Walser/Effects of the D6 Rule on MM

[Quasar]

I think that it can be summed up to say that most if not all of us think that the people who are running MN Hockey have done good things for it and have worked hard for it. I can understand how somebody who has put lots into a project feels a proprietary interest in it and in keeping it going. I do think that that because things change that the people who are running it have to change too. Look at what happens when a person disagrees with association hockey model. You get a long list of kids who turned pro and numbers about how this many kids played D1 and things like that. They go back to the 70s and 80s to show how good it has been. I am willing to bet that a large number of the people who are running MN Hockey do not have kids playing hockey now, they used to play but are not now in MN. Their kids were the way upper end kids who do not have a problem anyhow and/or they were on the boards and were protecting their kids and promoting them so even if they were shaky they made the A teams and got the breaks for them. The biggest thing that Walser and MM represent are how things have and are changing. No longer can you tell a parent to either do it my way or hit the highway like you used to be able to. Look at how things have changed now that the internet is here and now that transportation is easier and cheaper. Back in the 70s and 80s which is what is being quoted as proof that associations hockey is not a bad thing I am willing to be that most people had not heard of groups like Belle Tire, Little Ceasars, and etc and did not know how successful they were. It was possible to tell a parent who was not happy that we have the best system and are way better than those hacks on it New England who are messed up. Now you can't get away with that, you can get on the internet and not only see the teams and how they are ranked and etc but you can also see videos of them and have a direct contact number for the coaches.

JDUBBS says that change is a slow process and might eventually happen. Others like the O-Town-Clown and etc say that it won't happen and that association hockey is the best thing ever. What I am saying and others like me is that both of those points of view are way wrong. The change is happening right now as we speak. It is happening in girls hockey with a school trying to push a SSM type program into being, it is happening now that MM has won that case, it is happening now that AAU is in MI and will be in MN soon to provide another hockey choice, it is happening when The Fire fills up with high quality kids who want to play something other than association hockey. Summer hockey is accelerating the process and if you look at it I am not so sure that I want a summer hockey model to be followed. In the summer we have 32-0 blowouts with coaches trying to get all of their kids a hat trick in the game. We have super high end teams like the Blades showing up and playing brand new startup AAA teams. What has to happen is that MN Hockey has to wake up and see Walser and etc for what they are and that is the nose of the camel. Change is here, association hockey is done and although it used to work is going to finish failing and collapse. If MN Hockey wants to remain relevant they have to evolve and adapt or they will go away. All that MN Hockey is to USA Hockey is a feeder system for players and money and that is it. When MN Hockey falls apart and some other entity takes over USA Hockey will run to it and hug and kiss and make up and sanction them to keep the pipeline flowing and that is it. MN Hockey has the choice to either remain as the adults who are running the program or the group that could not handle the fact that their monopoly was broken up so they fell apart. That is it, two choices and MN Hockey can not continue to live back in the day dreaming of the glory that used to be and hope that by not acknowledging it that it is not happening. Wake up MN Hockey, smell the coffee and get going or get out of the way so that we can get the anarchy out of the way and then get some adults into place to run it.

Standing "O"

DITTO !!

[the_juiceman]

I think that it can be summed up to say that most if not all of us think that the people who are running MN Hockey have done good things for it and have worked hard for it. I can understand how somebody who has put lots into a project feels a proprietary interest in it and in keeping it going. I do think that that because things change that the people who are running it have to change too. Look at what happens when a person disagrees with association hockey model. You get a long list of kids who turned pro and numbers about how this many kids played D1 and things like that. They go back to the 70s and 80s to show how good it has been. I am willing to bet that a large number of the people who are running MN Hockey do not have kids playing hockey now, they used to play but are not now in MN. Their kids were the way upper end kids who do not have a problem anyhow and/or they were on the boards and were protecting their kids and promoting them so even if they were shaky they made the A teams and got the breaks for them. The biggest thing that Walser and MM represent are how things have and are changing. No longer can you tell a parent to either do it my way or hit the highway like you used to be able to. Look at how things have changed now that the internet is here and now that transportation is easier and cheaper. Back in the 70s and 80s which is what is being quoted as proof that associations hockey is not a bad thing I am willing to be that most people had not heard of groups like Belle Tire, Little Ceasars, and etc and did not know how successful they were. It was possible to tell a parent who was not happy that we have the best system and are way better than those hacks on it New England who are messed up. Now you can't get away with that, you can get on the internet and not only see the teams and how they are ranked and etc but you can also see videos of them and have a direct contact number for the coaches.

