetary penallty against associations for coaching helmet violations, making changes to regional tournaments, slowing the increase in MH and USAH fee increase for players.... these are just some things I have either led or I have been very instrumental.
The age change not passing was a result of no one driving it at the bord level which clearly falls on the planning committee (I did not drive it due to a personal loss that took the wind out of my sails during the last year or so.)

The biggest problem with MH is the way the admin - leadership electin process occurs and how voting is allocated to board members. Off the top of my head there are at least 9 VP (including the president) that are elected by the board and not directly by the members. There are 5 or 6 others that are not elected by memership. 12 are elected by members of youth hockey, but hte other 15 all vote and control the destiny of youth hockey. This is the problem that needs to be addressed. and I and other DD have pushed for a change, but its 12 against 15 with the 12 trying to change the balance of power.

I think the opinion is wrong. Length of service nor age are factors that should not be the judge of service to MH, districts or local assn. The effort put into staying in touch with ALL of the people a person represents.

Our rural needs for youth hockey are different that urban, our small size is different than large assn, but there are similaritites also. I have worked hard to know what is happening in all parts of the state. I have been to half the metro rinks, almost all the northern rinks, I have been to MN Made and talked to those people. But first and foremost I stay in contact with District 16 people daily (district, assn leaders, coaches, refs, parents and players).

But thanks for challenging me and reading and hopefully working to put power with the membership.

[Ugottobekiddingme]

Being the second longest serving District Director on the MH board I have to take exception to this statement.
I do not think it is the age of the rep but the effort he /she puts into teh job they have been given.
I put in alot of time at the rinks and talking to people with players and to talking to coaches and players and refs.
And I try and keep an open mind.

Mark Elliott
District 16 director
Bemidji, MN

Mr. Elliott...you need not take exception towards an opinion and I don't think Pioneerguy was directing it at you. You have served the MN Hock board many years and should be recognized for your service to Minnesota Hockey. But let's be "frank" here, on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most productive...how would you rate your ability to successfully drive hockey initiatives within MN Hock and what has prevented you from accomplishing goals...if any? Ultimately...why was the age date change prevented and the "internal" reasoning behind it?

Being from the most remote area of MH is the biggest issue from my being a driving force. Being a director instead of a VP also is a negative. Being outside of the 'inner circle' - a loose canon perhaps - a vocal opponent to the admin against things that are bad for kids, coaches, local associations.
As far as being productive, stopping the one-site state tourney, stopping blue pucks from being mandatory, stopping a fixed monetary penallty against associations for coaching helmet violations, making changes to regional tournaments, slowing the increase in MH and USAH fee increase for players.... these are just some things I have either led or I have been very instrumental.
The age change not passing was a result of no one driving it at the bord level which clearly falls on the planning committee (I did not drive it due to a personal loss that took the wind out of my sails during the last year or so.)

The biggest problem with MH is the way the admin - leadership electin process occurs and how voting is allocated to board members. Off the top of my head there are at least 9 VP (including the president) that are elected by the board and not directly by the members. There are 5 or 6 others that are not elected by memership. 12 are elected by members of youth hockey, but hte other 15 all vote and control the destiny of youth hockey. This is the problem that needs to be addressed. and I and other DD have pushed for a change, but its 12 against 15 with the 12 trying to change the balance of power.

I think the opinion is wrong. Length of service nor age are factors that should not be the judge of service to MH, districts or local assn. The effort put into staying in touch with ALL of the people a person represents.

Our rural needs for youth hockey are different that urban, our small size is different than large assn, but there are similaritites also. I have worked hard to know what is happening in all parts of the state. I have been to half the metro rinks, almost all the northern rinks, I have been to MN Made and talked to those people. But first and foremost I stay in contact with District 16 people daily (district, assn leaders, coaches, refs, parents and players).

But thanks for challenging me and reading and hopefully working to put power with the membership.

Glad to see you back on the board and sorry for what you have gone through, no person can understand the pain of losing a partner unless it happens to them personally.

Thanks for the straight answers and I appreciate your direct ability to share what is needed and your honest desire to do what is best for MN Hock.

[old goalie85]

Thank you for all you do for Mn hockey Mark ...