How Affluence Affects Hockey Success-- Per Capita Chart

hshockeyfan53 · Post by **hshockeyfan53** » Tue May 03, 2011 3:02 pm

From 2005-2009 these are the historical records for MN High School Hockey according to MinnesotaScores.net. I thought it would be interesting to pull per capita numbers from the top 10 and bottom 10 just to show people how being wealthy and affluent is or isn’t related to having the opportunities to succeed in hockey. I didn’t include the private schools because they usually aren’t directly related with only one city/town. Usually players come from several different communities.

Top 10 records (2005-2009) *NO PRIVATE SCHOOLS

Per Capita Income (2000 census)

1. Little Falls 104-16-2 $15,924
2. Hermantown 97-18-2 $20,993
3. Roseau 97-20-3 $18,371
4. Edina 94-23-1 $44,195
5. Eden Prairie 83-22-8 $38,854
6. Blaine 93-27-2 $22,777
7. Duluth East 80-26-5 $18,969 (Entire Duluth)
8. Warroad 87-30-4 $16,412
9. Centennial 75-26-9 $25,419 (Lino Lakes)
10. Woodbury 83-25-9 $32,606

Average Per Capita Income: $25,452

Bottom 10 records (2005-2009) *NO PRIVATE SCHOOLS
145. North Metro 23-79-1 $23,693 (Oak Grove?)
146. Greenway 21-83-1 $18,162
147. Henry Sibley 18-80-4 $49,589 (Mendota Heights?)
148. Simley 19-86-2 $25,493
149. Becker/Big Lake 15-83-0 $19,333 (Becker)
150. Bagley/Fosston/C-G 12-69-0 $15,472 (Bagley)
151. Fairmont 11-72-1 $18,658
152. Bloomington Kennedy 11-88-5 $29,782 (Bloomington)
153. North Branch 7-80-2 $20,875
154. Sleepy Eye 4-73-0 $20,175

Average Per Capita Income: $24,123

This was shocking to me that they were so close. I just crunched the numbers you guys do what you want with them. It looks like everybody has the money but to me it seems that what they decide to spend it on is what really matters. Hence the cities with the great hockey history (Warroad, Roseau, Edina etc….) have the best record because hockey is what they spend their money on!!

muckandgrind · Post by **muckandgrind** » Wed May 04, 2011 1:42 pm

The problem with comparing team records is that none of these teams have identical schedules. My bet is that the schedule of Little Falls, probably isn't nearly as tough as Duluth East or Eden Prairie.

MNHockeyFan · Post by **MNHockeyFan** » Wed May 04, 2011 4:57 pm

muckandgrind wrote:The problem with comparing team records is that none of these teams have identical schedules. My bet is that the schedule of Little Falls, probably isn't nearly as tough as Duluth East or Eden Prairie.

I was thinking the same thing. Interesting analysis but one other consideration is that it doesn't take into account demographics other than per-capita income. For example, you can have a community whose neighborhoods are mostly comprised of older folks who are past their child-rearing years, but are still relatively well-to-do. School enrollments in the district are declining and you are left with fewer kids going out for its various sports teams. Examples might include Henry Sibley, North St. Paul, Bloomington Kennedy, Roseville, Mounds View, etc.

No Political Connections · Wed May 04, 2011 5:42 pm

muckandgrind wrote:The problem with comparing team records is that none of these teams have identical schedules. My bet is that the schedule of Little Falls, probably isn't nearly as tough as Duluth East or Eden Prairie.

The interesting study (although it would be a masters thesis level job) would be to take some of those towns and see how they did against towns and schools who made more than them and less than them. For example since Duluth East plays an independent schedule how did they do against Cloquet, Grand Rapids (both of whom you would expect to be about the same from an average income stand point) and then how do they do against teams like Edina, Eden Prairie and etc who you would assume have a higher income.

Instinctively I think that the tie in is going to be between per capita income and tax revenue generated based on property taxes. A higher per capita income means higher value (or at least more expensive) housing prices which allows communities to build more public buildings, including ice rinks. I think that a town that generally has a low average income is going to have a lower property value generally which probably means that the town coffers are lower. Put another way, I think that Edina with it's assumed high per capita income has a correspondingly higher property average value which means more tax money to spend and Greenway with it's lower per capita income has lower property values so they have less property taxes and less to spend on ice rinks..........

I think that you can also make an argument relating to the population of a town to the number of kids who play hockey which in turn relates to the amount of ice time the kids on the teams get. I see something like that at the mite level when a team gets 2 or 3 hours of outside ice per week because of all of the mite teams that the town has and then goes up against a town who has one or two mite teams (along with fewer Squirt, MiniMite, PeeWee, Bantam) so the competition for ice time is lower so those kids get 4 or so hours of inside ice and the larger program gets hammered. Not really a dollars issue as much as an ice time issue. This I think is where Warroad and etc make their moves. The worst thing you can be is a program with lots of kids and not much ice time available because you are either going to sacrifice your future by not getting your younger kids ice time or you are going to sacrifice your present by not being able to get your current older teams what they need. A Catch 22 all the way.

Just a rambling sort of dis-jointed thought pattern on this nice day when I spent the day inside taking a couple of final exams for some classes I am taking.

darkhorse · Post by **darkhorse** » Thu May 05, 2011 10:23 am

The time it took putting this list together is appreciated but in all honesty there are so many other variables it really isn't relevant. There is very little objectivity when so many variables are at play especially when you can choose specific data points to use to make a point.

hshockeyfan53 · Post by **hshockeyfan53** » Thu May 05, 2011 12:11 pm

darkhorse wrote:The time it took putting this list together is appreciated but in all honesty there are so many other variables it really isn't relevant. There is very little objectivity when so many variables are at play especially when you can choose specific data points to use to make a point.

Yeah I know it doesn't mean much but it just maybe sheds a little light on the subject. I appreciate the constructive criticism though!

Slap Shot · Post by **Slap Shot** » Sat May 07, 2011 9:17 pm

How have the Mpls and St. Paul city schools done the past twenty years? While there are exceptions, hockey is a money sport.

muckandgrind · Post by **muckandgrind** » Mon May 09, 2011 7:39 am

Slap Shot wrote:How have the Mpls and St. Paul city schools done the past twenty years? While there are exceptions, hockey is a money sport.

I think it also has to do with demographics (many immigrants who don't care about the sport) combined with poor learning environments. There are quite a few good hockey players that are from the cities of Mpls/St Paul that play for the local private schools like BSM.