JDUBBS says that change is a slow process and might eventually happen. Others like the O-Town-Clown and etc say that it won't happen and that association hockey is the best thing ever. What I am saying and others like me is that both of those points of view are way wrong. The change is happening right now as we speak. It is happening in girls hockey with a school trying to push a SSM type program into being, it is happening now that MM has won that case, it is happening now that AAU is in MI and will be in MN soon to provide another hockey choice, it is happening when The Fire fills up with high quality kids who want to play something other than association hockey. Summer hockey is accelerating the process and if you look at it I am not so sure that I want a summer hockey model to be followed. In the summer we have 32-0 blowouts with coaches trying to get all of their kids a hat trick in the game. We have super high end teams like the Blades showing up and playing brand new startup AAA teams. What has to happen is that MN Hockey has to wake up and see Walser and etc for what they are and that is the nose of the camel. Change is here, association hockey is done and although it used to work is going to finish failing and collapse. If MN Hockey wants to remain relevant they have to evolve and adapt or they will go away. All that MN Hockey is to USA Hockey is a feeder system for players and money and that is it. When MN Hockey falls apart and some other entity takes over USA Hockey will run to it and hug and kiss and make up and sanction them to keep the pipeline flowing and that is it. MN Hockey has the choice to either remain as the adults who are running the program or the group that could not handle the fact that their monopoly was broken up so they fell apart. That is it, two choices and MN Hockey can not continue to live back in the day dreaming of the glory that used to be and hope that by not acknowledging it that it is not happening. Wake up MN Hockey, smell the coffee and get going or get out of the way so that we can get the anarchy out of the way and then get some adults into place to run it.

OH Brother!!

[karl(east)]

Walser + AAA hockey + Tier I hockey + WI Fire ---->all are a threat to MN Hockey (association model) which has lead to frivolous expensive legal fight -- not all that much straying going on in this thread.

Yeah, I considered the topic title "Existential Threats to the MH Model," but that title would probably apply to over half the active threads on this forum this summer.

Not that it doesn't make for fascinating reading for those of us who don't really have a vested interest in the arguments...

[Ugottobekiddingme]

Walser + AAA hockey + Tier I hockey + WI Fire ---->all are a threat to MN Hockey (association model) which has lead to frivolous expensive legal fight -- not all that much straying going on in this thread.

Yeah, I considered the topic title "Existential Threats to the MH Model," but that title would probably apply to over half the active threads on this forum this summer.

Not that it doesn't make for fascinating reading for those of us who don't really have a vested interest in the arguments...

Vested as invested or disenfranchised as to why we invest interest towards hockey?

[HockeyDad41]

I've been considering the possibility that maybe the problem lies less with the leadership of MH and more with the district and association levels.

Seems to me that the district directors and association presidents have the power to grant waivers to allow movement between associations. A lot of the griping I am reading could be resolved if only the disenfranchised families had the ability to move to an association of their liking.

I haven't had my coffee yet so maybe this makes no sense.....

[old goalie85]

Makes sense to me. MH should tell the assc. that they have to allow waivers. It's part of the rules. Maybe more people would be happy w/ the "old" model if [like HD says] assc hockey was a little more open. I dodn't understand why assc wouldn't take waivers. To many worried about little Jonny not making the team?? It shouldn't be the Highschool coach. the pee-wee that we had waive in last year moved into the the school district this year.[has two younger bros also] Seems like a Win-Win to me.

[MrBoDangles]

You must be part of that 2% someone was talking about.

And you're obviously the part with their heads in the sand.

2%.......?

[Quasar]

Do away with waivers altogether. A kid shows up at try outs, laces em up, makes the team, or doesn't make the team.

No one should care where he's from. If he follows the rules, and Mom and Dad pay the fees and help out that should be enough.

[JDUBBS1280]

You misinterpreted what I said. I never said change wasn't happening. I did say that it won't completely happen overnight. In the end, I don't think you will EVER see MN Hockey move completely away from the community model. We'll NEVER be like Michigan or out East. That is a good thing. That's what makes MN Hockey special. But some changes and adaptation is necessary. There will be more opportunities to play elsewhere. Just don't expect those changes to all happen over night.

[Quasar]

You misinterpreted what I said. I never said change wasn't happening. I did say that it won't completely happen overnight. In the end, I don't think you will EVER see MN Hockey move completely away from the community model. We'll NEVER be like Michigan or out East. That is a good thing. That's what makes MN Hockey special. But some changes and adaptation is necessary. There will be more opportunities to play elsewhere. Just don't expect those changes to all happen over night.

Could happen over night. Lets say they remove the waiver requirement for Bantams only as a test program. I would be willing to bet after the initial flurry not more than a hand full of kids would move. If it worked with Bantams they could add peewees and see how it goes for a year. At least we would see which side of the argument is right. The only problem I see with this is that Old Goalie would build the Forest Lake super team and dominate the State tournament

[Quasar]

Makes sense to me. MH should tell the assc. that they have to allow waivers. It's part of the rules. Maybe more people would be happy w/ the "old" model if [like HD says] assc hockey was a little more open. I dodn't understand why assc wouldn't take waivers. To many worried about little Jonny not making the team?? It shouldn't be the Highschool coach. the pee-wee that we had waive in last year moved into the the school district this year.[has two younger bros also] Seems like a Win-Win to me.

Associations are reluctant to waive kids in for a couple of reasons. First off don't those waivers have to be approved every year? Why would an association waive a kid in, train him, work with him and then next year have to face him when his home association refuses to waive him in? Secondly I think is the fact that right now a good part of the problem surrounds nepotism and protection of our kids. That kid has been on the team playing with my kid since minimites. His dad and I are best buddies and always have fun, our kids are always on the same team. Why would I want to allow a waiver for a kid to come in and bump my buddy's kid off of the team? Granted that other kid is way better, works harder and etc but not only is his dad my buddy but he donates stuff to the club and he also knows people so I will be screwing my kid's chances up down the road.

The only way this works is if the kids and only the kids decide who skates where. Club A wants to build so they get high end coaches, improve their facility and go looking for kids, just like what happens in Clownville right now where OTC lives. The other clubs know this and they do not want the Clownville club to become a monster club so they start to work to keep their kids in their club. The Juicemanville club really really does not want to lose their top kids so they place kids on the right level teams, no more favorites and etc, they tell their kids we are going to do this right and they do. The Juicemanville club kids stay there since why would they want to move to a different club when this one is being fair. Now, SECoachville's club is a little different. They want their buddy's kids to be protected no matter how good the other kids are, no matter how little the "good" kids work to get better. They like taking the same team on the road year after year and are always shocked when the same thing happens to them. The kids who are skating for SECoachville who are working hard, getting better, listening to the coaches start to wonder if maybe playing A level hockey for the Clownville Clowns (their mascot sort of looks like that clown called Pennywise from the Stephen King book) might not be the way to go so they go over to Clownville to check it out. The fourth club here is called Observille. They are big. The kids on their B team are routinely better than a bunch of the kids on either the Clownville or Juicemanville clubs so when the teams are formed some of them migrate to both of those teams as well. Now we have three high end clubs who are competing and scrapping away to try to win, the talent has leveled out (sort of like water in a bucket) and the only people who are really getting screwed up are the parents and kids in SECoachville, guess what, board elections are a couple of months away, here is your chance to fix it. The only people who are hating life right now are the board members and etc for SECoachville who are running around telling everybody who will listen that this ain't fair because we have always formed our team this way and we like to do it this way.............. where does your kid tryout???

What a great way to enjoy your morning coffee. Fun read... I'm checking out Observille soon as I get a chance. I've heard they're playing at the Super rink.

[observer]

Just don't expect those changes to all happen over night.

Everyone talks about MN Hockey like it's a single person behind the curtain making decisions over all his subjects like the wizard of OZ. MN Hockey makes no decisions. Committees made up of members from Districts, from those District Associations, make decisions at meetings, by vote.

Think of the saying, Think Globally, act locally. It means get involved. Be active in your association get support for your opinions, take that support to your District meeting and gain support and take that District support to the State meetings. People just want change, in support of their opinion, without gaining the support of others. Certainly not majority support. How's that work? You just going to wish your change into effect?

Support for your freedom act has to happen at the Association level first. Once your Association supports your decision, because it's sensible, your Association can take it to the District where it will also gain support because it's sensible. Quit fussing and take your sensible solution with you as you actively support, and get involved with, your Association.

My initial suggestion is to allow supposed A level players from Associations that don't offer A level of play to try out for the closest neighboring Association, in the same District, that does offer A level of play. If the player makes the team you're set. If not, player returns to his Association and plays on a team in his community Association. It sounds like that is allowed in some places and not others. That should be fixed at the Association level in support of their District members that aren't strong enough to host their own A level teams.

There are many other solutions. The next best is to probably open enroll your student where you suspect they'd like to attend HS anyways. If that's your plan for HS you might as well get your player in with his future team mates on a youth team in that school area soon as opposed to later. As a mite? Squirt? Lets say first year PeeWee, or first year Bantam. If it's where your child would like to attend HS then get on with it.

It can be fun. The Mpls-Park Bantam A whooped Edina 6-0 at Regionals and went to the State Tournament. A number of the players attend school at Benilde and so play youth hockey with the St. Louis Park Youth Association where Benilde is located. Minneapolis or St. Louis Park HS probably will not beat Edina any time soon. Benilde might. The six of you should start stating your individual plan for your personal solution and we'll watch with interest. I believe there's an achievable solution for each of you.

It's the old, be part of the solution not part of the problem. As a parent, or grandparent, you should know screaming and kicking your feet isn't all that effective.

[Quasar]

Just don't expect those changes to all happen over night.

Everyone talks about MN Hockey like it's a single person behind the curtain making decisions over all his subjects like the wizard of OZ. MN Hockey makes no decisions. Committees made up of members from Districts, from those District Associations, make decisions at meetings, by vote.

Think of the saying, Think Globally, act locally. It means get involved. Be active in your association get support for your opinions, take that support to your District meeting and gain support and take that District support to the State meetings. People just want change, in support of their opinion, without gaining the support of others. Certainly not majority support. How's that work? You just going to wish your change into effect?

Support for your freedom act has to happen at the Association level first. Once your Association supports your decision, because it's sensible, your Association can take it to the District where it will also gain support because it's sensible. Quit fussing and take your sensible solution with you as you actively support, and get involved with, your Association.

My initial suggestion is to allow supposed A level players from Associations that don't offer A level of play to try out for the closest neighboring Association, in the same District, that does offer A level of play. If the player makes the team you're set. If not, player returns to his Association and plays on a team in his community Association. It sounds like that is allowed in some places and not others. That should be fixed at the Association level in support of their District members that aren't strong enough to host their own A level teams.

There are many other solutions. The next best is to probably open enroll your student where you suspect they'd like to attend HS anyways. If that's your plan for HS you might as well get your player in with his future team mates on a youth team in that school area soon as opposed to later. As a mite? Squirt? Lets say first year PeeWee, or first year Bantam. If it's where your child would like to attend HS then get on with it.

It can be fun. The Mpls-Park Bantam A whooped Edina 6-0 at Regionals and went to the State Tournament. A number of the players attend school at Benilde and so play youth hockey with the St. Louis Park Youth Association where Benilde is located. Minneapolis or St. Louis Park HS probably will not beat Edina any time soon. Benilde might. The six of you should start stating your individual plan for your personal solution and we'll watch with interest. I believe there's an achievable solution for each of you.

It's the old, be part of the solution not part of the problem. As a parent, or grandparent, you should know screaming and kicking your feet isn't all that effective.

This post is a perfect example of why the idea of a Walser team has taken hold. I was with you all the way to the kicking and screaming part.
A simple rule change at the Minnesota hockey board level is all that's needed. But the old "get involved " chestnut will dampen any discussion.
I think there are more than likely more than 6 people looking for change!
But what the hey.... I'm just an old grandpa having a temper tantrum along with the other 5 loonies.

[MrBoDangles]

Just don't expect those changes to all happen over night.

Everyone talks about MN Hockey like it's a single person behind the curtain making decisions over all his subjects like the wizard of OZ. MN Hockey makes no decisions. Committees made up of members from Districts, from those District Associations, make decisions at meetings, by vote.

Think of the saying, Think Globally, act locally. It means get involved. Be active in your association get support for your opinions, take that support to your District meeting and gain support and take that District support to the State meetings. People just want change, in support of their opinion, without gaining the support of others. Certainly not majority support. How's that work? You just going to wish your change into effect?

Support for your freedom act has to happen at the Association level first. Once your Association supports your decision, because it's sensible, your Association can take it to the District where it will also gain support because it's sensible. Quit fussing and take your sensible solution with you as you actively support, and get involved with, your Association.

My initial suggestion is to allow supposed A level players from Associations that don't offer A level of play to try out for the closest neighboring Association, in the same District, that does offer A level of play. If the player makes the team you're set. If not, player returns to his Association and plays on a team in his community Association. It sounds like that is allowed in some places and not others. That should be fixed at the Association level in support of their District members that aren't strong enough to host their own A level teams.

There are many other solutions. The next best is to probably open enroll your student where you suspect they'd like to attend HS anyways. If that's your plan for HS you might as well get your player in with his future team mates on a youth team in that school area soon as opposed to later. As a mite? Squirt? Lets say first year PeeWee, or first year Bantam. If it's where your child would like to attend HS then get on with it.

It can be fun. The Mpls-Park Bantam A whooped Edina 6-0 at Regionals and went to the State Tournament. A number of the players attend school at Benilde and so play youth hockey with the St. Louis Park Youth Association where Benilde is located. Minneapolis or St. Louis Park HS probably will not beat Edina any time soon. Benilde might. The six of you should start stating your individual plan for your personal solution and we'll watch with interest. I believe there's an achievable solution for each of you.

It's the old, be part of the solution not part of the problem. As a parent, or grandparent, you should know screaming and kicking your feet isn't all that effective.

You're blinded.

[HockeyDad41]

I can pretty much assure you that nothing will change at the local association unless someone with the authority to do so forces them to change. Too many conflicts of interest.

[Quasar]

I can pretty much assure you that nothing will change at the local association unless someone with the authority to do so forces them to change. Too many conflicts of interest.

Yep ..Some one at Minnesota hockey has to pull the trigger!!

[observer]

someone with the authority

There is no, someone of authority. MN Hockey is in place to facilitate their members process. They run the meetings for their members to make decisions.

Stop with the someone needs to do something. Don't ever bring that up again. The someone is you.

[old goalie85]

Now that I think about it , why have the waivers?? Let the kids try-out wherever!!! Water will find it's own level. If people like the "product" they will stay, if not they can look for greener pastures. If your cool w/ FL stay, if not head south to WBL, or Stillwater. Maybe you go and find out it's not that great down there maybe the problem is you or the kid. At least you were allowed to test the water. I like the assc. and town I grew up in and my lids play in. I am however starting to see both sides of the deal. If it's broken it needs to be fixed!!!

[Quasar]

someone with the authority

There is no, someone of authority. MN Hockey is in place to facilitate their members process. They run the meetings for their members to make decisions.

Stop with the someone needs to do something. Don't ever bring that up again. The someone is you.

Ok ... The majority of associations (members) said they didn't want the no checking rule. USA Hockey said no checking.. Minnesota hockey had a meeting... Minnesota hockey made a decision ... the result?? no checking ..

Why don't you get real?

[karl(east)]

Walser + AAA hockey + Tier I hockey + WI Fire ---->all are a threat to MN Hockey (association model) which has lead to frivolous expensive legal fight -- not all that much straying going on in this thread.

Yeah, I considered the topic title "Existential Threats to the MH Model," but that title would probably apply to over half the active threads on this forum this summer.

Not that it doesn't make for fascinating reading for those of us who don't really have a vested interest in the arguments...

Vested as invested or disenfranchised as to why we invest interest towards hockey?

Uh, something like that, I think.

Basically, I'm not a parent, nor am I remotely involved with MH. Instead, I'm reading this as someone who cares about what happens to hockey in Minnesota, and someone who will probably be a parent someday. What's going to work best for my kids and their friends? I'm reading all of these threads and I'm still not sure, though of course lots of this is beyond my control, or anyone's control, for that matter.

[Quasar]

Yeah, I considered the topic title "Existential Threats to the MH Model," but that title would probably apply to over half the active threads on this forum this summer.

Not that it doesn't make for fascinating reading for those of us who don't really have a vested interest in the arguments...

Vested as invested or disenfranchised as to why we invest interest towards hockey?

Uh, something like that, I think.

Basically, I'm not a parent, nor am I remotely involved with MH. Instead, I'm reading this as someone who cares about what happens to hockey in Minnesota, and someone who will probably be a parent someday. What's going to work best for my kids and their friends? I'm reading all of these threads and I'm still not sure, though of course lots of this is beyond my control, or anyone's control, for that matter.

Hi Karl,
You and I are the book ends.. In between is where the action is...
I just love the conversation, and I am thankful that there is a well monitored place for it to take place.. Thank's

[HockeyDad41]

someone with the authority

There is no, someone of authority. MN Hockey is in place to facilitate their members process. They run the meetings for their members to make decisions.

Stop with the someone needs to do something. Don't ever bring that up again. The someone is you.

Seriously someone at MH needs to do something to fix this.

[Quasar]

As soon as a person stands up and says that they want changes to the system the system goes after them. Go into your association sometime and ask around about why does so and so get away with that. How come stuff like that goes on. People with either look nervous and run from you or will tell you that it happens because that is how the board wants it to happen. For starters as soon as you say you want change your kids (even the unborn ones) are slotted on the lowest B2 team there is, no matter what. Stand up and say you want onto the board to make some changes, good luck, the board runs the elections and counts the votes. Now of course you go to the district level, good luck there, the rest of the boards in your district who are behaving exactly like this are going to step in and you are not going anywhere. And on and on it goes.

This is a totally cerebral argument for me. MN Hockey is living back in the day when this model worked and refuses to look around and see that it is broken. I sit here and know full well that this won't change but also feel bad that it won't. If one change could be made it would but it won't because the people who are entrenched in power are not going anywhere and they are enjoying the benefits and power that comes along with being the king. Getting your ring kissed by the peasants is way better than having to compete with them. I do not think that MN Hockey can change or will change. The powers that be do not see a reason to change and as long as they have the power they are not going too. What has to happen and what is in the process of happening is that MN Hockey is going to be forced out. Their power to enforce their rules took a hit when they lost that lawsuit. New people are coming to town to provide the services that the peasants want and slowly but surely the peasants are going to change providers.

No matter how desperately MN Hockey tries to retain power and to make sure that the good old days continue to exist it is a lost battle for them. The very entity that they in turn service (USA Hockey) is going to be the same one that finishes them off when (not if) they sanction the first non association hockey club in MN against MN Hockey's wishes. I think/thought that it was going to be an AAU type situation in outer MN or somebody like Walser who came into town and forced the issue. Others think that it will be a MM type of entity that gets it going by putting together a league and then getting it sanctioned. We might both be wrong or we both might be right. It might be something really crazy like a bunch of girls up north.

Observer, there are way more than six of us who are not happy now. Six of us are on this board taking a position but there are countless others who agree with us and remain silent. There are more who have looked at it and decided that it is a lost cause and have either bought a house across the boarder or who have shipped their kids off to MI or someplace else. Go on living your dream. Change is coming, some say it is here, you are getting reports from across the land about how it is there and working and the peasants like it. MN Hockey has to understand that we the peasants are not happy here in MN. We do not like being held hostage and having our kids held hostage by an entity who's only argument is that back in the day it worked great.

Beware of peasants bearing Pitch Forks !!!!

[observer]

State your individual unhappy situation and we'll discuss a solution for your particular situation.

[royals dad]

As soon as a person stands up and says that they want changes to the system the system goes after them. Go into your association sometime and ask around about why does so and so get away with that. How come stuff like that goes on. People with either look nervous and run from you or will tell you that it happens because that is how the board wants it to happen. For starters as soon as you say you want change your kids (even the unborn ones) are slotted on the lowest B2 team there is, no matter what. Stand up and say you want onto the board to make some changes, good luck, the board runs the elections and counts the votes. Now of course you go to the district level, good luck there, the rest of the boards in your district who are behaving exactly like this are going to step in and you are not going anywhere. And on and on it goes.

This is a totally cerebral argument for me. MN Hockey is living back in the day when this model worked and refuses to look around and see that it is broken. I sit here and know full well that this won't change but also feel bad that it won't. If one change could be made it would but it won't because the people who are entrenched in power are not going anywhere and they are enjoying the benefits and power that comes along with being the king. Getting your ring kissed by the peasants is way better than having to compete with them. I do not think that MN Hockey can change or will change. The powers that be do not see a reason to change and as long as they have the power they are not going too. What has to happen and what is in the process of happening is that MN Hockey is going to be forced out. Their power to enforce their rules took a hit when they lost that lawsuit. New people are coming to town to provide the services that the peasants want and slowly but surely the peasants are going to change providers.

No matter how desperately MN Hockey tries to retain power and to make sure that the good old days continue to exist it is a lost battle for them. The very entity that they in turn service (USA Hockey) is going to be the same one that finishes them off when (not if) they sanction the first non association hockey club in MN against MN Hockey's wishes. I think/thought that it was going to be an AAU type situation in outer MN or somebody like Walser who came into town and forced the issue. Others think that it will be a MM type of entity that gets it going by putting together a league and then getting it sanctioned. We might both be wrong or we both might be right. It might be something really crazy like a bunch of girls up north.

Observer, there are way more than six of us who are not happy now. Six of us are on this board taking a position but there are countless others who agree with us and remain silent. There are more who have looked at it and decided that it is a lost cause and have either bought a house across the boarder or who have shipped their kids off to MI or someplace else. Go on living your dream. Change is coming, some say it is here, you are getting reports from across the land about how it is there and working and the peasants like it. MN Hockey has to understand that we the peasants are not happy here in MN. We do not like being held hostage and having our kids held hostage by an entity who's only argument is that back in the day it worked great.

Beware of peasants bearing Pitch Forks !!!!

More likley helicopter parents in a yukons or beemers.